Westboro Baptist Church Protests

[kani-lehua]

"many mixed feelings at farrington high school as westboro baptist church demontrators tried to make their opinions clear to the public. 5/18/08"

http://www.kitv.com/video_legacy/16324478/index.html

apparently they are NOT feeling the aloha.

[kstephen]

yes, they are from Kansas (as i am) but we Kansans have been putting up with the Phelps, their "church" and their protests for a long while. they have protested at the college where i work and the college where my husband works. even in our small town, they had to take security measures at a funeral for a local boy that died in Iraq because they protest at soldiers' funerals too. i don't know anyone who can stand them.

BBC did a documentary and a reporter lived with them and did his report.
its on youtube. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbZHwtsBmWE)

if this is your first encounter with them,
I'm sorry you had to experience it.
life is good until the Phelps come along and protest in your neighborhood.
they are lunatics.
kerri

[LikaNui]

Yes, they're lunatics.
The news has reported that their "church" consists of only three families. Three. That's not a church -- it's a cult. :mad:
And they drag their children into their protests too. :mad:
Idiots. Just... frickin' IDIOTS, all of 'em.

[MyopicJoe]

LMFAO xD

I can imagine their strategic planning the year prior:

A: Dangit, it's too cold to protest up here.
B: Yeah, spreading hate is too uncomfortable.
A: We should protest in Hawaii. It's a lot warmer.
B: Oh boy! I want to learn to surf. Think we can use it as a tax write-off?
A: Oh yeah, no problem. As long as we get one protest on the news and keep all our receipts.
C: Excuse me. With the current price of oil, airplane tickets to Hawaii will be expensive.
A: Bah! God shall provide. Someone will throw a bottle at us or something. I figure we can squeeze out 5 law suits in two weeks.
B: Yeah, and if we need some cash, Frankie will front us if we fax him the filings.
A: Exactly. Motion to vacation in Hawaii next year. All in favor, say "Aye".


Louis Theroux has done a bunch of documentaries for the BBC. The guy's awesome. He lived with the Westboro folks for three weeks to do his piece. I don't think I could endure being around them that much. Needless to say it'll be disturbing to some:

Part 1/6 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbZHwtsBmWE)
Part 2/6 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OwdTARbpzZA)
Part 3/6 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G-mWnnbkkec)
Part 4/6 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bmUNdQtur0s)
Part 5/6 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQYiaPkgVzI)
Part 6/6 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=45IOOdkLvB4)

[MyopicJoe]

BBC did a documentary and a reporter lived with them and did his report.
its on youtube. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbZHwtsBmWE)

*cheer at Kerri*

Sorry to hear you had to live with them :(

[Peshkwe]

Those are some sick puppies.

What I am surprised at though is that no one has tried to do that group a serious mischief.

[MyopicJoe]

What I am surprised at though is that no one has tried to do that group a serious mischief.

I'm sure people have, but their matriarch is a lawyer. I hear they fund their "church" through law suits.

But they themselves got sued for protesting at a funeral (from Wikipedia):


On March 10 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/March_10), 2006 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006) WBC picketed the funeral of Lance Cpl. Matthew A. Snyder.[54] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westboro_Baptist_Church#cite_note-53)[55] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westboro_Baptist_Church#cite_note-54)[56] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westboro_Baptist_Church#cite_note-55) On June 5 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/June_5), 2006 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006) the Snyder family sued[57] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westboro_Baptist_Church#cite_note-56) Fred Phelps, WBC, and unnamed others for defamation, invasion of privacy, and intentional infliction of emotional distress. On 31 October (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/October_31) 2007 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007), WBC, Fred Phelps (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Phelps) and his two daughters, Shirley Phelps-Roper (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shirley_Phelps-Roper) and Rebecca Phelps-Davis, were found liable for invasion of privacy and intentional infliction of emotional distress. A federal jury awarded Mr. Snyder $2.9 million in compensatory damages, then later added a decision to award $6 million in punitive damages for invasion of privacy and an additional $2 million for causing emotional distress (A total of $10,900,000). The organization said it wouldn't change its message because of the verdict.[58] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westboro_Baptist_Church#cite_note-57)[59] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westboro_Baptist_Church#cite_note-58)[60] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westboro_Baptist_Church#cite_note-59)

...

