Why gas is so high, a DIFFERENT perspective

[islandguy]

U.S. actions overseas also affect gas prices (http://www.honoluluadvertiser.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=2008806130325)
Glug, glug, glug.

You know that sound? Of course you do. It's the sound of gasoline gushing into your car's gas tank. It's the sound of money gushing out of your wallet. And it's now the surround-sound of the deepening global economic crisis, as skyrocketing oil prices push up commodity prices and spark a worldwide food shortage.

So it's no surprise that presidential contenders Barack Obama and John McCain are vying to promise relief from high oil prices. Obama promises to tax oil company windfall profits, double fuel-efficiency standards for the auto industry and increase government-funded research into alternative energy sources. McCain swears he'll suspend the federal gas tax, rely on market innovation to spur conservation and open off-limits coastal areas for oil drilling.

But what neither mentions — and the media rarely point out — is that U.S. foreign policy also has a dramatic effect on the price of oil. So if you don't like gas at more than $4 a gallon, you should look at the candidates' foreign policy platforms...

[Glen Miyashiro]

Looks like you cut-and-pasted that snippet but forgot to add the link to the original text of Rosa Brooks' latest L.A. Times column (http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/la-oe-brooks12-2008jun12,0,3042274.column).

(You're welcome.)

[Frankie's Market]

But what neither mentions — and the media rarely point out — is that U.S. foreign policy also has a dramatic effect on the price of oil. So if you don't like gas at more than $4 a gallon, you should look at the candidates' foreign policy platforms....."

Or,..... you can just be philosophical about it like Conan O'Brien. And just think of $4 for a gallon of gas as being like Starbucks for your car. :D

[Ron Whitfield]

...prices for gas/petrol based products, food and almost everything else will never come down except in minor and temporary blips. It's high to stay and will only be going up and up until we get off oil, big time. Any drug dealer will tell you the same.
We can't drill ourselves out of this mess, so the mantra of opening Anwar is a cunard designed only for prolonging our oil dependence, and of course more obscene profits for the oil hooligans.

[TuNnL]

What I got from reading the entire article (thank you Glen, for giving credit where credit is due) is that something needs to be done about speculators. Here is a key section of Ms. Brooks article:
That makes oil markets acutely sensitive to relatively small disruptions in supply. If production drops in one corner of the world, the price of oil goes up, and you pay more at the pump. And as with all markets, oil prices also depend on expectations about the future. When investors fear there may be future developments -- crises, corruption, coups, wars -- that will cause disruptions in global supply, oil prices also go up.The reason oil prices are so high is because the rampant speculation going on. True, foreign activity abroad result in news reports which often link these actions with the stability of the oil market. But speculators do more than take these questions and manipulate them into a doomsday scenario. They are milking the “Enron loophole” (http://money.cnn.com/2008/05/08/news/economy/senate_gas_prices/index.htm) that creates artificial inflation of the price. :(

[Kalalau]

Speculation, yes. A replay of the Panic of 1873 when the speculators cornered gold. The president...I won't bother mentioning which party, kept gvt. gold off the market so his friends could drive the price way up and make a lot of money while the whole economy tanked. A theme.

[Creative-1]

A factor I rarely see discussed is that oil is pegged to the dollar. The dollar has been dropping in value (due mostly to our balance of payments deficit).

It looks like oil is going up. Another way to look at it is that the dollar is going down.

The good news is that the dollar is probably at it's low for this cycle.

[timkona]

GM had an electric car. Funny it didnt sell.
Solar Panels have been around for decades, AND ARE VERY COST EFFECTIVE, especially in places like Hawaii where power is 0.30+ per kwh.
40 mpg vehicles are for sale for the last 15 years, but only in the last couple years have trucks/SUV's lost their lustre.
Nuclear Energy runs over 1/2 of France, and good portion of the rest of Europe, except in Germany, where 80% of new homes have solar power.

Some of you folks need scapegoats like big govt, big auto, big oil, speculators, regulations, etc etc etc. But the ballsa$$ truth of it is simply this........

When CONSUMERS DECIDE to purchase widgets, widgets will start selling like hot cakes.

To discover why US is so dependent on foreign oil, consult a mirror.

[TuNnL]

GM had an electric car. Funny it didnt sell ... Some of you folks need scapegoats like ... big auto ... But the ballsa$$ truth of it is simply this........When CONSUMERS DECIDE to purchase widgets, widgets will start selling like hot cakes.Ahhh, the ignorance. A timkona trademark. The reason The GM EV-1 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Motors_EV1) didn't sell is because the company refused to sell it (http://www.pbs.org/now/shows/223/index.html). It was only available on a lease basis. Those who leased it loved it and begged GM to reconsider their position. Instead, GM refused to renew any of the leases, collected all the EV-1s, and demolished them. They even destroyed (or claimed to have destroyed ;)) the blueprints.

Too bad. If they had allowed the EV-1 to go into mass production, it would likely have surpassed the Volkswagen Beetle as the best-selling car of all time. Instead, the Big Three’s relationship with Big Oil took precedence (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MSBykAngDpY) over the consumer. Can you say “re-birth of the Ralph Nader movement”? :rolleyes:

[timkona]

Lease, sell..... the point is if they were flying off the showroom floor, and GM was making any profit off it, then guarantee they would still be there.

