The 2008 Presidential Elections - Chapter 4

[Adri]

There is no requirement that presidential candidates have any experience as senators much less a certain number of days as senators so the number of days Obama was a senator is somewhat irrelevant to whether he'd be a good president.

[AlohaKine]

There is no requirement that presidential candidates have any experience as senators much less a certain number of days as senators so the number of days Obama was a senator is somewhat irrelevant to whether he'd be a good president.

Well of course there is no required experience. It would be very helpful however. John McCain has extensive political and military experience. Obama was NO military experience with a war on terror going on and little political experience.

[matapule]

How many days of experience does Sarah Palin have as Senator? How many days of experience did Reagan have in Congress? Carter, Clinton, W?

Experience in Congress does not necessarily have anything to do with whether someone would make a good President or not. According to my research only about half of American Presidents had Congressional experience. In fact, the person who most people regard as the greatest President, Washington, had no Congressional experience. While the person most people consider the worst, Harding, came from the Senate.

There are many good reasons why you may not want to vote for Obama, AlohaKine, but don't let yourself be manipulated by this amateurish and irrelevant email. Research both candidate's positions, style, and relevance and then decide who you want to vote for.

[Vanguard]

According to my research only about half of American Presidents had Congressional experience.

This website has the research all charted out! (http://www.electoral-vote.com/evp2008/Info/experience.html)

My favorite US President Theodore Roosevelt had so little experience. Wow! :p

[matapule]

John McCain has extensive political and military experience. Obama was NO military experience with a war on terror going on and little political experience.

How much military experience did FDR and Churchill have? (I'll give you a hint, you won't like the answer.) AlohaKine your arguments are irrelevant.

Don't vote for Obama because of his stand on abortion, or entitlements, or social security. Pick a good reason not to vote for him, not something that has no relevance.

[matapule]

This website has the research all charted out! (http://www.electoral-vote.com/evp2008/Info/experience.html)


Dang, Vanguard, you are good! How do you come up with this stuff so fast and right on topic? http://newsgab.com/forum/images/smilies/newsgab/bowdown.gif

[TuNnL]

'From the time Barack Obama was sworn in as a United State Senator, to the time he announced he was forming a Presidential exploratory committee, he logged 143 days of "experience" in the Senate. That's how many days the Senate was actually in session and working. After 143 days of work "experience," Obama believed he was ready to be Commander In Chief, Leader of the Free World .... 143 days.As opposed to Sarah Palin who has 0 (zero) days of experience as a United States senator. :rolleyes: What an absurd email you’ve chosen to litter the HT forum with, Alohakine. Yet another “blind partisan” on this board. Any relationship to Nancy Pelosi (http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2008/09/29/house-republicans-blame-pelosis-speech/?mod=googlenews_wsj)? :confused:

[Frankie's Market]

I got this e-mail about Obama today. It's pretty good.

Subject: 143 Days

http://www.smileyhut.com/sleep/yawn.gif (http://www.smileyhut.com)

Yeah,.... pretty good. Right.

The experience argument for McCain. Pretty much trashed ever since he picked Sarah Palin to be his running mate.

Here's something a little more fresh than a stale e-mail.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/09/27/tina-fey-as-sarah-palin-k_n_129956.html

[Walkoff Balk]

Does anyone think that the cast member on SNL who plays Obama sound anything like him?

[tutusue]

Does anyone think that the cast member on SNL who plays Obama sound anything like him?
Just slightly; similar speech pattern but not voice. As I mentioned in the Palin thread, there was an Obama impersonator on Leno a couple of months ago who was great. Looked and sounded like him. That's who I'd like to see on SNL.

[Vanguard]

Dang, Vanguard, you are good! How do you come up with this stuff so fast and right on topic? http://newsgab.com/forum/images/smilies/newsgab/bowdown.gif

This (http://heroeswiki.com/Enhanced_memory). :cool: Kidding! :p Thanks for the kind words!

[matapule]

Does anyone think that the cast member on SNL who plays Obama sound anything like him?

And the cast member who plays McCain, looks more like Clinton in my opinion, but it's all funny.

[GregLee]

This website has the research all charted out! (http://www.electoral-vote.com/evp2008/Info/experience.html)

The McCain/Palin campaign has claimed that Palin's executive experience as mayor then governor is more significant than legislative experience, and indeed, the charts show that only two presidents in the lowest performance quartile, Johnson and Tyler, had prior experience as governor.

[Walkoff Balk]

And the cast member who plays McCain, looks more like Clinton in my opinion, but it's all funny.
When will SNL run a best of with a presidential theme? You can see how different Daryl Hammond look in the 1990's to the present Bill Clinton.

[matapule]

Watch this 30 second video (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/10/01/the-fox-news-ethos-summar_n_130969.html) to show how FAIR AND BALANCED Faux News is. I would be sad if it weren't so laughable.

[Frankie's Market]

There was a lot of hype surrounding the VP debate. 69.9 million viewers tuned in, mostly to see which Sarah Palin would show up. The one who wowed the GOP convention in St. Paul, or the one who resembled a train wreck in front of the mike with Katie Couric. Fortunately for Palin and her political future, the audience was treated to the former, for the most part.

But looking at the bigger picture of the overall presidential race, it was a push. It didn't change the dynamics of the race. And while the veep debate was the biggest political story yesterday, another story has been somewhat overlooked. But if you ask me, it was a much more significant story: McCain's campaign pulling up stakes in Michigan, and its implications on the race.

http://blog.newsweek.com/blogs/stumper/archive/2008/10/03/mccain-s-leaving-michigan-can-he-still-win-on-nov-4.aspx

Remember during the primary season: despite all the spin and controversies that Hillary Clinton and her campaign generated, it was the delegate math that ultimately prevailed in giving Obama the Democratic nomination. And so it will be in the general election that it all comes down to the electoral college math. And by conceding Michigan, McCain/Palin's path to getting 270 electoral votes looks more and more like the bridge that goes to nowhere. (Sorry, I couldn't help myself! :D)

[tutusue]

[...]And while the veep debate was the biggest political story yesterday, another story has been somewhat overlooked. But if you ask me, it was a much more significant story: McCain's campaign pulling up stakes in Michigan, and its implications on the race.[...]
I read about that yesterday and thought McCain's people chose an interesting day to do that...a big news day with people's attention focused elsewhere! It reminds me of a professional acquaintance who was headline news in Hawaii, embarrassingly so. Within a couple of days the Clinton/Lewinsky story broke stuffing acquaintance's news further back in local newspapers. I'd guess he was forever grateful to Clinton! :rolleyes:

[Frankie's Market]

I read about that yesterday and thought McCain's people chose an interesting day to do that...a big news day with people's attention focused elsewhere! It reminds me of a professional acquaintance who was headline news in Hawaii, embarrassingly so. Within a couple of days the Clinton/Lewinsky story broke stuffing acquaintance's news further back in local newspapers. I'd guess he was forever grateful to Clinton! :rolleyes:

Some people are lucky. Just ask former U.S. congressman Gary Condit. Recall that he was linked (via an extramarital affair) to Chandra Levy, a government intern who went missing and was later found dead. Although he was never named as a suspect in the missing person/murder case, the heat was being turned up on Condit. Then, 9/11 happened. In one day, the political downfall of Condit was transformed from a headline generating scandal into a low-key affair. Condit was eventually voted out of office, but he can be grateful for being spared the kind of scrutiny that he and his family would surely have been subjected to had the media's focus not been directed to the 9/11 tragedy.

[Ron Whitfield]

To boot, nobody's even mentioning Linda Lingle's 2 week absence to rack up brownie points with mainland powers towards her own political agenda in the guise of support for the current republican presidential ticket.

[Peshkwe]

Remember 'Billy Beer'?

http://www.weht.net/WEHT/Billy_Carter.html


Remember Roger Clinton, Jr.?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roger_Clinton,_Jr.


Well McCain has a bus tosser too:

http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/10/05/mccain-brother-calls-northern-virginia-communist-country/

Republican presidential candidate John McCain's brother made an apparent joke at a campaign rally this weekend that might not play well in parts of newly competitive Virginia.

Joe McCain, speaking at an event in support of his brother, called two Democratic-leaning areas in Northern Virginia "communist country," according to a report on The Washington Post's Web site.

"I've lived here for at least 10 years and before that, about every third duty I was in either Arlington or Alexandria, up in communist country," Joe McCain, a Navy veteran, said about his military postings. He spoke at an event in Loudon County, Va.

[Vanguard]

Obama Camp Hits Back At McCain's "Keating Economics" (http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/10/obama_camp_hits_back_at_mccain.php)

[Vanguard]

Jerry Falwell Jr.'s Liberty University registers its students in Virginia, gives them election day off, so they can vote McCain and prevent Virginia from going Obama (http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=95414732)

Obama leading McCain in Ohio, Penn, Minn polls (http://news.yahoo.com/s/bloomberg/20081006/pl_bloomberg/am6wsrkwniy4)

[Adri]

Today's Honolulu Advertiser has an interesting opinion piece about the accuracy of polls and "the Bradley effect".

"/snip The Bradley effect has come to mean this: Voters lie to pollsters about black candidates, and enough of them lie to create a huge gap between poll results and election results. The Bradley effect asserts that when Americans get into the voting booth and see the black candidate's name on the ballot, they flinch. /snip"

http://www.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/20081006/OPINION03/810060304/1110/OPINIONFRONT

[Vanguard]

Maverick family to McCain: No way are you one of us! (http://blogs.reuters.com/trail08/2008/10/06/maverick-family-to-mccain-no-way-are-you-one-of-us/?hesno)

Current projections (http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/?BadNewsForObama)

[Peshkwe]

Holy crud....if even half of this is true, McCain best shut Palin up real quick:

http://blog.nj.com/njv_publicblog/2008/10/mccain_and_palins_scary_connec.html

[Vanguard]

John McCain's top ten temper explosions (http://blog.case.edu/conservativemovement/2008/01/29/john_mccains_top_ten_temper_explosions)

McCain: Obama is "Touchy" and "Angry" (http://gawker.com/5059745/mccain-obama-is-touchy-and-angry)

Holy crud....if even half of this is true, McCain best shut Palin up real quick:

http://blog.nj.com/njv_publicblog/2008/10/mccain_and_palins_scary_connec.html

B-b-but Reverend Wright!