On February 4 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/February_4), 2008 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008) U.S. District Judge Richard D. Bennett upheld the ruling but reduced the punitive damages from $8 million to $2.1 million. The total judgment now stands at $5 million. An appeal by WBC is still pending.[67] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westboro_Baptist_Church#cite_note-66) Liens (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lien) have been ordered on church buildings and Phelps' law office in an attempt to ensure that the damages are paid.

[helen]

I can imagine their strategic planning the year prior:

A: Dangit, it's too cold to protest up here.
B: Yeah, spreading hate is too uncomfortable.
A: We should protest in Hawaii. It's a lot warmer.
B: Oh boy! I want to learn to surf. Think we can use it as a tax write-off?

This might make sense if they were coming to Hawaii in December, January or February, not in May.

[MyopicJoe]

This might make sense if they were coming to Hawaii in December, January or February, not in May.

lunatics?

:D

[pzarquon]

I think it's ridiculous this group gets half the airtime and media attention it does. A smattering of people from three families in Kansas show up and we point cameras at them? In many communities, they're simply ignored, and that's the most effective response for a group that thrives on provocation.

KHNL did a couple of segments on them, and even aired a whole hand-wringing self-referential piece where they talked about themselves and the debate over covering them at all. Which, of course, was doubly ridiculous.

[Peshkwe]

Are they here to act up randomly or is there a specific target in their sights?

I've heard they've kinda slunk off in a few places where it was made clear to them that police protection wasn't going to be waiting on them hand and foot. To go ahead and protest but if there was trouble to call it in and the police would be there ...eventually.

[Adri]

I'm sure people have, but their matriarch is a lawyer.

Not just the matriarch. A lot of their members are lawyers (or graduated from law school at least, not necessarily the same thing). There is a movement of trying to make "right thinking" lawyers to help these groups attain their goals by manipulating/using the legal system. (Such as Falwell's Liberty's Law School, The Ave Maria School of Law and Robertson's Regent University Law School). However, I believe all the law schools I mention here are more mainstream than the positions taken by by the lawyers/members of the Westboro Baptist Church.

http://www.lawschool.com/falwells.htm

[kani-lehua]

"Other regular anti-homosexual slogans of Westboro include "Homosexuality = Death," "Fags Die, God Laughs," "Matthew Shepard Rots in Hell," "AIDS: Kills Fags Dead" and "Ellen DeGeneres is a Lesbian Slut." (The latter was carried at an "Equality Rocks" rock concert and fundraiser, at the event DeGeneres commented that she wasn't offended so much by the slogan as the fact that they had drawn pockmarks all over her face on the poster.)" as quoted from wikipedia.

you go ellen!


#11 Today, 01:42 PM
Peshkwe
Kumu Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 777

Re: Westboro Baptist Church Protests

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Are they here to act up randomly or is there a specific target in their sights?


it was mentioned, the other targets, but i can only remember one and that's the arizona memorial.

[timkona]

Better to have cameras pointed at your face than rifle barrels. But in Hawaii, everybody knows that cops tend to turn a blind eye toward vigilantism if the street justice is somewhat justified. I'd say these folks are treading a dangerously thin line.

Try Waianae. Or Milolii. Dead lawyers win very few cases.

[AlohaKine]

This whole thing started about 15 years ago when Westboro did its' first picket of Gage park a few blocks from their homes in Topeka. They claimed gay activity was going on in the park. When they picketed it and they got negative reactions. Ever since then they have gotten more and more extreme and offensive. At first it was just Gays, now it's the whole World against them and "God Hates the World" is one of their slogans.

Some serious mental problems going on with this church.

[turtlegirl]

my favorite part of that video was of the counter-protester guy who held the big sign that said "angry sign"!!

Ha!!