Oh....wait a minute.....<copy><paste> A little over 1,000 EV1s were produced by G.M. before the company pulled the plug on the project in 2002 due to insufficient demand. Right from Tunnl's source.

So let's see. They started in 1996. Ended in 2002. And merely 1000 cars.

I'm so laughing at this one. Without looking it up, I would venture to guess that lots more Toyota Corollas sold during that same 6 year period. Please allow me to repeat myself.........

When CONSUMERS DECIDE, widgets sell.

glurg :cool:

[TuNnL]

Lease, sell..... the point is if they were flying off the showroom floor, and GM was making any profit off it, then guarantee they would still be there.Not true. If the sales of the EV-1 would result in selling less of the other GM line, then "profit" is negated.

wait a minute.....<copy><paste> A little over 1,000 EV1s were produced by G.M. before the company pulled the plug on the project in 2002 due to insufficient demand. Right from Tunnl's source.From the same source (http://www.pbs.org/now/shows/223/index.html):

Some suggest that G.M. -- which says it invested some $1 billion in the EV1 -- never really wanted the cars to take off. They say G.M. intentionally sabotaged their own marketing efforts because they feared the car would cannibalize its existing business.

Rather than jumping to conclusions and looking for a reason to justify your pessimist position, Tim, try watching the entire documentary (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbeylQN8PAc), instead of skimming the cliff-notes. It’s best when doing research to evaluate all the factors that were affecting a particular technology (including politics). ;)

[timkona]

a reason to justify your pessimist position

Let's see. My Corolla is gettin 40+ mpg. The wife's old Echo is gettin about 35+ mpg. House has solar H20 & Compact Flourescents everywhere. Even the 1970 VW Westfalia has a brand new engine, that runs fine on the new crap gasoline blends at 26 mpg, with the new tranny, and big tires, going 70 mph mind you. (And that's fully loaded, with camping gear, AF, daughter-unit, 3 muts, a case of beer, and a partridge in a pear tree.)

Did you know that world wide demand for solar panels has created a waiting list that is several months long? And yet, very little of that demand is in America. Did you know that it is nearly impossible to build a Nuclear Power Facility, Hydroelectric Facility, or even a new gas refinery, in America?

Consumers Decide what they buy. I CHOOSE to save money, limit my fossil fuel usage any way I can, and damn the starving Arab children. Anybody who values their wallet has already CHOSEN to save money and change their habits. The rest will fall in line soon enough.

PS - Profits always trump Politics. Profits come primarily from consumers. I agree that killing the EV was a major mistake, as stated in the video. Today, they might be flying off the showroom floor.

[Walkoff Balk]

Did the documentary Whatever Happened to the Electric Car? do as well at the box office as An Inconvient Truth? Unless we Americans love them big automobiles. Chicks dig the fast cars. Why isn't that a car commercial slogan? Yes, I do feel sorry for SUV owners because they probably have kids.

[timkona]

LOL WB. If you listen in on women's conversation, you will find that they know all about guys in big trucks and fast cars. It's mostly just small talk.

A basic course in MicroEconomics 101 is all it takes to shatter any liberal conspiracy theories about the current energy situation. Consumers are in control. Don't doubt that for a single minute. If you don't believe it, then why is GM canceling the Hummer? Why are used car lots FULL of trucks and SUV's? Why do I see so many carpenters showing up at job sites in Corolla's stuffed to the roof with tools inside? Perhaps sales of gas guzzlers are declining? It's called choices. Duh.

Hey TunnL, when did GM take away your EV-1? And how much was that lease? Looks like a lot of movie stars owned 'em. Like Tom Hanks, and some others.

1000 cars in 6 years. Cracking up laughing.

[TuNnL]

Hey TunnL, when did GM take away your EV-1? And how much was that lease? Looks like a lot of movie stars owned 'em. Like Tom Hanks, and some others. 1000 cars in 6 years.Like many Americans, I never heard of the EV-1 until recently. The rest of your questions, including why so few were produced (hint: demand exceeded production), are answered in the film (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbeylQN8PAc). ;)

[timkona]

MacroEcon 101

Anytime demand exceeds production, profits are lost. Price points should be raised to offset the cost of increasing production, commonly referred to as "ramping up". In the long run, this enhances the economy of scale, which lowers the per unit cost. When demand at a given price point falters, there is then room to lower price while maintaining profit through volume.

I know that's dry crappola, that is hard to read. But you get the drift. Watched about 6 minutes of the first segment. Don't have time for the rest. None the less, GM blew it, by not sticking to it. On that we agree. But a billion samolians is a lot of dough. Betcha the factory is sitting in some midwest town, being overgrown by weeds, rats, birds, and cats.

[timkona]

http://money.aol.com/news/articles/_a/ford-will-still-suv-plant-for-2-months/20080616163009990001?icid=200100125x1204127005x120 0175981

Ford closes an SUV plant due to lack of demand. Perhaps it's just my ignorance talking, but it sounds like CONSUMERS are DECIDING not to buy SUV's.

http://www.bloggingstocks.com/2008/06/03/ford-sales-plunge-in-may/
After all, Toyota just sold its millionth Prius.

yet another article about consumer choice.....they're everywhere.

Bwahahahahahahahahahahahah. Hey TuNnL maybe its a conspiracy theory.

glurg :cool: