Honolulu Mayor's Race 2004 - Chapter 3

[pzarquon]

Continuing this thread (http://www.hawaiithreads.com/showthread.php?t=1687): With the Primary Election over, Duke Bainum and Mufi Hanneman will have to battle it out the next six weeks until the General Election in November. Neither got the 50 percent plus one needed to win outright yesterday. Bainum got 46 percent, Hanneman got 43 percent, and Fasi got about 10 percent.

Lillian Hong was fourth with 0.6 percent, followed by Terrance Teruya with 0.3 percent. Congratulations, you two, for your earnest, accessible campaigns.

Reactions? Thoughts?

[mel]

I voted for Ms. Hong in the primary because I am not completely satisfied with the top 2 winners. The choice is harder for me this time as the race stews for another 6 weeks. I think what you need Ryan is another poll to accompany this thread.... and there should be 3 choices: Bainum, Hannemann and undecided.

[admin]

Ask and ye shall receive!

[mel]

If the general election were held today, that perenial candidate who runs in every single race, every year.... "Blank Vote" would get my vote today.

[LikaNui]

Lillian Hong was fourth with 0.6 percent, followed by Terrance Teruya with 0.3 percent. Congratulations, you two, for your earnest, accessible campaigns.

Ditto from me: Congratulations to both of you!
:)

[Miulang]

Speaking of the outcome of the election, you guys better watch out. Somebody might legally change his/her name to "Undecided" or "Blank Vote" and run in the general election. What would his/her campaign be focused on? "Anything but the status quo".

I personally would write in "Micky Mouse" for President, but I hear Minnie won't let him run...something about not wanting to live a fishbowl existence (and there were some rumors about some illicit activities related to Goofy)... :rolleyes:

Miulang

[lillian l. hong]

Mahalo to you all.
Mahalo to your kind thoughts.
Mahalo to your encouraging thoughts.
Mahalo to your understanding thoughts.
I lost. For those 1016 voters who voted for me, I am very happy and very grateful.
Well, life goes on. I just finished the Woman's expo at NBC to-night. I am trying to get in next week end's Senior Fair at NBC.
X'mas is also coming. I will be doing jewelry shows and crafts in the future.
I'll be waving "Mahalo" sign in the street some time before Friday. I'll most probably going back to Olelo next week.
Thanks again to you all when I needed a shoulder to lean on. You were there for me.
Love, Lillian Hong
P.S. Congratulation, Mr.Teruya.

I voted for Ms. Hong in the primary because I am not completely satisfied with the top 2 winners. The choice is harder for me this time as the race stews for another 6 weeks. I think what you need Ryan is another poll to accompany this thread.... and there should be 3 choices: Bainum, Hannemann and undecided.I like to personally say thank you to you for voted for me. At the same time, I wish to also personally thank you if you are with HawaiiThreads and are reading this note and you did vote for me. Thanks a million!
Love, Lillian Hong
P.S. Hi, Mocha

Ditto from me: Congratulations to both of you!
:)Hi, LikaNui,
Thank you very much.
Love, Lillian Hong

[kamlost]

*Hug* for Lillian :)

Yes.. now that's admirable. Going on with life and taking it as it comes.

[craigwatanabe]

Look on the bright side...you realized you got over 1000 friends! How many people can say THAT! I sure can't :)

[Miulang]

Well, life goes on. I just finished the Woman's expo at NBC to-night. I am trying to get in next week end's Senior Fair at NBC.
X'mas is also coming. I will be doing jewelry shows and crafts in the future.
I'll be waving "Mahalo" sign in the street some time before Friday. I'll most probably going back to Olelo next week.


Hello, Ms. Hong: Yes, life must go on. But don't stop dreaming, don't stop believing, and don't stop talking to the people who stop by your booth at your shows. Keep talking to them about what you think needs to be changed. It's a harder way than having lots of money and lots of "friends" in high places. But with your sincerity and candor, I really think you will win lots of people over, one person at a time. People who talk with you will feel your sincerity and be cheering for you if you should ever run for office.

You and Mr. Teruya were the voice of the little people this time around. I hope if you and he decide to withdraw from public politics that you still take time to be active on a personal level; it's that important to your city, your state and our country right now.

Me kealoha pumehana,
Miulang ;)

[lillian l. hong]

To you all-HawaiiThreads:
Reading your caring notes made me cry & at the same time I was laughing.
I am "Home Alone". My husband left this morning for Hong Kong on a buying trip. My 3rd daughter went to San Francisco for a 2 months temp. job.
From Star Bulletin on Sunday, September 20, 2004: Final count: I got 1095.
I was going to take off politics for awhile until 2005. I thought after the election I would be like a cold dead fish. I was soooo wrong.
I don't know why, almost every night around 11:30 p.m. I came to the computer. I type in hawaiithreads. There you are!
I believe HawaiiThreads is a success story. Somehow there is an endless link between you and I. So many of you(s)! The link is very warm. You are treating me like a family.
Thanks to you all. I am changing my mind. I am going back to the city council meetings. I am going to wave in front of the City Hall & State Capitol to say "Mahalo". I am going back to Olelo to make some programs.
I am no longer a cold dead fish. I am a warm alive Lillian Hong.
Thank you for being so kind to me.
Love, Lillian Hong

[lillian l. hong]

*Hug* for Lillian :)

Yes.. now that's admirable. Going on with life and taking it as it comes.