Who are these hateful people?! Ten bucks says someone beats these creeps up before they make it back to Kansas!

[Da Rolling Eye]

my favorite part of that video was of the counter-protester guy who held the big sign that said "angry sign"!!

Ha!!

Who are these hateful people?! Ten bucks says someone beats these creeps up before they make it back to Kansas!
Sorry. The Primo Warrior days are long gone. :D

[Peshkwe]

Looks like it was a busy day for em according to the schedule someone posted here:

http://www.kiowapilots.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11130


They're probably heading back to Kansas now...or where ever their next stop is to be.


With all the head wounded guys coming home and guys with the stress, someone's gonna snap and take a few of them out.

[kani-lehua]

there will be no tearful goodbyes. please click your heels together (3x) and repeat, "there's no place like home." this organization/cast of characters (sounds like a white supremacist group masquerading around as a church) needs to follow the yellow brick road home.

got my boot on. ready, set, aim and kick!

kerri, sorry you have to live with them.

[Walkoff Balk]

Did Herman Frazier scheduled Westboro Baptist next year? Then, UH linebackers Adam Leonard and Blaze Soares can knock the hanna butta out of them.

[Random]

With all the head wounded guys coming home and guys with the stress, someone's gonna snap and take a few of them out.
And I'd be the first to contribute to his or her legal defense fund.

Then again, shooting them is humane. I'm a fan of cruel and unusual punishment, one that would involve them screaming and begging for death ... for months, perhaps even years.

[MyopicJoe]

I think it's ridiculous this group gets half the airtime and media attention it does. A smattering of people from three families in Kansas show up and we point cameras at them? In many communities, they're simply ignored, and that's the most effective response for a group that thrives on provocation.

I suppose they're the real life version of forum trolls, Pz? ;)


There is a movement of trying to make "right thinking" lawyers to help these groups attain their goals by manipulating/using the legal system.

That's scary, Adri. I suppose the court system is the modern day battle field, and lawyers the knights and footmen.


Then again, shooting them is humane. I'm a fan of cruel and unusual punishment, one that would involve them screaming and begging for death ... for months, perhaps even years.

Haha, Random. I think I'd go with a sharpened fork, a well stocked first aid kit, and a week on an isolated farm.

[1stwahine]

Upon arrival at Word of Life, we were given flyers. My Pupule side told me to go niele and confront the bastards.:p My Christian side told me go inside dee church. PK pulled my arm. :D Pastor reminded the congregation not to confront or engage with the Westboro BC Protesters.

I listened....had plenny undercova police officers.;)

Auntie Lynn

[scrivener]

I think it's ridiculous this group gets half the airtime and media attention it does. A smattering of people from three families in Kansas show up and we point cameras at them? In many communities, they're simply ignored, and that's the most effective response for a group that thrives on provocation.
I agree. Ignoring them is the only way one can ever hope to counter them effectively.

Not just the matriarch. A lot of their members are lawyers (or graduated from law school at least, not necessarily the same thing). There is a movement of trying to make "right thinking" lawyers to help these groups attain their goals by manipulating/using the legal system.
Your choice of words here concerns me a little. If they were protesting child abuse exactly the same way, would you also consider it a manipulation of the legal system? When does protesting within the boundaries of the law cross the line into manipulation?

Then again, shooting them is humane. I'm a fan of cruel and unusual punishment, one that would involve them screaming and begging for death ... for months, perhaps even years.
Do you mean this? I thought an interesting point was brought up by one of the Westboro visitors on either KGMB or KITV Sunday evening. The reporter asked her about tolerance, and she said something like, "Why aren't any of these people demonstrating tolerance of us?" As I have written before, tolerance isn't tolerance if it is only extended to those whose beliefs and practices don't offend your sensibilities. It's how you respond to the truly reprehensible (as I believe these people are) that betrays your belief (or disbelief) in tolerance.

