Republican National Convention 2008

[Frankie's Market]

In the interest of bringing fairness and balance to HT, I have taken the initiative of starting this thread about the upcoming RNC this week at St. Paul, Minnesota. :)

Of course, this week starts off with much uncertainty, due to Hurricane Gustav. And while I don't want to make light of this situation (as of this writing, now a category 3 hurricane), I couldn't help but note the irony of the RNC being impacted by weather conditions. Recall that the Fundamentalist group, Focus On The Family, made some controversy a couple of weeks ago by encouraging its members to pray for rain to ruin Barack Obama's DNC speech at Denver's outdoor Invesco Stadium. As it turned out, the weather couldn't have been more cooperative to the Dems as Obama delivered his historic speech.

But while God ignored FOTF's prayers for the DNC to be rained upon, it looks like Mother Nature is going to play some havoc with the GOP's plans.

Already, the Republican governors from Texas, Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama, and Florida have cancelled their earlier plans to attend the convention. And just this morning, the White House announced that both President Bush and VP Cheney will also be no-shows. McCain and Palin? No announcements yet. Supposedly, they will play it by ear, based on what transpires in Gustav's wake.

Tomorrow, the GOP convention will commence. But it will be a low-key affair. It will be mostly attending to party business and procedural matters, with little in the way of political hoopla and rhetoric. And the following 3 days at the Xcel Energy Center? Everything seems to be up in the air at this point.

[matapule]

Recall that the Fundamentalist group, Focus On The Family, made some controversy a couple of weeks ago by encouraging its members to pray for rain to ruin Barack Obama's DNC speech at Denver's outdoor Invesco Stadium.

This is ironic, but I just heard a replay of that FOTF suggestion to pray for rain at the DNC on the Internet.

This weather situation has presented the GOP with an opportunity to gain HUGE political advantage. There is a silver lining in every cloud. They could say, we are cancelling the convention this year. McCain and Palin are our nominees. We are asking all delegates to donate their time for disaster relief. We, the GOP, are donating the money we would have spent on the convention, to disaster relief. Now that makes a statement!

Doesn't FOTF get it? God is not on their side. Duh! But maybe he is if the Republicans prove worthy.

[tutusue]

In the interest of bringing fairness and balance to HT, [...]
Oh, that's no fun at all. Fairness? Balance? HT? Carry on...
:D

[Frankie's Market]

This weather situation has presented the GOP with an opportunity to gain HUGE political advantage. There is a silver lining in every cloud. They could say, we are cancelling the convention this year. McCain and Palin are our nominees. We are asking all delegates to donate their time for disaster relief. We, the GOP, are donating the money we would have spent on the convention, to disaster relief. Now that makes a statement!

I don't know if Gustav and an abbreviated GOP convention will play out to anybody's advantage, at this point. I will say this, though. I don't think it would be a wise move for either the Republicans or the Democrats to use Gustav for political gain. Providing relief and assistance for the hurricane victims should definitely not be a partisan affair.

As McCain slogan says, "Country First." And if his campaign wants to live up to that ideal, then everyone on both sides of the aisle needs to set aside their political differences and to work together to deal with what could be a very bad natural disaster.

[Kalihiboy]

Here's Sarah Heath (now Palin) doing the sports in Anchorage 20 years ago:

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/blog/ball_dont_lie/post/Republican-VP-candidate-Sarah-Palin-s-sportscast?urn=nba,104578

She looks great then and now, hardly aged one bit!

Aj

[matapule]

Here is an interesting statistic. I haven't verified its accuracy.

1 out of 3 Vice Presidents has assumed the Presidency through assassination, death by natural causes, or resignation.

YIKES!

[Leo Lakio]

1 out of 3 Vice Presidents has assumed the Presidency through assassination, death by natural causes, or resignation.There are nine Vice Presidents who assumed the Presidency due to presidential death or resignation:
John Tyler
Millard Fillmore
Andrew Johnson
Chester Arthur
Theodore Roosevelt
Calvin Coolidge
Harry Truman
Lyndon Johnson
Gerald Ford

That's about one in five, around 21%.

[matapule]

Thanks LL, I should have checked my information first before posting.

[Random]

Here is an interesting statistic. I haven't verified its accuracy.

1 out of 3 Vice Presidents has assumed the Presidency through assassination, death by natural causes, or resignation.

YIKES!
Better hope that Obama remains healthy. :eek:

[Random]

Tomorrow, the GOP convention will commence. But it will be a low-key affair. It will be mostly attending to party business and procedural matters, with little in the way of political hoopla and rhetoric. And the following 3 days at the Xcel Energy Center? Everything seems to be up in the air at this point.
Perhaps they should postpone it? Unless the Xcel Energy Center already have scheduled engagement after the RNC.

[TuNnL]

They could say, we are cancelling the convention this year. McCain and Palin are our nominees. We are asking all delegates to donate their time for disaster relief.Whatever the case, I don’t know that McCain and his partner are that disappointed to lose Monday’s lineup. As the Associated Press reports (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aq47mOx4jKI), a night without Bush and Cheney in the spotlight may not be such a bad idea for the RNC. :o

[timkona]

First and foremost, and with all criticism's duly noted, and acknowledged....

Sarah Palin is holy moly, smokin' red hot........(wolf whistles loudly). :D

Hillary must be fumin' like Snow White's stepmother.

[Random]

First and foremost, and with all criticism's duly noted, and acknowledged....

Sarah Palin is holy moly, smokin' red hot........(wolf whistles loudly). :D

Hillary must be fumin' like Snow White's stepmother.
Why? Slick Willy checkin' Palin out? I thought he likes young interns.

[Menehune Man]

OMG!
This is too funny.
The Ideological opposite of Hillary to try and get "those" votes. HaHa!
Talk about livin' on the edge, picking Palin as VP.
Let's see how this turns out...

[Frankie's Market]

Whatever the case, I don’t know that McCain and his partner are that disappointed to lose Monday’s lineup. As the Associated Press reports (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aq47mOx4jKI), a night without Bush and Cheney in the spotlight may not be such a bad idea for the RNC. :o

Interestingly, CNN Republican strategist Alex Castellanos said the same thing. And he's probably right.

Be that as it may, the GOP should find a later occasion and venue in which to rally and energize their rank-and-file. The problem is,... this is not the week to carry out such a mission. The nation will not be in the mood for party politics and hoopla as it recovers from Gustav.

[Leo Lakio]

Sarah Palin is holy moly, smokin' red hot........(wolf whistles loudly). :DSomeone's Coors Light has gone skunky... :cool:

[Random]

Someone's Coors Light has gone skunky... :cool:
Well, she is hot for a cougar. ;)

It's not like they're going to hire a kitty for such a high job position, unless you're backing Paris Hilton. :p

[Leo Lakio]

Well, she is hot for a cougar. ;)Husband Todd is around the same age (they were high-school sweethearts), so she isn't technically a "cougar."

[Ninja]

No she's a MIL.... :D


Meow :)

[Leo Lakio]

No she's a MIL.... To me, she's a PILI - a "Politician I'd Like to Ignore."

[Random]

To me, she's a PILI - a "Politician I'd Like to Ignore."
Really? I thought it is "Playmate I'd Like to Inter[censored]"

[Leo Lakio]

Timkona was so quick to point out a perceived "rift" in the Democratic Party, in the thread on their convention; yet he's amazingly quiet in this thread - Tim, your supposed independence as a RepubliCrat is shaky. What about the "rift" in the Republican Party, as exemplified by the huge number of state-level GOP politicos who are staying home this week (for the sake of their own campaigning, nothing to do with hurricanes)?

[timkona]

Hey Leo, I been way busy this weekend. I'm vettin Palin myself right now. Far as I can see, it's a terrible choice.....near as bad as Mitt Romney would have been.

I will have a full comment soon enough.

[Ron Whitfield]

www.stopsarahpalin.com (http://www.stopsarahpalin.com)

And this, coming from a sucker for girls w/glasses

[Leo Lakio]

Hey Leo, I been way busy this weekend. I'm vettin Palin myself right now. Far as I can see, it's a terrible choice.....near as bad as Mitt Romney would have been.

