You talk pidgin?

[adrian]

I just caught myself speaking pidgin in another message board site. Apparently, I just made a thread about something important, and usually the forums are busy around this time, so I was expecting a lot of responses quickly. I was wrong. For five minutes, no one responded. I checked, and I saw the problem, which was the topic's title. It read: "which one would go: your legs or your arms?". Pidgin eh? So, I reworded it: "If you had a choice, which would you choose to cut off? your legs or your arm."

Seeing that this is a Hawaii board, I just wanted to share that with people who understands.

Did you do something like that? (either online or offline)

[Eric]

I usually speak standard English but often drop into pidgin when I'm talking with my parents, especially my raised-on-the-plantation father. My wife is always amused when I'm on the phone with him, because it's so uncharacteristic of me to be talking pidgin. Sometimes it's just easier. The other day I was helping him with some repairs and I called from across the room:

Me: "Dad. I can't find the Philips screwdriver, is it over there?"
Him: "Hanh?"
Me: [sigh] "Dad. No moa da Philips screwdrivah. You get um?"
Him: "Let me see... hai." [holds up the screwdriver for me to come get]

[Glen Miyashiro]

Even though I thought I spoke pretty good standard English, when I was in California people could still tell I was from Hawai'i by my accent. I guess it never really goes away. :D

[Miulang]

Ex-pats like me who have been away from Hawaii for eons relish in being able to break out in pidgin with other local ex-pats (go visit da www.ohanalanai.com boards).

Small keed time, eh, was forced foa speak da kine "good English" even at home. Somebody wen go tell me dat was da only way I going get ahead. So I wen come up hea to da mainland foa school lidat and now close to 40 yeas I stay up heah. So good fun to speak da kine pidgin wit odda ex-pats because we know now wat we go miss by being up heah. Sometimes I tink da ex-pats moa "local" den you guys who still ova in da 'aina. Plenny kine guys ova in da 'aina still trying foa figga out one way to bus' out from ova dere and hele up hea. Plenty us guys want to hele back to da 'aina but no can because no moa enough kala foa live. Eventually though, you going come homesick one way or anoda. Das why stay so important to keep practicing da kine pidgin foa me. Eh, das one real "leveler" which means I not trying to ack betta den somebody else. So wat if I wen go grad school wen I talk da kine pidgin? Nobody going know. Da funny part is plenny kine words we no know how foa spell in pidgin because you going spell da words depending on how you go talk. But since pidgin stay one official dialect ("Hawaiian Creole") den dass okay for us go use, yeah? Plus, when you go wala 'au and you go stick Hawaiian kine words insai too, ho, sometimes come out really funny kine! Like one time on da Lanai, somebody wen go mention "aiyapots". We get good fun trying foa guess wat da person wen go say: "aiyapohts" (as in where planes land) or "aiyapots" (da cannister dat can hold da kine beverages).

Da odda neat ting about writing and talking in pidgin is you get so good fun, no moa time foa get in beefs! ("Wot, I owe you money?")

Miulang

[adrian]

Me: "Dad. I can't find the Philips screwdriver, is it over there?"
Him: "Hanh?"
Me: [sigh] "Dad. No moa da Philips screwdrivah. You get um?"
Him: "Let me see... hai." [holds up the screwdriver for me to come get]
LOL.

Sometimes its easier to speak pidgin when your yelling.

[craigwatanabe]

I didn't think I spoke pidgin until I left for the Military right out of High School (Kalani 78). In Basic Training my instructors made me take a reading comprehension test. When I passed it at a college reading level they couldn't understand how someone illiterate could read at the college level.

Illiterate! How dare! Because of my Pidgin English, they thought I was mentally retarded because I spoke "Funny". I told them they talked funny with their Southern slang.

After four years in Idaho, I picked up that western slang and when I came home to Hawaii my friends looked at me funny when I would ask them, "Whatch yall looking at me funny like thaaat". They would respond, "Eh Haole! What you did wit bradda Craig!

It turns out that after one year of repatriating myself here in Hawaii, I developed a more standard sound that helped me get into broadcasting locally.

But even Pidgin English has it's variations. I though I spoke decent pidgin until I visited Kauai. Hoooo boy sloooow down bradda try talk mo betta den dat no can undastand you. Then there's my Filipino friend Noli, he mixes pidgin with his Filipino accent and bradda, I give up, da bugga speaking something strange!


When you say, "Eh da lunch wagon on Ward avenue is onolishish ho da kau kau stay broke da mout!" that's a bit Chinese and a bit Japanese mixed in with local talk better known as Pidgin urban style.