I'm not a huge fan of Wayne Cordeiro, but his doctrine is sound and his demeanor admirable. He told the reporter on whatever station I was watching that the only response to hate is love, and that these protestors were missing the mark by claiming that Jesus hates gays. While the speech and actions of the Westboro people sicken me, what I am mostly overcome by is a feeling of sadness that they seem to have missed the message.

[MyopicJoe]

I agree. Ignoring them is the only way one can ever hope to counter them effectively.

...

I'm not a huge fan of Wayne Cordeiro, but his doctrine is sound and his demeanor admirable. He told the reporter on whatever station I was watching that the only response to hate is love, and that these protestors were missing the mark by claiming that Jesus hates gays. While the speech and actions of the Westboro people sicken me, what I am mostly overcome by is a feeling of sadness that they seem to have missed the message.

*nod at scrivener*

The opposite of love isn't hate, it's indifference. We should pity them.


On a side note, their mission of hate is a great way for them to control their own people. It sets up an Us. vs Them attitude, and it feels their members with fear of the outside world so they'd be afraid to leave. This is an old tactic that works well for countries too.

[MyopicJoe]

I listened....had plenny undercova police officers.;)

Heh. How could you tell Auntie? Unfamiliar faces? People who didn't know the routine? Not paying attention? Sitting funny cuz of the conceal carry under their belt?

Would have been cool to spot SSD stationed on a roof over watching the protest, video cameras whirling. Taking pictures of them like bird photography. Probably get your camera confiscated :p

[1stwahine]

Heh. How could you tell Auntie? Unfamiliar faces? People who didn't know the routine? Not paying attention? Sitting funny cuz of the conceal carry under their belt?

heheheh

I know dem. ;)

Auntie Lynn

[MyopicJoe]

I know dem. ;)

Auntie Lynn

I'm kinda scared now...

I think I hear Godfather music...

*looks out my window nervously*

[Leo Lakio]

I thought an interesting point was brought up by one of the Westboro visitors on either KGMB or KITV Sunday evening. The reporter asked her about tolerance, and she said something like, "Why aren't any of these people demonstrating tolerance of us?"According to someone who attends New Hope Farrington, their pastor asked the congregation to give out ice-cold bottled water to the Westboro group, so they would not pass out in the heat.

[1stwahine]

I'm kinda scared now...

I think I hear Godfather music...

*looks out my window nervously*

"Speak softly love and hold me warm against your heart
I feel your words the tender trembling moment start
We're in a world, our very own
Sharing a love that only few have ever known

Wine colored days warmed by the sun
Deep velvet nights, when we are one..."
By Andy Williams

Auntie Lynn :) ;)

[MyopicJoe]

"Speak softly love and hold me warm against your heart
I feel your words the tender trembling moment start
We're in a world, our very own
Sharing a love that only few have ever known

Wine colored days warmed by the sun
Deep velvet nights, when we are one..."
By Andy Williams

Auntie Lynn :) ;)

Very sweet, Auntie :)

Until I consider that it might be your version of Jule's Ezekiel speech from Pulp Fiction...

*is scared and looks out his window again*

[1stwahine]

Very sweet, Auntie :)

Until I consider that it might be your version of Jule's Ezekiel speech from Pulp Fiction...

*is scared and looks out his window again*

heheheh

Dances around my computa Na Na, Na Na Na Na, Hey Hey...Goodbye!:D

And the beat goes on.:p

[kani-lehua]

I'm kinda scared now...

I think I hear Godfather music...

*looks out my window nervously*


if you find a dead rat, me thinks that's the time to start worrying?!;)

[MyopicJoe]

if you find a dead rat, me thinks that's the time to start worrying?!;)

haha yeah, Kani :D

or one dead cockroach in my bed!

*panic*

[paradiseali]

I thought it ironic that they protest at the funerals of the very people who gave their lives to protect freedom of speech. They were like children acting out because negative attention is better than no attention at all. I notice that they were very quiet when they thought the media wasn't watching. Too funny!

They not feeling the aloha cause they don't know what it is. I hope they contributed plenty dollars to the Hawaiian economy while they were here on vacation.