[Peshkwe]

Oooooo....Sarah and TODD (huh?!??) want to walk the auto plants and 'connect'.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=70oC8Uw-UKY

Bwahahahahahahaha!!!

[Vanguard]

"My fellow Prisoners" (http://talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/222883.php)

Wow, who'd have thought he'd come up with an even bigger zinger than "That One"!

[Ron Whitfield]

And you can tell the bimbo's behind him aren't even listening, just waiting for their cue to applaude this cretin.

[Peshkwe]

OMG!

The man is going all PTSD and flashing or something.

[Walkoff Balk]

There should be a translation subtitles option during the debates to show what they're really thinking and saying.

[Vanguard]

McCain's Planetariophobia (http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2008/10/08/mccains-planetariophobia/)

This is no surprise. McCain was just a boy when the authorities went after Galileo.

[Peshkwe]

I may not be the brightest crayon in the box....in fact I know I'm missing a few colors....and the Democrats may not be the best pick for who's to run this country, but I am sooo very tired of the 'neo-stupid' movement we've been fed under the guise of 'folksiness'.

At this point I'd probably vote for almost anyone that shows they have more than two brain cells to rub together and shows they're not afraid to use em to strike a spark.

PLEASE!!!

I'm tired of being forced to puddle around in vapid tar pits of faux stoopid.

[escondido100]

for those that are on the fence on who to vote for, and are willing to watch a three minute video, you may want to clickhttp://www.catholicvote.com/ it may be time to vote your conscience.

[TATTRAT]

WOW, are these the typical McCain supporters?!

The cameraman does seem to taunt at a couple points, but a lot of it is unprovoked.

The two videos, check 'em out

http://news.aol.com/political-machine/2008/10/09/taunting-prospects/

[Vanguard]

The two videos, check 'em out

No thanks, I've already seen Deliverance.

[Leo Lakio]

Why I am so cynical about the elections ---

Read the discussions on any internet boards, HT included. Look how easily many people fall into divisive class-ism. ALL liberals are cockroaches. ALL Republicans are evil. ALL Democrats are godless. ALL conservatives are heartless.

People who profess to hate racism have no problems dissing all members of another category. It’s no different, except that stereotyping by race has become a “bad” thing to do – while it’s still acceptable to stereotype by other classifications: Age. Monetary status. Religious affiliation. Political leaning.

If you are capable of seeing why it is inaccurate to put specific behavioral traits at the end of phrases such as “all Hawaiians are …” or “all Blacks are …” or “all Haoles are …,” you should have no trouble grasping why it’s equally incorrect to say “all Baby Boomers are …,” “all Christian fundamentalists are …” or “all NPR listeners are …”

National politicians of recent vintage have become masters at manipulating this divisiveness in Americans, and using it to their advantage. Any real message of what they will propose to do if they are in power is overwhelmed by their wild taunts about the perceived faults and flaws of their opponents.

The voting public that craves intelligent discussion of issues has lost out to those who want to hear more about a candidate’s child’s child, or acquaintances from the 1960s, or number of divorces – or any of a number of far more trivial topics.

This didn’t start with the election of 2008, by any means. But it is why I continue to profess that the American Empire is in dramatic decline, and it’s foolish to fail to recognize that. And when we look for someone to blame, it ain’t the media or the politicians --- the culprits look back from the mirror.

[TATTRAT]

No thanks, I've already seen Deliverance.

lol, Great post, would read again!

[salmoned]

Why I am so cynical about the elections ---

Read the discussions on any internet boards, HT included. Look how easily many people fall into divisive class-ism. ALL liberals are cockroaches. ALL Republicans are evil. ALL Democrats are godless. ALL conservatives are heartless.

People who profess to hate racism have no problems dissing all members of another category. It’s no different, except that stereotyping by race has become a “bad” thing to do – while it’s still acceptable to stereotype by other classifications: Age. Monetary status. Religious affiliation. Political leaning.

If you are capable of seeing why it is inaccurate to put specific behavioral traits at the end of phrases such as “all Hawaiians are …” or “all Blacks are …” or “all Haoles are …,” you should have no trouble grasping why it’s equally incorrect to say “all Baby Boomers are …,” “all Christian fundamentalists are …” or “all NPR listeners are …”

National politicians of recent vintage have become masters at manipulating this divisiveness in Americans, and using it to their advantage. Any real message of what they will propose to do if they are in power is overwhelmed by their wild taunts about the perceived faults and flaws of their opponents.

The voting public that craves intelligent discussion of issues has lost out to those who want to hear more about a candidate’s child’s child, or acquaintances from the 1960s, or number of divorces – or any of a number of far more trivial topics.

This didn’t start with the election of 2008, by any means. But it is why I continue to profess that the American Empire is in dramatic decline, and it’s foolish to fail to recognize that. And when we look for someone to blame, it ain’t the media or the politicians --- the culprits look back from the mirror.

I don't get it. No one 'looks back from the mirror'. An image may be reflected, but no one 'looks back'. So you believe no one is to blame. Okay, I might find a point of agreement there. It's mighty hard to blame the ignorant for spreading the 'facts and faith' they've been taught and for disregarding the reality they've been told isn't there or isn't true or isn't important. Who's to blame for teaching others to believe as they themselves believe - who could do otherwise? What parent or teacher says, "Believe nothing but what you personally analyze and determine through continual investigation, experimentation and logical reasoning to be true, no matter who claims it to be true - not even what I am telling you right now"?

[Leo Lakio]

I don't get it. No one 'looks back from the mirror'. An image may be reflected, but no one 'looks back'. So you believe no one is to blame.When your eyes are closed, you will not see.

No, you certainly don't get it; that is obvious by your assumption of what I believe.

[salmoned]

Yes, and even with open eyes one cannot see without illumination. So, why don't you turn on a light?

[Leo Lakio]

Yes, and even with open eyes one cannot see without illumination.And there we do agree. So - back to the thread's topic, then?

[salmoned]

The only difference I see between your comments and the attitude you deride is that you didn't use the word 'all' in your group characterizations. Characterizing 'National politicians of recent vintage...' and 'The voting public that craves intelligent discussion...' is clearly in the same vein of fallacy as 'all Christian fundamentalists...'. So I now can clearly see who's looking back in your mirror.

[timkona]

Here comes a classic zinger....ya ready libs?

It's amazing to me how Obama's rise in the polls has been inversely proportional to Wall St's gigantic losses. The only station reporting this is Fox News. Not a mention, or even the merest speculation on MSNBC, CNN, or NPR.

Just thinking out loud. And with recent Fed interest cuts, I think I might refinance and go on another real estate buying spree. Gotta love the way the money markets respond when liberalism is perceived as succeeding.

Perhaps there is a bright side to an Obama Presidency, and I just never noticed.

glurg :cool:

[Adri]

I have seen articles and heard news stories that attribute the increase in Obama's popularity at least in part to the rise in economic concern and the feeling that McCain is not good (or as good) in handling economic matters. Another part that seems to be helping Obama is a general distaste the voters seem to have for mudslinging and negative campaigning.

[Leo Lakio]

It's amazing to me how Obama's rise in the polls has been inversely proportional to Wall St's gigantic losses. The only station reporting this is Fox News. Not a mention, or even the merest speculation on MSNBC, CNN, or NPR.NPR's been saying it for quite a while. Many people look at the financial troubles as something caused by Republican policies of deregulation, and note that Sen. McCain has long said that he does not know much about economics.

Your zing has fizzled. Might want to see a doctor about that. Or an economist.

[Ron Whitfield]

Oh darn, did TK get it wrong, again...?

Most folks can see right thru the McPalin BS of desperation and if the vote were today, Obama would skate in on hot greased rails.

Only 25 more shopping day's til Christmas!

[timkona]

Many people look at the financial troubles as something caused by Republican policies of deregulation

Free market capitalism is anathema to those who use dependency, and subjugation as the source of their power.

[escondido100]

points to ponder. please refute intelligently.


Why I'm voting Democrat

I'm voting Democrat because I'm way too irresponsible to own a
gun, and I know that my local police are all I need to protect
me from murderers and thieves.

I'm voting Democrat because I love the fact that I can now marry
whatever I want. I've decided to marry my horse.

I'm voting Democrat because I believe oil companies' profits of
4% on a gallon of gas are obscene but the government taxing the
same gallon of gas at 15% isn't.

I'm voting Democrat because I believe the government will do a
better job of spending the money I earn than I would.

I'm voting Democrat because freedom of speech is fine as long as
nobody is offended by it.

I'm voting Democrat because when we pull out of Iraq I trust
that the bad guys will stop what they're doing because they now
think we're good people.

I'm voting Democrat because I believe that people who can't tell
us if it will rain on Friday CAN tell us that the polar ice caps
will melt away in ten years if I don't start driving a Prius.

I'm voting Democrat because I'm not concerned about the
slaughter of millions of babies so long as we keep all death row
inmates alive.

I'm voting Democrat because I believe that business should not
be allowed to make profits for themselves. They need to break
even and give the rest away to the government for redistribution
as THEY see fit.

I'm voting Democrat because I believe liberal judges need to
rewrite the Constitution every few days to suit some fringe
kooks who would NEVER get their agendas past the voters.

I'm voting Democrat because my head is so firmly planted up my
@#% it's unlikely that I'll ever have another point of view.

'A Liberal is a person who will give away everything they don't
own'

- William F. Carling -

[timkona]

Escondido, please remember that debate is only fun if you put forth points that can be reasonably refuted.

You should vote Democrat if you believe, have opinions, or 'think' it is good.

The rest of us prefer facts, knowledge and history.

PS - Congrats to you and your horsey.

[Walkoff Balk]

I'm voting Democrat because I love the fact that I can now marry
whatever I want. I've decided to marry my horse.