So lata's we goin grind la dat (then you give them the palm down shaka sign local style) Hmmm is there a way we can get the shaka sign as an icon we can use on this board? :D

[adrian]

But even Pidgin English has it's variations. I though I spoke decent pidgin until I visited Kauai. Hoooo boy sloooow down bradda try talk mo betta den dat no can undastand you. Then there's my Filipino friend Noli, he mixes pidgin with his Filipino accent and bradda, I give up, da bugga speaking something strange!

When you say, "Eh da lunch wagon on Ward avenue is onolishish ho da kau kau stay broke da mout!" that's a bit Chinese and a bit Japanese mixed in with local talk better known as Pidgin urban style.

So lata's we goin grind la dat (then you give them the palm down shaka sign local style) Hmmm is there a way we can get the shaka sign as an icon we can use on this board? :D Good idea about the shaka smilie.

And yeah, I read that pidgin a mixture of various languages mixed together to help the plantation workers understand each other.

[btwnc2c]

Ex-pats like me who have been away from Hawaii for eons relish in being able to break out in pidgin with other local ex-pats (go visit da www.ohanalanai.com boards).

So good fun to speak da kine pidgin wit odda ex-pats because we know now wat we go miss by being up heah. Sometimes I tink da ex-pats moa "local" den you guys who still ova in da 'aina.

Eventually though, you going come homesick one way or anoda. Das why stay so important to keep practicing da kine pidgin foa me.
Miulang

I had to pick out some of your comments because I agree with so much on this. This topic about "pidgin vs. good English" has been on the boards for awhile now. I also left Hawaii a long time ago. Going on 37 years. Went to parochial schools and the usual thing...parents did not allow us to speak pidgin English when my sis and I were growing up. I've heard it said that a person's accent/inflection or lack of it is a result of whoever was responsible for their language skills. So maybe those East Coast Maryknoll nuns and the Franciscan nuns had an influence on me as a result. I don't have an accent or a local inflection and never have. There are a lot of people in Hawaii that have remained there that don't have one either. People here never know where I'm from. BUT, c'mon...admit it we ALL do and can slip into the "pidgin mode" if we want to.

We here on the mainland are often estranged from the Hawaiian culture and people, and live in places where there aren't ANY local people around. To hear the locals' sing-song patois, the pidgin english and the unique sayings, reminds us of home. Maybe that's why on the other site where pratically everyone there are outside of Hawaii, break into pidgin on the boards. We miss that connection...the comfort of being around our family and friends.

I admit for myself it's not easy to write in pidgin. You really have to think about it. But when I do, it's a kick. It's like we have our own special language and we're connected. On those very rare times that I'm around the ohana and the pidgin is flying (and I'm trying :D ), I get so nostalgic for home and family. I'm referred to as the "wannabee tita." :)

Well, that's my 2-cents and I'll get off the box now. Aloha.

[kimo55]

I admit for myself it's not easy to write in pidgin. You really have to think about it.


not for me. its nachurl li dat.
prefer it when im 'off duty".
more fun.
and it helps cement da ohana and confuses da haoles who you don't want part of the conversation.

[pzarquon]

not for me. its nachurl li dat.Even if pidgin flows easily from one's keyboard, reading pidgin is another matter entirely. For good reason, there's no Pidgin Manual of Style or anything, so there's no rules or conventions as to how pidgin looks (since it is, after all, an oral tradition). Is it li'dat, or la'dat? Stay or stey or steh? Some folks use apostrophes to mark omitted letters in English words (he wen' go), some don't.

The differences we see in top selling "pidgin literature" are excellent examples. Depending on your own personal style, Lee Tonouchi's stuff may be hard to process but Lois Ann Yamanaka's stuff might flow naturally... or the other way around. There's no right way or wrong way, and that's both good and bad.

Whether by design or not, reading written pidgin aloud is one way to stay on track. As long as coworkers don't think you're being strange.

and it helps cement da ohana and confuses da haoles who you don't want part of the conversation.I suppose. Of course, this might be an argument against speaking strictly pidgin. Interesting how a pidgin/creole language that developed to be more inclusive to different types of people can also be invoked in a way that is exclusionary...

[kimo55]

I suppose. Of course, this might be an argument against speaking strictly pidgin. Interesting how a pidgin/creole language that developed to be more inclusive to different types of people can also be invoked in a way that is exclusionary... hate it being referred to as creole. cuz that has nothing whatevah to do with Hawaii. creole is from another completely far removed geographic locale.

