How can I start a new career?

[adrian]

The field of computer repair is slowly getting boring for me. I've done a lot of networking and database stuff in college, and back then I came to the conclusion that its not for me - so I stuck with computer repair. But a few months later, I guess the steam is getting cold and I'm quickly losing interest because its all repetitive stuff (remove for spyware/viruses, install this, fix that).

Before I grow careless and break something, I want to go into something interesting. All I know is that I'm not a salesman because I can't sell stuff at the store; I can't handle major maneuvering; and unless there's cute girls, I can't stand the hospital scene, so continuing with my CNA won't cut it.

Where can I go to "reinvent myself" after sticking/planning into a career for so long?

[MadAzza]

Well, no wonder it's getting boring. You've been doing it for, what, three months? Wow, that is, like, a long career, dude.

I suggest you keep doing what you're doing for a while until you figure out what you might be good at and enjoy. And keep in mind that you're still quite young, so you might change your mind a dozen times as you mature into whoever you want to be. That's OK, just go with it, but try to stick with something for a little while so you don't job-hop too much. Builds character, looks better on a resume and all that.

Is it possible that you are interested in working with computers or software in some other way?

Try asking an impartial person what your strengths and weaknesses are. (A supervisor would be better for this than a friend, but explore all options available.) You might have gifts that you're not even aware of, which you can apply to whatever you end up doing.

[1stwahine]

Adrian, No one can tell you what is better for you to do or what field to go into. It is you alone who has to decide. You have the ability and the smarts to repair computers! Many would love to be in your shoes...I am one of them.

So many people are without jobs. Many lack skills and brains. You are fortunate to have all three. Be thankful for what you have. If you need a boost to get your interest back up...come visit me on a Saturday Afternoon when I feed the Hungry at Kaukau Wagon. I'm sure it will change your mind.

Auntie Lynn

[adrian]

Adrian, No one can tell you what is better for you to do or what field to go into. It is you alone who has to decide. You have the ability and the smarts to repair computers! Many would love to be in your shoes...I am one of them.

But that's the thing - it seems like all I know is computers.

I remembered way back that I was interested in photography and videography, but the latter was sort of a family thing. I may not be eligible to go out and record lives for the 6 o'clock news (who'd want a 5ft camera guy anyway?) but I was creative in capturing the event (mostly of my sister's hula dancing).

[1stwahine]

But that's the thing - it seems like all I know is computers.

I remembered way back that I was interested in photography and videography, but the latter was sort of a family thing. I may not be eligible to go out and record lives for the 6 o'clock news (who'd want a 5ft camera guy anyway?) but I was creative in capturing the event (mostly of my sister's hula dancing).

Wow! You are LUCKY! Many DO NOT KNOW NUTTIN!

Count your blessings Adrian. You are still young. Plus, you are fortunate to have a family who have more than most.

Auntie Lynn

[scrivener]

Adrian, advice in this area is kinda like belly-buttons: Everyone's got it, but each looks a bit different from the others. You're going to get tons of advice about this, but I've actually been thinking about this for you for years. So just listen to me, 'cause I'm the man.

Get a Bachelor's degree.

Go to a four-year institution (we have several on this island, not to mention those on neighbor islands), take a bunch of courses you never thought you'd want to take, with a heavy emphasis on liberal arts, and discover yourself. That's what a college education is all about: Figuring out who you are and what matters to you and where you fit in.

You might get some flack, especially from those people who paid for your Associate's degree. Don't let that get in the way. The single best thing I ever did for myself was get a B.A., and I'll feel the same even when I complete this blasted M.Ed. I'm working on now.

So go to college. Read Kierkegaard. Look through a telescope. Paint your self-portrait. Examine rocks. Argue with a women's studies major (but not too much). Make up excuses for missing due dates. Get a little too friendly with a business major. And yeah, take a few computer courses. It's one of the best of the selfish things you'll ever do.

[GeckoGeek]

scrivener gave good advice. The other tact I'd suggest is just start applying for job. You might go for help desk in a company. You'll start with the stuff you're doing now, but you'll be on track to becoming an application specialist.

But if that doesn't appeal, well, just apply. You never know where you'll end up. That's how most carer changes happen. Someone has a skill that can be applied to a new job and the employer can't find anything that's a better fit.

[Composite 2992]

Sometimes work can end up being just that: work. What started off as a passionate interest turns out to be a humdrum everyday routine. Such as: I gotta go drive the airplane to Maui AGAIN. Or: I gotta go load the boat with tourist divers and gather the tiger sharks around the cage AGAIN. Or: I gotta go spin tunes at the night club for the same scantily clad women with big boobs AGAIN.

In those times, having a bunch of engaging hobbies can help.

Go surfing. Fly kites. Ride a bike around the island a couple of times. Learn how to shoot a pistol at a piece of steel that looks like a ram at 200 meters. Take a class in painting. Or go make a movie with some friends. Play the guitar. Whatever. Just get some variety in life. Too much of anything can become humdrum after a while.

[manoasurfer123]

Scrivener's advice is excellent!

I credit my career now to my work study position at UH while I was attending school.

And believe me...there are more cute girls at a 4 year college then any hospital so maybe you can maneuver just fine there. I also credit meeting my current wife from my time spent at college.

You will find so many things at a 4 year school...and if you think choosing a career is difficult....wait till your advisor says.... So Doc... what do you want to "Major" in? You may find yourself saying... "Computers"

I'm not saying that a college degree is your key to finding your career... it does give a good opportunity to explore many options while educating yourself though.