I will have a full comment soon enough.Gotcha - a good holiday weekend, I hope. Looking forward to your views. (No, really! I am! Why is everyone laughing?)

[Random]

Hey Leo, I been way busy this weekend. I'm vettin Palin myself right now. Far as I can see, it's a terrible choice.....near as bad as Mitt Romney would have been.

I will have a full comment soon enough.
Take your time. Better yet, take a year's sabbatical.

[turtlegirl]

Gotcha - a good holiday weekend, I hope. Looking forward to your views. (No, really! I am! Why is everyone laughing?)

Me too!! I'm sooo interested to hear TK's take on this whole mess!

If the republicans manage to win this election, I'll be considering a 4 year sabbatical - in Costa Rica!

[turtlegirl]

Cue the protests...aaaand....action!

Time news report here (http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1838021,00.html)

Were there organized protests this big outside of the DNC?

[Leo Lakio]

Were there organized protests this big outside of the DNC?Estimates at the recent DNC protests were of around 300 people. The Time article you cite says about 10,000 at the RNC. That's more like the crowd at the DNC ... in Chicago in 1968.

[Random]

If the republicans manage to win this election, I'll be considering a 4 year sabbatical - in Costa Rica!
Did Alec Baldwin had a sex change? :confused:

Yes, I remembered his promise about the 2000 Presidential Election. Wished he had kept his word. Will you keep yours?

[Random]

Cue the protests...aaaand....action!

Time news report here (http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1838021,00.html)
Hmm. Note to self: When a masked person in black is marching next to you, he's gonna cause trouble and ruin your peaceful protest day.

Were there organized protests this big outside of the DNC?
Yeah, but they're too chicken to "Recreate '68."

[TuNnL]

www.stopsarahpalin.com (http://www.stopsarahpalin.com)

And this, coming from a sucker for girls w/glassesPalin does the sexy librarian look very well. I’m telling you the “visual vetting (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1RN5xbWtNSU)” action cannot be underscored enough in McCain’s selection methodology. :D

[Ron Whitfield]

Indeed, they'll work the looks angle and are trying every way possible to spin her positively, but this is gonna end badly.

www.truthout.org/article/disclosures-palin-raise-questions-vetting-process

[Kalalau]

Thanks to President Bush for his wonderful hateful divisive speech.

[sansei]

:o hi this is sansei and im now listening to a replay of the Rnc and i heard George bush's speech and it was Great! He's right on about Mccain and Palin ticket and im voting for mccain and Palin as the hopeful new pres and Vp.in my heart they wil win.

Well thank's for your time:o

[Kalihiboy]

:o hi this is sansei and im now listening to a replay of the Rnc and i heard George bush's speech and it was Great! He's right on about Mccain and Palin ticket and im voting for mccain and Palin as the hopeful new pres and Vp.in my heart they wil win.

Well thank's for your time:o

Sansei you have told us your voting for them on how many different posts, we all know your batting from the right side. Can you enlighten us on anything else new?

Aj

[TuNnL]

Aj — in case you haven’t noticed, LikaNui has been tinkering with this “project.” The tough love approach hasn’t worked. FYI.
Knock yourself out. ;)

[Leo Lakio]

:o hi this is sansei and im now listening to a replay of the Rnc and i heard George bush's speech and it was Great! He's right on about Mccain and Palin ticket and im voting for mccain and Palin as the hopeful new pres and Vp.in my heart they wil win.

Well thank's for your time:oBut Sansei - you know your local hero Mayor Mufi supports Sen. Obama, yes? Be careful, or Timkona will accuse your heart of "cognitive dissonance."


(I'm just joking around with you here, sansei. You're cool.) :)

[Ron Whitfield]

And, wasn't there more Bush lies, about McPain having stood up under VC torture?

I believe he broke and did their bidding.

[Walkoff Balk]

:eek:I'm getting a Republican "Hat On" that's lasting over 4 hours. Doctor! Doctor!

[Frankie's Market]

And, wasn't there more Bush lies, about McPain having stood up under VC torture?

I believe he broke and did their bidding.

I don't know nuthin' bout that.

The one falsehood about his time as a POW that I know for sure,....when he campaigned in Pittsburgh and told a bunch of Steeler fans that when interrogated in the Hanoi Hilton and asked for names of officers, he rattled off the members of the Steel Curtain defense. That brought a hearty cheer from the partisan crowd.

Only problem was,.... McCain was a POW from 1967 to 1973. The Steeler defense didn't get that "Steel Curtain" nickname until the team won its first Super Bowl, and that was in 1975.

His autobiography relates a similar story, but in that version, he used the names of the 1960s Green Bay Packers offensive line, which makes more sense as that team won the 1967 Super Bowl, just a few months before McCain's plane was shot down.

So in that case, it wasn't an out-and-out falsehood. But it was embellished for the purpose of playing to the Pittsburgh audience he addressed that day.

[Pua'i Mana'o]

The Hockey Mom, the VPSomebodyLF, the former Mayor of Lana'i (now Governor of a SuperWalMart), came out swinging. She was funny and sarcastic, nasty and nailed it. Her old tv reporter skills did her well from the teleprompter screen. Word to Obama/Biden: if you treat this candidate is a pantyweight, it will be at your peril.

[TuNnL]

Did anyone watch Governor Lingle’s introduction (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N5LzIdYv1zY) of Sarah Palin? If you believe YouTube’s numbers, I was apparently the only one (at least on the Internet). All I can say is, it made me cringe. Particularly the part about “elopement” representing “fiscal discipline.” Geez. And how she paused after each sentence as if to wait for applause that never came. Linda embarassed herself more than anything else. :o

[Frankie's Market]

The Hockey Mom, the VPSomebodyLF, the former Mayor of Lana'i (now Governor of a SuperWalMart), came out swinging. She was funny and sarcastic, nasty and nailed it. Her old tv reporter skills did her well from the teleprompter screen. Word to Obama/Biden: if you treat this candidate is a pantyweight, it will be at your peril.

Indeed. A very well delivered and fiery speech by Palin. And as you noted, nasty and sarcastic in tone. Which I'm sure is fine with the Obama/Biden campaign. By coming out on the attack like she did, Biden won't have to worry about looking like a bully in the VP debate. He can take off the velvet gloves with no apologies needed when the moderators start asking tough questions relating to foreign policy and presidential readiness.

It should also be said: From her introduction as the VP nominee up until now, Palin's appearances have been heavily scripted and choreographed. But when she hits the campaign trail, she can't rely on a teleprompter to say all the right things. Not every crowd she encounters will be as adoring as the GOP convention. When she leaves St. Paul, her "training wheels" will be taken off, so to speak. So we'll get a chance to see how Palin performs as a candidate on the national stage and if she's able to stay on-message and avoid gaffes.

One description that many of Palin's friends/rivals from Alaska seem to agree on: she's very intelligent and a quick study. When it comes to learning about the issues that she may be behind the curve on now (like economics and foreign policy), I'm sure she has the smarts and the determination to catch up quickly. Perhaps at a much faster pace than what many people think. But for all the talent and ambition that Palin has, I seriously doubt that even she can catch up to Biden's decades-long expertise in international affairs over the next 30 days, in time for the veep debate. Particularly if the report that she didn't get her passport until 2007 is true.

[Kalihiboy]

Palin chose in her acceptance speech to ignore issues regarding the economy. Appropriate for her considering she put her town of less than 10,000 heavily into debt.

Aj

[GregLee]

Did anyone watch Governor Lingle’s introduction (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N5LzIdYv1zY) of Sarah Palin?
Yeah, I watched it on CSPAN. It was okay, I thought, but just standard Republican fare.

[Leo Lakio]

Arresting journalists (http://www.minnpost.com/stories/2008/09/02/3295/amy_goodmans_arrest_when_journalists_are_the_story ) - another great way to run a Republican convention.

[Ron Whitfield]

This bunch have already stated that issues don't matter.