I usually hug people in real life. This is the 1st time I was hugged on e-mail.
May I give you a hug back?
Love, Lillian Hong

[lillian l. hong]

Look on the bright side...you realized you got over 1000 friends! How many people can say THAT! I sure can't :)
It was very nice of you try to cheer me up. I do appreciate very much and am very grateful of all these 1095 people. I am sure also there were some more that believed in me, and watched my programs but could not vote.
Yes, Mr. Craig Watanabe, for real, not that many people have over 1000 friends. I got 1095 friends! HeeHee!
Love, Lillian Hong

[lillian l. hong]

Just an update:
I was setting up to-day at NBC for the Seniors' Fair for the weekend. This is my trade. Dr. Bainum has a booth, so does Mufi. I know Bainum's volunteers are going to give out little free gifts. His booth is just across mine but in the next lane. I asked the management about Mufi. Tracy told me his is in booth #4, far away from me. I will try go and see him to-morrow. Is any one going to the Seniors' Fair? Please drop by and see me, OK? Booth #114.
Love, Lillian Hong

[kamlost]

hehe sure you can Lillian.

[terrence k. teruya]

I would like to take this moment to thank all the wonderful and supportive people that have given Miss Hong and myself great support. Yes it is unfourtunate that the same type of leadership will get in office yet again. It is not because we were not offered colorful choices but truly it is the lack of participation of the majority. Yes I too tire from same old politics, I am a electronic technician by trade but if someone is not doing the job, I refuse to sit back and let them control my life as well as the many people I know.

What do we know...what we have always known...trash, infrastructure,public safety,and many others. If you listen to every candidate, they pretty much had the same answers but the question is who will DO IT THIS TIME and really address these problems. I am a city employee also and will do my best to support the next leadership. I am saying that the next leader is taking 4 years of my life so they better do the job they are elected to do.

People say I got guts to have run in this race but it is more of disgust is what motivated people like Miss Hong and myself to run. Yes it may be Banium for four years, if he fails then its Mufi for four years, then when the public has had enough we will run again and this time say we told you so. Now lets get to work on these problems,we are so close to financial disaster, I hope these candidates prove us wrong.

It will take more than my tae kwon do training and chinese kung fu to ever hope to win this fight. Many of my supporters are first time voters, I have plans to return again but not in the immediate future. Congratulations Miss Hong, you did a wonderful job of gathering votes, maybe we should team up and fight together, I would be glad if either of us gets into office. We know the problems because we live it everyday.

THANKYOU EVERYONE and all the candidates who got on the ballot to give the people of honolulu a choice!! :) Well next week is my training on the new hybrid electric bus...lets see if it works for our city or be another money eating machine.

[lillian l. hong]

Mahalo to Mr. Teruya for his nice long note. Please keep me and others inform of your electric bus. You are the insider, and you are the one dare to speak up.
I was off this thread for few days. Every time I think of the Senior fair I laughed. Seniors wake up early. Seniors go to bed early. Our Senior Fair
opened at 8:30 a.m. and closed at 4:30 p.m. I had to get up every morning around 5 a.m. It was not my rountine. I came home, ate, and jumped on to the bed and slept!
Dr. Bainum and Mufi both had a booth to greet seniors and others. I got so many surprised people, not just seniors, saw me, eyes wide opened, and asked me if I am really Lillian Hong. They were so happy to meet me in person. Some gigled and gave me hugs. I did OK for my sales. I am very grateful for all those who came into my booth and say hello.
Update: I saw on TV news at 10 p.m. Mayor Fasi endorsed Mufi Hannemann.
Please take good care of yourself and your loved one.
Love, Lillian Hong

[pzarquon]

I saw on TV news at 10 p.m. Mayor Fasi endorsed Mufi Hannemann.He was surprisingly emphatic about it. Up to and including mutterings about repurposing his trademark yellow "shaka signs" to be Mufi signs. I wonder why the enthusiasm? Is it fondness for Mufi, or an aversion to Bainum? I suspect it might be the latter.

The question is, does Fasi's say so automatically move his thousands of voters into Mufi's column? What were those voters saying with their votes? None of the above, or we'd like the Fasi administration's style back? If the latter, Mufi's a good fit. If voters were saying they want something else, I'm guessing Fasi's endorsement implies that Bainum is the alternative to "politics as usual."

Fasi also said he's done with running for elected office. Of course, that doesn't mean he's done with the business of politics!

[craigwatanabe]

This is my theory as to why Frank Fasi ran for office despite the odds: Isn't there a campaign law that allows a candidate to keep their campaign warchest instead of reimbursing it to donors as long as they keep running for office?

But if you spent all of the money for other purposes (illegallyl) but still have to justify the spending for campaigning, you simply keep running for office, cook the books to reflect supposed campaign spending until the warchest is depleted on paper.