- William F. Carling -
I can only dream of marrying a horse. First, our kids will have married parents. Our school will have a helluva football team with half human, half horse kids on the team.

[timkona]

Does Obama smoke?

[Leo Lakio]

Does Obama smoke?Tobacco? He says he quit before announcing his presidential bid, but still smokes the occasional cigarette. More here (http://www.suntimes.com/news/elections/1207854,obamahealth100708.article).

[Frankie's Market]

Here comes a classic zinger....ya ready libs?

It's amazing to me how Obama's rise in the polls has been inversely proportional to Wall St's gigantic losses. The only station reporting this is Fox News. Not a mention, or even the merest speculation on MSNBC, CNN, or NPR.

An observation made by someone who's obviously not a regular viewer of Hardball (MSNBC) or Situation Room (CNN). :rolleyes:

You've got to be kidding. Wall Street's woes and its effects on the presidential campaign is talked about constantly on all the news networks. Today included. Statements like this only show you're not paying close attention.

[Kaukura]

i have read that it is known but very hush hush that Laura Bush smokes. Maybe she's quit or has tried to, but I've read that she does indeed do so. Not that it matters IMO.

[tutusue]

[...]
It's amazing to me how Obama's rise in the polls has been inversely proportional to Wall St's gigantic losses. The only station reporting this is Fox News. Not a mention, or even the merest speculation on MSNBC, CNN, or NPR.[...]
Ah jeez, I don't watch Fox news, consider myself politically ignorant and even I'm aware of the correlation!

grulg :D

[Vanguard]

Barack 'Osama' on Rensselaer County absentee ballots (http://timesunion.com/AspStories/story.asp?storyID=728326)

[matapule]

It's amazing to me how Obama's rise in the polls has been inversely proportional to Wall St's gigantic losses. The only station reporting this is Fox News. Not a mention, or even the merest speculation on MSNBC, CNN, or NPR.

This is a classic example of re-writing history. Yes, the neo-cons were bound to come up with some nonsensical way to blame the market collapse on the "libruls." Nice try, but doesn't wash.

I predict that the market is going to make a huge increase on November 5, the day after Obama is elected president. How are the neo-cons going to spin that? Smart money goes into the Stock Market before the election in a "total stock index fund" like the Wilshire 5000.

[matapule]

Why I'm voting Democrat

Ah.....I see your primary news source is Rush Limbarf. Excellent!

So Carlin is marrying his horse. Makes perfect sense. A horse'sass marrying a horse. The two go nose to tail so to speak.

Go to time out and don't come back until you can play nice.

[Vanguard]

Betty White: "If Barack Obama needs more experience, I could give it to him" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TxL7MKsGoPo)

[Walkoff Balk]

i have read that it is known but very hush hush that Laura Bush smokes. Maybe she's quit or has tried to, but I've read that she does indeed do so. Not that it matters IMO.
Can you still "smoke a pipe" in the White House? I thought you get impeached for that.

[Frankie's Market]

George congressman and longtime civil rights activist John Lewis had some strong words for John McCain and Sarah Palin today.

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/10/one-of-mccains.html

"As one who was a victim of violence and hate during the height of the Civil Rights Movement, I am deeply disturbed by the negative tone of the McCain-Palin campaign. What I am seeing reminds me too much of another destructive period in American history. Sen. McCain and Gov. Palin are sowing the seeds of hatred and division, and there is no need for this hostility in our political discourse."

Lewis even invokes segregationist former Gov. George Wallace, saying Wallace "never threw a bomb. He never fired a gun, but he created the climate and the conditions that encouraged vicious attacks against innocent Americans who were simply trying to exercise their constitutional rights. Because of this atmosphere of hate, four little girls were killed on Sunday morning when a church was bombed in Birmingham, Alabama."

Lewis concludes: "As public figures with the power to influence and persuade, Sen. McCain and Gov. Palin are playing with fire, and if they are not careful, that fire will consume us all. They are playing a very dangerous game that disregards the value of the political process and cheapens our entire democracy."

To which John McCain (someone who never fails to capitalize on playing the hurt aggrieved victim of harsh comments) predictably had this to say.

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/10/mccain-offended.html

"Congressman John Lewis' comments represent a character attack against Governor Sarah Palin and me that is shocking and beyond the pale," McCain said. "The notion that legitimate criticism of Senator Obama's record and positions could be compared to Governor George Wallace, his segregationist policies and the violence he provoked is unacceptable and has no place in this campaign.""The notion that legitimate criticism of Senator Obama's record and positions could be compared to Governor George Wallace, his segregationist policies and the violence he provoked is unacceptable and has no place in this campaign."

McCain continued, saying "I am saddened that John Lewis, a man I've always admired, would make such a brazen and baseless attack on my character and the character of the thousands of hardworking Americans who come to our events to cheer for the kind of reform that will put America on the right track."

"I call on Senator Obama to immediately and personally repudiate these outrageous and divisive comments that are so clearly designed to shut down debate 24 days before the election. Our country must return to the important debate about the path forward for America."

I tell you. McCain has some nerve calling on Obama to repudiate the comments of John Lewis, when he and his running mate didn't repudiate the yells of traitor, terrorist, off with his head, and kill him from his own supporters at McCain/Palin rallies. Only yesterday when some nutjob lady called Obama an Arab did McCain finally respond to this kind of outrageous sentiment. But if McCain thinks that this one (rather belated) act of condemning anti-Obama smearing gives him the license to browbeat Obama into keeping the rhetoric in the campaign clean, give me a FREAKIN' BREAK! McCain is like the spoiled little kid who has no problems making fun of everybody else in the schoolyard. But when all the other kids get fed up and they turn the tables on him, the spoiled kid runs to the teacher and starts hysterically crying that the other kids have ganged up together to tease and harrass him.

I don't know how Barack Obama will respond to this latest tempest in a teapot. But if it was up to me, I would say, "Grow up, Sen. McCain. Straighten out your own house first before you presume to lecture Obama and his surrogates on running a clean campaign."

[Kalalau]

How Racism Works...

What if John McCain were a former president of the Harvard Law Review?
What if Barack Obama finished fifth from the bottom of his graduating class?

What if McCain were still married to the first woman he said 'I do' to?
What if Obama were the candidate who left his first wife and became engaged one month later?


What if Michelle Obama were a wife who not only became addicted to pain killers, but acquired them illegally through her charitable organization?
What if Cindy McCain graduated from Harvard?

What if Obama were a member of the Keating-5?
What if McCain were a charismatic, eloquent speaker?

If these questions reflected reality, do you really believe the election numbers would be as close as they are?
This is what racism does. It covers up, rationalizes and minimizes positive qualities in one candidate and emphasizes negative qualities in another when there is a color difference.

You are The Boss... which team would you hire?

With America facing historic debt, 2 wars, stumbling health care, a weakened dollar, all-time high prison population, mortgage crises, bank foreclosures, etc.

Educational Background:

Obama:
Columbia University - B.A. Political Science with a Specialization in International Relations.
Harvard - Juris Doctor (J.D.) Magna Cum Laude

Biden:
University of Delaware - B.A. in History and B.A. in Political Science.
Syracuse University College of Law - Juris Doctor (J.D.)

vs.

McCain:
United States Naval Academy - Class rank: 894 of 899

Palin:
Hawaii Pacific University - 1 semester

North Idaho College - 2 semesters - general study

University of Idaho - 2 semesters - journalism Matanuska-Susitna College - 1 semester

University of Idaho - 3 semesters - B.A. in Journalism

Now, which team are you going to hire ?

>> PS: What if Barack Obama had an unwed, pregnant teenage daughter....

[Ron Whitfield]

FM, all that crap from JMc's response is pure coaching from his handler's teachings by Karl Rove. McCain himself couldn't put two sentences together such as the ones writen for him.

Yet another wheel off the BS Express. It's already a unicycle and by tomorrow it'll be up on blocks.

[Leo Lakio]

The Ohio Republican Party used Jackson Brown's "Running On Empty" in a pro-McCain/anti-Obama campaign ad, without permission (Browne is suing over this one).

Sen. McCain's crew also used a "we're not worthy" clip from Wayne's World, without permission - until Mike Myers told them to stop.

Gov. Palin used Heart's "Barracuda" without permission, even after receiving legal notice to cease and desist.

During the primary season, John Mellencamp had to tell Sen. McCain's campaign to stop using his songs "Our Country" and "Pink Houses" (without permission, of course) at his rallies.

Most recently, it's the Foo Fighters who have told the McCain camp to cease the use of their song "My Hero." (Do I need to add ... without permission?)


If you have any appreciation for the creative artists whose work you enjoy - please take note of the GOP's repeated lack of respect for their intellectual property rights.

[Kalalau]

Its been on a couple of Air America shows that the Republicans have already stolen this election by having their secretaries of state in 6 of the "battle ground" states purge Democrats from voter rolls--100,000 in Colorado alone, a fifth of Democrtic voters. So the country gets elderly doddering confused and very angry McCain for president while it slides into another Depression and fully half the population will know its another bogus government, and if God forbid McCain can't finish his term the absolutely unqualified hockey mom with that incredibly irritating voice becomes the Commander In Chief. Anyway, keep your eye on the electoral vote, see if Iowa and Colorado and New Mexico go Republican and there is an unusually low turnout of Democratic voters. Not that the press would ever report that. They are now occupied with whatever trivial transgressions ACORN has committed, and are oblivious to the purge of the Democratic voter rolls. Maybe Air America is wrong. I would prefer to believe so.

[Peshkwe]

Don't forget the theme from Rocky

http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2008/02/19/would_abba_take_a_chance_on_mccain/

Use of Van Halen's stuff:

http://newsroom.mtv.com/2008/09/05/van-halen-heart-peeved-at-gop-so-what-song-should-mccain-use/


John Hall told him to knock off using 'Still the One'

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bDelEINTH74&feature=related

And Franky Valli:

http://blog.wired.com/27bstroke6/2008/07/mccain-campai-1.html

They whine about having to pull the we're not worthy bit:

http://www.johnmccain.com/mccainreport/Read.aspx?guid=271b9107-7174-4c9f-a621-077b5438c319

He is busted for using Katie Couric in a politcal ad:

http://www.mediabistro.com/tvnewser/cbs/mccain_ad_featuring_katie_couric_removed_from_yout ube_94128.asp?c=rss

Now the Foo Fighters?
http://www.eonline.com/uberblog/b33028_foos_fighting_with_mccain.html



Sooo it's up to what...a total of 10? (two for Mellencamp) versions of infringement so far?