Best of luck.

[tikiyaki]

....OR....You can start your own business.

You have extensive knowledge in one of the most significant and powerful tools in the universe right now. Computers.
The computer is the home base and proprietary force for nearly everything these days, except for maybe manual labor, and slinging hash.

Get a book like this...

http://www.amazon.com/Getting-Rich-Your-Underwear-Profitable/dp/0967162483/sr=8-14/qid=1162914246/ref=sr_1_14/002-3647441-2075204?ie=UTF8&s=books

Depending on the type of person you are, you may be much happier being a "chief" than an "indian" (please excuse any racial implications of that statement...it's a saying:-)

After years of working for people, I discovered that I fail to be a good employee in almost all situations. I discovered I'd much rather have clients than a boss

It's not for everyone. Like someone I know said...alot of times I'm self employed, sometimes I'm self UNemployed....it gets stressful, but rewarding too, and usually you have to do a bunch of different things to supplement your income...ie: I do music : composing, recording, CD mastering, whatever people will pay me to do, but I do graphic art too. Here's the thing...It's ALL computer based too.

Whatever it is, you should enjoy it, and it seems alot less like work that way.

[1stwahine]

....OR....You can start your own business.

You have extensive knowledge in one of the most significant and powerful tools in the universe right now. Computers.
The computer is the home base and proprietary force for nearly everything these days, except for maybe manual labor, and slinging hash.

Whatever it is, you should enjoy it, and it seems alot less like work that way.

Now...that's what I call EXCELLENT ADVICE!:D

Like Tikiyaki said, you already have the "knowledge!" All you gotta do is find what you enjoy and bring the two together.;) So much out there ~ the World is at your fingertips!

It's waiting foa you Adrian!:)

Auntie Lynn

[JAvendan]

hey doc,

i've tried to reply your post a few time already but i kept cancelling the post.

... so here goes!!!

there are so many different things you can do with computer and in the computer industry.

i believe you are working in a store doing sales and support - destop and some networking.

that's great and that's a start.

i know you've posted files and pages to the web so you have experience with that.

how about system administration? - user/group admin, network resources like file and print sharing, network services like http, ftp, etc?

you mentioned photos and movies - so, you've created/authored dvds??

the computer field/industry is huge and there are so many things available but you have to be in the right place and the right time - i really believe that.

you may have to leave the shop - go to school to further your education/experience... maybe find a place that can offer you a wide variety of computer related jobs so you can decide what you like and don't like.

i worked in a libary early on and learned about dos based machines - x86 - moving to windows 3.1 <--- i think i just dated myself - lol. i also worked in a mac service shop and learned everything i could about macs.

eventually, i learned about networking and networking operating systems in a corporate/business environment. very lucky as i was doing the same things the the "full" time guys were doing.

i then moved on to unix system administration and now microsoft networking.

in short keep your eyes open for different opportunities!!!

learn learn learn and enjoy life... pick up a few activiites outside computers.

i have two daughters and a loving wife. i spent a great deal of time with them and very much enjoy their company!!!

i have taken up ukulele and hula... gotta mix it up to stay fresh.

good luck, brah.

joel

[Pua'i Mana'o]

<puts on some Inner Circle>

I've been watching you

C'mon!

Hey!

Standing across the room
I saw you smile
Said I want to talk to you-oo-oo
For a little while
But before I make my move
My emotions start running wild
My tongue gets tied
And that's no lie...--

crap, wrong song. But good vibe. Becaaaaause....the fact remains that I HAVE been watching you. Here, on HT. You have asked many fabulous questions. Even in the thick of things, you look for solutions, that next lilypad etc, and give me the impression that you are always trying to get a step ahead.

Good for you, Adrian. You already possess a skill set that many people never develop. Critical thinking skills will float your boat regardless of what the tide brings in.

So that's the good part. The obstacles you face (common to The Brilliant Ones among Us) will be: 1)the grit to pay your dues 2)the patience to pay your dues 3)earning respect for paying your dues.

So take the advice regarding college. Consider the prudence of starting your own business. But NEVER forget that those dues are what will shape both your character and your earning power.

I want to also recommend that you work as a waiter at some time in your life. It is among the most noble professions from which you will face many, many learning opportunities. You must learn, at some point in your life, how to serve others on their terms. I daresay that some of the most emotionally and socially intelligent people I've ever come across consider their memories working as waithelp among their most sober learning experiences. And if you don't have the courage to work in a restaurant, the military is a comparable alternative. I sh*t thee not.

Then, read "Rich Dad, Poor Dad". But not until you have worked at least 6mo. as a waiter, or been in the Guard for a year.

[craigwatanabe]

Go on Welfare. Obtain an EBT card. Get Quest.

Or you can think about your life as a young adult with an open book and start filling in the pages with experiences.

Right out of high school I joined the Air Force in the field of electronics. Getting out I got a job with Kaimuki Typewriter fixing copy machines and desktop calculators. Then I went to work for Data Dimensions fixing and installing dumb terminals and Digital VAX and HP 3000 mainframe computer systems. I hated electronics after that but like you that's pretty much all I knew outside my Audio/visual certification I got from Kalani High school (true geek).