All that matters for them is that she's a republican and a 'God's plan' kinda gal.

Sickening.

[Kalihiboy]

Daily Show shows the hypocrisy from Rove, Dick Morris and others:

http://www.tvparty.com/1blog.html

[matapule]

Watch this clip (http://www.comedycentral.com/videos/index.jhtml?videoId=184086) to understand how Republicans really stand on the issues.

Ooooops, Kahiliboy just beat me to it.

[Pua'i Mana'o]

At the gym this morning, every. Single. Person. in my aerobics class was so thoroughly impressed with Palin and talked about voting for "the first real candidate that any of them could ever relate with". The idea that McCain is so close to kicking the bucket is considered a positive. Experience? Pshaw; she'll learn, just like the rest of them. She won't have to go it alone, like any of the other presidents ever do.

Whoever helped McCain pick her shot that arrow straight on the bullseye.

[GregLee]

I just heard Tom Brokaw on MSNBC say he would interview Linda Lingle shortly. (Now = 10:30am Thurs.)

[Frankie's Market]

At the gym this morning, every. Single. Person. in my aerobics class was so thoroughly impressed with Palin and talked about voting for "the first real candidate that any of them could ever relate with". The idea that McCain is so close to kicking the bucket is considered a positive.

That might be the view of your circle of aerobic friends. And it may also be true with part of the hardcore conservative right wing base. (I say "part," as I'm also sure that other right wingers will be nervous about the idea of McCain dying suddenly in office and do not share your unreserved confidence.)

But among independents and the moderate wings of the Democrats and Republicans who will decide this election? They'll be ultimately making their vote based on who is at the top of the ticket. Remember. Sarah Palin is not running for President. John McCain is.

The good news for the GOP last night is the bad news for them tonight. How does Presidential nominee, John McCain, top the excitement and energy generated by the VP nominee, Sarah Palin? Or will McCain end up being upstaged by his running mate? Once again, the GOP base may not have a problem with that. But for the independents, McCain could end up looking diminished in their eyes. Assuming they tune in at all.

Experience? Pshaw; she'll learn, just like the rest of them. She won't have to go it alone, like any of the other presidents ever do.

Oh pshaw! Some VPs end up being way in over their heads when they are suddenly thrust into the Oval Office unprepared. Can anybody say "Andrew Johnson?" :rolleyes:

[Frankie's Market]

I just heard Tom Brokaw on MSNBC say he would interview Linda Lingle shortly. (Now = 10:30am Thurs.)

Lingle got her couple of minutes of MSNBC fame.

Brokaw of course, noted that Obama was born in Hawaii. But Lingle played up McCain's connections to the islands. She mentioned Sen. McCain honeymooning with second wife Cindy in Hawaii. And then she mentioned McCain's father being at the helm of the U.S. Pacific Command Center here during the Vietnam War era. Uhhh yeah. Like those things will be decisive factors for voters here. Welllll, no one can't say that our own Lingle Dingle didn't try. :rolleyes:

Glad that Brokaw cut off that yawner of an interview when he did. Given 2 more minutes of MSNBC airtime, Lingle might have further bolstered McCain's connections to Hawaii by saying that he's good friends with Jerry Toffee and Susan Plague. :D

[Kalihiboy]

They ended up honeymooning in Hawaii because this is where McCain caught the eye of Cindy while still married to his first wife. The woman who stood beside him during his years in Vietnam POW camp and raised their oldest kids, she got traded in for a much younger beauty queen. We all know how McCain likes his beauty queens, it makes him feel and look younger.

Here's a photo of John McCain's father with Bob Hope and Bob Basso:

http://starbulletin.com/2008/01/07/features/flashback.html

[Pua'i Mana'o]

That might be the view of your circle of aerobic friends. And it may also be true with part of the hardcore conservative right wing base. (I say "part," as I'm also sure that other right wingers will be nervous about the idea of McCain dying suddenly in office and do not share your unreserved confidence.)

But among independents and the moderate wings of the Democrats and Republicans who will decide this election? They'll be ultimately making their vote based on who is at the top of the ticket. Remember. Sarah Palin is not running for President. John McCain is.

The good news for the GOP last night is the bad news for them tonight. How does Presidential nominee, John McCain, top the excitement and energy generated by the VP nominee, Sarah Palin? Or will McCain end up being upstaged by his running mate? Once again, the GOP base may not have a problem with that. But for the independents, McCain could end up looking diminished in their eyes. Assuming they tune in at all.



Oh pshaw! Some VPs end up being way in over their heads when they are suddenly thrust into the Oval Office unprepared. Can anybody say "Andrew Johnson?" :rolleyes:

I should have spoken further and profiled my aerobic class for you:

Obama sign-wavers.

HGEA. Mostly Japanese and Haole. Many retirees and close to it (I would save the average age is in the 40s). DOE teachers. Bank tellers. Women.

Let me tell you, that the normal pattern is that aerobics finishes and everyone immediately scrams to ready up for the day ahead. That was not the case this morning; everyone stuck around for a good 20 minutes, wanting to talk about how impressed they were with Palin.

Somebody did their marketing research. After at least a decade of Oprah, Martha Stewart, Real Simple magazine, and Mommy Olympics (woh vs sah), Sarah Palin hits the profile.

The Dems had better not underestimate her, and intellectualizing away her competence won't overcome the visceral relativity this woman offers.

Palin is a lethal weapon.

[Kalihiboy]

Palin is a lethal weapon, in the same mold as Dan Quayle in that you cannot underestimate her and the GOP had the last laugh in 1988. Some might say I just insulted Palin or Quayle with this post.

I'm really interested to hear her debate with Joe Biden on foreign policy and economics, it will be one of the most interesting VP debates in quite sometime.

Aj

[Pua'i Mana'o]

that, I believe, is the only way to swing the vote. She has aces for likability. She needs to demonstrate that, wunnerful tough cookie though she may be, she is no way up to the task at hand.

Aikido. Biden cannot beat her. He needs to make her beat herself.

[Kalalau]

Cindy McCain's outfit was priced out by Vanity Fair at around $300,000.

Oscar de la Renta dress, $3,000
Chanel j12 White Ceramic watch, $4,500
3 carat diamond earrings $280,000
4 strand pearl necklace $11-25 k
Designer shoes $600

An absolutely stunning outfit! Take that, you elitist Democrats!

[Frankie's Market]

I should have spoken further and profiled my aerobic class for you:

Obama sign-wavers.

HGEA. Mostly Japanese and Haole. Many retirees and close to it (I would save the average age is in the 40s). DOE teachers. Bank tellers. Women.

Let me tell you, that the normal pattern is that aerobics finishes and everyone immediately scrams to ready up for the day ahead. That was not the case this morning; everyone stuck around for a good 20 minutes, wanting to talk about how impressed they were with Palin.

They may have been "impressed" with Palin's speech. But will they vote for the GOP ticket come Nov. 4?

You can answer that question any way you want. After all, no one can confirm either way. They are your friends.

But looking at the larger picture, I'm highly skeptical that a majority of Obama sign-wavers, HGEA, HSTA, and AJA will vote for McCain/Palin.

Somebody did their marketing research. After at least a decade of Oprah, Martha Stewart, Real Simple magazine, and Mommy Olympics (woh vs sah), Sarah Palin hits the profile.[

It would be reassuring to McCain supporters if all that were true. IF

And yet, there are indications that Palin was hastily vetted and selected in a matter of 48 hours. What to believe, what to believe.

The Dems had better not underestimate her, and intellectualizing away her competence won't overcome the visceral relativity this woman offers.

Just as the GOP had better not miscalculate Palin's appeal to Clinton's support base, as Gloria Steinem eloquently states in her op-ed.

http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/opinion/la-oe-steinem4-2008sep04,0,1290251.story

"This isn't the first time a boss has picked an unqualified woman just because she agrees with him and opposes everything most other women want and need. Feminism has never been about getting a job for one woman. It's about making life more fair for women everywhere. It's not about a piece of the existing pie; there are too many of us for that. It's about baking a new pie."