[Peshkwe]

Ummm...Make that 11....it's bad when FOX has to send a Cease and Desist for copyright infringement:

http://www.mediabistro.com/tvnewser/fnc/fox_sends_cease_desist_to_mccain_web_operator_9719 0.asp?c=rss

"Fox News requests that you immediately cease and desist from any further use of the copyrighted material and that access through the Website to the Material, and any other Fox News materials, be immediately disabled."



And yet....the irony ...

http://technorati.com/posts/UuZyw6Stv8Qs7VfDrzSG7oZZGvV2oWPMS7%2Bv1OQaMVs%3D

Sean Cairncross, the party's chief counsel, wrote (.pdf) the Foster City, California online vendor that the GOP "takes infringements upon its trademarks seriously." "Please cease and desist from allowing vendors to utilize the federally registered trademarks of the RNC or we will be forced to consider a legal remedy," Cairncross wrote CafePress.




Although to be fair Obama got one too from CBS:

http://www.mediabistro.com/tvnewser/nbc/brokaw_olbermann_featured_in_obama_ad_95839.asp?c= rss

[Frankie's Market]

If you have any appreciation for the creative artists whose work you enjoy - please take note of the GOP's repeated lack of respect for their intellectual property rights.

Very true. Although you can't really blame the Republicans for trying. Vast majority of all the cool songs are made by liberals. If GOP politicians had to stick with conservative-minded musicians, they would be restricted to either country music or to trailer trash rockers like Ted Nugent or Kid Rock. :p

[tutusue]

[...]If GOP politicians had to stick with conservative-minded musicians, they would be restricted to either country music or to trailer trash rockers like Ted Nugent or Kid Rock. :p
Oh thank gawd...someone else feels the same way about KR as I do!!! I just don't get his success...at all! :rolleyes: Generation gap?

[timkona]

Ted Nugent, Kid Rock.....auwwrighghghhhh and Bocephus, with Monday Night Football/NASCAR/hunting/fishing/farming/old skul rules. Morality, Honor, Dignity, Family, Truth, Honesty, Hardwork, and Friendship. Treat others....et al.

A BBQ at my place, and a seat for all. Bring your favorite enemy.

[Vanguard]

William Buckley's son for Obama (http://thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2008-10-10/the-conservative-case-for-obama/) Buckley's Podcast about same subject on bloomberg.com (http://www.bloomberg.com/tvradio/podcast/night_talk.html)

[Peshkwe]

This is just sad:

http://the-uptake.groups.theuptake.org/en/videogalleryView/id/939/

[Leo Lakio]

Newt Gingrich says the GOP is worried about Sen. McCain's chances:
"He has to make the case that he's different than Bush and better than Obama on the economy," said former House Speaker Newt Gingrich, one of more than a dozen prominent Republicans who in interviews during the past week expressed concern over the course of McCain's bid. "If he doesn't win that case, it's all over, and it's going to be a very bad year for Republicans."
Source (http://www.comcast.net/articles/news-general/20081012/Republicans.McCain/)

[Seeking Penance]

lol!!!!

thank you matapule!!!

i look forward to signing on to hawaii threads - just to find out matauple's thoughts on mccain and palin....especially that......of palin

it is clear matapule dislikes palin and mccain with a passion

for that matapule you deserve a curtsy

*curtsies to matauple*

[Vanguard]

McCain: "After I whip his 'you-know-what'" (http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2008/10/12/1537045.aspx)

[Adri]

huh. What happened to McCain's thought that a proper presidential candidate should "talk and walk softly and carry a big stick"? Wasn't his criticism of Obama that he felt Obama was talking too much about what he'd do to opponents intead of just doing it?

[salmoned]

Yeah, what's with all this 'code talking' - 'his you-know-what' = black ass; 'stark differences' = he's black, I'm white. If McCain has something to say, why not just say it? Leaving it all to the listener's imagination just doesn't cut the mustard. I respected the man for his 'maverick' ways, but he's no maverick today.

[tutusue]

McCain: "After I whip his 'you-know-what'" (http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2008/10/12/1537045.aspx)
McCain adds:
I wanna emphasize again, I respect Sen. Obama," McCain said. "We will conduct a respectful race and we will make sure that everybody else does too,...
It's a little late for that claim, isn't it? :mad:

[Frankie's Market]

Well, it was only a matter of time. After days of McCain and Palin hammering Obama for "palling around with terrorists" because of his serving on an educational board with former 1960s radical Bill Ayers, Virginia's GOP chairman has taken it further and now links Obama to Osama Bin Laden. And even after the initial wave of criticism to this statement, the Republican official did not back down from his outrageous charges. How low will the Republicans go? :mad:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/10/12/AR2008101201956.html

[Adri]

I really think some people are trying to rile up the nuts enough to try to kill Obama.

[Peshkwe]

It's all about the 'dog whistle' effect.

http://ethicalmartini.wordpress.com/2008/07/29/what-is-dog-whistling/

“Dog whistling”, or “dog whistle politics” is a relatively new term that’s emerged in politics over the past decade or so. It refers to the art of calling up your supporters and getting them riled up by using subtly coded language that appeals to their baser instincts.



http://racecardpoliticswatch.wordpress.com/about/

Dog-Whistle Racism is political campaigning or policy-making that uses coded words and themes to appeal to conscious or subconscious racist concepts and frames. For example, the concepts ‘welfare queen,’ ’states’ rights,’ ‘Islamic terrorist,’ ‘uppity,’ 'thug,' 'tough on crime,' and ‘illegal alien’ all activate racist concepts that that have already been planted in the public consciousness and now are being activated by purposeful or accidental campaign activities, media coverage, public policy and cultural traditions. So, what’s dog whistle racism? It’s pure political theater to push buttons to win elections and policies.



Basically it uses phrasing and purposeful pauses in sentences to troll for reactions. If you aren't a part of the targeted audience or one who has been targeted by that specific audience....you won't really notice it. It's meant and psychologically pitched for the sonic understanding of the targeted audience, like a dog whistle is sound pitched for only a dog's hearing.

Once the reaction to the psychological pitch has been picked up by the few, that understanding is passed to other like minded individuals and it starts a cascade effect.

[Vanguard]

“It has deeply saddened us to see Senator McCain abandon his historic support for ACORN and our efforts to support the goals of low-income Americans." (http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/1008/Acorn_pushes_back_hugs_McCain.html)

[Seeking Penance]

*cackles* @ the thought of support and the abandobment of mccain towards low-income

and obama is a supporter of low-income americans? i hurl at the thought - aside from the 4 years he supported and as a community organizer, offering neighborhood economic development at Grove Parc in Chicago.

not forgetting the 8 years as Grove Parc's representative in the Illinois State Senate and 4 years as a U.S Senator - the end to that.

all obama ever talks about now is middle america and the middle class no mention of low income america

unless of course i am hallucinating

*cackles*

[Frankie's Market]

You know that the McCain/Palin campaign is in serious trouble when the most stinging criticism comes, not from liberals or independents, but from McCain's own party.

As if the earlier swipes from conservative mainstays like George Will, Kathleen Parker, David Brooks, and Christopher Buckley weren't bad enough, more dissenters have come out of the right-wing woodwork today:

Bill Kristol (NY Times/Fox News commentator) calling on McCain to fire his campaign strategists.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/13/opinion/13kristol.html?_r=1&oref=slogin

Christopher Hitchens (Vanity Fair/Slate columnist) is now openly endorsing Obama, as he can no longer hide his distaste for McCain and Palin.

http://slate.com/id/2202163

Even Florida Gov. Charlie Crist has seemingly distanced himself from the McCain/Palin bandwagon, publicly saying that he plans to spend less time on the presidential campaign trail. Not surprising, given state polling data that now shows the Democratic ticket is in the lead and that Crist and the Florida GOP will have their hands full trying to avert an Obama coattail effect on the state and local races there.

http://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics/campaign-2008/story/722731.html

[escondido100]

post 81 should be deleted. The last two words should not be used in a public forum, or any forum for that matter.
i will not vote for obama, but if elected he will be my president. currently he is a US senator and despite differences he deserves respect.

[Walkoff Balk]

Sen. McCain is going to be on Letterman later this week because he knows the presidential nomination goes through David Letterman.

[Ron Whitfield]

The death card is a legit topic, and has been discussed here already.
I still say it's very possible, if not probable that there will be an attempt.

McCain is going to wish somebody would off him when Letterman get's hold of him.

[Frankie's Market]

McCain is going to wish somebody would off him when Letterman get's hold of him.

I don't think McCain will have it that bad on The Late Show this Thursday. As long as McCain utters the magic words, "I'm sorry," Dave will probably bury the hatchet..... Well, maybe after Dave receives an apology and gets a couple of good-natured zingers in at the senator. :o

[Adri]

post 81 should be deleted. The last two words should not be used in a public forum, or any forum for that matter.
i will not vote for obama, but if elected he will be my president. currently he is a US senator and despite differences he deserves respect.

The topic has been in the news a lot lately since a few McCain supporters have been shouting for someone to kill Obama. You'd have to censor a lot more than this forum to quiet that information. I'm not saying that I hope someone kills a presidential candidate, just that there are certain people who are trying to incite crazy people to do just that.