What got me thinking about that was when I was assigned to report on Frank Fasi's run for Mayor on radio back when Morgado was running against Harris. In the past all campaign headquarters on election night was heavily catered with food and entertainment...except Frank's. Arnold had a massive luau while Frank had ham and cheese sandwiches cut into quarters. I felt as if I was cheated out of a night of good food! So what happened to all the campaign money! Hmmm.

[pzarquon]

Candidates in debate on debates (http://starbulletin.com/2004/10/05/news/story5.html)
Crystal Kua, Honolulu Advertiser, Oct. 5, 2004
Mayoral candidates Duke Bainum and Mufi Hannemann are accusing each other of dodging debates and community forums leading up to the general election. Hannemann is challenging Bainum to agree to all televised debate invitations. He said there were seven invitations for televised debates and that Bainum has only agreed to one so far. But Bainum's campaign says Hannemann has gone back on his statement that he would meet Bainum "any time, any place," because Hannemann has either canceled or not made commitments to three joint community events.

[lillian l. hong]

Hi, everyone,
I am still here. I am still opening this thread almost every night, and read some of the mails. Somehow I just don't feel like talking about the Mayor's race any more. I have put aside my trade since November, 2003 to emphasize on running for Honolulu Mayor. I am now catching up with my jewelry and craft trade. This is the X'mas season. I am still watching the TV news about Dr. Bainum and Mufi. I am still reading the newspapers about them. I watched Presidential's debate. I watched vice presidential's debate also. I will go thru the voting process. I don't know who I am going to vote for the president/vice president. I don't know who I am going to vote for our Honolulu Mayor. I don't know whether I should vote what people called, "lesser of the 2 evils". I don't know whether I should leave it a blank vote to indicate I am not fully happy of the 2 candidates.
Can somebody please help me?
Love, Lillian Hong

[Miulang]

I don't know whether I should leave it a blank vote to indicate I am not fully happy of the 2 candidates.
Can somebody please help me?


Dear Ms. Hong:
I think many people face the same dilemma as you, regardless which race you're talking about. Here is my take on things: If you can vote with your conscience and feel strongly about a candidate, there is no question what your decision should be. If you have doubts about the effectiveness of both candidates running for any office, consider the merits of what each candidate has to offer and try to think about who would be better and then vote for that person. Unfortunately, to not cast your vote for one or the other person means that you essentially have voted for the person who will end up with the most votes anyway. Some people call this "voting strategically". Your vote does count, no matter who you vote for, especially in a closely contested race. If it means choosing between the "lesser of the two evils", then at least you have made a statement. If you don't cast your vote for either candidate, you essentially are handing over the election to whoever has the most votes anyway.

I hope this holiday retail season rewards you well.

Miulang

[Mocha]

Just a note to Lillian Hong: You always do a courageous job of running for office. I saw our mutual friend Lilian Hiratani two weekends ago...and I mentioned that she should have told all her friends to vote for you. You do have more friends and people who now vote for you Lillian...be true to yourself and keep to your principles. ;)

[lillian l. hong]

Mahalo to Miulang & Mocha.
Your kind notes help.
I'll watch some more TV news and read some more newspapers about Dr. Bainum & Mufi.
For all others that are with this threads:
are you already decided? Are you also in my shoes, so to speak?
Love, Lillian Hong
P.S. to Mocha: You are really our friend: You know Lilian & Lillian! Haha!

[pzarquon]

Eep. Malia Zimmerman at Hawaii Reporter has stirred things up quite a bit with her piece on Jennifer Toma-Bainum (http://hawaiireporter.com/story.aspx?04190df9-96c5-4310-a343-26146c52eacc), wife of Duke Bainum. In short, Jennifer Toma-Bainum became caretaker for and eventually managed the estate of a driver for Charlie's Taxi, and ended up in court contesting that control against the man's Mainland family.

The substance covers events predating their marriage in February (the third for both), and IMHO are irrelevant to the campaign. Yet, the race for the mayor's office is what prompted the digging in the first place, and even while the man's family proclaims no interest in local politics, the neighbor - a primary source - certainly seems to make the link.

Considering the source, the reliance on official documents and on-record interviews is commendable. Beneath it all, it's an all-too-familiar a story of one family's struggle and unanswered questions in the wake of a loved one's death.

As Ian Lind notes (http://www.ilind.net/), "It makes for an interesting read."

[Linkmeister]

I'm listening to the two of them on PBS right now. Not much new, I have to say.

[Miulang]

What the heck is going on? Now Mufi is ragging at Bainum because Bainum doesn't own a home on Oahu? Mufi is wondering how Bainum can spend $3 million to mount a mayoral campaign and yet still live in an apartment in Waikiki? I didn't realize "home ownership" was a prerequisite to running for mayor. At least the guy lives on Oahu, although I guess his wife owns a house in Hilo. Danged but these third marriages cause all kinds of complications, don't they? :rolleyes:

Miulang

[Linkmeister]

See, this is why I'm not enamored of Mufi. He seems to get a little whiny sometimes. That's a pretty silly thing to try to trash your opponent with, I'd think.