[Pua'i Mana'o]

I'm going to say this: considering what I experienced this morning was pretty remarkable, I am reminded that the woman's vote has swung elections before.

U'ilani excerpted a bit from Peggy Noonan, but I will link the whole article here (http://online.wsj.com/public/article_print/SB122044753790594947.html), because it is spot on.

[Peshkwe]

that, I believe, is the only way to swing the vote. She has aces for likability. She needs to demonstrate that, wunnerful tough cookie though she may be, she is no way up to the task at hand.

Aikido. Biden cannot beat her. He needs to make her beat herself.

I no like her.

The forked tongue flickering like dat is way disturbing. Watch her eyes...watch the eyes.

[Leo Lakio]

Gov. Palin's speech draws nearly as many television viewers as Sen. Obama's.
About 37 million people watched convention coverage Wednesday night, according to preliminary data from Nielsen Media Research posted by TV Week. Those numbers include viewers at the three major networks, plus CNN, Fox News Channel and MSNBC.

Her speech beat comparable viewership figures from the Democratic National Convention in Denver last week, when 24 million people watched Democratic V.P. candidate Sen. Joseph Biden speak. It approached the convention-record 38 million set by Democratic presidential candidate Sen. Barack Obama.

Source (http://www.bizjournals.com/twincities/stories/2008/09/01/daily26.html)

Perhaps the ticket should be reversed - Palin/McCain?

[Kalihiboy]

The ratings for Palin's speech probably has something to do with people wanting to learn more about her, listen to her, etc. considering she was practically unknown to a majority of the American public 2 weeks ago.

Cindy McCain mentions how proud the McCain's have 4 generations in the military, of course her husband John the day after he buried his father abruptly left the Navy. Then on to a career in Arizona politics, which was helped and financed by Charles Keating. Keating later spent 5 years in jail because of his shady Savings and Loan scandal that John McCain and 4 others were involved in.


Aj

[Ron Whitfield]

I wonder if there will be a mention of the current republican president, George W. Bush, tonite.
There hasn't been a single mention of his name or Cheney's yet at this trick and pony freak show.
I can't understand why..., how odd...

[GregLee]

Keating later spent 5 years in jail because of his shady Savings and Loan scandal that John McCain and 4 others were involved in.
I followed the congressional hearings on the Keating 5 pretty closely. The involvement of McCain (and Glenn) was marginal. In the crucial meeting with regulators he attended at Keating's behest, as soon as he learned there was a federal indictment, he just left the room right then. No special pleading or exerting influence to help his friend and sponsor -- he was out of there. In retrospect, it would have been far better for him not to have attended the meeting at all, of course ...

[tutusue]

I thought Palin's speech was well written and well delivered. Too bad it was completely lacking in substance. :( And that poor, self described red-neck, Levi. He looked like a deer in headlights. That kid certainly got more than his hormones bargained for.

The possibility of Palin becoming the president is still as frightening as ever. Bush's speech writer can't help her should that become a reality.

[Peshkwe]

Someone needs teleprompter remedial reading classes.

[Adri]

Oops. Although the campaign released info that they were having teleprompter issues because the equipment was new and the operator wasn't sure how to work it.

[Kalalau]

Malloy of Nova, a successor to Air America, has said that the son who Palin lauded for going into the army was given a choice of going into the army or going to prison for vandalism. I have the funniest feeling that if it had been a Democratic candidate's son who had such a choice, the press would have done days of team reporting, no stone left unturned to inform every non- comatose human in North America of the fact.

[Frankie's Market]

I followed the congressional hearings on the Keating 5 pretty closely. The involvement of McCain (and Glenn) was marginal. In the crucial meeting with regulators he attended at Keating's behest, as soon as he learned there was a federal indictment, he just left the room right then. No special pleading or exerting influence to help his friend and sponsor -- he was out of there. In retrospect, it would have been far better for him not to have attended the meeting at all, of course ...

Interestingly though, McCain was the only one of the Keating 5 senators who was a Republican. But as you correctly point out, he and John Glenn were exonerated and did not receive any discipline from the Senate.

The other three (including longtime Democratic Whip Alan Cranston) weren't so fortunate. Although they were not subjected to expulsion from the Senate, they were stripped of whatever leadership positions and committee chairmanships they had.

[Kalihiboy]

McCain tried to distance himself from Charles Keating during that scandal even though it was well known in Arizona circles that it was Charles Keating and Cindy's dad who helped McCain in his first stab at local politics in Arizona.
Former AZ Senator Dennis Deconcini was the other Democrat involved in the Keating scandal. He was interviewed recently about McCain and the scandal.

Having attended high school and college in Arizona I saw firsthand McCain's rise in the political circles. I also know Charles Keating ruined the retirement savings of personal family and friends of mine in AZ. I could go on and on about the crooked politics in Arizona, but I've talked about it already in prior posts recently.

The Keating 5, Abscam and other political scandals involving members of Senate, House, etc. are not forgotten by those who lived thru the scandals.

Aj

[Kalihiboy]

McCain was more involved with Keating (in terms of his overall personal relationship and history with him and McCain's father in law business wise with Keating) than anyone else because of their past relationships. But to save his political arse, and a wise thing to do on his behalf he chose to distance himself from Keating more and more, to the point in which Keating called him out publicly "a wimp" amongst other crude name calling he often liked resorting to do. We were shocked in Arizona that McCain survived essentially unscathed, considering DeConcini let his term run out of the Senate, he was later appointed by Clinton to a position. It was McCain's wise choice to continue to do his job as Senator, look forward and distance himself with Keating that literally saved his career in AZ politics and eventual GOP nomination. So he turned "poor judgement" as the Senate Ethics Commission levied upon him into something positive by simply backing off or walking away from the crooked Keating.

Aj

[Kalihiboy]

McCain said tonight "I Will Not Let You Down", didnt George W. Bush say something similiar to that 8 years ago that he wouldnt let the country down like Clinton had done and restore honor and dignity to the White House?

I find these statements silly at times, of course it's obvious why would we want him to let us down in the first place.

Too bad George W. Bush didnt get a chance to list his "accomplishments" over the past 8 years at the convention, he had his short video speech and Cheney's name I dont think was uttered in the 4 days at the convention. Talk about distancing yourself from the GOP nominee, perhaps by the choice of McCain's camp? Of course George W. couldnt take a vacation in Crawford right now because of Hurricane Gustav and the GOP Convention, nice to know during an election year the administration showed they gave a damn about a possible natural disaster hitting the Gulf Coast again.

Aj

[Walkoff Balk]

John McCain should have said, "Sorry, I don't accept the nomination, I just wanted to be invited to the party."

[Frankie's Market]

The Keating Five scandal was ugly. Some of those people who lost their life savings even committed suicide. I still remember TV news footage where Charles Keating was shown leaving the courtroom with his lawyer when a distraught elderly lady accosted him, saying "Bring back my husband! You bring back my husband!" His lawyer and security personnel quickly whisked him away from the scene. Through it all, Keating wasn't even man enough to look that old lady in the face.

[Frankie's Market]

When Sarah Palin was officially nominated for the VP slot, Heart's Barracuda was blasted over the arena's PA system. Barracuda was Palin's nickname as a high school basketball player. But I wonder how Ann and Nancy Wilson feel about the Republicans appropriating their song? They are staunch Democrats.

Talk about shades of 1984, when the GOP used Bruce Springsteen's Born In The U.S.A. as their convention theme, which drove the Boss crazy. Especially since that song wasn't meant to be patriotic and, in fact, talked about all the things that were wrong with America.