[Vanguard]

A 106-year-old Vatican based American nun who last voted in a US election when Dwight Eisenhower was seeking office has decided to throw her support behind Barack Obama. (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/uselection2008/barackobama/3190402/106-year-old-nun-to-vote-Barack-Obama.html)

Obama campaign ads in video games (http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/1008/Frontiers_of_advertising_contd.html?showall?1)

The McCain campaign estimated the crowd at 25,000 people, but local police and fire marshal put it closer to 12,000. (http://voices.washingtonpost.com/virginiapolitics/2008/10/post_103.html)

[Vanguard]

Obama Wins (childrens') Scholastic News Election Poll (http://content.scholastic.com/browse/article.jsp?id=3750501)

[tutusue]

Interesting political illustrations... (http://www.drawger.com/zinasaunders/)

[Peshkwe]

William Buckley's son for Obama (http://thedailybeast.com/blogs-and-stories/2008-10-10/the-conservative-case-for-obama/) Buckley's Podcast about same subject on bloomberg.com (http://www.bloomberg.com/tvradio/podcast/night_talk.html)

..........



UPDATE! (http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/10/14/buckleys-son-leaves-national-review/)

Mr. Buckley said he had “been effectively fatwahed by the conservative movement” after endorsing Barack Obama in a blog posting on TheDailyBeast.com; since then, he said he has been blanketed with hate mail at the blog and at the National Review, where he has written a column.

[Peshkwe]

Ahhh....so that's what they're so afraid of....

They want to break down the white, Christian, male power structure (http://crooksandliars.com/2007/05/31/bill-oreilly-the-white-christian-male-power-structure-is-in-jeopardy/)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aTD_DSU23IY

[Frankie's Market]

Sarah Palin gets blasted in an editorial by the Anchorage Daily News. Compares her "I’m very, very pleased to be cleared of any legal wrongdoing" response to the Troopergate report as being Orwellian-type spin.

http://www.adn.com/opinion/view/story/555236.html

If Palin were smart, she'd better make sure that spokesmen for the McCain campaign don't start denouncing her home state's paper. If she ends up returning to her job as Alaska governor (which seems more likely with each passing day), the last thing that Palin needs is to have hostile relations with the local press. She's already lost the respect of many Alaska Democrats and Independents who once thought of her as being a bipartisan uniter and ethical reformer. Will she end up burning her bridges with the media there as well?

[tutusue]

Today's NYTimes poll (http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/15/us/politics/15poll.html?_r=1&hp&oref=slogin) shows Obama with a very decent lead...for whatever polls are worth!

I just don't think Palin has enough smarts, insight or experience to think beyond her nose when it comes to press relations with her home state, FM. She's caught up in McCain's machine and probably hasn't even entertained the thought that they may not win. <crossing fingers!>

I saw news coverage this evening of Palin speaking to special needs parents, most with Down Syndrome children, complete with all the photo ops. She was telling the parents she knew what they were going thru. HORSE PUCKY! That beautiful little guy, Trig, is only 6 months old. That gives the Palins only 6 months of hands on experience. She can't even begin to know what these parents of much older SN children have been thru. I'm the biological auntie to an adorable but severe SN, 9 year old boy. My former sil is 18 times further into the process than Palin, who at this early stage, has no idea.

That said, Sarah Palin seems like the kinda gal I would like to hang out with during chicks night out! Really! But, good grief...she's nowhere ready for the political primetime. :eek: And, if she was, I probably wouldn't want to hang out with her!

[Walkoff Balk]

That said, Sarah Palin seems like the kinda gal I would like to hang out with during chicks night out! Really!
Can you hear each others' conversation at Chippendales? Then, shoot your rifles after being so worked up.

[Frankie's Market]

Today's NYTimes poll (http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/15/us/politics/15poll.html?_r=1&hp&oref=slogin) shows Obama with a very decent lead...for whatever polls are worth!

My favorite website to get an instant snapshot of all the major national and state-by-state polls is at http://www.realclearpolitics.com

I saw news coverage this evening of Palin speaking to special needs parents, most with Down Syndrome children, complete with all the photo ops. She was telling the parents she knew what they were going thru. HORSE PUCKY! That beautiful little guy, Trig, is only 6 months old. That gives the Palins only 6 months of hands on experience. She can't even begin to know what these parents of much older SN children have been thru. I'm the biological auntie to an adorable but severe SN, 9 year old boy. My former sil is 18 times further into the process than Palin, who at this early stage, has no idea.

You are so right. When a Down syndrome or autistic child is a brand new infant, parents usually don't experience any difficulties that they would otherwise face in raising a perfectly healthy baby. But as the child gets older and the slowness of their developmental process becomes apparent, that is when the real trials and challenges begin.

[timkona]

Why do we elevate our politicians status to that of God or Goddess?

Why do we presumably exclude ourselves from ever being in such lofty positions?

Speaking for myself, and perhaps Auntie Lynn, we got just as much cred as anybody. And I will guarantee you that some folks, who don't, should run.

If you would pal around with Palin, then why not consider yourself worthy of a shot at running the country. I've said it before. I betcha every single one of us (Ht'ers) could do it.

Go Ahead. Run the United States of America. At any level. You can totally do it.

[Seeking Penance]

[quote=tutusue;213042]Today's NYTimes poll (http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/15/us/politics/15poll.html?_r=1&hp&oref=slogin) shows Obama with a very decent lead...for whatever polls are worth!

with all due respect tutusue - i have no doubt whatsoever with obama in a decent lead for whatever polls are worth......

yet let us not forget the 1948 presidential election/campaign between truman and dewey....

in the end they were all wrong ..... completely and entirely, the commentators, the political editors as well as the politicians....that dewey adamantly will become president....

the fatal flaw back in 1948 was the reliance on the public opinion polls

an announcement was made that dewey was next to be president.

in the end truman won....columinst, reporters, and editorial writers blamed themselves for relying too much on the polls.

------ I hope it isn't the case for obama ------ I hope in the end whomever america decides; will at least have enough sense to place america back to its ownership - in the hands of the american people

granted regardless of arguements back and forth with experience

this will turn ugly in the end if obama ends up at the bottom of the poll come november

[Seeking Penance]

Why do we elevate our politicians status to that of God or Goddess?

Why do we presumably exclude ourselves from ever being in such lofty positions?

Speaking for myself, and perhaps Auntie Lynn, we got just as much cred as anybody. And I will guarantee you that some folks, who don't, should run.

If you would pal around with Palin, then why not consider yourself worthy of a shot at running the country. I've said it before. I betcha every single one of us (Ht'ers) could do it.

Go Ahead. Run the United States of America. At any level. You can totally do it.




thank you timkona - i couldn't have said it better - thank you again timkona

[tutusue]

Why do we elevate our politicians status to that of God or Goddess?
[...]
If you would pal around with Palin, then why not consider yourself worthy of a shot at running the country.
[...]
Simple...'cuz I have absolutely NO interest. It has nothing to do with worthiness. Possibly, had I found a passion for politics early in my life and pursued that interest, then I might be qualified.

Politicians as Gods or Goddesses? <faint>

[tutusue]

[...]
with all due respect tutusue - i have no doubt whatsoever with obama in a decent lead for whatever polls are worth......

yet let us not forget the 1948 presidential election/campaign between truman and dewey....[...]
And this is exactly why I added "for whatever polls are worth!"...meaning they can either be worth something or nothing at all! One never knows.

[TuNnL]

Barack 'Osama' on Rensselaer County absentee ballots (http://timesunion.com/AspStories/story.asp?storyID=728326)There’s been a lot of talk in this town about firing Elections Chief (http://archives.starbulletin.com/2008/08/01/news/story03.html) Kevin Cronin. But Rensselaer County appears to be giving the Aloha State a run for its money. For those who just want to skip to the ballot, and see the misspelling, click here (http://timesunion.com/shared/graphics/newsdb/081010ballot.jpg). Incidentally, my cousin went to Rensselaer Polytechnic (http://www.rpi.edu/) Institute for college. Can’t wait to get her opinion on this. :p

[Peshkwe]

Why do we elevate our politicians status to that of God or Goddess?



'Cause the pedestal gets em closer to the rope? The closer to they get to it the more likely they'll stick their heads though all on their own.

[Peshkwe]

Ermm...folksy saying clarifications ahead...just so no one freaks out:

Rope, as in.... "give em enough rope......" The way the price of rope has gone way up, you just can't give enough without some sort of pedestal or a forklift as a cost offset.

[Ron Whitfield]

Or we can lower the rope way down like we've lowered the bar for qualifications and expectations for those somehow deemed worthy of deciding futures for us.

Pedestal? More like a piece of newspaper...

[Peshkwe]

Oh lovely....

:eek:


Al Jazeera goes out and interviews people going to a Palin rally:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zRqcfqiXCX0


:head~desk:

[timkona]

Funny how all those folks were so racist against a color that is not their own.

Funny how all those folks felt that they were right because of their color.

Funny how them folks seemed like they would not cotton to strangers.

Hawaii can be a funny place.

Gawd, I hate racism.


glurg :cool:

[Frankie's Market]

yet let us not forget the 1948 presidential election/campaign between truman and dewey....

in the end they were all wrong ..... completely and entirely, the commentators, the political editors as well as the politicians....that dewey adamantly will become president....

the fatal flaw back in 1948 was the reliance on the public opinion polls

an announcement was made that dewey was next to be president.

The Chicago Tribune (a pro-Republican paper) made the now-infamous "Dewey Defeats Truman" banner headline in their early election night edition. But most major media organizations didn't make the same premature projection that day.

in the end truman won....columinst, reporters, and editorial writers blamed themselves for relying too much on the polls.

The problem for pollsters in analyzing the 1948 election was two-fold. First of all, several large states turned out to be very close battlegrounds between Harry Truman and Tom Dewey. In the end, Truman and the Democrats pulled out narrow victories of less than 1% each in California, Ohio, and Illinois. Had those states gone the other way, Dewey would have been the President.