Then I got a job with PRI (the Gas Company) as an Instrumentation Calibration Technician, thinking I was going to calibrate precision electronics. No that was a glorified term for gas meter/regulator repair technician. So for the next 22 years I fixed and calibrated gas meters and regulators you see from your home to industrial plants. I hated that job from day one because it wasn't what I knew. But the pay was fantastic.

I also started working in radio (my love besides my wife and kids and my 1989 BMW 635 Csi), became a professional photographer and tried a multitude of multi-level marketing businesses.

Then I left all that to come to the Big Island to settle down at age 44. That's when I found what I love to do best...retail. I started working for Home Depot part time for the benefits but the reality is I get to talk to people and help them with their building projects. I get paid to talk to people!

I love to talk! But I couldn't build a dog house that could stay up in a typical trade wind breeze. I didn't know the difference between a 3D Brite finish nail and a 16D Galvy box nail. I knew what a drill was but I didn't know the difference between a Dewalt versus a Ridgid.

I came in with no experience with retailing (no sales experience other than my own marketing company Starcomm Hawaii), and very little hardware experience other than watching HGTV every Saturday mornings. But from my customers and a lot of training from Home Depot, I became very adept at hardware and home improvement. So much so that customers come in asking for me instead of some other sales associate because of what I've learned and applied.

I wish I had found retailing at a home improvement center earlier in my life because this is what I truly enjoy doing.

Adrian you're young and your life is like an open book. Maybe computers isn't your field as it wasn't mine but don't waste 22 years figuring that out. It's good that you understand that what you're doing now isn't what you want to do passionately.

Really now is the time to go out and try other fields. Even those jobs you'd never think of taking! But like Scrivner mentioned, get that 4-year degree. I tell my boys I don't care if it's a degree in basketweaving, the college experience is one that is necessary and will help guide you in your endevours.

You can listen to your peers but they only know what you know. Here on HT you have a wealth of knowledgable people who have done a million things and made as many mistakes. You can learn from our experiences so you can be successful as you grow.

Maybe we can call this the Adrian Project and get you fast tracked to success. I'm sure we all here know of someone who can get people on the inside.

This would be interesting and fullfilling at the same time. Our combined talents and network of people should be able jump start anyone's career here in Hawaii and abroad.

[adrian]

Adrian, advice in this area is kinda like belly-buttons: Everyone's got it, but each looks a bit different from the others. You're going to get tons of advice about this, but I've actually been thinking about this for you for years. So just listen to me, 'cause I'm the man.

Get a Bachelor's degree.

Go to a four-year institution (we have several on this island, not to mention those on neighbor islands), take a bunch of courses you never thought you'd want to take, with a heavy emphasis on liberal arts, and discover yourself. That's what a college education is all about: Figuring out who you are and what matters to you and where you fit in.

You might get some flack, especially from those people who paid for your Associate's degree. Don't let that get in the way. The single best thing I ever did for myself was get a B.A., and I'll feel the same even when I complete this blasted M.Ed. I'm working on now.

So go to college. Read Kierkegaard. Look through a telescope. Paint your self-portrait. Examine rocks. Argue with a women's studies major (but not too much). Make up excuses for missing due dates. Get a little too friendly with a business major. And yeah, take a few computer courses. It's one of the best of the selfish things you'll ever do.
I never thought of going (back) to school. But while I was in college, I really struggled in math, and that what held me back. I'm just afraid that if I go back to school then I'll have to repeat that, have more stress, and go through the same thing I went through last time (mainly depression).

....OR....You can start your own business.

I tried that, and now I'm working for someone who's "in my territory".


Again, thanks guys for your support and ideas. Whenever I'm in a jam, I know I can count on this community for support.

I just need something to stimulate my life.

[craigwatanabe]

I never thought of going (back) to school. But while I was in college, I really struggled in math, and that what held me back. I'm just afraid that if I go back to school then I'll have to repeat that, have more stress, and go through the same thing I went through last time (mainly depression).


I tried that, and now I'm working for someone who's "in my territory".


Again, thanks guys for your support and ideas. Whenever I'm in a jam, I know I can count on this community for support.

I just need something to stimulate my life.

You need to date Madazza when she's on the patch! That'll stimulate your life:D

[Hellbent]

I want to also recommend that you work as a waiter at some time in your life. It is among the most noble professions from which you will face many, many learning opportunities. You must learn, at some point in your life, how to serve others on their terms. I daresay that some of the most emotionally and socially intelligent people I've ever come across consider their memories working as waithelp among their most sober learning experiences. And if you don't have the courage to work in a restaurant, the military is a comparable alternative. I sh*t thee not.


what, do you hate him or what? working restaurant service sucks. tips are great if you work in a good place and are competant, and I do think everyone should work as a waiter when they are younger, but i wouldnt really wish it on anyone =p

i would suggest you try working somewhere else, especially not a place that cant afford chairs, security cameras, or counterfeit detection pens.

[Pua'i Mana'o]

what, do you hate him or what? working restaurant service sucks. tips are great if you work in a good place and are competant, and I do think everyone should work as a waiter when they are younger, but i wouldnt really wish it on anyone =p

i would suggest you try working somewhere else, especially not a place that cant afford chairs, security cameras, or counterfeit detection pens.

Have you worked in that industry? And "it sucks...you wouldn't really wish it on anyone..." is all you can say about it?

Your summation is a fine example of leading the horse to water, but not being able to make him drink.