[escondido100]

it seems like everybody here is preaching to the choir.....there are a few conservatives around...what amazes me is the lack of tolerance and aloha that goes on when obama supporters talk amongst themselves......the issues if discussed would speak for themselves....mccain/palin are the only ones that are really qualified to lead us into the challenges or the future....just cuz hawaii has been mislead by dems for......ever do we need to leadth entire nation down that path........http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w305/mcgeedigital/SaraCuda.jpg

[LikaNui]

When Sarah Palin was officially nominated for the VP slot, Heart's Barracuda was blasted over the arena's PA system. Barracuda was Palin's nickname as a high school basketball player. But I wonder how Ann and Nancy Wilson feel about the Republicans appropriating their song? Yesterday they formally asked the RNC to stop using the song.
So after McCain's speech tonight to end the RNC, what song was played?
Yep.
Barracuda.
:rolleyes:

[U'ilani]

Looking at the electoral count based on recent polling data (http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/maps/obama_vs_mccain/), it could very well be that Ohio will again be the state that decides the election. Obama has been wisely campaigning in Ohio this week--rural Ohio, where McCain and especially Palin will be popular.

Can you imagine all of the campaign mail and phone calls those poor people are going to be inundated with during these next 2 months?

----

[Frankie's Market]

Yesterday they formally asked the RNC to stop using the song.
So after McCain's speech tonight to end the RNC, what song was played?
Yep.
Barracuda.

Yeah, I saw that. But taking the discussion beyond the Wilson sisters' disapproval,....

It was one thing to play Barracuda when Palin's nomination was announced. But playing it again after McCain's nomination acceptance speech? It indicates something that has become glaringly apparent. McCain has been upstaged by his running mate, on a night where the focus was supposed to be on him.

For all of the pros and cons that Sarah Palin has brought to the GOP ticket, one thing cannot be disputed. The Alaska governor has really electrified and excited the GOP base in a way I haven't seen since, well, Ronald Reagan back in 1980. Some conservative pundits have attributed to her a rockstar/celebrity type of presence (which is ironic, since many of those same pundits mocked Obama for that very reason).

But one has to wonder if Palin's dynamic presence could too much of a good thing, especially if McCain and his record of experience and accomplishments are overshadowed by his exciting new running mate. If too much attention goes to the bottom of the GOP ticket, this could end up working against McCain if his campaign message is diminished or if the media's fascination with Palin leads to them picking up on every gaffe and mis-step she commits.

[TuNnL]

I'm going to say this: considering what I experienced this morning was pretty remarkable, I am reminded that the woman's vote has swung elections before.

U'ilani excerpted a bit from Peggy Noonan, but I will link the whole article here (http://online.wsj.com/public/article_print/SB122044753790594947.html), because it is spot on.I read the Noonan article. I must say I got a much different reaction out of it. What it told me is just how clueless today’s generation’s understanding is of what it means to be a Republican. I’m not talking about what Reagan or any of the Bushies stand for. They are not real Republicans. They are the product of the Rovian doctrine: the Religious Right and the neocons who hijacked the party after the great Barry Goldwater (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barry_Goldwater) retired and left the GOP to its own devices.

These days, Republicanism has become faith-based and hawkish while fiscal discipline and non-interventionism have disappeared — artifacts that have become more rhetorical than philosophical. Yes, today, a Republican is a hater, a fearmongerer, a globalist (like the Dems) and a governmental lapdog. Look at escondido’s attempt (http://www.hawaiithreads.com/showthread.php?p=208774#post208774) to defend the party. Superficial surface propaganda lacking any real research of how Palin really (http://fairlyconservative.com/the-race-for-president/a-chat-with-anne-kilkenny-from-alaska/) got her “Barracuda” nickname. Any real issues? Of course not. The RNC was about “bashing” and “narratives,” so of course the partisans lap it up.

IMHO, people like John McCain and Sarah Palin are two of the most shameful examples of fake politicians masquerading as Republicans. It’s absolutely horrifying that McCain’s plan will actually tax the middle class (http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2008/06/12/1135488.aspx) more than Obama’s plan. McCain should be kicked out of the party for that fact alone.

The difference between me and scrivener is, scrivener is voting Libertarian to preserve the party’s eligibility. I’m voting Libertarian because Ron Paul is not on the ballot. :p

[matapule]

Smart humahumanukanuka'apua'a don't go for the bait.

http://www.hollywoodsbest.net/forum/images/smilies/fish.gif

[Peshkwe]

Eh...just think about it..........






Jesus was a Community organizer

Pontus Pilat was a Governor






:cool:

[Vanguard]

Eh...just think about it..........

Jesus was a Community organizer

Pontus Pilat was a Governor

:cool:

Nice! :D

Just think about it ...

The Islamic Republic of Iran had a female vice president (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Massoumeh_Ebtekar).

That did wonders for woman's rights, didn't it? :rolleyes:

[Leo Lakio]

These days, Republicanism has become faith-based and hawkish while fiscal discipline and non-interventionism have disappeared — artifacts that have become more rhetorical than philosophical.To reinforce the "fiscal discipline" point in TuNnL's post, here is information gleaned from an article in Maclean's magazine - about the surprising legacy of President Bush being more traditionally "liberal" in a number of areas:

Total federal spending rose 68% under Bush, more than double the growth in federal spending over the eight years of Clinton's presidency. Spending has increased across the budget. Bush was aided and abetted by a Congress dominated by Republicans until 2006. Spending bills were passed on everything from farm subsidies to health (up 44 per cent) and education (up 47 per cent). As a proportion of the economy, total government spending has increased over Bush's tenure, from 18.4 per cent of GDP in 2000 to 20.3 per cent of GDP in 2006, according to the Tax Policy Institute run by the Urban Institute and the Brookings Institution. Bush's tax cuts and spending replaced a string of four consecutive surpluses under Clinton with huge deficits beginning in 2002. For the fiscal year ending September 2009, the deficit is projected at nearly US$500 billion, the biggest ever.

Full article here (http://www.macleans.ca/world/usa/article.jsp?content=20080820_86797_86797).

[GregLee]

... the Religious Right and the neocons who hijacked the party ...
Don't forget the racists. Arguably the devolution of the GOP began with "the Southern strategy" of Nixon's 1968 campaign, in turn a reaction to the departure of the old racist South from the Democrat party after Lyndon Johnson's Voting Rights Act of 1965.

[turtlegirl]

http://i179.photobucket.com/albums/w305/mcgeedigital/SaraCuda.jpg

Quite possibly true...I almost wet my pants while laughing like crazy at the Republican VP nomination. :D Heck, I'll bet that someone out there almost peed themselves with laughter over this goofy banner.

Sarahcuda? Hahahaha!!! Everyone outta my way - I'm running to the polls as fast as I can to vote for this woman! She is obviously qualified to run for the title of 'dumb mean fish with sharp teeth'! Oh, wait, she wants to be VP??

[Leo Lakio]

it seems like everybody here is preaching to the choir.....there are a few conservatives around...what amazes me is the lack of tolerance and aloha that goes on when obama supporters talk amongst themselves......the issues if discussed would speak for themselves....mccain/palin are the only ones that are really qualified to lead us into the challenges or the future....just cuz hawaii has been mislead by dems for......ever do we need to leadth entire nation down that path........It's good to have some conservative voices in this thread, rather than just letting us lefties do all the bashing. ;)

Now that the Republican Convention is over, I gotta express my disappointment in timkona's contributions...or lack thereof. For someone who claims to target the two major parties with equal vitriol, the stats speak for themselves:

His contributions to the Dem Convention thread: 14 of 94, about 15%.
His contributions to the Rep Convention thread: 2 of (as of this post) 89, just over 2% - and one of those was to say that he would contribute more.

Hey, Tim: I realize that there are factors in your life that probably got in the way - it happens to us all - but I am honestly disappointed. This was the best chance I could see for you to prove that you could comment on (or attack) both parties equally, as you claim to be such an independent thinker, and I truly did want to see how you viewed both sides.

Yet you didn't follow through. You teased about how the Dems did their dog-and-pony show, but you let the Reps take a free ride. I wanted to see if you could be "fair and balanced" (in the words of your favorite news outlet) - but it looks as if you only loaded one barrel of your shotgun this time. :(

[Ron Whitfield]

Yes it's always just great to hear more right wing BS. Havn't had enuf of that yet.