[BKHale2007]

his wife owns a house in Hilo.

Olaa Residential Lots?

[BKHale2007]

Sunday's entry of Ilind.net leaps to Bainum's defense.

[pzarquon]

Our latest Mufi sighting? He was chatting and eating a hot dog at Aloun Farms on Saturday, as families swarmed in search of the perfect pumpkin. Between this and seeing him at Walmart that first week, I'll give credit where credit is due: the man sure knows where to be seen. I don't think I've ever seen Bainum milling with the common people.
What the heck is going on? Now Mufi is ragging at Bainum because Bainum doesn't own a home on Oahu?
It's a pointed question, but one that can backfire. Given the family's assets, I suppose you could question his committment to Hawaii. But most folks won't see much deeper than, "Bainum rents!" And, well, I'm sorry to break it to Mufi, but lots and lots and lots of locals rent. People who were born and raised here often rent their homes and apartments their entire lives. I sincerely doubt I'll own a house in Honolulu.

Yes, the premium-priced Waikiki Landmark is a far cry from a walk-up dingbat in Makiki, but you don't want to come across as demonizing renters. Mufi and Bainum have a lot to distinguish themselves on issues... I'd recommend Mufi stick to those.
Sunday's entry of Ilind.net leaps to Bainum's defense.I don't know if I'd call it a defense of Bainum so much as a reality check - a thoughtful reminder of what incomplete sources, messy family disputes and reporting bias might do to a story. I have to admit, even though I feel Jennifer Bainum's pre-Bainum affairs are irrelevant to the mayor's race, the article was shocking. Ian's second look brought some perspective:
First, anyone who has been involved directly or indirectly in a family meltdown over a disputed inheritance should be wary of any tale told from a single perspective, as Zimmerman's story is... Second, Zimmerman's writing doesn't lend itself to a critical stance... And, third, Zimmerman quotes extensively from documents filed in court records, but loses track of the fact that the court reviewed those same documents and apparently came to different conclusions than she would.

[lillian l. hong]

Hi, everyone,
I am still here. I was a vendor at the "Taste of China" last weekend at the NBC. Mufi also had a booth, I did not see Dr. Bainum's booth. I saw Mufi came in with Gail, his wife. I was with my customers.
Later that night, My husband told me that both came by our booth and shook his hand at different time, and went thru all booths also. I did not see them. My husband said I was with some customers talking.
I am still watching TV and reading newspapers about the 2 mayoral candidates. Some of my customers also talked to me about them. I am still undecided. How about you?
Please take good care of yourself and your loved ones.
Love, Lillian Hong
P.S. I am doing very little from Olelo. I am completely off air since September 18, 2004. I am very busy with my trade. Hoping I'll be back in 2005.

[mel]

Anyone watch the televised debate last night on KITV 4?

I did. Listened intently and am still undecided about whether or not I should cast a vote for either candidate or just go for a "blank vote" on this race.

Here are some concerns: (Taken from this article in today's Honolulu Star-Bulletin (http://starbulletin.com/2004/10/27/news/story1.html))

Both also would not say whether they would lower property tax rates during a time of skyrocketing assessments.

"I'm not ready to make that commitment yet," Hannemann said. "I've always said that the next mayor really has to get a better handle on what our debt is, what (our) finances are really like."

Bainum believes "that's unlikely," he said. "I don't want to create false hopes for people. But certainly if we find ourselves in that position, I'd be happy to lower tax rates."

Both candidates are uncomitted to at least putting a hold on property tax rates. This is the terrible legacy that they will inherit from the Harris administration as all the debts come due for those many ridiculous (BRT, fake waterfalls, Natatorium, etc.) capitol improvement projects.

Both candidates refused to sign ATR's Taxpayer Protection Pledge (http://www.atr.org/nationalpledge/index.html), but then I should not be surprised. They are Democrats even though this is officially a "non-partisan" election.

Of course my biggest issue about both candidates is the rail transit. As a longtime opponent of this potentially expensive and tax sucking debaucle, I have a difficult time supporting either candidate because a vote for any of them is a vote for rail. The last cost figure I heard on this project is that it will be something like $22 billion just to build it.

A page out of Mufi's book brings this question to me.

Do we need rail? No. Studies have shown that 10% or less of the population actually use mass transit. I look at pictures of places such as New York City which has had rail transit for at least a hundred years. Doesn't look like it has solved any traffic problems there. The streets of New York are always filled with traffic even if most of the people do not own cars and use their mass transit.

Can the city afford it? Definitely not without some dire impact to taxpayer wallets.

Can the city maintain it? The city has had a poor record of maintaining just about everything it has built. The cost for maintenance and debt service on any rail project will be devastatingly high.

Because of rail I have not been enamored to any of these candidates.

I am sure that after I post this, the raving liberal majority and the environmentalists on this board will come after me like a ton of bricks as they normally do to all conservatives here at this site.