[MyopicJoe]

I thought it ironic that they protest at the funerals of the very people who gave their lives to protect freedom of speech. They were like children acting out because negative attention is better than no attention at all.

Yeah, pretty pathetic.


I notice that they were very quiet when they thought the media wasn't watching. Too funny!

Oh really? Haha.

[AlohaKine]

There's a Westboro Baptist Church in Canada that is rather unhappy about the negative attention it sometimes gets for having the same name. The Canadian church is not affiliated with the Kansas one and actually requested that the Kansas church change It's name.

[Random]

Haha, Random. I think I'd go with a sharpened fork, a well stocked first aid kit, and a week on an isolated farm.
You're too kind. Not at all cruel. :p

[Random]

Do you mean this? I thought an interesting point was brought up by one of the Westboro visitors on either KGMB or KITV Sunday evening. The reporter asked her about tolerance, and she said something like, "Why aren't any of these people demonstrating tolerance of us?" As I have written before, tolerance isn't tolerance if it is only extended to those whose beliefs and practices don't offend your sensibilities. It's how you respond to the truly reprehensible (as I believe these people are) that betrays your belief (or disbelief) in tolerance.
I've been tolerant. If there is one imperfection in me, it's my primal, savage, and oftentimes impure (i.e., deviant, cruel) thoughts.

Be thankful I have not put my thoughts to actions ... so far.

[Random]

There's a Westboro Baptist Church in Canada that is rather unhappy about the negative attention it sometimes gets for having the same name. The Canadian church is not affiliated with the Kansas one and actually requested that the Kansas church change It's name.
Riiight. Like that's gonna happen anytime soon. :rolleyes:

[Leo Lakio]

Riiight. Like that's gonna happen anytime soon. :rolleyes:First step is to ask nicely. Quiet legal action is probably next (as quiet as possible, since it's not a good image for churches to be seen as litigants).

[Bob P]

"Speak softly love and hold me warm against your heart
I feel your words the tender trembling moment start
We're in a world, our very own
Sharing a love that only few have ever known

Wine colored days warmed by the sun
Deep velvet nights, when we are one..."
By Andy Williams

Auntie Lynn

That's my ringtone when for my wife on my cell. I get some funny looks when it rigns and I say 'Oh, that's my wife' :D;)

[AlohaKine]

First step is to ask nicely. Quiet legal action is probably next (as quiet as possible, since it's not a good image for churches to be seen as litigants).

Litigation is bread and butter for Westboro. Some of the members also work for the government in Topeka. Other Baptist churches wish they would stop calling themselves Baptists, but can do nothing since their is no central Baptist organization to boot them out and make them stop calling themselves that.

[kani-lehua]

oops! subjuct being discussed in another thread.

[SusieMisajon]

There is something wrong with the law process if nothing can be found to stop them.

[Adri]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westboro_Baptist_Church

I believe the church members are largely the members of Fred Phelp's family and a lot of them are lawyers or disbarred lawyers. They have used the legal system to their advantage claiming that what they do is protected free speech and have even received awards of money for the violation of their civil rights when they were prevented from picketing in a few places. They are not afeared of the law process.

[SusieMisajon]

You would think that judges would stop awarding large sums of money to them.

[AlohaKine]

Wow. They have a new Obama video on their website. They call Obama "the antichrist", says the he "justifies murder", that "God hates him", he has a "slimy tongue",and he's a "beast". Makes Ralph Nader's comments pale in comparison. Of course they also call Bush a "piece of crap", just to be fair.

Does this mean they don't want to work with the new president?:D

http://www.signmovies.net/videos/signmovies/gho.html

[matapule]

Matapule, exercising maximum self control wif bof hand oder de mout. Don comment matapule, don comment. It is good to turn over rock and see cacaroaches in daylight.

Peace, out.

[AlohaKine]

Roachs run for cover when you turn the lights on.

[Frankie's Market]

Wow. They have a new Obama video on their website. They call Obama "the antichrist", says the he "justifies murder", that "God hates him", he has a "slimy tongue",and he's a "beast". Makes Ralph Nader's comments pale in comparison. Of course they also call Bush a "piece of crap", just to be fair.