The second problem that pollsters had to deal with was the presence of a relatively strong 3rd party candidate. Strom Thurmond was the choice of the Dixiecrats, a party made up of former southern Democrats who ran on an anti-civil rights, anti-desegregation platform. No one really had a firm grasp on just how much support Thurmond would take away from Truman in the southern region on election day. As it turned out, Thurmond wasn't as successful as some pollsters thought he would be. While he did gain the electoral votes of Louisiana, Mississippi, S. Carolina, and Alabama, the Dixiecrats weren't quite able to pull off victories in Tennessee, Georgia, N. Carolina, Florida, Oklahoma, and Arkansas, which all had bastions of segregation existing at the time. Had at least 4 of those 6 states went Dixiecrat instead of Democrat, no candidate would have had the required majority of electoral votes and the election of the President would have been turned over to the House of Representatives.

Fast forward to 2008. None of the "third party" or independent candidates (like Bob Barr or Ralph Nader) are even remotely strong enough to muddy any electoral vote projections. While polls are not infallible, I wouldn't hold my breath expecting another chaotic 1948-type of election results this year.

[tutusue]

[...]
McCain is going to wish somebody would off him when Letterman get's hold of him.
McCain tries to make peace with Letterman (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081017/ap_en_tv/mccain_letterman)

[Ron Whitfield]

I'm wondering if, as McCain walked off after his time with Dave, the band played The Beatles 'I'm A Loser'?
Or another Who tune that Bush is fond of "Won't Get Fooled Again'?
Or the Stones 'This Could Be The Last Time'?

[Walkoff Balk]

Is Joe the Plumber coming on the show too?

[tutusue]

Joe the Plumber was further immortalized this evening on Saturday Night Live Thursday Weekend Update! Poor guy is gonna be sorry he ever went outside to play ball with his son!

There was a great parody of the McCain rally lady (http://www.nbc.com/Saturday_Night_Live/video/clips/update-crazy-mccain-lady-we-liked-it/768741/), the one who talked about Obama being an Arab! SNL turned her into a crazy lady who wanders in and out of frame. Funny bit!

And then there was last night's debate (http://www.nbc.com/Saturday_Night_Live/video/clips/update-thursday-final-debate/768721/)! Both sides took an SNL hit as did good ol' JtP!

in reference to Palin's appearance on SNL this coming week-end, the AP has reported Palin as saying (http://www.cnn.com/2008/SHOWBIZ/TV/10/16/palin.snl/) about Tina Fey:
It would be fun to meet her, imitate her and keep on giving her new material.
Keep on giving her new material? :eek:

[Kelly0040]

Kristen Wig was awesome as crazy McCain rally lady. I was in tears.

[tutusue]

Jay Leno did a very funny skit last night featuring Bush, Palin and Obama impersonators. Shoots, couldn't find the video online but I laughed harder at this skit than I did at SNL. Didn't think that was possible! I dunno where Leno's show found the Bush guy, who's been on the show for quite awhile, but he's absolutely hysterical and looks so much like the real W. "Palin" was also excellent but unfortunately for her she'll always pale in comparison to Tina Fey. "Obama" is the impersonator I've seen previously and mentioned in another post. He's excellent, imho! Great skit!

The real Joe Biden was a featured guest and helped kick off the show!

[Karen]

People on the street in NY interviewed, saying they are voting for Obama and then agreed with all of McCain's views, not even knowing they weren't Obama's views nor having any views of their own, or they really do agree with McCain's views but are voting for Obama.......unbelievable....short audio and very embarassing for the left.

http://www.bpmdeejays.com/upload/hs_sal_in_Harlem_100108.mp3

[Marco]

very embarassing for the left.

Hardly. I'd be far more embarrassed to be associated with supporters that have yelled out pleasantries like "terrorist", "arab", "kill him" at their rallies. Given the amount of hateful rubbish crowds on the right have spewed, this is nothing. And seeing as it was just a little three minute segment, who knows how many people had to be interviewed before getting the response they were looking for. Smells like a hatchet job to me.

And I'd bet my paycheck that if they did the reverse and took Obama's policies and juked them as McCain's to his supporters, their sentiments would be similar.

[Frankie's Market]

It's not just nameless "kooks" in the crowd that are questioning Obama's patriotism. Minnesota congresswoman and McCain supporter Michele Bachmann is also doing the same, linking Barack and Michelle Obama with the anti-American viewpoints of Bill Ayers and Jeremiah Wright. But she didn't stop there. She also lumped in Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reid, and every other liberal minded member of Congress as possibly being un-American and says that the media should investigate it. Wow! Does Bachmann know how much she's sounding like Sen. Joseph McCarthy? Is she aware of the disastrous results this witchhunt had on McCarthy's political career?

http://thinkprogress.org/2008/10/17/bachmann-anti-american/

When she calls Tony Rezko a leftist, you know that Rep. Bachmann knows not what she is talking about. Man, even conservative firebrand Jesse Helms never recklessly threw around kinds of charges against his colleagues in Congress. What was this lady thinking?

[Ron Whitfield]

Karen, possibly, the McCain group that agree with his statement's but will be voting for Obama, say's many things that could be considered very negative for JMc, like... they may not believe and/or trust him, and have a better feeling towards BO.

BTW, you notice a ton of back pedaling from John and Sarah in their speeches right now. Way different from last week. John is forcing himself to portray the old style that everybody used to like, and Sarah isn't spewing venom and lies in quite the same blatant manner... no wink. They got the emergency memo, ...that they were killing themselves in the eye's of swing voting America.

[tutusue]

Luke Russert continues to be an eloquent voice for youth during this election year and he offers his insight (http://www.oprah.com/slideshow/oprahshow/20081017_tows_fridays/9) into why younger voters have registered in record numbers. He appeared on Oprah today and woulda made his dad proud.

[tutusue]

While Luke Russert is NBC's voice of youth during this election, it appears that Helen is the voice of whoever wants to read her blog (http://margaretandhelen.wordpress.com/). This very funny, 82 year old tells it like it is! No more CNN for me. It's Helen, all the way! :D

[Honoruru]

While Luke Russert is NBC's voice of youth during this election, it appears that Helen is the voice of whoever wants to read her blog (http://margaretandhelen.wordpress.com/).

Thanks for the link. This is hilarious! And right on!

[tutusue]

Helen needs to be an election correspondent for Leno's show! She and the cookie lady, together, would be a hard team to beat! :D

ETA...I just shot off an email to the Tonight Show. Not that it will even get read but thought I'd give it a go!

[cyleet99]

Love it, TS! Thanks for the link. Helen Philpot is very funny; I choked on my gum, and 'bout woke up the DS.

I sent off my absentee ballot tonight; glad to see I had some options other than That One and the Other One, even though I had never heard of three of the candidates. Oh, and I decided to vote for the rail system (oops--OT!) It was helpful to be able to do some research on a lot of the other topics (and candidates) with the ballot in front of me.

Onward, friends!:D

[Seeking Penance]

Fast forward to 2008. None of the "third party" or independent candidates (like Bob Barr or Ralph Nader) are even remotely strong enough to muddy any electoral vote projections.

My guess Ralph Nader will take votes away from florida and ohio - by 1.3% from Florida and at least 1% from ohio either for obama or mccain. This is only a guess. The smallest percentages adds up.

[Vanguard]

Colin Powell endorses Obama (http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/10/19/colin.powell/)

Huzzah! :cool:

ACORN controversy: Voter fraud or mudslinging? (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/F/FRAUD_OR_FOOLISHNESS?SITE=AP)

[Vanguard]

A warning regarding voting "straight ticket" (http://www.snopes.com/politics/ballot/straightticket.asp)

I would meticulously vote for each candidate one by one.

[Peshkwe]

OH SNAP!!!

Just heard this on FOX news (yeah I watch Fox as well as the rest), a guy who ran a voter registration program was arrested for changing voter registration forms from Democrat to Republican:

http://www.bradblog.com/?p=6534

This just in as Brad is headed over to the FOXNews studios. Yesterday the LA Times reported on the Republican voter registration outfit who had apparently been illegally changing thousands of registrations from Democratic to Republican.

Last night the head of that GOP backed group, Mark Anthony Jacoby of Young Political Majors (YPM), was arrested by the California State Election Fraud Taskforce and Oxnard CA Police.

According to CA SOS Debra Bowen's press release, Jacoby himself had committed voter registration fraud.



Here's the LA Times article:

http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/la-me-fraud18-2008oct18,0,3505611.story

[Adri]

Since when did being inarticulate and dumb get to be a virtue in this election? NOTE: I am not saying that either candidate is actually inarticulate or dumb ~ this is a rant towards the opinions expressed by some presumably Americans being interviewed or posting on message boards. I just saw an interview of "undecided voters" where a guy says he thinks he's going to vote for McCain because McCain isn't as polished a speaker as Obama. I saw posts on a posting board criticizing Obama for pronouncing Iraq and Pakistan correctly (the posters did acknowledge that Obama's pronunciation was correct as far as the rest of the world goes) while McCain did not pronounce them correctly but, in the posters' opinions, McCain pronounced them in "an American way" while Obama pronounced them like a foreigner ~ and some of the posters found this "annoying". I keep hearing that Obama's manner is "professorial" and that alienates him from the voters who want an "every day kind of President". I'm all for having a down-to-earth President but I cannot believe people would say that they'd vote for someone because they mispronounce things like a real American or because they're not good speakers.

[Walkoff Balk]

Behind in the Polls.
Who you gonna call?
Joe the Plumber.

[Frankie's Market]

Behind in the Polls.
Who you gonna call?
Joe the Plumber.

I don't know about calling Joe. Seems that his impact on the campaign has been a mixed bag for both candidates.

Believe it or not, Rasmussen did a poll on the phenomenom of Joe the Plumber. Here are the results.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/election_20082/2008_presidential_election/democrats_favor_spreading_wealth_around_gop_disagr ees

Forty-four percent (44%) of voters have a favorable opinion of Joe the Plumber, while another 41% have an unfavorable opinion and 15% are not sure. Among those following the story, the numbers for Joe are 58% favorable and 37% unfavorable.

The surprising star of the Presidential debate is a hit with middle income voters. Among those earning $40,000 a year to $100,000, 52% have a favorable opinion of Joe the Plumber while 33% offer an unfavorable assessment.

Those who earn less than $40,000 a year are less impressed—just 39% have a favorable opinion of him while 44% provide an unfavorable review.