It is from the Louisiania/Cajun area

It is a term used in referring to white Louisianians.
It is:
* white person born in the colonies
* a person of European descent born especially in the West Indies or Spanish America
* a white person descended from early French or Spanish settlers of the U.S. Gulf states and preserving their speech and culture
* a person of mixed French or Spanish and black descent speaking a dialect of French or Spanish
*a language evolved from pidginized French that is spoken by blacks in southern Louisiana
* Having to do with creole cooking.

but it does not in any way have to do with Hawaii or any aspect of Hawaii or our "slanguage."

I suppose. Of course, this might be an argument against speaking strictly pidgin. there can be no argument against speaking strictly pigin.
if one want to one does. If can, can. if no can, NO CAN!

Interesting how a pidgin/creole language that developed to be more inclusive to different types of people can also be invoked in a way that is exclusionary... it didnt develop TO BE more inclusive. the slanguage does not have innate inclination or motivation, purpose or cause in and of itself as a sentient being would.

the development of pidgin was a natural development with input from all races and cultures on the islands through the decades and i feel it is our unofficial (for locals/kama'aina) language.

to argue that one should not speak it is to welcome the natural response;
"eh you no like hea da kine? wot, boddah you!?
kay den; goway".

[Karen]

there can be no argument against speaking strictly pigin.
if one want to one does. If can, can. if no can, NO CAN!"

Hi Kimo!

I have no argument with this, except that I must comment on the fact that my opthamalogist doesn't use pidgin when on the job, nor have my bankers, dentist, etc. Must be a reason for that, and I suspect it goes beyond them simply not wanting to be misunderstood. (G)

Pidgin has its place, just as our redneck, Southern drawl and way of speaking does in my beloved South Texas, but at home, same thing is true....professional people leave that stuff at home.

[kimo55]

Hi Kimo!



hahzeet!
pau mo da lawn oah deah or what?
no mo' hana today? jez chill wit da keiki and get time to tok widdus now?
glad to seeya again!
wheah yoo been jelly bean!?


I have no argument with this, except that I must comment on the fact that my opthamalogist doesn't use pidgin when on the job, nor have my bankers, dentist, etc. Must be a reason for that, and I suspect it goes beyond them simply not wanting to be misunderstood. (G)

especially when it can be seen that it would be misundahstood when they come work in da shahts, sleepahs and their outrigger ohana t shirt.

Pidgin is da casual "Im back wit my gang" thing we wear (conversationally speaking) to feel comfortable, jes as we wear more comfy clothes when we holoholo on down kapiolani pahk steh hangin wit da braddahs.

[scrivener]

hate it being referred to as creole. cuz that has nothing whatevah to do with Hawaii. creole is from another completely far removed geographic locale.

"Creole" and "pidgin" are linguistic terms with specific meanings. Yes, "Creole," with a capital C and with no modifiers, is usually taken with the connotations you spell out. However, Louisianians don't have exclusive use of the word.

A pidgin is a language spoken by people from disparate linguistic backgrounds as a common tongue; there are pidgins in any area where people with different native languages are brought together and are forced to communicate. Pidgins are spontaneous and creative but have no traditions or grammatical expectations or rules.

Once a pidgin is established and develops these rules, especially when it has been passed down through generations so that rather than a learned language, it is an inherited language, it becomes a creole; hence, "Hawaiian Creole English."

You might feel that you have "ownership" of this language and I can understand that; it is the common language of the islands and I love it; however, to insist that creole is only about Louisiana and white people is sorta like being mad at Van Morrison because his recording of "Brown Eyed Girl" isn't as good as the Ka`au Crater Boys' version.

[kimo55]

You might feel that you have "ownership" of this language and I can understand that;



uh, no i did not say i have ownership of this language.



to insist that creole is only about Louisiana and white people is sorta like being mad at Van Morrison because his recording of "Brown Eyed Girl" isn't as good as the Ka`au Crater Boys' version.


uh, no that would not be the case. On both counts.

[kimo55]

"Creole"...
Louisianians don't have exclusive use of the word.




I would never " insist that creole is only about white people"
nope. never.

Here is the etymology of the word:
French créole, from Spanish criollo, from Portuguese crioulo = white person born in the colonies.

How it became a generic term for a type of pidgin lately i dunno. It will always sound strange to have the originally Louisiana term applied to Hawaii.

[Karen]

Hey Kimo!

Oh man I wish the lawn was mowed, Nope lots being with family and friends, and not working outside. Shame on me! We did harvest some avocadoes, pass some along, and even vacuum sealed and froze some. Dunno how that's gonna taste in a few weeks, but gotta try, cuz some claim it works.