[Leo Lakio]

I want to also recommend that you work as a waiter at some time in your life. It is among the most noble professions from which you will face many, many learning opportunities. You must learn, at some point in your life, how to serve others on their terms.I'd have to second this idea. So many countries require a minimum term of military service - I think we should require a term in the food service industry. It is educational, enlightening, humbling, and will teach respect for those who we encounter in all service industries. You'll never be nasty to waitstaff again.

Next step - learning (as a society) to respect our educators better...but that's another thread.

[craigwatanabe]

It's not so much as it sucks, but it's the humility of serving others that makes you a better person.

You appreciate the better jobs out there because you've been thru those jobs from hell.

The military is also an excellent place to launch a career not from doing the 20-years in it but to gain the discipline and dedication to one's self worth and work ethic that can be applied to other career paths.

You don't get to the top by wishing it...you earn it!

[Pua'i Mana'o]

Mahalo, Leo and Craig, for your clarifications. Beautifully made.

[Miulang]

I consider a young person between the ages of 18-30 to be in "apprenticeship" for a career. It's a time to figure out what you DON'T want to be more than it is what you DO want to spend the next 20-30 years doing. So it's perfectly acceptable to go out and try out different jobs in different industries at that age.

In my case, I knew even in high school what industry I wanted to spend my career in, and at the time, I thought I knew what I wanted to do. In the succeeding years, though, my dream morphed and I worked in clinical and research laboratories, publishing, international development fundraising, socially responsible investments, telecommunications and IT...and most of the jobs had some tie to healthcare. I have never regretted working at any of the jobs I had because in my case, all these experiences have helped make me who I am, and now I have come full circle and am looking for a position that will allow me to help make basic health care accessible to the millions of people who cannot afford it. Along the way, I also received a BS in Journalism (:D ), a Master of Health Administration and a certificate in Project Management.

To me, a formal education is valuable, not because of what you read in your textbooks, but what it does for you as an individual: it teaches you critical thinking, it teaches you that you don't need to know everything but you learrn how to find out what you don't know, and it's a chance to interact with people who don't necessarily always think, talk or act the way you do.

But life experiences are also important. So Adrian, even if it may get boring some days at the shop, my advice to you is to try and stick it out for at least a year. Learn all you can from your boss (both the good and the bad) so if you ever decide to go into business for yourself, you'll know how to do things better than he did. With the exception of maybe waiting tables or working for a temp agency, prospective employers frown on job hoppers.

And if you really have no clue about what you want to do next, go over to the Career Kokua (http://www.careerkokua.org/)website that the State has set up for all Hawai'i residents. This site has preference tests you can take for free and lists basic job descriptions for hundreds of jobs. The 2 tabs that will be of particular interest to you are the ones labeled "Career Assessment" and "Career Exploration". By using the resources that you're paying for, you can try to be a little more rigorous in your exploration and not so hit-and-miss.

If you want to go back to school, I say go for it. You proved to yourself that you could succeed in those classes you had a tough time in. And always remember that there are all kinds of resources available to help you. You don't have to do things all by yourself.

Good luck!
Miulang

[Leo Lakio]

If Adrian doesn't mind my putting a new spin here...what advice would you give to someone asking that same question, but they are pushing 50?

After decades of satisfaction in variations of a particular career, they are thinking "what else should I pursue, while there's still time?"

Aaaaaand...GO!

[Miulang]

If Adrian doesn't mind my putting a new spin here...what advice would you give to someone asking that same question, but they are pushing 50?

After decades of satisfaction in variations of a particular career, they are thinking "what else should I pursue, while there's still time?"

Aaaaaand...GO!
ahhhh...if you mean you, Leo, the State of WA also has a comparable website to KokuaCare on Worksource (https://fortress.wa.gov/esd/worksource/Employment.aspx)(I've used it myself). I would take the preference tests and then look at the job descriptions.

Approaching 50 is a precarious time to be in the job market...too young to retire and too old to be considered for entry level positions! Many companies, when faced with cost cutting, will "retire" their older workers with the most experience (a severance package will cost them less than to keep you employed with bennies for another 10 years). There is also subtle age discrimination still (the reason why they tell you never to put your age, date of birth or date you received your degrees on your resume) which is really kind of sad because experienced workers tend to work harder (and smarter) than younger employees.

Can you afford to work part time? Do you need medical insurance? Do you have a sugar daddy/mommy who can support you?:D

I think a lot of people who look for things to do when they are in their 50s are following their passion, and not worried so much about making the big bucks. I know many who, discouraged by the age discrimination bias, end up setting up small businesses in something they were doing on the side as a hobby anyway.

In any case, according to some gerontologists, the human body, if taken care of, can last 120 years. If that's the case, turning 50 does not make you over the hill!:cool:

Miulang

[Bard]

I personally think that any age is a fine time to do soul-searching and look for a new career or hobbies. :) Keeps the mind fresh and exercised. My wife's grandfather has been about 10 different things in his years (I mean really different things.. can't remember them all now, but he's currently a pastor). My uncle was in the Navy, worked in telecomm for a while, had a ranch in Colorado, had a farm on Kaua`i, and I think now he's back in telecomm... he's pushing 60 and rides Harleys with a motorcycle club. :D

I should also say I've been doing computer crud for a good 20 years now, got my degree in it, yadda yadda.. sooo ready to move on. I feel your pain Adrian. ;) I'm starting into art now.

[Konaguy]

I never thought of going (back) to school. But while I was in college, I really struggled in math, and that what held me back. I'm just afraid that if I go back to school then I'll have to repeat that, have more stress, and go through the same thing I went through last time (mainly depression).