With Bush's low approval rating, that wouldn't be controversial with all but the most diehard W. lower. :rolleyes:

But using inflamatory language towards Obama, different story. It generates lots of controversy and publicity. That's all that this church wants. Read Adri's earlier post.

Since publicity is all they want, I would be inclined to totally ignore them, just as many media outlets have chosen to. I just hope that no dum-dum out there is motivated by the church's propaganda to plot the unthinkable against the new president.

[AlohaKine]

They have a really tough time attracting new members. A lot of what they put out is funny in a black humor kind of way to some people, other stuff is just plain sick.

[AlohaKine]

The Westboro nutcases plan to return to Honolulu to picket Obama's Grandmother's funeral on the 14th. WTF. :eek: I wonder if it will get press.

[1stwahine]

The Westboro nutcases plan to return to Honolulu to picket Obama's Grandmother's funeral on the 14th. WTF. :eek: I wonder if it will get press.

The best thing to do is to ignore them.

Let the professionals handle them.

Professionals meaning HPD and other Law Enforcement Agencies. ;)

Mahalo,

Auntie Lynn

[LikaNui]

Somebody oughta tell all the inmates in Halawa and OCCC about these nutcases from WBC coming here to harass a local boy at his tutu's funeral, and have the inmates spread the word to their not-so-gentle friends outside.
A few good WHACK WHACK's oughta send a good message.
Heh. :cool:

[diamond3121]

The Westboro nutcases plan to return to Honolulu to picket Obama's Grandmother's funeral on the 14th. WTF. :eek: I wonder if it will get press.


It's pathetic to protest at someone's funeral.

[Leo Lakio]

It's pathetic to protest at someone's funeral.That's probably the nicest thing most of us would say about this group - "pathetic."

[diamond3121]

That's probably the nicest thing most of us would say about this group - "pathetic."


It's the nicest thing I can say.

[Walkoff Balk]

Send crack addicts who haven't showered to keep giving Westboro Baptist Church members hugs.

[AlohaKine]

Westboro Baptist getting attacked in Seaford, Delaware. In spite of heavy police protection, it happened. ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZGKx2pTBQc

[1stwahine]

Westboro Baptist getting attacked in Seaford, Delaware. In spite of heavy police protection, it happened. ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZGKx2pTBQc

Do I hear an "Amen?" :D

[anapuni808]

when this group was here a few years ago, they were across the street from `Iolani Palace with their signs saying "God hates Hawaiians" and other things like that. Well, it just so happened there was an event going on the grounds that day and we all decided to walk over and talk to the folks from Kansas. There were several cops there to "protect" them and they didn't quite know what to do with us. They ended up stepping back & just watching.

We encircled them (Hawaiians & non-Hawaiians, myself included) and tried to ask them why they were here and what they hoped to accomplish. Eventually, after one of our group was in tears trying to talk to them - someone started chanting "E Ku Mau Mau", which we then continued for some time as we circled around them. Their story to the news was that we were cursing them. HPD stood back because we were not touching any of them. and they pretty much let themselves be intimidated. I guess folks who use another language is just something they don't understand in Kansas. But, I think they probably figured out they weren't in Kansas anymore :D

I'll admit that chant can be intimidating to those who don't know what it means but it is certainly not cursing anyone.

Bottom line for me is that these folks are ignorant, blind & stupid. But - not stupid enough to ever ignore them or their kind. These kind of fanatics are dangerous but not impossible to deal with.

[Leo Lakio]

...their signs saying "God hates Hawaiians" and other things like that.Oh, my. That's a good way to become scarce. I guess their god hates everyone who isn't one of them.

[Adri]

Well, it's good that Madeline Dunham's memorial service seems to have passed well and without the WBP (unless the WBP intend to picket the private service for family members).

[Leo Lakio]

(unless the WBP intend to picket the private service for family members)....where the Secret Service will have a huge presence. That would be their most foolish maneuver yet.