They say heavy rain is probably coming, so I now have an excuse to not mow till Wed. or so, besides, I want the trades to cool me when I do yardwork, and I luv doing it. honest...really(G)

[fvck3k]

Here at the office we "Hawaii Transplants" email each other in pidgin. It's difficult at times to decipher what we're trying to say to each other but during lunch we clear everything up and end up having a good 'ol time making fun of what we were trying to say.

[hikiee]

Even if pidgin flows easily from one's keyboard, reading pidgin is another matter entirely. For good reason, there's no Pidgin Manual of Style or anything, so there's no rules or conventions as to how pidgin looks (since it is, after all, an oral tradition). Is it li'dat, or la'dat? Stay or stey or steh? Some folks use apostrophes to mark omitted letters in English words (he wen' go), some don't.

The differences we see in top selling "pidgin literature" are excellent examples. Depending on your own personal style, Lee Tonouchi's stuff may be hard to process but Lois Ann Yamanaka's stuff might flow naturally... or the other way around. There's no right way or wrong way, and that's both good and bad.

Whether by design or not, reading written pidgin aloud is one way to stay on track. As long as coworkers don't think you're being strange.

I suppose. Of course, this might be an argument against speaking strictly pidgin. Interesting how a pidgin/creole language that developed to be more inclusive to different types of people can also be invoked in a way that is exclusionary...

I can't speak Pidgin but can pretty much understand. On the contrary to your post, I find that when I read "pidgin literature" it's much easier to understand. But maybe it's just because sometimes the people I hear speaking pidgin go so fast it's kind of hard to keep up.

[AuntieNellieKulolo]

I can talk pidgin pretty good fo' one haole from Punahou currently living in NYC...
:D

I use certain words no matter who I'm with as a matter of habit and as a reminder of where I'm from. If somebody doesn't know what 'cockaroach'(as a verb) or 'puka' means, they will learn from me. My boss now knows the meaning of 'kuleana' and 'pilikia', just like I learned 'agita'(roughly the NYC equivalent of 'pilikia') and just because somebody is 'on line' doesn't mean they're using a computer... I also find I use 'yeah?' a lot more than the average NYer.


When I'm back home with my local friends I jus' go buckaloose... :)

[craigwatanabe]

In true pidgin the syntax pretty much follows the Hawaiian language so if you were to say: Where is the remote? The proper pidgin syntax should be: Eh da remote, wea stay? Not Wea stay da remote? That's how you can tell someone who speaks Hawaiian fluently trying to speak broken English vs someone who tries to assimilate into Hawaii's local culture without understanding it. You have to use the rules of Hawaiian syntax and insert English words to make it sound totally local.

Here on the Big Island, the Hawaiian language is spoken quite a bit so the keiki that must attend public schools suffer as a result when they try to cross the bridge from family to school and must use pidgin english to do so.

They understand how to communicate in Hawaiian and not in English but thru school and their friends they learn English words. They put those words into the syntax they're used to (Hawaiian) and it comes out Pidgin.

What some try to do is the opposite: They use English syntax and insert Pidgin words. That's why Big Island pidgin from the rural areas like Kapoho cannot be fully understood by people who speak urban pidgin from Honolulu because the syntax is all backwards.

One of the Beamer brothers (I think it was Keoala Beamer) once said on a radio interview that many of today's contemporary Hawaiian singers who translate Hawaiian lyrics into English ones mess up the meaning of those lyrics to the point where the singer is meaning something entirely different.

That's very important especially if you're singing about sovereignty and you want it but the translation tells the Haole that you don't. Translation of Hawaiian chants should be taboo as the essence of the message won't be entirely understood if translated and could be dangerously misinterpreted.

So to answer the question: Where is the remote? The answer in Pidgin is: Eh Stupid...da TV on top, what you stay blind!

True Hawaiian pidgin English follows the syntax of the Hawaiian language.

[kimo55]

Translation of Hawaiian chants should be taboo as the essence of the message won't be entirely understood if translated and could be dangerously misinterpreted.


many kamaaina believe chants should not be transcribed or even recorded and disseminated. too sacred fo dat.

[Glen Miyashiro]

Craig, do you know whether the syntax of other Polynesian languages is the same as Hawaiian syntax? Here in Honolulu, most Hawaiians are fluent in English but I'm much more likely to meet a Samoan or a Tongan who's not. From the times I've talked to folks like that, it sounds like the syntax is probably similar. Just wondering.

[craigwatanabe]

Actually Hawaiian syntax is similar to many languages around the world. Internationally, it's the English language that's all F@#ked up. I don't know about other polynesian languages but I do know Japanese language syntax is similar to Hawaiian. It makes more logical sense to put together words in that sentence structure than the way we do it in English.

[Sherry]

I took me so long to learn to speak English that no, I try not to speak pidgin. But I can. After being here so long, you cannot help but pick it up I guess.
So orally, yes sometimes. But written, never. :)

[craigwatanabe]

It's almost impossible to write in Pidgin because there is no written format to follow. To me that's how you can determine if a language is an official one if you can write it down. Some proponents of Hawaiian Creole (Pidgen English) consider it to be an official language. I don't think so.

But if you like try write um down goin look la dis jus ask Miulang cuz we stay write back to each odda all da time dis way. Yeah Miulang? We get um! :D

[Albert]

Most people I hear actually talking pidgin can't seem to speak without using that f***ing word in every sentence.

It does, I admit, make me somewhat prejudiced against pidgin.

[craigwatanabe]

you're right about that one and I think that's why pidgin english has been given a bad rap because of the F@#king insertion. I used to hear a couple of my co-workers (before I retired) always using the "f" word like inhaling: Oh wow you F@#ka you going F@#king kau kau today at that F@#king lunch wagon today? Eh dey get some F@#king ono kine grinds."

EH you F@#ka watch your F@#kin language my kids stay right hea you F@#kin brokedick.

Oh pardon me.

Yeah that four-letter word pretty much is getting old.

[adrian]

you're right about that one and I think that's why pidgin english has been given a bad rap because of the F@#king insertion. I used to hear a couple of my co-workers (before I retired) always using the "f" word like inhaling: Oh wow you F@#ka you going F@#king kau kau today at that F@#king lunch wagon today? Eh dey get some F@#king ono kine grinds."

EH you F@#ka watch your F@#kin language my kids stay right hea you F@#kin brokedick.

Oh pardon me.

Yeah that four-letter word pretty much is getting old.
Yes, that may be the most versitile word.

[AuntieNellieKulolo]

Does anybody remember the Pritchett(I think) cartoon that came out a few years ago that showed a bunch of kids waiting at a bus stop? It came out in either Midweek or the Weekly as I recall. I went to the Pritchett website but it wasn't there. Every other word that came out of their mouths was a variation on 'f!@#in'... I remember some folks made stink over it, but come on, it's the truth... :D

[Mokihana]

Sometimes I tink da ex-pats moa "local" den you guys who still ova in da 'aina. Plenny kine guys ova in da 'aina still trying foa figga out one way to bus' out from ova dere and hele up hea. Plenty us guys want to hele back to da 'aina but no can because no moa enough kala foa live.
Da odda neat ting about writing and talking in pidgin is you get so good fun, no moa time foa get in beefs! ("Wot, I owe you money?")

Miulang


Wen I first wen move to da mainland, errybody wen axe me weah I stay from cuz of my accent. Dey wen try force me foah lose um so I could talk like dem. Sheesh. I know dat sometimes no stay as strong as odda times, but eef I stay wit odda locals, no can help full on accent an pidgin. Peeps wen assume dat cuz of my accent an dat I can talk pidgin dat I stay illiterate. Hmmm... hakum I wen get A's in English da kine in college den? Funny kine, dat.

I love pidgin! No get pilikia foah rite um down.. jass seem to flow rite chru my fingahs to da keyboard. Jass axe anybody at da lanai (http://www.ohanalanai.com)
Since so much of da time I gotta talk good English (cuz ho, no can ansah da phone wit "Eh howzit! How u stay?" in my office), den I look forwahd to da times I can kick back an talk da kine wit my friends in da firss language I wen learn. No mattah eef one person spell words one way, anden somebody else go spell um one naddah way. Is easy foah undastand.

One reason why I no get too much pilikia learning American Sign Language is cuz da syntax stay similar in many ways to Hawaiian an pidgin.

So bussum out, peeps!!!

[craigwatanabe]

Actualy ASL kinda follows the English syntax that's why it's called American Sign Language. I used to be a walking aide for the deaf and blind so I had to communicate with ASL by touch. One thing about ASL is that a lot of words were combined into one hand gesture such as "My name is" so it may seem as if the syntax is similar. One thing that most languages don't use that English proper does contain are idioms. If you told a deaf person to go jump in the lake when they ask you a favor, they'd give you a very puzzled look as if they were saying, "you want me to go swimming?" Same with many other languages. English uses these idioms but many foreign languages including Hawaiian don't.

Because there is no written form of Hawaiian Creole you can write it's pidgin in various ways and still be understood as Mokihana said. Whether its: other or oddah or odda or even uddah you still understand because of it's phonic content.

Das rite so like da braddah said, bus em out cuz no mattah how stay spelt we going all figga em out one way or da odda.

Imua! :)

[Glen Miyashiro]

Because there is no written form of Hawaiian Creole you can write it's pidgin in various ways and still be understood as Mokihana said. Whether its: other or oddah or odda or even uddah you still understand because of it's phonic content.

Das rite so like da braddah said, bus em out cuz no mattah how stay spelt we going all figga em out one way or da odda.
Eh, you ever seen da phonetic spelling dat da UH linguistics guys use to write pidgin (http://www2.hawaii.edu/~gavinm/hcegrammar.htm)? Ho, now das hard to read. Reminds me of da pronunciation guides in da kine Webster's Dictionary.

[Mokihana]

Actualy ASL kinda follows the English syntax that's why it's called American Sign Language.

Imua! :)

Interesting wat u wen say. I wen learn ASL from one wahine whose parents are deaf... so ASL was her first language. Da syntax I wen learn was, foah instance: "Go store me". So das wat I wen mean about da syntax stay da same as Hawaiian, an real different from English. Is pretty similah to "hele au i ka hale kū‘ai", yeah?

[craigwatanabe]

You may be right, when I learned to "speak" in ASL we were taught the english syntax method. I think for those who became deaf and english was their native tongue, the syntax was developed that way for easier ASL intergration. When I was a guide I had to work with those who lost their hearing as opposed to those who's first language was ASL. When you're born without a particular sense, you don't miss it and could never understand life with it so guides like myself wouldn't be necessary for those people.

One night I took a group of deaf kids (mostly teenagers) from a school for deaf to a taiko drum performance at Leeward Community College. These kids spoke with ASL as their native language and I had a very hard time communicating with them. These kids could never understand the concept of musical beats and rhythm because they can't hear.

When we were seated many of these kids were puzzled as to why I was taking them to a musical event where they couldn't hear anything. Before the performance started I handed out those large 12-inch party balloons and instructed them to blow them up and place it against their chests and hands.

When the performance started, the sound of the drums echoed thrugh the auditorium and vibrated the balloons. Now these naturally deaf kids could "hear" the beats of the taiko drums for the first time in their lives. A lot of them cried.

That was an experience all of us appreciated and one I'll never forget.

[Mokihana]

That was fantastic, you taking the deaf kids to the taiko drum concert! Good for you! I bet it was as much a blessing to you as it was for them.

You musta learned SEE (Signing Exact English), then, as opposed to ASL. As you know, ASL is a language unto itself, with its own grammar and syntax... it's one of the reasons I consider myself multi-lingual.

Thanks for sharing about the concert... you blessed me, too!

[Nohealani]

LOL...eh u talk pidgin? I just recently returned from a student exchange at the University of Auckland...and although I speak standard english I found that when a friend from Hawai'i and I spoke together, we'd forget who was around and out came "pidgin to da max" we only noticed it when we finally stopped talking and everyone around us had this look of utter confusion with a touch of intrigue...they would always say..."what language we're you just speaking...and we'd say.."oh pidgin...its a hawaiian secret!" and start laughing because of the look on their faces. Hey... but Maori as well as Pacific Islanders I have found also have their own Broken English dialect too...To all my Auckland Ohana....No Worries....CanCan...Always Da Kine...Much Love,


Cheers,
Nohealani

[adrian]

bump. I like see wat oda people like say hea.

[Pomai]

My best and most genuine pidgin comes out when I'm furious and cussing at idiot drivers on the road (windows rolled up of course). :mad: :p

Otherwise people would think I'm from the mainland if I try to talk pidgin casually.

It's good to emphasize a story though, depending on who you're talking with. "Da kine" "laddat". or "Brah!"

Absolutely proper English in the office or when discussing an important matter (with a doctor, banker, etc.). ;)

[backwoodlessons2]

Sometimes I talk Da Kine language...Pidgin

[GypsyLika]

Pidgin is my first language. I learned standard by totally immersion; I lived in Oklahoma. Nobody could undastand me so I had to adjust. I learned to speak just like them. Den wen I use to go back home my friends would all say, "Eh you stay pidgin out wit one Okie accent!" oops had to adjust da accent.

My kids are raised mainland and at home I basically talked pidgin to dem and dey friends. My kids would scold me for talking la dat because da friends no undastand. But I told my kids as much az dey stay hangout at our house if dey listen dey going learn. Sure enough wen my kids friends stay our house & need fo'use da bathroom, dey would say "I gotta go shishi!"

My kids undstand basic Pidgin. #1 daughta worked at a call center and she said a man from Hawaii called and had the hardest time talking straight English. So she toldem' "I undstanda pidgin cause my mahdah local, go head talk pidgin BUT go slow."

My #2daughta helped organized a National Aids Conference held in da Minneapolis area. They had a large Hawaii group there. They noticed her jewelry and Tshirts and thought she was from Hawaii too. She explained it was her "mahdah" da one. She called to tell how much fun she had with the Hawaii group and they gave her all kinds of munchies and stuff. She said, "Mom I made dem laugh cause I asked dem, am I suppose to call you guys Aunty or Unco?"

Its all about the audience and who you talking to? In da mainland when somebody asks me to talk Pidgin and there's nobody to Pidgin out with, it comes out kind of awkward and outta contexts if no moe somebody fo'talkstory wit.

O'wot wuz da question......yeah I tawk & write pidgin, why ha'come? :D :)

[Pomai]

Why? What? Hah? What.. WHAT! Boddah you? What? Why? Hah? :p

[zztype]

Why? What? Hah? What.. WHAT! Boddah you? What? Why? Hah? :p
Who? Me? Talk pidgin, ladat?

Nah.

:)

[1stwahine]

I beg your pardon...Whack Whack! :p ;)

Auntie Lynn

[Leo Lakio]

If I try to talk pidgin, I risk getting the crap beat out of me. One of my first lessons upon becoming a regular visitor to Hawai`i, as well as part of the Hawaiian community in the PacNW.

I do think, however, that I could develop a vocabulary of "Haole Pidgin." Phrases like (spoken with a sharp, clipped, over-enunciated Midwestern accent):

> How IS it?
> What? Bother you?
> Why, yes, as a matter of fact, I rather DO enjoy beef! (followed by a sock to the eye, necessitating the application of said beef to said eye, in an attempt to reduce swelling.)

[lurkah]

> How IS it?
> What? Bother you?
> Why, yes, as a matter of fact, I rather DO enjoy beef! (followed by a sock to the eye, necessitating the application of said beef to said eye, in an attempt to reduce swelling.)
Dass how, brah. Jahs geev um wit da pidgin! You da kine nice haole boy who da locals appreciate for at least attempting to communicate using pidgin. They would even hanai you into their 'ohanas, even going so far as to play matchmaker by offering up their favorite "honey girl (http://starbulletin.com/2000/06/15/features/artd.jpg)" for you, too. Too bad you already have a "Sweetie". :D

[Leo Lakio]

even going so far as to play matchmaker by offering up their favorite "honey girl" for you, too.
...this is why, if I ever get a chance to see Frank DeLima live, I will NOT sit anywhere near the front row...

[1stwahine]

How come? He is so cool -- on and off the stage! :p :D

Auntie Lynn

[Leo Lakio]

How come?
I'm a mainlander/haole; I might as well wear a big target on my chest.

[Pomai]

This is a CLASSIC pidgin sentence..

"Look what stay ON TOP TV.".

... as if what you're watching is on the top of the TV.. not coming from the picture tube. :p

[lurkah]

I'm a mainlander/haole; I might as well wear a big target on my chest.
Well, then...a better evening entertainment choice for you might be Mel Cabang. :rolleyes:

[Pomai]

For the uninitiated, this book will be released soon...
http://www.besspress.com/client/products/prodimagelg/2502.jpg

This is the original book that's been in print for a long time now...
http://www.besspress.com/client/products/prodimagelg/41X.jpg

Stay get 'em at besspress.com (http://www.besspress.com/productdetails.cfm?SKU=2502). Go check 'em now go. :D

[AbsolutChaos]

For the uninitiated, this book has been in print for a while now...
http://www.besspress.com/client/products/prodimagelg/41X.jpg
Amazon sells it (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/093584841X/102-4023118-4229711?v=glance).

I'd suggest picking that one up for starters.

Some "old school" stuff in there for sure.

Two years ago I got a couple of those books as a gift from a friend who lived here. I've not actually had time to look through them yet, though. While I appreciate pidgin, I would never dare to massacre it with my Mainland attempts at speaking. :D I enjoy being able to understand it enough to laugh at the local characters in various plays or understand some of my friends who slip into it in various social settings, but I will never think myself able to speak that way.

Guess it's a personal hang-up...I know it's not the same, but I gotta admit that I wince when I hear people attempt to speak Hindi with an American accent--most of the time I can't even tell what they are trying to say. Then I politely applaud them since they look so pleased with themselves. Part of me appreciates it, but part of me fervently wishes they'd stop. At the same time, in different regions of India people speak Hindi with different dialects/accents, and I sometimes can't understand them either, though I grew up with Hindi.