Those with a higher income have an even lower opinion of Joe—35% favorable, 52% Unfavorable.

Fifty-seven percent (57%) of entrepreneurs have a favorable opinion of the man who wants to someday buy his own business.

Given a choice between the two presidential candidates and Joe, 44% say Obama is the one who best understands the economic realities they face. Twenty-nine percent (29%) named McCain and 19% Joe the Plumber.

[tutusue]

[...]I keep hearing that Obama's manner is "professorial" and that alienates him from the voters who want an "every day kind of President". I'm all for having a down-to-earth President but I cannot believe people would say that they'd vote for someone because they mispronounce things like a real American or because they're not good speakers.
Those must be the same people who approve of Palin as a VP because she's folksy, entertaining and...hot! :rolleyes:

Personally, I don't find anyone with a vile temper and who will drop the "c" bomb on his wife in public an "every day kind of President". I call that dysfunctional.

[Peshkwe]

I'm so tired of the 'Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Bomb' thing. All that needed doing was to change it to: 'Dr. Strangeglove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Patriot Act'.

I'd much rather have someone in office with proven brains over perceived 'balls' any day of the week.

[Vanguard]

(Old news) Hillary claims underdog status (http://embeds.blogs.foxnews.com/2008/05/04/hillary-claims-underdog-status-in-indiana/)

McCain: 'I love being the underdog' (http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/10/19/campaign.wrap/index.html)

[Leo Lakio]

Since when did being inarticulate and dumb get to be a virtue in this election?In the 2000 election. Just look at Dubya - once you set the bar that low, all bets are off.

[matapule]

it appears that Helen is the voice of whoever wants to read her blog (http://margaretandhelen.wordpress.com/). This very funny, 82 year old tells it like it is! No more CNN for me. It's Helen, all the way! :D

Seniors ROCK!

malohi u kakai motu'a

[Frankie's Market]

Gen. Colin Powell experiences the backlash from the conservative base for his endorsement of Barack Obama.

First, Pat Buchanan plays the race card, saying that Powell is only endorsing Obama because he's Black.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a4CaggJflak

Soon afterward, Rush Limbaugh also threw Powell under the bus, parroting Buchanan's accusation that Powell's endorsement was motivated by Obama's skin color.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5dmeFAjN9pY

Wow! Either those guys are mindreaders who can decipher other people's true motives,..... or it's all just conservative sourgrapes. My money's on the latter.

[tutusue]

[...]
First, Pat Buchanan plays the race card, saying that Powell is only endorsing Obama because he's Black.
[...]
Soon afterward, Rush Limbaugh also threw Powell under the bus, parroting Buchanan's accusation that Powell's endorsement was motivated by Obama's skin color.
[...]
Buchanan and Limbaugh seem to conveniently forget that Obama is also half white. Silly conservatives...:rolleyes:

[Adri]

So Obama is coming back to Hawaii to visit his ailing Grandma Thurs and Fri. Cokie Roberts better not go off about visiting a more American-type place again.

[Ron Whitfield]

She's gotta be in very bad shape for him to take off. Hope she hold's on at least long enuf to see her dream come true.

[Frankie's Market]

So Obama is coming back to Hawaii to visit his ailing Grandma Thurs and Fri. Cokie Roberts better not go off about visiting a more American-type place again.

Ummm. Don't think that's gonna happen. The circumstances surrounding his August visit to Hawaii and this emergency trip to be at the side of his grandmother (whose health status is described as "serious") are clearly different. Cokie Roberts might have been inelegant in her comments on Obama's earlier trip to Oahu. But let's not paint her as the devil incarnate.

[tutusue]

She's gotta be in very bad shape for him to take off. Hope she hold's on at least long enuf to see her dream come true.
I remember reading somewhere that Obama didn't get back to Hawaii in time when his mom died. I think he arrived the day after. Sorry...don't have a link right now. Anyway, I truly hope he doesn't have to go thru the same experience with his tutu. A prayer is in order...

[Vanguard]

I hope Obama's grandmother will be OK, and I hope she is healthy enough to witness Election Day and Inauguration Day.

[Ron Whitfield]

Look's like McCain has decided to give up on Colorado, due to the electoral vote lessening from his favor.
With only two weeks to go, and at this rate, will there be any states left for him?

[Adri]

Ummm. Don't think that's gonna happen. The circumstances surrounding his August visit to Hawaii and this emergency trip to be at the side of his grandmother (whose health status is described as "serious") are clearly different. Cokie Roberts might have been inelegant in her comments on Obama's earlier trip to Oahu. But let's not paint her as the devil incarnate.

He came back to visit her (and family) the last time too. But I'm not painting Roberts as the devil. I do think the devil is slightly worse ;)

[matapule]

Look's like McCain has decided to give up on Colorado, due to the electoral vote lessening from his favor.
With only two weeks to go, and at this rate, will there be any states left for him?

Take McCain out of the umu, he's done!

Let's see if he blames Parah Salin for his flame out. Although Salin is a nincompoop, she can hardly be held accountable for McBlame's ineptitude.

[Peshkwe]

John Stewart on the 'Real America' schtick...

What the Pfo???? (http://www.thedailyshow.com/full-episodes/index.jhtml?episodeId=188632)

[Marco]

I voted today and am feeling really good about this.





And I have a serious man-crush on Colin Powell.


And Jon Stewart

[Vanguard]

Lucky you, Marco! I wish I could vote today. I've known who I was going to vote for since last year and I'd rather avoid the crowds. :)

[Marco]

Lucky you, Marco! I wish I could vote today. I've known who I was going to vote for since last year and I'd rather avoid the crowds. :)

Thanks Vanguard :)


Went with my sisters, wife and her sisters. I hear ya about hating crowds, but it really wasn't very crowded where we went (Kapolei branch).

Last time I voted in 2004, I think I was too young/green/ignorant and didn't feel like I really knew who/what I was voting for. Just spent a couple hours researching all the candidates, which wasn't nearly enough time. But I'm feeling really good about it this goaround.

[tutusue]

Lucky you, Marco! I wish I could vote today. I've known who I was going to vote for since last year and I'd rather avoid the crowds. :)
If you live in Hawaii you can vote today, Vanguard! Early bird voter sites opened today on each island. Or you can vote absentee. Maybe you discussed these options earlier in this thread. I only checked the previous page! :o

[Leo Lakio]

I got to vote today, too --- mailed in my absentee ballot.

[Vanguard]

If you live in Hawaii you can vote today, Vanguard! Early bird voter sites opened today on each island. Or you can vote absentee. Maybe you discussed these options earlier in this thread. I only checked the previous page! :o

Nope, Tutusue, I haven't been a resident for years. I'm a New Yorker for the time being. At least voting on November 4th will be somewhat festive!

I don't remember about posting about options, but I do remember posting a snopes.com warning about the voting along party lines option.

[matapule]

According to this WSJ article (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/10/22/bernanke-endorses-obama-w_n_136792.html), Ben Bernanke, Chairman of the FED, has endorsed Obama's economic platform as opposed to McCain's platform. I'm not sure if that is good or bad?!

[Seeking Penance]

this is for you matapule - you came in to mind when it was forwarded to me.

mahalo - malama pono

[Vanguard]

Montage of Fox News and Republicans making fun of John Edwards' $400 haircut and defending Sarah Palin's $150K wardrobe (http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/10/23/25449/015/234/639469)

[Ron Whitfield]

Opie, Andy Griffith, & The Fonz! www.funnyordie.com/videos/cc65ed650d (http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/cc65ed650d)

Not so funny - www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBiti-ZbeO0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GLWEDMLmjKk
www.youtube.com/watch?v=4KIvAXPEcaE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4KIvAXPEcaE)
www.youtube.com/watch?v=TWiEHBf77co (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TWiEHBf77co)

[turtlegirl]

Oh. No. He. Didn't. :eek:

Here's John McCain advocating taxcunts (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y0YVzzNNuho)in Manchester, NH.

Whoa.

[Ron Whitfield]

Who wouldn't want a tax cuxt?

[turtlegirl]

Joe Six Pack, Joe The Plumber, now it seems that McCain has to deal with his brother Joe The Idiot!!

Story with audio here (http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/1008/Dept_of_fraying_tempers.html)

Is this for real?? Apparently Joe McCain, the presidential nominee's brother, called 911 to complain about a traffic jam. Then cursed at the operator and hung up. Then called back to complain some more.

[Vanguard]

Bob Barr says don't waste vote on McCain (http://foolocracy.com/2008/10/barr-a-vote-for-john-mccain-is-a-wasted-vote/)

[Frankie's Market]

Ummm. Don't think that's gonna happen. The circumstances surrounding his August visit to Hawaii and this emergency trip to be at the side of his grandmother (whose health status is described as "serious") are clearly different. Cokie Roberts might have been inelegant in her comments on Obama's earlier trip to Oahu. But let's not paint her as the devil incarnate.

I stand partially corrected on this. Cokie Roberts wasn't the "devil incarnate" who would dare to criticize Obama for taking an emergency trip to visit his grandmother. That role was filled by Republican strategist and frequent CNN/MSNBC commentator Brad Blakeman.

http://www.earthtimes.org/articles/show/238341,obama-rushes-to-ailing-grandmother-at-height-of-election.html

Republican strategist Brad Blakeman, responding to a question about how John McCain could square his opposition to wasteful spending with the Palin's wardrobe spree, said that the real outrage is Barack Obama "taking a 767 campaign plane to go visit Grandma."

"Forget about the energy that is wasted, what about the hundreds of thousands of dollars to take a private trip when this guy should be humping his bags on a commercial plane or taking a smaller plane," he told MSNBC. "Taking a 767 of campaign money from people who could least afford it is more of an outrage in my opinion."

Unbelieveable! Equating Palin's $150K shopping spree for clothes/accessories with Obama using his jet to visit his gravely ill grandmother. A lot of nasty rhetoric has been exchanged throughout this heated presidential campaign, but this one marks a new low. Would any card-carrying member of the Republican party care to defend this despicable statement?