You know Adrian, in a way I'm in the same situation as you. I am really weak in math also. But I'm very good with computers.

That being said, I'm 30 (almost 31) and really have no clue what I want to do with my life. I really don't want to be doing retailing forever. Thus I'm very perplexed what to do.

I can understand your apprehension about going back to school.I only went to college for a year about 12 years ago. I really didn't take it very seriously at the time.

In short, you are not the only one who is going through this.

[manoasurfer123]

If Adrian doesn't mind my putting a new spin here...what advice would you give to someone asking that same question, but they are pushing 50?

After decades of satisfaction in variations of a particular career, they are thinking "what else should I pursue, while there's still time?"

Aaaaaand...GO!
If were talking about you...Come Hawaii!

Beachboy seems to make some pretty good cash:p
Just watch out for any foot infections:rolleyes:

[Hellbent]

Have you worked in that industry? And "it sucks...you wouldn't really wish it on anyone..." is all you can say about it?

Your summation is a fine example of leading the horse to water, but not being able to make him drink.

Allow me to elaborate. I worked a variety of jobs in the food service industry when I was 19-24. I have worked as a dish washer, busboy, waiter, coctail server, and barback. I have made $100+ a night in tips. I have also made $20 a night in tips. I have worked in a strip bar, a lounge, a country club, a karaoke bar, and a restaurant. I have gotten off at 4am to go to home home, make breakfast, wake up the gf of the time and go to sleep to wake up like a vampire at 5pm.
Its great fun when youre younger, but after awhile it gets old. I dont think subservience is a great thing to learn, (but a useful skill sometimes nontheless). Have you ever seen the movie 'waiting...'? You could have good service but still get shafted on the tip.
I agree that everyone should serve in either the army or as a waiter when they are young. I was actually thinking that when I first posted, I just dont think its the greastest job unless youre a sommelier in a fine dinning restaurant.

[Pua'i Mana'o]

Let's review:

My suggestion for Adrian to enter into the food service industry was not based on the notion that it would afford him a satisfying future.

It is to build his character.

To learn to serve others on their terms.

To learn about people by interacting with all walks of life. On short notice. When they are fuggah-hungry.

To learn how to bust ass under stressful circumstances, to come up with solutions on a moment's notice, and to learn all of these skills relatively inexpensively (e.g. breaking a motherboard isn't in the same realm as breaking a plate with a lobster tail on it).

To learn what it means to be exploited labor. Supervised often by people with little training in the areas of HR, and know nothing about labor law.

Its noble. Freaking. Work. And even when you become wealthy enough to buy out the joint if you so desired, the lessons learned "way back when" are on par (in terms of useful application) with any MA-Psych degree. Look at the most well-rounded folk in their mid-career points. The coolest ones worked their way up the ladder. And how many of them schlepped in these fields, as I have described?

I mention it because Adrian already demonstrates the brains to figure a lot of things out. He would completely benefit by adding some of these experiences to his resume. Y'know, shore up his balls some. And what young man couldn't benefit from some shoring up of his balls? (Female application: lace up our ovaries).

Hell, hun, have I made myself clearer?

;)

[tikiyaki]

Not to derail this thread too much, but a few mentions have been made to being a little burnt on the computer based job. As someone who spends probably 75% of his day on the computer, I find myself thinking that doing something non-computer oriented would be a refreshing break. Not to mention, my perfect vision I maintained into my early 40's is starting to become less than perfect.

Anyone else feel this way ? I'm starting to feel that doing something else besides sitting in front of a computer all day would be a nice change.Something dealing with people or outside. Especially for people on the Islands, where being outdoors is a huge treat.

I'm actually taking some action on that notion and taking a busness course at the local college soon. I dropped out of college after one year to pursue rock stardom....Yea, real smart I know, but I got a different kind of education. Either way, going back to learn some basic business courses is intriguing to me, as I have this other dream now....

[tutusue]

Adrian, am I remembering correctly that you have quite a low threshhold for stress? If so, that will surely influence the choices you make.

[Hellbent]

Lets start over -
"How can I start a new career?"
What are you hobbies? You can always take night classes and pursue photography or videography. Perhaps you could get a job in that field, and that may become a career. Like alot of the examples given here, my friend had a successful business as a massage therapist, then closed that and got into the wedding video market, which he does well at now. So its possible that you could 'take a break' and explore other fields, especially before you get older and burdened down with responsibilities (mortgage, kids, etc) if you already arent.

[Bard]

Anyone else feel this way ? I'm starting to feel that doing something else besides sitting in front of a computer all day would be a nice change.Something dealing with people or outside.

YES.

I've put 1400+ miles on my bike in the last couple of years for this very reason. And I'm (foolishly) attempting to make a graphic novel now ;)

Pua'i, I'm totally with you on the character-building labor, though I've never been a waiter. If things turn south for me some day that may be in my future. ;) But there are plenty of equivalents to wait-staffing in the computer world. Internships (or heck, even regular jobs) at the wrong game company are one good one. I've had a few *cough* character building exercises at a few jobs of mine over the years... I don't even want to tell you guys about one boss I had for a couple of months until I got outta there. The memories are too awful. Last I heard he was heading to Hawai`i... :D For you guys' sakes I kinda hope he didn't make it (or he improved).

[manoasurfer123]

Doc - you mentioned you were in some sort of police scouts thing when you were younger...