This is the norm for this place. The number of posts supporting the liberal viewpoints on many topics bear this out. There is hardly any room for fiscally conservative or generally conservative viewpoints at all here. We are outnumbered. :(

The liberals around here love that sucking sound of taxes being scooped out of everyone's wallets. That is the liberal mantra.

http://macpro.freeshell.org/notax/notax-s.gif

[pzarquon]

Once again, an otherwise perfectly reasonable, thoughtful, provocative post on an issue that preemptively and presumptuously dismisses and discourages any contrary opinions via a blanket stereotype applied to those that might express them. Disappointing.

I love that you have a minority opinion. I just wish you didn't have to prematurely tar the supposed majority. Especially since it disregards the good contributions of other conservatives - fiscal or otherwise - we've got here.

[mel]

Just look at all the left leaning liberal posts on this board. They vastly outnumber conservative viewpoints.

[pzarquon]

Just look at all the left leaning liberal posts on this board. They vastly outnumber conservative viewpoints."Vastly" is relative, but accepting that assertion for the sake of argument, wouldn't you agree it would be more constructive to express why a weak stance on taxes and mass transit are problematic to you, without adding, "But I know you will all disagree because you're liberals!"

We've had this conversation at least half a dozen times (http://www.hawaiithreads.com/showthread.php?t=1706) already. If you are confident in your views, you shouldn't have to couch them in insults against those who haven't even disagreed with you yet. We're here to have a conversation, or a debate... so what's the point of making a statement that essentially also says, "I don't care what anyone else thinks."

Try this. Just re-read your post up to, "Because of rail I have not been enamored to any of these candidates." Excellently expressed. I was all ready to reply. But everything that followed made any response pointless (unless that was your intent?). At best, playing the "overwhelmed minority" again weakened your argument, at worst, it was baiting.

And yes, Mel, there will be people who will take the bait. Yes, there will be liberals who will dismiss your views on any issue because of your overall outlook. But not everyone here is like that. And I know you're better than that. Neither of us should "feed the trolls," as they say.

Okay. I might be more liberal than you, I might even be more supportive of mass transit (but not the BRT boondoggle). Yet I also agree that Harris has spent us, and our kids, into debt with useless projects that almost guarantee more, not fewer, taxes. We could've explored that here. Nothing is black and white. That's what makes life interesting. So why was it neccessary to put down everyone else here on this site? Or if you didn't want to hear what others had to say, why post it to a "message board" in the first place?

No, clearly you wanted a reaction, but you wanted to frame it instantly as "the raving liberal majority and the environmentalists on this board" coming after you "like a ton of bricks."

I wish there would have been an opportunity to interact. Instead, my reply is dismissed before I can even type it. You're waiting for the bricks, so whatever I say is an attacking volley. Like I said, it's disappointing.

[mel]

It's called a pre-emptive strike. Gotta do that over here. The other few conservatives on this board are constantly knocked down by the vocal majority with liberal viewpoints.

That is the fact over here.

On political issues one cannot escape this fact on this board. The numbers and even topic subjects related to political issues all bear this out. Right here in this Hawaii Hall topic someone just started a topic about the U.S. being cursed by the right wing (http://www.hawaiithreads.com/showthread.php?t=3398) which is inline with all the Bush bashing, Kerry praising and other liberal supporting topics either started or supported over here. That is why there is a broad picture in my viewpoint.

Somehow I gather the liberals are troubled by this. But being in the minority viewpoint I have to express this opinion because everything else will just "fall on me like a ton of bricks." The minority viewpoint has to survive somehow in this sea of liberals.

Getting back to the mayor's race here, anyone who is elected will spell gloom and doom for all the taxpayers in Honolulu and possibly Hawaii, especially if rail is built. The most likely winner of the Mayor's race will be Bainum and he will fast track this rail down into our aching wallets faster than we can scream "tax increase."

Fiscal conservatives anywhere? Not at the top spot in city hall. Not very much at this board either.

Very sad. :(

Last post of the day, gotta go to work. Will be back much later. If ever to this topic. Meanwhile, bash, bash, bash. Have fun folks.

http://macpro.freeshell.org/notax/notax-s.gif

[pzarquon]

Pre-emptive strike? You said it, Mel. It is sad.

You're making it about this board, and its members, rather than about the issues. Thinking about it, I think that's what bothers me most. If you go looking for it, sure, you'll find liberals on the attack and conservative martyrs. But that doesn't mean you have to turn every conversation into a Good v. Evil battle.

For crying out loud, the mayoral race is nonpartisan. And if you've been following this discussion at all, Bainum and Hanneman both have their share of fans and critics here. No one is spared. Why throw out the "rabid liberal" card at all?

I guess I'm just not expressing myself well is all. I like what you have to say, but wish you didn't have to say it with such pessimism. Yes, on the topic of the Honolulu mayor's race, there's a lot to say. But once again you sign off with more baiting, and add, "I might not even come back!"

So I guess there's something else I agree with you on. What's the point?

Anyone else want to parse the mayoral candidates and their debate performances (http://starbulletin.com/2004/10/27/news/story1.html)? Was the question of who they voted for in the presidential election relevant? Who ended up on defense, overall, and who on offense? Who seemed more at ease? And... do you think they'll go on their karaoke date anytime soon? :)

[Linkmeister]

You know, I never met a liberal who particularly liked paying taxes any more than a conservative. But many of us do think that it's the price you pay for a civil society, so we're less likely to whine about it.