And no, not one mention of the fabulous Bush or Cheney last night.
But, maybe they're saving the best for last. Tonite should be a huge display of republican love and reverential gratitude to B&C's 8 tremendous years. The endless ovations will no doubt be deafening as these two incredible cretins smirk they way onto the stage.
Yes, we should all be fearful of their two latest candidates, just like we have been so afraid to stand up against B&C for 8 years now as they snuff out truth, justice, and the American way.

[Pua'i Mana'o]

Leo, because this thread is moving so fast and the time span from RNC until now is quite short in r/l years, I believe that it is awfully presumptuous on your part to determine TK's deafening silence, particularly as we all aren't on HT every single day (well, some of us aren't). Give the man a chance.

[Leo Lakio]

Leo, because this thread is moving so fast and the time span from RNC until now is quite short in r/l years, I believe that it is awfully presumptuous on your part to determine TK's deafening silence, particularly as we all aren't on HT every single day (well, some of us aren't). Give the man a chance.
He wasted no time in commenting on the Democratic Convention, launching the thread the day it began.

He posted three days ago that he would comment "soon."

He has posted since then, in other threads.

He'll speak up when he's good and ready, I trust, and when circumstances in his life permit. I look forward to reading what he has to say - and I am quite comfortable pointing out how he has treated the two threads in a most dissimilar fashion, as well as noting what that implies.

And he doesn't need an apologist, so you may stand down.

[LikaNui]

Two CNN polls just now:


How do you rate Sen. John McCain's acceptance speech?

Thumbs up... 37%... 124,085

Thumbs down... 36%... 118,876

Didn't watch... 27%... 91,097

Total Votes: 334,058


And this one:


Which party's convention made the stronger case for why its candidate should be elected to the White House?

Democrats... 57%... 55,030

Republicans... 33%... 31,946

Neither... 9%... 8,747

Total Votes: 95,723

[Frankie's Market]

Neilsen just released their numbers, estimating that 38.9 million watched McCain's acceptance speech, which is a new all-time record audience for a convention broadcast. Obama's speech attracted 38.4 million. I'm certainly surprised by that.

No doubt the massive attention given to Gov. Palin's speech the night before helped to build anticipation for the final night. But the record TV audience for McCain's acceptance speech may turn out to be a mixed blessing. As Lika Nui points out, CNN polls show that McCain's speech got mixed reviews.

My take on McCain's speech? His life story and experiences in Vietnam was captivating, as it usually is. But it was short on substance and specifics regarding the economy. Also, what the hell was up with that awful green screen background behind McCain? The visuals looked horrible. And to think many Republican strategists mocked the DNC for using that Greek Temple background behind Obama! However overly grandiose one might think Obama's background was, it was a whole lot better than what was behind McCain. I don't think there's any way for a neocon to spin that.

[tutusue]

[...]Also, what the hell was up with that awful green screen background behind McCain? The visuals looked horrible. And to think many Republican strategists mocked the DNC for using that Greek Temple background behind Obama! However overly grandiose one might think Obama's background was, it was a whole lot better than what was behind McCain.[...]
My first thought was that McCain's background was a deliberate statement against Obama's background, esp. after Palin mentioned something about returning the styrofoam, Greek columns to a Hollywood prop shop...or sumthin' like that; can't remember her exact words! Regardless, it was a dig. He certainly did "pop" against that background, tho'...esp. in HD! :eek:

[Leo Lakio]

He certainly did "pop" against that background, tho'...esp. in HD! :eek:John McCain in HD. One excellent argument to not vote for him. That's four years of hell right there. :rolleyes:

[Kelly0040]

That green screen bugged the heck out of me.

My husband and I couldn't figure out what that white building was or why it was significant to what he was saying.

I don't normally visit blogs or anything related to politics (except for these HT threads tbh), but I found my answer (maybe) and I had a good chortle: http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/9/5/111829/9917/18/587802

[Ninja]

Neilsen just released their numbers, estimating that 38.9 million watched McCain's acceptance speech, which is a new all-time record audience for a convention broadcast. Obama's speech attracted 38.4 million. I'm certainly surprised by that.

No doubt the massive attention given to Gov. Palin's speech the night before helped to build anticipation for the final night. But the record TV audience for McCain's acceptance speech may turn out to be a mixed blessing. As Lika Nui points out, CNN polls show that McCain's speech got mixed reviews.

My take on McCain's speech? His life story and experiences in Vietnam was captivating, as it usually is. But it was short on substance and specifics regarding the economy. Also, what the hell was up with that awful green screen background behind McCain? The visuals looked horrible. And to think many Republican strategists mocked the DNC for using that Greek Temple background behind Obama! However overly grandiose one might think Obama's background was, it was a whole lot better than what was behind McCain. I don't think there's any way for a neocon to spin that.

Should be pointed out that CNN was the most watched for the DNCC by a large margin.
Fox News Channel the most watched for the RNCC.
The point, Liberals watch CNN for it's news and views, Conservatives the same with FNC.
Add PBS's numbers and it's a dead heat in viewers, so take polls from those networks with a grain of salt.

[Leo Lakio]

Yesterday they formally asked the RNC to stop using the song.
So after McCain's speech tonight to end the RNC, what song was played?
Yep.
Barracuda.
:rolleyes:Their statement on the matter is available here (http://hollywoodinsider.ew.com/2008/09/heart-responds.html); as noted, they were not pleased.That green screen bugged the heck out of me.Maybe they should have put this (http://blatherwatch.blogs.com/photos/uncategorized/2008/09/04/conservativeprinciples.gif) behind him. :D

[tutusue]

That green screen bugged the heck out of me.

My husband and I couldn't figure out what that white building was or why it was significant to what he was saying.

I don't normally visit blogs or anything related to politics (except for these HT threads tbh), but I found my answer (maybe) and I had a good chortle: http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/9/5/111829/9917/18/587802
Too funny...I attended Walter Reed Middle School for one year eons ago! Seeing that photo was a trip down Memory Lane! Thanks for the link.

[Frankie's Market]

That green screen bugged the heck out of me.

My husband and I couldn't figure out what that white building was or why it was significant to what he was saying.

I don't normally visit blogs or anything related to politics (except for these HT threads tbh), but I found my answer (maybe) and I had a good chortle: http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/9/5/111829/9917/18/587802

The McCain camp is now saying that the picture was no mix-up. There was no intention to show the Walter Reed Army Medical Center. (Which was just as well, since McCain wasn't talking about health care and benefits for veterans.) The Walter Reed Middle School was picked out as nice, random scenery. Clip art, as it were.

Still, it shows how deficient and incompetent McCain's people are when it comes to stagecraft. Sure, the picture might have been attractive to the tens of thousands seated at the Xcel Arena. But to the nearly 39 million folks who were watching on TV, it totally misses the mark. Other than the lawn, you can't see anything when the camera is doing a tight frontal shot of McCain. That particular shot is shown for what, 98% of the time?

Yeah, McCain's media advisors are real pros. Just like his veep vetting team. :rolleyes:

[Vanguard]

Two CNN polls just now:

How do you rate Sen. John McCain's acceptance speech?

Thumbs up... 37%... 124,085

Shocking.

I can understand 27-29% (http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/poll-finds-national-disconnect-president/story.aspx?guid={051E83A0-7E8C-4533-B463-E7FE108AFF26}&dist=hppr), as the approval rating of George Bush rides in this range (28 percenters as some of us liberals affectionately call them) -- where's the other 8-10% coming from? :p

[Walkoff Balk]

That green screen bugged the heck out of me.

I think the green symbolizes "recycle."

[Walkoff Balk]

My final thought.
What did I learn from this convention? That I should giggle non-stop until I start coughing when I hear the term "Community Organizer."

[LikaNui]

Check out this article (http://www.slate.com/id/2199492/&GT1=38001) about the use of Heart's "Barracuda":

Ann and Nancy Wilson, the frontwomen of the rock band Heart, are demanding that the McCain campaign stop using their 1977 song "Barracuda" at political rallies after the song was played in honor of vice-presidential nominee Sarah Palin on both Wednesday and Thursday nights. Does the McCain campaign have to honor the Wilsons' wishes?
Not if the campaign has the correct license. Like thousands of other songs, "Barracuda" is distributed by the American Society of Composers, Authors, and Publishers, meaning that any entity that is licensed with ASCAP can play a song without getting the artist's explicit permission. This license can be held by a venue, like a club or a sports arena, and apply to all events that take place there. In this case, the Xcel Energy Center in St. Paul, Minn., would be the holder, but a representative tells the Explainer that the venue's ASCAP license applies only to sporting events for the Minnesota Wild and the Minnesota Swarm, the professional hockey and lacrosse teams, respectively; otherwise, it's up to the people who use the premises to get their own. A spokesperson for the Republican Convention said the event did have an ASCAP license separate from the one for sports.
Assuming the licenses were all in order, the Wilson sisters probably don't have much legal recourse. But it would be a much different story if the campaign had used the song in an ad or a promotional video. While an ASCAP license covers the right to perform a song, you need a separate "synchronization license" from the publisher to put the song in an ad. Some artists ask for stipulations in their contracts with publishers that prevent their songs from being used for political advertisements or any other causes they find objectionable.
(...)
Last month, singer-songwriter Jackson Browne sued the McCain campaign, the Republican National Committee, and the Ohio Republican Party over the use of his song "Running on Empty" in an ad without obtaining a sync license. Had the McCain campaign used "Barracuda" in a video montage about Palin, they would have been required to get this permission, which the Wilson sisters presumably would have rejected—assuming their publisher asked them.
It's very common for musicians to object to the use of their material. The McCain campaign has already run afoul of several other artists this year, including John Mellencamp and Van Halen. In both those cases, the artists were objecting to the use of their songs at rallies, where an ASCAP license would apply. The McCain campaign agreed to stop playing Mellencamp songs voluntarily. The issue also frequently crops up with Christian groups that do not wish their material to be used at events they find objectionable.
If the campaign chooses to continue playing "Barracuda," and so much so that it becomes associated with Palin, the Wilson sisters could have a legal claim. They might argue a violation of their "right to publicity," which protects a person from having her identity used for marketing purposes. Such protections vary by state and tend to apply to commercial products, not political messages.

[Pua'i Mana'o]

He wasted no time in commenting on the Democratic Convention, launching the thread the day it began.

He posted three days ago that he would comment "soon."

He has posted since then, in other threads.

He'll speak up when he's good and ready, I trust, and when circumstances in his life permit. I look forward to reading what he has to say - and I am quite comfortable pointing out how he has treated the two threads in a most dissimilar fashion, as well as noting what that implies.

I clearly don't pay the same attention to TK's posting time stamps as you. I mentioned it only because your post stuck out as almost needy on your part. As if TK doesn't come around enough to spar these points.

And he doesn't need an apologist, so you may stand down.

*blink blink*

apologist?

WTF?

brazen stare

I. May. Stand. Down?

*erases a heavily-detailed paragraph at how out of line that comment is, deciding instead to walk away with two strong birds aiming high in the air*

[Leo Lakio]

*erases a heavily-detailed paragraph at how out of line that comment is, deciding instead to walk away with two strong birds aiming high in the air*Fine. Just as long as you cease telling me how to behave/post/discuss topics with others on the board.

This is the third time, in recent memory, that you have publicly told me that you feel my requests for additional information from others is pushing too hard, or out-of-line, or (today's term) "needy." I find it inconsiderate and a little out-of-character for the on-board relationship I thought we had, and I would appreciate it if you didn't do it any longer.

With all due respect to you and your strong birds.

[Frankie's Market]

Check out this article (http://www.slate.com/id/2199492/&GT1=38001) about the use of Heart's "Barracuda":

Now that the RNC has wrapped-up, this issue is probably moot.

Even if the McCain/Palin ticket plans to continue using Barracuda during the rest of the campaign and they have the legal right to do so, it probably wouldn't be wise for them to push it. Right now, the Wilson sisters are merely not supporting McCain/Palin. But if the GOP persists in using the song, Heart may start actively campaigning against them. Whether it be anti-McCain messages spread in concert performances or maybe,.... in a new music video, it would probably end up being a no-win situation for the Republicans.

[timkona]

Phew....finally got some time to contemplate, assimilate, verify, organize, and, otherwise, respond and comment, to the AMERICAN National Convention.

Did not watch Reps as much as Dems. Work, ya know, and all that. :(

Palin is not just a surprise, but plays well to a GOP that reminds you of the Grinch, right when Cindy Lou Hoo warms his heart, and he suddenly becomes this benevolent, lovable, furry uncle. And as I said, poor Hillary is like the classic stepsister/evil stepmother/ugly duckling....the brunt of the fairy tale in nearly every way. Walt Disney could not have written it better. Guarantee Dems, in general, are seething at the thought that Republicans win again, from a "historical first" point of view. Slavery, Suffrage, first woman in congress, Cold War, and now a smart, hot chick on the big ticket.

Palin prolly has more skeletons in the closet than the Pet Sematary. Ever live in a small town? I mean, like, 7000 small. No secrets in Kona either. But she spoke eloquently, and is clearly not a dumb beauty pageant contestant. And give Levi 1 bonus point for being a stand up guy(father) under national spotlights. How about the 2nd Man? Seems like a regular, hard workin, good daddy, to me. Alaska is a good proving ground because it is big, right? :rolleyes:

McCain clearly has a resume that speaks loudly of service at the least, and very high qualifications in certain parts, but certainly not economically. If ever a man had been 'groomed' his entire life to lead a nation, McCain has prolly met that criteria. His mom is real old, and it seems to me he has his wits about him way more than Reagan did at the end.

Maybe McCain and Biden would make a great pair. Why doesn't the real talent rise to the top.....Powell, Lieberman, Rice, Gore, Richardson, the list goes on and on and on, and does not include Bush, Kerry, Obama, Palin, Pelosi, Romney, or Rove. :cool:


Now that us "Real 'Merkans' " have had our soiree, I betchayall are nervous as a cat in a rest home.



Prediction.......McCain by a surprisingly large margin....perhaps 10% or more.

[Creative-1]

Where else can an Alaskan pit bull
put on lipstick and grow up to be
a vice presidential candidate?

Is this a great country or wat?

[Pua'i Mana'o]

Fine. Just as long as you cease telling me how to behave/post/discuss topics with others on the board.

This is the third time, in recent memory, that you have publicly told me that you feel my requests for additional information from others is pushing too hard, or out-of-line, or (today's term) "needy." I find it inconsiderate and a little out-of-character for the on-board relationship I thought we had, and I would appreciate it if you didn't do it any longer.

With all due respect to you and your strong birds.

Clearly you are determined not only to get a fight, but think the worst of me. Three times in recent memory...really, within how many years are these infractions, anyway? (I can only think of one other time that you and I were in disagreement, which had to do with a zealous newbie, but who am I to outshine you in trifle recollections?)

As for this thread, that the only thing I 'told you to do' was "give the man a chance" and it was you who insulted me first. Noticing your presumptuousness had nothing to do with your calling out TK, but the manner in which you were trying to bait him by judging his silence, as if any of us knows which threads another is prepared to respond. That, mon ami, is clear presumption, but my tone with you was soft. You call me inconsiderate, yet you know full well that I argue with TK probably more than anyone else on this board, furthermore I am on your side when it comes to political perspective. I believe in being fair, call them when I see it, and I am not one to avoid busting pus with anyone, loved ones included (yeah, I mean you). I thought that is how we liberals roll. So what the *hell* is your problem??

Get your grudge out with me already, because I am not changing. If I see you be a putz again, I am going to say it. I trust in our friendship that we can overcome it.

Seriously though, if this is the closest thing I get to an apology out of you, the birds still stand.

========
as for context, the only reason I had said anything in the first place is that this thread was seriously rocking&rolling, and I was digging it immensely. Yours was the first veer (in my opinion) into getting personal mode, and I really wished it wouldn't do that/go there. I mention this because it has become some self-fufilled prophecy and I am clearly playing my part.

I apologize to you, Leo for my collective behavior in your recent memory that resulted in your low opinion of me. I soberly acknowledge the likelihood that I will probably do it again. I don't want to be hurtful, but I am of no intention in changing how I communicate. Take or leave me as I am.