What about joining HPD's Police Academy and attempting to become an officer?

[1stwahine]

It is to build his character.

To learn to serve others on their terms.

To learn about people by interacting with all walks of life. On short notice. When they are fuggah-hungry.

To learn how to bust ass under stressful circumstances, to come up with solutions on a moment's notice, and to learn all of these skills relatively inexpensively (e.g. breaking a motherboard isn't in the same realm as breaking a plate with a lobster tail on it).

To learn what it means to be exploited labor. Supervised often by people with little training in the areas of HR, and know nothing about labor law.

Its noble. Freaking. Work. And even when you become wealthy enough to buy out the joint if you so desired, the lessons learned "way back when" are on par (in terms of useful application) with any MA-Psych degree. Look at the most well-rounded folk in their mid-career points. The coolest ones worked their way up the ladder. And how many of them schlepped in these fields, as I have described?

I agree wholeheartedly with Tita Pua'i Mana'o! It is from the Food Industry and many years of serving customers that I have learned many people skills. All what she described above is right on the money.:D

And another thing...as Tikiyaki suggests, finding something to do other than staying in front of your computer is essential. For me ~ I like to Volunteer, spend my time with MAMA and my grandchildren. Ok. Ok. Yeah ~ and Chinatown!;)

I know Adrian and I know his work personally. He has heart and is determined to succeed. He will. It is good that he has a network of friends like us. Really. Ones who really care and want him to succeed in Life. Over the years, we watched him as he struggled. We were there when he announced his graduation. We will be there as he continues to search and explore what he seeks...until the day he finds it!;)

Love and Aloha

Auntie Lynn

[shaveice]

it's almost a cliche now but there's the old suggestion that one consider the things that one really enjoys doing and then finding someone to pay you for doing what you enjoy.

another thing to consider is checking out a book on job descriptions. centuries ago, i used to work at the unemployment office and there was this fat book that listed practically every job around. i'm sure that book still exists though i don't know the title of it; if you give them a call or drop by an office, they can easily show you the book. it may give you some ideas of jobs that you didn't know existed.

and, of course, that's related to the next point which is talking to people and finding out what they do. most jobs you already know about but there may be some jobs that may interest you if you just knew about them.

(i've accompanied my friend to adrian's shop--3x? within the last week--and i'll be sorry to see him leave if/when he does.)

[Pua'i Mana'o]

it's almost a cliche now but there's the old suggestion that one consider the things that one really enjoys doing and then finding someone to pay you for doing what you enjoy.


there's also something to be said for facing fears. Doing things that we've either no interest in nor aptitude for. No tolerance for stress? Develop it. No aptitude for math? Try it for a couple of semesters (helllooo modern algebra). No artistic skill? Cull it. It makes for a more well-rounded, fearless person.

In other words, I am not giving suggestions for Adrian's future career (even though these might lead up to that destination), but for his walkabout.

[scrivener]

Adrian:

About the math thing. There are a LOT of people like that. I teach a bunch of them every year. If you let the math thing get in the way of your education, you're foolish. Yeah, you'll struggle, and yeah, it might cause you stress, but there are ways around that.

First, if you're not going to major in math, you don't have to take it for a letter grade. Take it for pass/fail. That will relieve a LOT of stress.

Second, many universities give certain options for non-math people. For example, you can take a philosophy course called "symbolic logic" or just "logic," and at many schools that will count as one math credit. For non-math majors, that's usually half your math requirement. Some schools let you use a computer programming course for a math credit, because programming is really the practice of logical thinking. Others let you take something called "applied mathematics" or something like that. It basically teaches you some real-world applications and gives you the formulae; all you have to do is learn to identify the variables and plug them into your formulae, most of the time on open-note tests. Seriously.

Finally, there's all kinds of support in place, and the offer I made to help you with math still stands. There are a lot of other people, on campus, who get paid to help non-mathy people to struggle through their courses.

Hey. I didn't say it would be easy. I took eight years to get my freaking four-year degree, and I'm no dufus. But I stuck with it, I made some great friends (some of whom you know on HT), and I learned so very, very, very much. And you know what? Having that piece of paper is almost everything. Nobody ever asks me about the THREE TIMES I failed calculus 1 (after getting As in it in high school), the TWO TIMES I failed Japanese 101 (despite having studied it for five years in elementary and high school), the TWO TIMES I failed Philosophy 100 (before finding the greatest philosophy professor in the whole world), or the numerous other classes I tried and failed.

Wait a minute. Maybe I am a dufus.

But I'm a dufus with a college degree. Big difference.

ps: they have this bogus major called "communications" which is a real four-year degree, and in it you get to play with cameras and video equipment. you'll take your courses with a lot of jocks and other people who don't really know what they want to do but who want a real degree.

[Palolo Joe]

ps: they have this bogus major called "communications" which is a real four-year degree, and in it you get to play with cameras and video equipment. you'll take your courses with a lot of jocks and other people who don't really know what they want to do but who want a real degree.
Geez, Scriv... twice in one thread. I agreed with your advice earlier to Adrian, until I got the whole "listen to me because I'm the man" disclaimer at the end.

And now this bullcrap? I didn't major in communications, but it's far from a "bogus" course of study. There are a number of good programs across the country that offer quality classes that can actually teach you something.

I wish I had the time/resources to fail entry-level courses and take them again. I had exactly eight semesters (plus whatever summer school I could afford) to get in, get my degree, and get out.