If you don't like rail (and I liked it a lot better 15 years ago than I do now), what alternative would you propose, Mel? More roads? Traffic is miserable now; more concrete seems unlikely to be any kind of a long term solution. So what might work?

[pzarquon]

Here's Burl Burlingame's take (http://starbulletin.com/2004/10/27/features/story5.html) on last night's match up. Man, I hope "moofin'" doesn't become a word. :) In short?Bainum's summation can be capsulized as, "What ails Honolulu may be successfully treated with a regularly applied program of fiscal hygiene and professionally doled dosages of properly measured medications," while Hannemann's can be summed up as "Localz RULE!"

[LikaNui]

>> Was the question of who they voted for in the presidential election relevant? <<

Sort of, though it should've been obvious to the questioner (I think Keoki asked that one) that for political reasons neither of them would answer it. If it was me, I wouldn't have answered either, mainly because it would be dumb to endorse one, have the other one win, and then fight an uphill battle to deal with the winner. Kinda like when Evan Dobelle loudly endorsed Mazie Hirono (Linda Lingle's opponent) for Governor; that was a really dumb move.

>> Who ended up on defense, overall, and who on offense? <<

Neither was particularly offensive (at least, not in the way you mean!), I thought Bainum was more defensive, and I thought Mufi won the debate.

>> Who seemed more at ease? <<

Mufi, definitely. Duke looked extremely uncomfortable, highlighted by blinking his eyes extremely rapidly all during the debate. Nervous as hell.

>> And... do you think they'll go on their karaoke date anytime soon? <<

One can only hope not!
:D

Gotta say, I was kind of on the fence before the debate, but it did help me make a final decision.

[pzarquon]

Sort of, though it should've been obvious to the questioner (I think Keoki asked that one) that for political reasons neither of them would answer it.Exactly. Not only is it poor politics in general, but Hawaii has the very fresh Dobelle-Hirono example to use as Exhibit Number One. Endorsements, except in the most locked-up races, are bad news waiting to happen.
I thought Bainum was more defensive, and I thought Mufi won the debate.I favor Bainum, if only in the way I favor a bee sting over a dog bite, but I agree, in all the match-ups I've seen, Mufi has really been at ease and in his element. I can only imagine his more extensive interaction with the public - even if it is pressing the flesh at WalMart and pumpkin patches - help quite a bit.

Brains and ability are important, but politics is at least half showmanship. Whether you think Mufi's more car salesman or lovable schmo, you gotta admit, he "connects" with people.

By the way, it looks to me like the TV ads have gone back to the "light and frothy" variety. I guess I'll take them over attack ads. But I'm not sure which does a worse job of making a strong impression: Bainum's set-to-music biography slideshow or Mufi and his wife's uneven "let's do this in one take" smarm-fest. :)

[BKHale2007]

I hope I'm quoting this right:

She likes classical jazz, I like music from the sixties and seventies

Music from those decades could encompass anything from the Supremes to Black Sabbath. Is Mufi being coy about his musical taste or does he have really diverse tastes in music?

[LikaNui]

I also meant to add that I was less than impressed with the questions that were asked by the panel. Some of the questions were in the class of "What's your favorite color?", almost.
I felt the best questions were the ones submitted by e-mail from the public!

[Linkmeister]

I hope I'm quoting this right:

She likes classical jazz, I like music from the sixties and seventies

Music from those decades could encompass anything from the Supremes to Black Sabbath. Is Mufi being coy about his musical taste or does he have really diverse tastes in music?

Why stop with Motown and metal? The Lettermen, Peter Paul and Mary, Dylan... :D

[mel]

If you go looking for it, sure, you'll find liberals on the attack and conservative martyrs. But that doesn't mean you have to turn every conversation into a Good v. Evil battle.

I am not trying very hard to find the liberal attacks. The topics started by liberals are attacks on conservatives, traditional values and of course President Bush. Many of it easily found in the American Asylum section which probably should be renamed the Liberal Haven.

For crying out loud, the mayoral race is nonpartisan. And if you've been following this discussion at all, Bainum and Hanneman both have their share of fans and critics here. No one is spared. Why throw out the "rabid liberal" card at all?

While the race may be officially "non-partisan", the truth of the matter is that both candidates are Democrats... both liberal though I suspect Mufi skews somewhat a little more to the right. His problem is too much ties to the labor unions, access to the old boy network and of course his stance on rail. Both candidates not wanting to sign the tax pledge that I referred to earlier just cements this IMO.

I like what you have to say, but wish you didn't have to say it with such pessimism.

When it comes to matters that may negatively impact my wallet, erode Hawaii taxpayers buying power and increases the cost of living, I cannot help but be negative. Hawaii taxpayers have been burned far too long by 40+ years of a liberal agenda creating one of the worst tax hells in the nation. How can one not be pessimistic when another liberal will take charge and potentially spend more money on something most people won't use but nearly everyone will have to pay for?

http://macpro.freeshell.org/notax/notax-s.gif

[mel]

You know, I never met a liberal who particularly liked paying taxes any more than a conservative. But many of us do think that it's the price you pay for a civil society, so we're less likely to whine about it.

