I think I'm learning Japanese (I really think so)

[turtlegirl]

Sing along now! And I apologize to everyone who now can't get that song out of their head.

Today was my first day of formal Japanese class. Whoa. What have I gotten myself into!?! The teacher speaks Japanese a LOT and I only knew two words! This is a beginners' class, and I am a total beginner, though I have been trying to prepare myself over the past several weeks by studying at home. I was lost within 15 minutes of the start of class.

Lots of the other kids in my class seem to have taken Japanese before.
They offer Japanese in high school now?? The girl next to me has had 4 or 5 years of Japanese class, and she's like 19 years old! And I swear the guy sitting other side of me is some sorta samurai!! Are they just there for an easy A?

The best I could remember to say when the instructor asked me a question was "Hai". I was horrified! And for some wierd reason, my brain was busy trying to translate English into Spanish, while my mouth was trying to recite Japanese!!!

Is this a normal '1st day of college' thing? Or a normal 'learning a 3rd language' thing? I've kinda freaked myself out, and all I want to do is study my face off for tomorrow's class... or burn my books and fly home for my Mom to take care of me! Okay, the former is the best option, but, wow, I've been out of school for a loooong time!

I know it'll be fine, and I'll learn, and I'll be glad I did. I guess I started this thread to share my experience, and seek any advice thats out there, and maybe hear about others' experiences learning a new language. :)

Anybody out there have any advice?

[sansei]

:o hi this is sansei and i myself know conversational japanese in which i can speak only with a japanese friend and my cousin who live's in the country side and they can understand my japanese only my cousin,i speak japanese in which she respond's in english and in jr high,i took japanese only my folk's didnt speak japanese so i changed class and went into science and at that time,i didnt enjoy japanese and here's how i say how is the weather in japanese,otenki De hawaii wa atatakai or warm and cold in japanese would be samui so i hope this may help you with learning word's in japanese?
Good luck or gambate kudasai!

Well thank's for your time:o

[Leo Lakio]

Anybody out there have any advice?Yeah - don't sweat it after one class.

The Alpha Female began studying Japanese (in Hawai`i) when she was in junior-high. Her father just started classes in the past year, in his mid-60s. It's not an easy language, by any definition. Stick with it.

I'd like to learn it myself (more than the handful of words and phrases I've learned in self-defense, that is).

Lastly - think about the trip you'll take to Japan in a few years (you know you will), and how good it will feel to be immersed in the language, and the level of understanding you will have reached.

[TATTRAT]

Holy Moley! What an undertaking! I applaud you, and look forward to hearing about the journey!

When I was on Oahu, I found that the Spanish I knew for back on the mainland meant NOTHING on O'ahu, lol...I had to learn Japanese, and right when I was getting a feel for it, I had to leave?! Bummer!

We plan on moving to japan in 2 years, and I have gotten some reading material and looking into Rosseta Stone, but from the little I know, it is gonna be HARD, lol.

[Random]

When I was on Oahu, I found that the Spanish I knew for back on the mainland meant NOTHING on O'ahu, lol...I had to learn Japanese, and right when I was getting a feel for it, I had to leave?! Bummer!
Yeah, you should've learned Ilocano (Spanish-influenced Filipino language).

[bittersweet]

I've taken japanese classes in 3 parts.
Part 1) Japanese school from Kindergarten to 3rd grade. Pretty much included singing japanese songs, learning how to make origami & learning to dance at Bon Dances.

Part 2) High school: This was fairly easy since I remembered a lot of vocabulary & basic hiragana. It was easy up until my sophomore year, where Kanji hit me! uhh...wakarimasen! Then I started taking both Japanese & Spanish in Junior year. That really screwed me up! I kept switching languages in the middle of a sentence! lol

Part 3) College: YES, I figured I knew enough Japanese to get me an easy A. And for the most part, it worked the first 2 years. I definitely breezed through 101, and just got lazy in 102. But I have to say, I really applauded the students who started 101 with no knowledge of the language at all. They always seemed like those students truly wanted to learn the language & immersed themselves in the class completely.

But I definitely think learning Japanese is more difficult than learning spanish! In Japanese, not only do you have to learn how to pronounce/speak the language, you have to learn 3 different ways of writing (Hiragana, Katakana, & Kanji!). And you also have to learn ways to say the same word...but to different hierarchy of people! Like when you speak to a friend, an elder, or to your boss! And you can't just count....there are different ways to count based on the shape of the item!

Anywho...good luck on learning Japanese! Stick with it!

[Vanguard]

And for some wierd reason, my brain was busy trying to translate English into Spanish, while my mouth was trying to recite Japanese!!!

Japanese is the second language I studied (if English counts as #1!), and when I learned a 3rd, sometimes I would think of a Japanese word when trying to think of the equivalent word from another language, so yes, this is quite normal!

If this is a college course, yes, you'll probably meet students who are a bit overqualified for that particular course level. I wouldn't worry at all unless the course is completely curved or if the professor sets the bar at the skill level of the average overqualified student (I've only seen that once in a language course, and the professor was an inexperienced adjunct -- again, unlikely). If you're taking Japanese at UHM, I am curious, are you taking JPN 100? Because that's a beginner class that's quite accelerated. I think it's more advanced than some intermediate courses at mainland universities! But I would have rather started Japanese in Hawaii or Japan than anywhere else.

Anyway, just hang in there! Try to supplement your learning by watching some subtitled Japanese films or television shows. Find friends who are fluent in Japanese. Not to use as tutors, but if you practice with them with just a few words a day or even if you just listen to them speak Japanese with other fluent speakers, that helps a lot. As long as you don't tune it out, your accent will improve little by little.

Please keep us posted concerning your studies!

[sansei]

:o hi this is sansei and i self taught myself to read,write and later speak conversational japanese and it wasnt easy only i went to the library and borrowed book's on first writing japanese hiragana and then katakana and then kanji which wasnt easy only my friend's and cousin in the country enjoyed reading my japanese and then i did my koseki which mean's to trace your family history and i learned on my father's side,my great great great grandfather was born in japan in the 1800's and then came down to his son's and their grandson's and then to my great grandfather and my father and my mom's side,i went to only my grandfather's,father born in the 1800's in okinawa so im half okinawan and half japanese so i thought to share this with everyone.

well thank's for your time:o

[Jim75]

Turtlegirl, do you get the basic cable TV channels? There's a channel that's pretty much all Japanese. Maybe entirely. I haven't been watching much TV lately, but it's fun to tune in and see what's on. There's this high-drama, Samarai soap opera and a show where they go into the homes of everyday people and see what their life is like. It'd be like a semi-immersion deal.

I have a Japanese friend named Keiko. She told me that in Japan the sound of a barking dog is Wah Wah, as opposed to Woof Woof. Sometimes when I'd see her, I'd say Wah Wah. She'd laugh.:p

You could also watch Kurosawa films. I like "Dreams".

[Honoruru]

Turtlegirl, your experience is similar, in many ways, to my own experience. I took Intro Japanese at UH in my freshman year. I thought it would be easy since I’m Japanese (actually, I’m Okinawan) and both my parents spoke Japanese and English. What I hadn’t anticipated was that most of my classmates had already taken Japanese (for years and years). This was back in the days when most local Japanese kids went to Japanese School after regular school hours (Elementary, Middle and even High School). A lot of my friends went to Japanese School, but I did not.

Anyway, most of my UH classmates had already taken years of Japanese, including writing. That was a distinct disadvantage for me. I related more to the gaijin (haole) classmates who were really interested in learning Japanese but were immediately years behind in class (like me). I thought that was unfair. It was a requirement for any Arts and Sciences degree at that time, and I fought for getting rid of that requirement. It was finally dropped, but only after I graduated. Too late.

But I still think learning a foreign language (any language) is beneficial, so I encourage you to keep at it. What I didn’t like back then was the inequities that came into play, especially in Japanese. BTW, I finally passed French, after having tried to pass (in addition to Japanese) Spanish and Hawaiian. Foreign language is ... well, foreign to me. I suck.

[Kalalau]

A friend and I signed up for 1st year Japanese at the local adult night school, the teacher was a Japanese-Hawaiian from Honolulu and a lot of fun! A smoker, a convivial drinker, she took our class to Little Tokyo near downtown LA for the annual Japanese festival which was excellent, informative, fun, educational. When time came for second year there weren't enough students so we just took year 1 again. Same thing next year, so we really got basic Japanese drilled into our heads. She said that when she visited Japan within a minute of being in the taxi at the Tokyo airport the driver recognized from her accent and language that she was not native Japanese. And now students of language like to study Japanese as its spoken by Hawa'i Japanese residents because the style usually goes back about 100 years to the style spoken in the Hiroshima area.

[turtlegirl]

Aaaarghhh!! My class is moving way too fast!! I don't think that the teacher even cares if we comprehend the material, she is barging right thru her lesson plan as though this is a race!! Today is only the 3rd day, yet we are supposed to have learned and understand Katakana by now?! Yeah right!!

95% of my classmates already know Japanese!! Why are they there??? I studied for 3 hours yesterday and 4 hours monday, plus 3 hours Sunday! All my homework is done for the whole week. But she's moving toooooo fast, especially with the Katakana. Today the instructor even made a JOKE about how nobody really has to study!! WHAAAT??!

I want to send her an email to find out what's going on here, but I'm so angry right now, I think that I'd just spit on the keyboard and then hit 'send'. What! Is! Going! On! Here!!!?

I don't even care what grade I get, I just want to learn this!! It's the instructor's responsibility to teach us, and if I, the total newbie, totally fail, well then she failed miserably as a teacher! Aaargh!!

[Vanguard]

95% of my classmates already know Japanese!! Why are they there???

GPA padding?

Did they even go over hiragana and katakana in class, or were you expected to study it and perfect it at home?

[Jim75]

Aaaarghhh!! My class is moving way too fast!! I don't think that the teacher even cares if we comprehend the material, she is barging right thru her lesson plan as though this is a race!! Today is only the 3rd day, yet we are supposed to have learned and understand Katakana by now?! Yeah right!!

95% of my classmates already know Japanese!! Why are they there??? I studied for 3 hours yesterday and 4 hours monday, plus 3 hours Sunday! All my homework is done for the whole week. But she's moving toooooo fast, especially with the Katakana. Today the instructor even made a JOKE about how nobody really has to study!! WHAAAT??!

I want to send her an email to find out what's going on here, but I'm so angry right now, I think that I'd just spit on the keyboard and then hit 'send'. What! Is! Going! On! Here!!!?

I don't even care what grade I get, I just want to learn this!! It's the instructor's responsibility to teach us, and if I, the total newbie, totally fail, well then she failed miserably as a teacher! Aaargh!!

Maybe you could approach the instructor and tell her what your experience is and ask if she thinks this is normal/expected or if you are in a class that is too advanced. If the instructor is teaching to the level of the students who have prior learning of Japanese, it would be helpful for you to know that. I would ask these questions. There is almost certainly an expectation of significant out-of-class study, since it's a language course. Were there any pre-requisites?

In this circumstance, the vast majority of the instructors I had in college would have been helpful and understanding. At a minimum, they would have offered useful guidance.

[acousticlady]

Maybe you could approach the instructor and tell her what your experience is and ask if she thinks this is normal/expected or if you are in a class that is too advanced. If the instructor is teaching to the level of the students who have prior learning of Japanese, it would be helpful for you to know that. I would ask these questions. There is almost certainly an expectation of significant out-of-class study, since it's a language course. Were there any pre-requisites?

In this circumstance, the vast majority of the instructors I had in college would have been helpful and understanding. At a minimum, they would have offered useful guidance.

I have to agree with Jim75. From my experience (not in Japanese of course) most students think they are the only ones who don't understand. It is very rarely the case. I'll bet if you start talking to the others in the class, you'll find others who are thinking the same thing as you. And don't assume that because some have had classes in high school that they will be getting an easy A. Do you know how many students have had prior math courses and get to college and flounder? Sometimes not having the prior experience can actually be helpful in the end! So hang in there and go with the flow.

[Opihimonster]

私は新しい言語に堪能になり常にたいと思った持っている。 私は悩みに私がyes/noの答えか指の方向ポイントを捜さなかったら私が日本で配置されたときに2年間の高等学校の日本語を私少 なくとも基本的な質問をしてもよい私いた取り。 私達は私達が彼と共に学ぶのでことを私達が彼にスペイン語を試み、教える私達の新しい赤ん坊、それはより容 易かもしれないことである希望と望んでいた。 私達は見る….

Yeah I wish...;)
the above is the below translated via MS Outlook (I always wonder how accurate that really is...)


I've always wanted to become proficient in a new language. I took 2 Years of Japanese in High School and when I was stationed in Japan I could at least ask the most basic questions but unless I was looking for a yes/no answer or a finger direction point I was in trouble. We were hoping that with our new baby that we would try and teach him Spanish, the hope being that since we'll be learning along with him it may be easier. We'll see....

[turtlegirl]

I've said it before, and now I get to say it again....What a difference a day makes!! I'm back in love with Japanese!! :D

I called the instructor yesterday, which didn't help me one bit. She just told me to take it easy and let her do her job, as she's been teaching this course a long time. I was all "Noooo, you don't understand!! I don't understand!! Wakarimasen!!!!" and she was like "trust me, no big deal". That made me totally annoyed. I spent a ton on out of state tuition, and I really really want to learn this and be proficient! I was so ticked that I only studied for about 40 minutes, and went to bed veeeery early. :mad:

Well, today while we were reviewing Katakana, I actually recalled and understood a ton of it. Eureka!! Things are finally making sense!! I guess having one bad day of class wasn't as awful as it felt! :)

I'm also going to sign up for a night school course!

Thanks, everyone for sharing your experiences and advice!

Oh, and the homework assignments are totally ignoring the Katakana. Maybe that's why I finished them so quickly. And no mention about studying it at home. And there was no prerequisite for this class - its just basic Japanese 101.

[TuNnL]

95% of my classmates already know Japanese!! Why are they there???I would venture a guess that they are there because two years of a foreign language is required in order to graduate from college (I’m assuming you are at UH). In this day and age, few students actually attend college in order to learn something. Most just do it because society has ingrained in us that a degree is what we need to succeed in life.

So following that mentality, you can see why your classmates chose to take Japanese. If they already know it, it should be an “easy A.” But like acousticlady says, they are making a dangerous assumption. They are expecting to “cruise” through the class, and may be in for a rude awakening when they realize that college life requires self-motivation and discipline, unlike the public school system in Hawai‘i. ;)

[dick]

My BA is in Japanese language from UH Manoa. It was an excellent program when I was there many moons ago. No clue what it's like now.

I began studying the language in high school (Maui High) where I took two years. I had so much fun, I just figured I'd continue in college and get my degree in it. At the time, UH was one of the top schools in America for Japanese, thus my deciding to go there.

I took a placement test before enrolling, and was placed in the 200-level classes. In high school, we were taught hiragana and katakana before learning any words, which helped a lot once I got to college. We were also taught some kanji.

For the most part, I've found that studying Japanese requires a lot of rote memorization. Hours of it. Daily. I'd probably spend three or four hours (if not more) every day learning vocabulary (and of course the kanji). There was also the grammar to deal with. I took a 300-level grammar class that spent months on the subject of the difference between "wa" and "ga."

By the time I graduated, I could read a newspaper (not 100%, of course) enough to comprehend all the stories. Magazines were easy.

The difficulty in Japanese that I found, was levels of "politeness" used in the language. When learning a verb, there are often three or four ways (levels) to use it. It took months of memorization to learn them all (there are rules, but also many exceptions).

So what it comes down to is the realization that there are going to be many many hours of dedication daily if you want to gain practical proficiency in the language.

[MyopicJoe]

I doubt this would help you learn to write Japanese, but it's fun to watch (http://fontpark.morisawa.co.jp/) (give the web page a bit of time to get started)

[Walkoff Balk]

I thought this class was for guys trying to pick up Japanese Nationals.

[turtlegirl]

My first quiz is tomorrow, and I am stoked!! It only covers the first 3 lines of katakana (the vowels, plus k and s) and basic greetings. I made flash cards, and I'm doing okay as far as understanding the material...so, my fingers are crossed that I remember it for the test. :eek:

[Leo Lakio]

Imua, turtlegirl!

(Oop - wrong language...):o

[Vanguard]

I doubt this would help you learn to write Japanese, but it's fun to watch (http://fontpark.morisawa.co.jp/) (give the web page a bit of time to get started)

They have Doraemon! かわい-ね!

Awesome website, but I wish they had chosen different sound effects.

I hope you did well on the exam, turtlegirl. I also hope that you practiced writing the characters you'll need to use. I don't know if you can call it muscle memory, but sometimes I find myself remembering how to write foreign characters just by putting a pen to paper and letting auto-pilot take over :D

[MyopicJoe]

Awesome website, but I wish they had chosen different sound effects.

Yeah. It's cute at first, but after a few minutes I need to rip the headphones off. I wonder how useful it would be as a form of torture. Supposedly some government used the recording of a crying baby to torture prisoners.

[Walkoff Balk]

I "wakalun" or "no understand."

[sansei]

:o hi this is sansei and i wish to share it's wakarimasen or dont understand,that's what i learned by selfteaching myself to understand japanese.


Well thank's for your time:o

[Leo Lakio]

I "wakalun" or "no understand."
:o hi this is sansei and i wish to share it's wakarimasen or dont understand,that's what i learned by selfteaching myself to understand japanese.
Wakarimasen is the formal way of saying it - wakalun (or as I heard it, wakaran) is a colloquial or slang way to say the same thing.

A friend's older relative said "wakaran" to an English-speaking salesman who came to her door many years ago. He misunderstood ... and proceeded to "walk around" the house to the back door - where the scene was repeated.

True story.

[Walkoff Balk]

Wakarimasen is the formal way of saying it - wakalun (or as I heard it, wakaran) is a colloquial or slang way to say the same thing.

I heard "wakalun" from my obachun from Okinawa. She would pronounce the "l" instead of "r." It was cute when your real first name starts with an R. There are differences between the Japanese and Okinawan language. Then, a word gets pidginized for Hawaii.

[turtlegirl]

I HATE MY CLASSMATES!!!!!

Today we were asked to turn in our homework. No problem for me, cuz I did it laaaaaate last night after getting home from the big island. Yeah, I compromise my sleep to finish my homework, cuz I really really care. So I was totally embarrassed when she asks for pages including the one part I didnt do - because when I got to that part last night it was 1 a.m. and I didn't want to blare japanese audio recordings at that hour in my super quiet home.

So my hand shoots up immediately and I'm all "Surimasen. I didn't finish this one part, may I hand it in tomorrow?" And I'm real worried that she will say no!! But she said it was okay. Whew.

Then she asks the rest of the class to hand their homework forward... < Insert chirping crickets soundbite here. > Nobody else even bothered!!!! Not one other person in my class had done one lick of their homework!!! NOT ONE!! :confused:

Later in the class we were asked to turn to a page in our textbook. She asks for those students who do not have textbooks to try to share with someone who does. OMG!! It is the 3rd week and more than half of my classmates didn't even buy the freakin book! What is wrong with these people?! I gladly shared my text with TWO other kids, and I was happy to help out at the time, but then...

...on the drive home, I started getting really angry about this situation. :mad: What jerk shows to class without their books?! Or homework?!! That's an insult to me, my hard earned tuition, the instructor, and to the ideals of higher learning!! I am SO annoyed!! Hay dios mio!! I HATE MY CLASSMATES!!

On the plus side, we got our Thursday quizzes back! I got 100%!! Yeah!!! :)

[LikaNui]

I got 100%!! Yeah!!! :) You ROCK!!!!! Well done!

[Leo Lakio]

It is the 3rd week and more than half of my classmates didn't even buy the freakin book! What is wrong with these people?! I gladly shared my text with TWO other kids, and I was happy to help out at the time, but then...

...on the drive home, I started getting really angry about this situation. :mad: What jerk shows to class without their books?! Or homework?!! That's an insult to me, my hard earned tuition, the instructor, and to the ideals of higher learning!! I am SO annoyed!! Hay dios mio!! I HATE MY CLASSMATES!!

On the plus side, we got our Thursday quizzes back! I got 100%!! Yeah!!! :)Not to worry - it's not a competition, it's about YOU doing a fantastic job (which your quiz score shows you are doing), because you know you can, you want to succeed, you know what this knowledge will do to enhance your future. No matter where you go, what you do, inside the classroom and out, you will have to deal with people who don't even seem to do the minimum necessary to progress in this world - and those who make the extra effort will often feel as if they are carrying them. (Yeah, I went through the same thing in my recent audio production course, dealing with flakes who wouldn't do their share of the workload, showed up an hour late to class, asked questions about stuff that had already been covered before they got there, etc...)

Just sit back and think about how you are able to accomplish so many of your goals in life (your career, your move to Hawai`i, etc.), and revel in the thought that a number of those other students may someday be the ones serving you your french fries. :D

[Menehune Man]

I know small kine...

Ka wa e o jo san

Which means "you're really cute" in a nice way.

Only useful long ago when I was single. ;)

Along with other sentences you now know.

[turtlegirl]

Ugh.

I had guests in town for the past week, and so I mostly neglected my studying. Well, thats not entirely true...I picked up a bunch of Japanese language only tourist magazines while in Waikiki, and was translating those to the best of my ability.

Regardless, now I feel like a very bad student, and I missed out on reinforcing everything I learned in class last week. I'm terrified of falling behind, and this class moves SO fast!

Does anybody know about Japanese tutuoring. Tutor is probably the wrong word. I would really like to be able to hang out with someone who knows more Japanese than I do, and speaks it better than me.

For clarity - my end goal is to be able to get a job working with tourists from Japan. To be able to say things like "look at that turtle" and be able to explain Hawaii history, all in Japanese. And to be able to go scuba diving and sailing and hiking with our visitors from Japan, and say more fun stuff like "this is a humpback whale", or "look at this beautiful waterfall", or "this is a humuhumunukunukuapuaa swimming by", or "would anyone like to go shopping at Hilo Hatties?", all in Japanese.

The closest I have come to this is trying to talk to Japanese tourists who surf Waikiki, and it's a bummer that I don't know phrases like "nice wave" yet.

Any ideas?

[turtlegirl]

Got our midterm grades today. Not midterm as in "long difficult test", but midterm grades as in "its the middle of the semester, and here's how you're doing so far".

.....drumroll........

I have a 95% so far!!! :D

Okay, I'm a teeny little bit disappointed, but hey, an A is an A. I'll take it!! (and try harder for the rest of the semester)

Japanese is awesome!!!! :D

[LikaNui]

Ho`omaika`i, TG! Congratulations.
As a reward, let's go kayaking out to Flat Island.
You do all the paddling. :p

[Vanguard]

Grats, TG! You'll be fluent in no time :p

Ho`omaika`i, TG! Congratulations.
As a reward, let's go kayaking out to Flat Island.
You do all the paddling. :p

You owe me a new keyboard.

[sophielynette]

Ho`omaika`i, TG! Congratulations.
As a reward, let's go kayaking out to Flat Island.
You do all the paddling. :p

Why would you go there? It smells like birds :p

Glad you're doing well Turtle Girl. Seeing you have so much fun learning Japanese makes me want to give it a try myself.

[surlygirly]

A 95 is something to be very proud of, especially when you've admitted you've been struggling a little. I've lived in Texas all my life and have taken Spanish since 3rd grade and STILL cannot get past conjugating present-tense verbs. It's like my brain will only get that far and then it shuts down and goes, "La la la mashed potatoes!" (Which will be so helpful in the advanced spanish I have to take to complete my degree) So I'm very in awe and impressed with your language capabilities. And you're right- an A is an A. Go celebrate- you've earned it!