Why four years? Because that's all my financial aid package could pay for.

[scrivener]

:)

I was mostly taking a jab at a friend who sometimes browses HT when I wrote that. I don't know if I ever mentioned it, but I was an undeclared communications major for a little bit (long enough to take two courses and then move on to something else), and I was mostly playing when I called it a bogus major. It's not.

I won't deny that there are certain majors I consider less scholarly, and some of the communications major falls into that category, but that's my opinion and I can't pretend it's not.

Anyway, peace. I still think Adrian should strongly consider a four-year degree.


(and the I'm the Man stuff was just silly posturing...I guess that didn't come across either...)

[tikiyaki]

MATH ! OY !

I have this theory that there are 2 kinds of people when it comes to learning. MATH people and ENGLISH people.

Math people are of the more logical type, English are more the creative thinkers. Math people excel in business type jobs, English people in creative arts etc.
Math comes really easy to certain people, like it's 2 different sides of the brain that are used. Math and science were always tough for me, but things like spelling and grammar were super easy, and I'm much more of a creative person than a logical, practical thinker. I know other people like this as well.

It's just a personal thoery of mine, and an observation when it comes to learning.

[nachodaddy]

Adri,

I see a lot of tiptoeing, a lot of carefully crafted responses here, so forgive me for being just a little blunt.

Join the military. Room and board for four years, GI Bill when you get out, 30 days vacation a year.

EVERYTHING that you need, and to some degree are lacking, can be found there.

You don't have to bayonet babies either. Your two year degree actually means something. You can play with all the computers you want.

You like living at home? You like having a crappy job? Better yet, can you at this time, in your head (and your pocketbook), commit to a four year college?

I run into guys all the time that I knew back in my military days and I am constantly amazed of how far they have gotten in life just because they enlisted and stuck to it. You don't have to make the military a career. Four years is nothing. It is what you do with it..........

You seem like a nice guy, just need some focus.

PM me if you want details and want to take it offline. We are discussing your life here, I can understand if you don't want it in the public domain.

[Bard]

Join the military. Room and board for four years, GI Bill when you get out, 30 days vacation a year.

Assuming you actually get out. Right now might not be the best time to join up with the military just for a free degree.

Might also consider something like the Navy Reserves though.. I have a friend who went into that for computer stuff. He had to go through boot camp and all that, but because he was in the Reserves he got booted up in rank immediately, and now he does tech stuff for them. He wanted to spend time in Japan and he's gotten to do just that because of his language skills, and they're paying for him to finish college with a Japanese degree. My dad was in the Navy Reserves for quite a while when he was younger, too, and he got to travel all over.

You just have to keep in mind that one caveat, they *are* hiring you for a potentially unpleasant task...

[sinjin]

1. Quit your present job two weeks from today.

2. Get a job working with your hands preferably outdoors. Building rockwalls with the Tongans would be perfect. Save your money for six months.

3. Buy backpack and fly to Europe or Asia. Stay at least three months but a year would be better.

4. Come back home and take Scriv's advice.

[nachodaddy]

Correct, it is very important that you know exactly what you are getting into before you sign on the bottom line. That requires some assistance when dealing with the recruiter.

Reserves is not the answer. You can still get put into unpleasant situations.

[Leo Lakio]

they have this bogus major called "communications" which is a real four-year degreeFWIW, while still in college, I started working in radio - which then became my uninterrupted career for nineteen years, the last decade as a producer of national radio programming. Since leaving radio (as a paid gig - I still volunteer), I've spent more than a decade as a professional music programmer, with a few side trips into producing albums.

My degree? A two-year Associate of Arts in Communications Media from a community college in the Midwest.

Not to knock the advice given to Adrian regarding a four-year degree, but it's not the answer for everybody.

[scrivener]

But Leo, it sounds like you knew what you wanted. Adrian doesn't know what he wants, and it's for that reason that I recommend a liberal arts education. I'm not saying that college is for everybody (it isn't), but I am saying that, based on what I've learned about him in the few years I've known him here, the pursuit of a liberal arts education would at least expose him to a bunch of stuff he never even would have considered.

[Leo Lakio]

No argument there, Scrivener. I knew from an early age that music and communications were where I wanted to go, and I didn't care about the money. I was never "rich," but today, I have no debt except for a mortgage (and that's a good debt to have.)

Adrian, Scrivener is right in that college will provide you with opportunities to try new experiences - you might even find that it reinforces your desire to stay with computer work, and helps you refine the areas where you would want to specialize. But Palolo Joe is right in that there are financial constraints that may prevent you from taking much time for experimentation.

Maybe you should get a food-service job to pay while you attend college - and that will neatly tie together several points of this thread (except the military one...I can't give you advice on that front.)

[craigwatanabe]

One of the coolest jobs in radio was Michael T's job when he was the music director for KIKI back when it was a top 40 station on the AM dial back in the 80's.

Now that's a fun job:D

[Palolo Joe]

That requires some assistance when dealing with the recruiter.
And that's not mom or dad, Adrian. If the military is something you decide to consider, tread very carefully. Try to find someone who has gone through the process to help you avoid the pitfalls.

The military is a good option. But unless you're willing to fight the "war on terror," I'd suggest thinking long and hard about enlisting. You literally sign your life away. The government owns you.

And Scriv, no worries brah. It's just my bullsheeeeeit meter was going beserk with those particular lines you wrote...

[craigwatanabe]

Correct, it is very important that you know exactly what you are getting into before you sign on the bottom line. That requires some assistance when dealing with the recruiter.

Reserves is not the answer. You can still get put into unpleasant situations.

Please don't mention recruiter with the military. I am proud of having served in the military, but I despise my recruiter for lying to me about how much fun it is to be in Basic Training.

I put military recruiters right along side the "sleazy used car salesman". My advice for anyone going into the military is to: Know what you want to do and know where you want to do it. If you don't subscribe to either of those then the military will place you where ever they want and having you do whatever they desire.

There are hundreds of jobs available in every branch of the military and most of them don't require you to tote an M-16 daily for survival. You can do a stint in the military (even the Army) and not see a day in Iraq, so if you choose the military, talk to those who have been in it. Use the recruiter only when you've made up your mind what you want to do and where you want to do it when making the decision to join.

[nachodaddy]

I am proud of having served in the military, but I despise my recruiter for lying to me about how much fun it is to be in Basic Training.



That sucks Craig, really. "Fun" does not equal the hardest thing you have done in your life up to that point.

You give great advice, no one should be at the mercy of a recruiter. My advice is in the same vein as yours: get informed and get help even before you see the recruiter. They still have to process ya so you can't avoid them forever but having a plan before you see them is crucial.

[WindwardOahuRN]

I have this theory that there are 2 kinds of people when it comes to learning. MATH people and ENGLISH people.

Math people are of the more logical type, English are more the creative thinkers. Math people excel in business type jobs, English people in creative arts etc.
Math comes really easy to certain people, like it's 2 different sides of the brain that are used.
It's just a personal thoery of mine, and an observation when it comes to learning.

It's a well-known fact, the "left-brain/right-brain" thing. Different functions are controlled by different areas of the brain, areas that have been mapped by neurologists..

And you're right---the people to whom math comes easy do have a more dominant side of their brain---the left side. It's considered the more logical, practical. The right-brained people are considered to be more emotion-based and imaginative.

Here's an article with a fun "Hemispheric Brain Dominance Test": :)

http://brain.web-us.com/brain/LRBrain.html

[craigwatanabe]

Then you have people that either use both or none...they're called "Moderates":D

The problem with straddling the fence or being in the middle of the road is 1) you'll have a picket fence post up your ass and 2) those who stand in the middle of the road tend to get hit.

But back OT...If I had to choose which side of the brain I'd love to reside my talents in I'd choose the creative side or right brained. That way I can have a flavor for life instead of being the boring engineering type. Life is for living not for computing.

[Pua'i Mana'o]

Cussing out my butt on one of my pet peeves:

I. Cannot. STAND. the insipid relegation of the whole of English and Math into cranial hemispheres!

Left brain writers are business writers. Pithy. Conscise. Ensure that their point is made. Sticklers for spelling, punctuation, grammar and composition. And yes, it is an *art* to be a left brained writer.

Right brain mathematicians are found across the whole spectrum of science. Chemists developing new polymers. Astronomers rethinking the contraction/expansion of the universe. Precision of calculation is the means, but invention and epiphany is the goal.

Arithemetic is left-brained. Higher mathematics is right. There are a helluvalot of bookkeepers who couldn't bang an integral to save their lives. Likewise, there are a myriad of writers who couldn't come up with the critical content of a manual regardless of their intimacy with the subject.

Left and right brained, indeed.

</hissing on sweeping generalizations>

[craigwatanabe]

Left and right brained, indeed.

</hissing on sweeping generalizations>

But better than having no brain right?:D

Eh Pua'i Mana'o, come on down to Home Depot one evening and we go talk story. :)

[WindwardOahuRN]

Cussing out my butt on one of my pet peeves:

I. Cannot. STAND. the insipid relegation of the whole of English and Math into cranial hemispheres!

Left brain writers are business writers. Pithy. Conscise. Ensure that their point is made. Sticklers for spelling, punctuation, grammar and composition. And yes, it is an *art* to be a left brained writer.

Right brain mathematicians are found across the whole spectrum of science. Chemists developing new polymers. Astronomers rethinking the contraction/expansion of the universe. Precision of calculation is the means, but invention and epiphany is the goal.

Arithemetic is left-brained. Higher mathematics is right. There are a helluvalot of bookkeepers who couldn't bang an integral to save their lives. Likewise, there are a myriad of writers who couldn't come up with the critical content of a manual regardless of their intimacy with the subject.

Left and right brained, indeed.

</hissing on sweeping generalizations>

LOL. There IS a dominance factor but it doesn't amount to a total dictatorship of the brain by one side or the other. Both sides of the brain are involved in different aspects of language and math processing.

Complicated, as evidenced by neuro-mapping and the ability of another area of the brain to take over functions previously assigned to other areas when needed (sometimes).

[Pua'i Mana'o]

But better than having no brain right?:D

Eh Pua'i Mana'o, come on down to Home Depot one evening and we go talk story. :)

I'll be in Kona through Sunday and in Hilo on Mon. PM your schedule and I will be the gal walking in with two cups of java from MikiDi!

[craigwatanabe]

I'll be in Kona through Sunday and in Hilo on Mon. PM your schedule and I will be the gal walking in with two cups of java from MikiDi!

Next week I'll be in Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday evenings 6pm to closing, Hardware department. I'm Craig Sr. There's another Craig in our department but he's the younger one so he's Junior.