[Frankie's Market]

Boy, you gotta hand it to Tim Kona. He's the only person on HT who can start arguments by posting and not posting. :D

[Peshkwe]

Gads!!!


I finally figured out why the combo of McCaine and Palin has been scratching at the back of my brain.....

They're 'toons!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cotton_Hill

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peggy_Hill

[matapule]

Where else can an Alaskan pit bull
put on lipstick and grow up to be
a vice presidential candidate?

Is this a great country or wat?

No, it is a country that has lost its focus, its values, and its goals. No, we are no longer the great country that we once were. We are a country that has grown soft at the belly, where mediocrity is celebrated. We are motivated by the clever sound bite, the humorous and sarcastic rejoinder. We no longer understand what morality is, where "winning" is more important than morality. We are evolving into a country of extremism in every splintered political philosophy, where compromise is considered defeat. We consider changing a strongly held view in light of new information as weakness and lack of commitment. We have lost our social conscience. We are viewed by the people out side our country as fat, lazy, stupid, and obnoxious and who are self-centered and not very astute.

I call on our troops who are being sent to Iraq to rise up and say, "hell no, I won't go!" It has been done before, it can be done again, at great personal cost to some of us. To acquiecse, is to support. We are what we condone.

It's unfortunate my fellow Americans, but we are working our way toward a very abrupt wake up call. Have I given up? No. It just makes me motivated to work harder than ever to make things better, to get us back on track. Rise up!

American hero once? Yes, but now a confused old man willing to sacrifice his ideals for personal glory.

Pit bull and barracuda my burro! What I see is an extremist racist and fascist. Yes, only in America today can you put lipstick on an extremist and be a vice presidential candidate. Unfortunately she represents too many people in the USA today. Shame.

[Ron Whitfield]

He followed orders to bomb Viet Nam in a BS 'war', got shot down and captured as a POW, cracked under torture and did their bidding, then supports Bush's BS war, and still does. But say's he hates war, sure...

Not a hero in my book, nor a good American.

[matapule]

Not a hero in my book, nor a good American.

Well, the truth be known, I agree with you. The true hero's, the true Americans in the Viet Nam era were the ones who refused to serve, even to the point of sacrificing their own futures.

I just felt my rant was strident enough that I didn't need to beat that horse too.

[Ron Whitfield]

...on all counts, but I just couldn't restrain myself. :D

[Leo Lakio]

Boy, you gotta hand it to Tim Kona. He's the only person on HT who can start arguments by posting and not posting. :DThanks, Tim, for giving your assessments.

As for arguments between Pua`i Mana`o and myself --- I have great respect for her and am appreciative of all the insight and knowledge she has shared with me. Everything else is manini pilikia.

[Pua'i Mana'o]

*goes and sits next to Leo and gives him a friendly poke in the ribs, then a peck on the cheek*

I'm sorry for offending you.

[Adri]

*goes and sits next to Leo and gives him a friendly poke in the ribs, then a peck on the cheek*

I'm sorry for offending you.

Ewww, you two. Get a room :p ;)

[Walkoff Balk]

Ewww, you two. Get a room :p ;)
Politics make strange bedfellows.

[Leo Lakio]

She was absolutely right about one thing, at least (if not more) - I responded to her in an insulting fashion, which she did not deserve. Having her respect and friendship is more important to me than being "right," so I apologize for that little flash of fire in her direction.

I also hope Tim didn't feel I was out-of-line - but if so, I apologize to him for that.

Can we now consider this diversion concluded?

[Kalalau]

What exactly did McCain do to betray America as a prisoner of the North Vietnamese? Republicans accused him of that during the primaries but I just figured, well, its Republicans, what do you expect. However in his acceptance speech he said that the torture "broke" him. Did that have some implication? How did he betray America?

[Peshkwe]

It's interesting he's saying he 'broke' considering this stuff:

http://www.pensitoreview.com/2008/02/17/in-1992-pows-accused-mccain-of-collaborating-with-vietnamese/

Here are transcripts of McCaine's talks with the 'at the time enemy' and communist reporters, etc.

http://www.vietnamveteransagainstjohnmccain.com/cin_declassified_landing.htm


But then there's this:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/25418965/

McCain spent 5 1/2 years behind bars in Hanoi. His flight suit and parachute were recently added to the museum display, which includes a recording of bombs falling and air raid sirens shrieking.

McCain still bears the evidence of his wounds and has described being repeatedly bound and beaten by his captors. After his plane was hit by a surface-to-air missile during a bombing mission over Hanoi in 1967, McCain ejected and suffered a broken leg, two broken arms, and was briefly knocked unconscious. The Vietnamese mob who found him smashed his shoulder and he was bayoneted.

He says medical attention was delayed in an attempt to get him to reveal information and he was held in solitary confinement for over two years.

Jailer says McCain lied about torture to win votes
Other former POWs also say they were tortured by communist forces at the jail, and many say they still suffer physical pain from it.

"They are liars. What they said is not true," said Duyet, who was a jailer at Hoa Lo from 1968 until the POW release in 1973, serving as prison chief the last three years. Duyet claimed McCain "invented that story that he was tortured and beaten to win votes."




Yanno...the best way to lie is to tell part of the truth and then shut the hell up.

One day the whole truth will come out....maybe he's doing the set-up preparations for the coming of that day? *shrugs*

[Peshkwe]

Ahh...here go:

http://www.usnews.com/articles/news/2008/01/28/john-mccain-prisoner-of-war-a-first-person-account.html?PageNr=1

I don't get this bit though....

http://www.usnews.com/articles/news/2008/01/28/john-mccain-prisoner-of-war-a-first-person-account.html?PageNr=8

Now I don't hate them any more—not these particular guys. I hate and detest the leaders. Some guards would just come in and do their job. When they were told to beat you they would come in and do it. Some seemed to get a big bang out of it. A lot of them were homosexual, although never toward us. Some, who were pretty damned sadistic, seemed to get a big thrill out of the beatings.

What?? How'd he find this out? They make him stand watch while the guards made out? Is he hinting about rape and then denying it in the same breath? Or is he just making a slam with the nastiest thing he can think of being?

Lessee...sadistic homosexuals who enjoyed torturing people...








Why are there schools of anchovies swimming by???

[Peshkwe]

Video on what one POW's dad found out:

http://www.vietnamveteransagainstjohnmccain.com/cin_hopper_video.htm

[Kalalau]

Very interesting, thank you.
I can't help but remember the "swiftboating" of John Kerry by a bunch of washed up bar flies and losers, their slanders against Kerry's truly heroic service to this country, and his well deserved Purple Hearts, indeed, the heartless, cruel and incomprehensibly tasteless mocking of the war wounds he received while fighting on behalf of this country, with their cute precious little purple bandaids, at their 2004 convention. What a contrast. Cover up the betrayal by McCain, but smear and slander an actual hero who would have stood in the way of all the stealing planned by the people on top. Sick.

[TuNnL]

Did anyone watch Governor Lingle’s introduction (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N5LzIdYv1zY) of Sarah Palin? If you believe YouTube’s numbers, I was apparently the only one (at least on the Internet). All I can say is, it made me cringe. Particularly the part about “elopement” representing “fiscal discipline.” Geez. And how she paused after each sentence as if to wait for applause that never came. Linda embarrassed herself more than anything else. :oYeah, I watched it on CSPAN. It was okay, I thought, but just standard Republican fare.I forgot to mention just how s-l-o-wly Lingle read from the podium, which I found especially irritating. Here’s further evidence (http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/fullcomment/archive/2008/09/06/fc-in-briefs-hi-i-m-linda-lingle-and-my-speech-made-no-sense-at-all.aspx):
I didn’t listen to every speech at the Republican convention (you’d have to be a true masochist to do that), but the dopiest one I did catch was Linda Lingle

[Kalihiboy]

Triumph shares his view at the GOP Convention:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKsX68vvgcI&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKwesxb83c4&feature=related