In non-English speaking countries, I'm reluctant to attempt the language too because I can't wrap my American accent around their words to pronounce them properly, so I know it has to be murder on the ears. I know some people don't mind and even love it when people attempt the language, but I also know others who would rather avoid hearing the auditory assault. I feel the same way about pidgin.

[Leo Lakio]

I do think, however, that I could develop a vocabulary of "Haole Pidgin." Phrases like (spoken with a sharp, clipped, over-enunciated Midwestern accent):
> How IS it?
> What? Bother you?
> Why, yes, as a matter of fact, I rather DO enjoy beef! (followed by a sock to the eye, necessitating the application of said beef to said eye, in an attempt to reduce swelling.)
Maybe that explains the following incident reported on the Advertiser's website today (he musta used the phrases above):

An 18-year-old Moili'ili man was arrested following what what police believe was a completely unprovoked and random attack last night on a 58-year-old man. Police said the older man was walking in Makiki about 9:05 p.m. when the suspect approached and punched him once in the eye. Police said the two men did not know each other and they could find no explanation for the incident. The victim was treated for a fractured eye socket.

[tutusue]

[...] While I appreciate pidgin, I would never dare to massacre it with my Mainland attempts at speaking. :D I enjoy being able to understand it enough to laugh at the local characters in various plays or understand some of my friends who slip into it in various social settings, but I will never think myself able to speak that way.[...]
I know some people don't mind and even love it when people attempt the language, but I also know others who would rather avoid hearing the auditory assault. I feel the same way about pidgin.
I agree with all of the above! Living in Makaha for 13 years (and Hawaii for 27), I've developed an ear for understanding heavy pidgin. But, I'd never attempt to speak it. I'd butcher the heck out of it!

Last night I attended the Hawaii Panorama 4 at HIFF...5 local, independent films. All contained pidgin, some more than others. One film in particular had a young actress who it seemed to me didn't speak pidgin as her 'first language'. While the film was very good her pidgin...to my Makaha ear!...seemed forced, kinda like standard American english with some pidgin words thrown in and devoid of the pidgin inflections and cadence; similar to the old 'Byrds of Paradise' series. During Q and A at the end of the film an audience member asked if sub-titles were being considered for the national release of the film. I'm sitting there thinking "Huh? Why would sub-titles be considered?". Then the friends I was sitting with, one born and raised in Hawaii, agreed. They said they had a hard time understanding it. I was stunned. Has my ear really adapted that much or were they tuned in to a different movie? :confused: They were just as surprised to hear I felt the pidgin was forced. Different strokes for different folks, I guess!

[adrian]

For the uninitiated, this book will be released soon...
http://www.besspress.com/client/products/prodimagelg/2502.jpg<snip>

whoohoo! Another way to lower my english-talking abilities!

But what's bad, is that when our haole deans try talk pidgin after our local dean talked lil dat.

[Pomai]

whoohoo! Another way to lower my english-talking abilities!


Actually alot of the translations in "Pidgin to da Max" are from the "old school", dating all the way back to the era of Pineapple and Sugar Plantation labor. Some of the terms aren't even in use today. Like "hamajang". When was the last time you heard that one? At least I haven't for quite a while. Maybe Greg Hammer will say it now and then, but that's about it.

It seems most children in Hawaii growing up today speak more proper English than they do pidgin. At least that's my observation hearing them talk on the streets.

[zztype]

This is a CLASSIC pidgin sentence..

"Look what stay ON TOP TV.".

... as if what you're watching is on the top of the TV.. not coming from the picture tube. :p
Eh, when you come back from da kitchen, try close da light. Bumbye da electric bill goin' be all hamajang!

[Pomai]

Last night at Mai Tai's in Ala Moana seen a "couple" familiar faces, and also a guy wearing this cool t-shirt...

To the tune of the BANDAI toy logo, it said BUMBAI.

To those not in the know, "bumbai" means "a little later". "Bumbai, I come see you".

This is the best one yet though...
http://www.96seven44.com/images/tako_bell.gif

:cool:

[tutusue]

OMG! That 'Tako Bell' logo is hysterical! I love it!

[Pomai]

Here's how the shirt looked:

http://www.96seven44.com/images/bumbai_av.gif

Here's my name:

http://www.96seven44.com/images/pomai_av.gif

Here's the original:

http://www.96seven44.com/images/bandai-av.gif

If you piece that sentence together, it sounds weird.

:D

[Pomai]

It won't take long for someone to do this one:

http://www.96seven44.com/images/putin_av.gif