Here in Hawaii we have been paying the price for liberal agendas too long. We are the 4th highest taxed state in the nation. Already we are paying way too much taxes, and already the liberals got more taxes enacted (bottle bill tax) and want us to pay even more (several years of local Democrats drafting bills to increase the GE Tax and others). There is no regard for how much the taxpayers actually have to dish out to support liberal agendas.


If you don't like rail (and I liked it a lot better 15 years ago than I do now), what alternative would you propose, Mel? More roads? Traffic is miserable now; more concrete seems unlikely to be any kind of a long term solution. So what might work?

Yes, what is wrong with building more roads? Motorists are the majority. Motorists use the roads the most. They pay the most taxes. So the ground transportation solutions should go to the people who pay the largest share of the taxes. The 10% or less who use mass transit already have TheBus here in Honolulu and that already is being subsidized by everyone in the county who pays property taxes.

http://macpro.freeshell.org/notax/notax-s.gif

[pzarquon]

The ever enterprising Ian Lind has started digging into the Jennifer Alonso-Toma issue (http://www.ilind.net/) himself, as the Hawaii Reporter campaign apparently spreads far and wide.

Ian had noted previously that despite Murasaki's son's assertions, there are always two sides to any story, and that given the always messy business of family politics and estates, it was notable in this case that the courts had disagreed with him. Ian reviewed some of the records, and even posts one of the man's psychological evaluations, and makes it clear that although the man was not well, he decided early on he was upset with his son wanted his money to go somewhere else.

He notes, reasonably:
No one can claim to know the "truth" based on this public record, but it is strikingly clear that Zimmerman's version omits many of the basic facts needed to even appreciate that there are two sides to the tale.If, meanwhile, Bainum opponents are seizing on the Jennifer Alonso-Toma issue as voraciously and aggressively as it sounds like they are, I think they've picked a gun that'll backfire.

Despite the 'train wreck' aspect, I think most people see the flap as irrelevant to the campaign... and if Bainum's critics whip themselves into too much of a froth, it'll turn even more people off. And as these latest poll numbers (http://starbulletin.com/2004/10/27/news/story2.html) show, Hanneman's biggest liability isn't his support versus Bainum's support... but in the surprising jump in the number of people who separately have an unfavorable opinion of him.

[pzarquon]

The Honolulu Weekly has its day-in-the-life ride-along profiles (http://www.honoluluweekly.com/cover/detail.php?id=55) of both Duke Bainum and Mufi Hanneman online. Genevieve Suzuki captures the feel of both campaign trails. Lesa Griffith, meanwhile, briefly profiles the women who would be Honolulu's first lady.

[BKHale2007]

It was She likes classical and jazz

[BKHale2007]

http://www.hawaiireporter.com/story.aspx?e15c951f-7bc5-41c6-a73e-ce415e424e35

Whether or not you think HR has a vendetta against Duke Bainum or his wife, this still merits consideration.

Two lawyers and one psychologist who helped ensure Jennifer Toma-Alonso received rights along with her mother to the entire fortune of 85-year-old Masumi Murasaki for whom she served as a "caregiver," are in court because of their professional conduct.

[pzarquon]

Early results (absentee and early voting) fresh out of the State Capitol shows Bainum with a slight lead over Hanneman, 51 percent to 48 percent. Of course, these numbers are technically with zero out of 297 precincts reporting. We'll see how returns for today look in a few hours.

For once I agree with the KITV pundit who said election day and late voting probably favors Hanneman, so as they say, "Too close to call."

[mel]

Well it looked like Mufi won at the so-called "final" printout about 11 tonight.

Mufi 145,353
Duke 144,059

The glitch: Someone forgot to send about 4,000+ absentee ballots over from the City Clerk's office to the State Capitol. These are mail ins from a 4:PM pickup.

So says News 8.

Where's the fat lady singing?

[pzarquon]

As of 5:30 a.m., Mufi's come-from-behind win has held, 147,943 to Duke's 146,588. A notable turnaround from the strong lead Duke had mere weeks ago in statewide polls. I personally know maybe half a dozen people - family, friends, coworkers - who switched to Mufi in that period, so I definitely think it was an unexpected trend.

Like I said above, "I favor Bainum, if only in the way I favor a bee sting over a dog bite," and at worst Mufi's win, to me, just means more of the same in City Hall.

Interestingly, a number of folks - including the current mayor - is chalking up this reversal to the Jennifer Toma Bainum "smear" (if not so much Zimmerman's initial work but the way it was seized upon, amplified, and spread far and wide by "unknown parties"). With folks going on record about it, mainstream media is now in the awkward position of explaining something that it previously tried to ignore. Though I guess this is a tangent better suited to a separate Hawaii Media thread.

[mel]

Bring out the fat lady.

[lillian l. hong]

Bring out the fat lady.
You mentioned twice the "fat lady", what does it mean?
I looked for the threads almost every night or morning. Now it is all over this election, what's next?
Thank you again for all the kind words, suggestions, advices you all had
given me over the pass few months. Thank you also for your shoulder for me to lean on when I needed the most.
Please take good care of yourself and your loved ones.
If you ever go to any gift show, please drop by my booth and say hello, please.
Love, Lillian Hong

[mel]

You mentioned twice the "fat lady", what does it mean?


Hello Lillian,

The term has generally has its origins in Opera I believe, but has also been used in sports. "the game ain't over till the fat lady sings."

That said here is what I picked up from the infoplease website: (http://www.infoplease.com/askeds/4-24-01askeds.html)

Today's Question:

Where did the saying "It ain't over until the fat lady sings" come from?

The Answer:

Often mistakenly attributed to N.Y. Yankees Hall of Famer Yogi Berra, this popular quote is not usually written or quoted in its entirety. The actual quote was the following:

"The opera ain't over until the fat lady sings."

This modern-day proverb is credited to San Antonio sports writer/broadcaster Dan Cook. Cook wrote the phrase in an article in 1976 and then used it again on TV in 1978. Cook, who used the quip during an NBA playoff game, was trying to give San Antonio Spurs fans hope after their team lost a game against the Washington Bullets and was on the brink of elimination.

But historians argue that the phrase may be older than that. It may have originated from an old Southern proverb, "Church ain't over until the fat lady sings."


To put this back in context of the Honolulu's mayor race.

I fell asleep election night with my TV on. When I awoke around 2 in the morning or so, there KITV was broadcasting live Mufi Hannemann and his supporters singing "Hawaii Aloha." I think he had Vicki Takamine Holt or someone lead the song.... and well I guess by this time the counting was probably over and the "fat lady" and people were singing! (I don't consider Vicki fat)... of course I was kind of in a daze and turned off the TV shortly after and went back to sleep.

Anyway besides Honolulu getting its first mayor of Samoan ancestry, we also have a mayor who can sing. Someone mentioned earlier in this thread about Mufi and Duke going out for a karaoke sing-a-long... hmmmm....

[BKHale2007]

$5 Million House of Cards Collapsed With Puff of Truth

http://www.hawaiireporter.com/story.aspx?a489e2ba-58ae-4523-b1de-e46dee60ed5e

[BKHale2007]

Ian Lind mentions a temporary website:

The plot thickens. The press advisories from D.C.-based Qorvis Communications that were received right before the election, offering to arrange interviews with Hawaii Reporter's Malia Zimmerman, also pointed to a web site, www.hawaiiansfortruth.com, "for more information on the (Bainum) scandal."

The site was registered on October 30, 2004 and disappeared immediately after the election.

A quick check shows it was registered using an address in Paonia, Colorado, a town of no more than a few thousand people. Interesting to note, though, the telephone number listed is in Arlington, Virginia. Nowhere near Paonia. I tried calling the number yesterday and got a recorded message. No call back as yet. It smacks of a bit of false info to obscure those actually controlling the site. But we'll see.

Whois Output for: hawaiiansfortruth.com

Domain Name Owner:
Seeking Truth
4024 P Lane
Paonia, CO 81428
US

Administrative Contact:
Seeking Truth
Kline, G [GK-135]
4024 P Lane
Paonia, CO 81428, US
Phone: 571-217-3630
Email: *********@comcast.net

Technical Contact:
Omnis Network
Network, Omnis [ON-1]
3655 Torrance Blvd Suite 230
Torrance, CA 90503, US
Phone: (310)316-2744
Fax: (310)316-4991
Email: ******@omnis.com

Billing Contact:
Seeking Truth
Kline, G [GK-135]
4024 P Lane
Paonia, CO 81428, US
Phone: 571-217-3630
Email: *********@comcast.net

Record Information:
Domain Record Created: October 30, 2004 00:00
Domain Record Updated: October 30, 2004 19:33
Domain Record Expires: October 30, 2005 00:00

More to follow, I'm sure.

[Miulang]

Excellent sleuthing, BK! You do the profession of investigative reporting proud. Keep up the good work. Eventually the truth will come out. :cool:

Miulang

[pzarquon]

Ah, let the gloating begin. The "triumph against a massive conspiracy" tone is a bit much. I also think it's interesting that this more substantive review of Bainum's campaign claims (rather than the focus on the essentially irrelevant Jennifer Toma-Bainum fiasco) comes only after the election.

Edited to add: It occurs to me that there's a whole conversation waiting to be had on this in the Hawaii Media section (http://www.hawaiithreads.com/showthread.php?t=3625)...

[BKHale2007]

Thanks. Ian Lind has a lot of good stuff that hasn't been in the other media. Sometimes I've given him tips. Incidentally, Malia Zimmermann will speak at UH-Hilo.

[Tutulady]

I hope I'm quoting this right:

She likes classical jazz, I like music from the sixties and seventies

Music from those decades could encompass anything from the Supremes to Black Sabbath. Is Mufi being coy about his musical taste or does he have really diverse tastes in music?The later AND he's a very good singer and jokester as well! LOL I speak from personal knowledge mind you. :)