[turtlegirl]

Sooo, this guy Blakeman would like to see Barack Obama flying Hawaiian Air or Delta? Is he insane? We are talking about a presidential nominee, one who has recieved public and likely private threats, and Blakeman thinks he should fly commercially? Insane!!

I wonder how much it would cost to fly Obama and family, and all his secret service, advisors, bodyguards and nannies here commercially. Don't forget to throw in the cost of all of the added security at the airports, the motorcades, etc. etc...

Unbelevable, indeed! But, wait...maybe Obama should have just bought his g-ma $150,000 worth of clothes.....:rolleyes:

[Vanguard]

I wonder how much it would cost to fly Obama and family, and all his secret service, advisors, bodyguards and nannies here commercially. Don't forget to throw in the cost of all of the added security at the airports, the motorcades, etc. etc...

Medical Evac for "grandma" to the mainland might be cheaper?

Seriously, I think Blakeman is a big creep for bringing this up.

[tutusue]

It wasn't a question of IF; rather a question of WHEN some idiot would twist Obama's trip to visit his seriously ailing Toot into a political piece of garbage. Congratulations, Brad Blakeman...you get the "Sh!+head-of-the-Election" award. No mirrored disco ball for you. :mad:

Does anyone else wonder why any of the media folks who, during an interview, ask McCain if he thinks Palin either 1.) is a good choice for VP or 2.) is qualified to be the president should the need arise? Do these journalists really expect McCain to say anything other than YES? Maybe that question is required by McCain's camp to allow him to wax poetic about his Caribou Barbie? It just seems like such a dumb question. Maybe it's my perception that's dumb. Dunno!

[Ron Whitfield]

www.youtube.com/watch?v=99HzP6BQm5Y (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=99HzP6BQm5Y)

Go Al, do your duty!

[Frankie's Market]

It wasn't a question of IF; rather a question of WHEN some idiot would twist Obama's trip to visit his seriously ailing Toot into a political piece of garbage. Congratulations, Brad Blakeman...you get the "Sh!+head-of-the-Election" award.

I give you credit if you actually did predict it. I'm amazed that any McCain supporter would go on national TV and take such an idiotic, indefensible, and mean-spirited cheapshot against Obama. I mean, if it was McCain's 96 year old mother who had fallen ill, would anyone expect the senator to ditch the "Straight Talk Express" plane and make the trek to be at her side via commercial flight? C'mon! If Blakeman thought that comment would convert people into the McCain camp,.... what planet is he living on?

Being the cable TV news junkie that I am, I'm surprised that it was Blakeman of all people who would make such an idiotic comment. While he can be very partisan, I've never heard him go off the deep-end,..... until today. Well, I'm crossing him off my list of conservative pundits whom I consider to be principled in their commentary.

Here's Keith Olbermann's take on the matter.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r1dk2omRTzA

[tutusue]

I give you credit if you actually did predict it.
I don't think I predicted it; rather, expected it! I was talking with my pro-Obama doc on Tuesday, discussing Obama's upcoming trip to Hawaii. I felt the trip, the reason for it and his time away from the campaign trail wouldn't hurt Obama. I felt it would help him. Doc was worried that the opposite might happen. Then I told doc that I fully expected someone to talk smack about it...probably McCain himself...trying to turn it into something 'out there'...and that, too, would help Obama. End of conversation.
[...]I mean, if it was McCain's 96 year old mother who had fallen ill, would anyone expect the senator to ditch the "Straight Talk Express" plane and make the trek to be at her side via commercial flight? C'mon!
Absolutely NOT!!! However, would a man who calls his wife a '¢*n+' in public be expected to have enough empathy to break from the campaign trail so close to the election for an ailing family member? I don't know the answer to that question...and that's a sad statement in and of itself. It would've never occured to me to ask that question about Obama.
[...]While he can be very partisan, I've never heard him go off the deep-end,..... until today.[...]
Partisan is fine. Vile is not. It seems McCain is in good company.

[Adri]

I give you credit if you actually did predict it. I'm amazed that any McCain supporter would go on national TV and take such an idiotic, indefensible, and mean-spirited cheapshot against Obama. I mean, if it was McCain's 96 year old mother who had fallen ill, would anyone expect the senator to ditch the "Straight Talk Express" plane and make the trek to be at her side via commercial flight? C'mon! If Blakeman thought that comment would convert people into the McCain camp,.... what planet is he living on?

I dunno how many McCain supporters get on national tv but I've seen the comments some self-purported McCain supporters have left on the CNN and Foxnews websites regarding Obama's trip to visit his Grandma ranging from allegations that Obama didn't visit his Grandma in August so why visit her now unless he's trying to milk it for campaign purposes, to attacks about why he waited to tonight instead of dropping everything to fly to her as soon as he heard she was ill unless he's using it to garner sympathy, to attacking him for "suspending his campaign" just to visit his Grandmother when he wouldn't suspend his campaign to help with a national emergency (the way McCain did).

[Seeking Penance]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NrzXLYA_e6E

[tutusue]

http://margaretandhelen.wordpress.com/

[Frankie's Market]

I dunno how many McCain supporters get on national tv but I've seen the comments some self-purported McCain supporters have left on the CNN and Foxnews websites regarding Obama's trip to visit his Grandma

There's a big difference between political/media figures who have reputations and credibilities to protect vs. some nameless/faceless people leaving slanderous comments on websites. Can't even begin to compare to the two.

ranging from allegations that Obama didn't visit his Grandma in August so why visit her now unless he's trying to milk it for campaign purposes,

This is a flat-out lie. Obama did in fact visit his grandmother in August.

http://www.care2.com/news/member/640795881/843920

But of course, it's so easy for anyone to anonymously post a vicious lie on the net. It's a different story if someone tried to do it on TV with their face and identity revealed for all the world to see, right? So I don't know why you're even bringing up slanderous and irresponsible comments made by anonymous people.

to attacks about why he waited to tonight instead of dropping everything to fly to her as soon as he heard she was ill unless he's using it to garner sympathy,

To garner sympathy? And if, heaven forbid, Obama's grandmother's health takes a turn for the worst, what will that person say then? But hey, being an anonymous poster means never having to say you're sorry, even when you've completely made a horse's patoot out of yourself.

to attacking him for "suspending his campaign" just to visit his Grandmother when he wouldn't suspend his campaign to help with a national emergency (the way McCain did).

I have 2 comments to that:

1) McCain never actually suspended his campaign. Following the "suspension" announcement, McCain's campaign continued to run commercials and his surrogates/spokespeople continued to make appearances on network news shows. This was documented by Media Matters.

http://mediamatters.org/items/200809260009

2) In the official announcement re: Barack's decision to leave the campaign trail for 2 days to visit his grandmother, communications director Robert Gibbs did not say that Obama was "suspending" his campaign. Here is what Gibbs actually said.

http://blog.4president.org/2008/2008/10/statement-from-robert-gibbs-on-barack-obama.html

“Recently, his Grandmother has become ill, and in the last few weeks, her health has deteriorated to the point where her situation is very serious. It is for that reason that Senator Obama has decided to change his schedule on Thursday and Friday so that he can see her and spend some time with her. He will be returning to the campaign trail on Saturday."

So contrary to what your anonymous commentators state, Obama did not say that he was suspending his campaign. In fact, Michelle Obama and Joe Biden will continue to make appearances and Obama/Biden commercials will stay on the air while Obama himself is in Hawaii today and Friday.

[Vanguard]

McCain Camp Silencing Supporter Who Repudiated Anti-Muslim Smears (http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/10/23/14361/223/752/639952)

Somehow, this vaguely reminds me of the time an Iranian VP was rebuked (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7628316.stm) for saying Iran was friends with the Israeli people.

[Vanguard]

Former Mass. Gov (R) endorses Obama (http://www.boston.com/news/local/massachusetts/articles/2008/10/24/former_mass_gov_william_weld_to_endorse_obama_1224 835789/)

[timkona]

This thread has turned into an orgasm of liberalism.

[lavagal]

This thread has turned into an orgasm of liberalism.

Oh Tim! What have you got against orgasms?

[tutusue]

This thread has turned into an orgasm of liberalism.
CHEERS! For both!

[Ron Whitfield]

No wonder I'm feeling so good!

[matapule]

This thread has turned into an orgasm of liberalism.

Actually, I would liken it to an evaculation of conservatism.

Seriously, I am happy to disagree with you. This thread has turned in to a celebration of common sense.

[matapule]

This thread has turned into an orgasm of liberalism.

Yes, Tim, YES, YES! Oh God, OH GOD. Oooooooooh, Tim. AHHHHHHHHHHHH.



Anyone got a cigarette? http://www.clipartof.com/images/thumbnail/559.gif

[Leo Lakio]

This thread has turned into an orgasm of liberalism.Hmmm...now, if we can only get the rest of the nation to follow suit, come Nov. 4...

[Walkoff Balk]

Yes, Tim, YES, YES! Oh God, OH GOD. Oooooooooh, Tim. AHHHHHHHHHHHH.



Anyone got a cigarette? http://www.clipartof.com/images/thumbnail/559.gif
I'll have what you had.

[Walkoff Balk]

Hmmm...now, if we can only get the rest of the nation to follow suit, come Nov. 4...
Suit? I thought it's a blue dress.

[anapuni808]

:o :o :o

(nah, nah - not really. I'm laughing as I'm reading)

[Stephen]

When did liberalism become common sense? On the flip side, when did conservatism become common sense?

I would argue that too much of leaning to either is an abandonment of common sense. . . . .

Any idea that allows for no thought certainly can't be considered common sense, can it?

Stephen

[LikaNui]

Any idea that allows for no thought certainly can't be considered common sense, can it? More importantly, any idea that allows for no thought simply can't be considered as an "idea."

[Frankie's Market]

Just when you thought that the campaign couldn't get any dirtier,....

20 year old Ashley Todd, a volunteer for the McCain campaign in Pittsburgh, hoaxes being the assault victim of an African-American Obama supporter. After being interrogated by the police, Todd admits that no such attack occurred