Banning Religious Holidays

[alohabear]

This was from last night's O'Reilly Factor:
Religious holidays struck from school calendar
Guest: Brian Blair, Hillsborough County commissioner

Students in Hillsborough County, Florida will now have only three days off during the school year - Labor Day, President's Day and Martin Luther King Jr. Day. All religious holidays have been eliminated, and county commissioner Brian Blair declared that the community are outraged. "This is unacceptable. Special interest groups are continuing to whittle away at American traditions that our forefathers died for. People want their holidays and we're going to ask the school board to reconsider the vote." The Factor pointed out that America was built on Judeo-Christian principles that have been honored for centuries. "Religion is very important for many Americans, and now they're going to be penalized because of some crazy anti-religious movement. Everybody should remember this when the school board is up for re-election."

Do you think this is too extreme? I do . How many of these student will actually show up to school on Christmas? I think this PC thing is going too far.

[Leo Lakio]

I am not, by any stretch of the imagination, a religious man (spiritual, yes - but not religious), but I would have to agree that this is one step too far.

We don't get enought "days off" in this country as is, so don't take any more of 'em away!

(One could even argue that Christmas is not a religious holiday anymore, at least not in the more commercial necks of these woods...)

[pzarquon]

Ah, the O'Reilly Factor. A reliable source of unreliable and sensationalized information.

The kids still get Christmas off, because of the "Winter Holidays" (Dec. 18-Jan. 1). And while good Christian folk muster the moral outrage of the removal of Good Friday, also rejected were Yom Kippur and Eid Al-Fitr (a Muslim holiday).

Another way to read this particular decision, since the revised calendar came in response to a request to add Eid Al-Fitr, was that it was anti non-Christian. Note that the president of the Florida Council of Churches, a Christian group, said: "I think it's really petty on the part of the school board. ... Instead of giving them one holiday, they decided they're not going to give anybody anything."

What are the options? Open the calendar to all faiths, or keep things like this secular? (Referring to official days off -- folks can celebrate/observe whatever they want independently, and in the Florida case, the school system will continue to excuse students with no penalty on their religious holidays.) Make faith a personal, not political, issue? Or come up with clever secular "covers" for religious holidays we value more? I think it's funny how some religious institutions insist on branding Halloween events -- which many would call pretty darn secular -- as a "Fall Carnival" because, you know, of those godless pagans.

I'm an atheist. My wife and kids are Catholic. They go to Mass and Sunday School for their faith, and public school for... other stuff. My ideal world is one where the public space -- government, public schools, whatever -- is kept secular. Folks should be able to nurture their beliefs however they want, on their own... but not at the expense of others.

But, well, in god "we" trust and all that.

[Leo Lakio]

What are the options? Open the calendar to all faiths, or keep things like this secular? (Referring to official days off -- folks can celebrate/observe whatever they want independently, and in the Florida case, the school system will continue to excuse students with no penalty on their religious holidays.) Make faith a personal, not political, issue?
I think the best option is encapsulated parenthetically here --- allow families to have children out of class, hassle-free, for a certain number of "personal holidays" during the school year.

[craigwatanabe]

I'm a Christian but I've always wondered about how to handle these kinds of holidays in the public sector. From a logical point of view it would be a problem to have government workers get the day off because of a religious holiday and it shouldn't be a paid holiday because it would come from the taxpayers pockets, some who aren't of those religious beliefs.

Like Leo Lakio mentioned that one could argue that Christmas has evolved into a secular holiday. It's not as holy as it used to be with all the commercialism and everybody buying gifts for themselves and forgetting the whole notion of what it was (even that has it's own arguement there).

I'm inclined as a Christian to just let the holidays become a secular one so all can enjoy the winter festivities without the hassle of religion to hamper it. Then we can all celebrate it anyway we want without some religious extremist telling another how to do it correctly.

So let's replace Ho Ho Ho with Spend Spend Spend!!! Merry Master Card and a Happy New Visa Card to all!!!

Jeez and it's not even Halloween yet!

[SouthKona]

School sponsored (PTA) "Easter Egg" hunts are off limits, also. There was a valid complaint a few years ago by a Jewish family that the "Easter" egg hunt was non-inclusive to all the children. So it was renamed EGGstravaganza, so that all the kids would feel welcome to participate. :D

[Glen Miyashiro]

School sponsored (PTA) "Easter Egg" hunts are off limits, also. There was a valid complaint a few years ago by a Jewish family that the "Easter" egg hunt was non-inclusive to all the children. So it was renamed EGGstravaganza, so that all the kids would feel welcome to participate. :DPretty funny, considering that some Christian churches decry Easter eggs as a pagan fertility ritual added on to what is supposed to be a commemoration of Christ's resurrection.

[craigwatanabe]

Well eggs hatch :D

[helen]

Students in Hillsborough County, Florida will now have only three days off during the school year - Labor Day, President's Day and Martin Luther King Jr. Day. All religious holidays have been eliminated,
I can understand Easter and maybe Christmas being an issue but the other holidays like Veterans Day, Thanksgiving, Memorial Day and New Years Day being off the calendar as well? Since when those four are considered religious?

[craigwatanabe]

I can understand Easter and maybe Christmas being an issue but the other holidays like Veterans Day, Thanksgiving, Memorial Day and New Years Day being off the calendar as well? Since when those four are considered religious?


If it wasn't for the Puritans we'd have no Thanksgiving Day. But the rest shouldn't be banned.

[AbsolutChaos]

So let's replace Ho Ho Ho with Spend Spend Spend!!! Merry Master Card and a Happy New Visa Card to all!!!

Jeez and it's not even Halloween yet!

As replacements for the "traditional" holidays, perhaps we should just let the greeting card industry continue to make up new holidays for us, similar to Sweetest day... I figure we're due for them to sneak in a new holiday anyway so they can sell more cards. :p

[scrivener]

I'm with Craig on this one. I'm a Christian, too, of the sort that has gone on mission trips and learned to play guitar by standing in front of congregations and leading worship, and I feel down to my bones the need to keep public institutions secular. Students should be allowed to miss school for religious reasons, but an instutionalized day off for a religious purpose is unacceptable.

Good Friday? Why in the world would any non-Christian ever want to commemorate such a day? And whether my fellow believers want to admit it or not, a day set aside for such commemoration is completely in violation of the Bill of Rights because it is a government endorsement of a religious thought, and we just can't have that. To these fellow believers, I ask: Do you want Christians to be treated this way when there is someday a non-Christian in the White House and when the majority of both houses of Congress are non-Christian? I don't.

So yeah. Get God off our money, out of our pledges, and expelled from our school calendars. You think this is chiseling away at some Christian tradition, do you? How dare you limit the power of the Holy Spirit by assuming a little thing like that could stand in its way?

[scrivener]

What are the options? ... Make faith a personal, not political, issue? Or come up with clever secular "covers" for religious holidays we value more? I think it's funny how some religious institutions insist on branding Halloween events -- which many would call pretty darn secular -- as a "Fall Carnival" because, you know, of those godless pagans.
The recent overflow of these Fall Carnivals, Harvest Festivals, and Autumn Flings is a reaction to what Christians consider a religious event. "Godless Pagans" is an oxymoron because Paganism is a religious inclination.

Which brings up Christmas. Christians who are saying that changing Christmas to a secular day is destroying tradition have forgotten that Christ was probably born nowhere near December 25, and that the only reason we celebrate it there is that the Christian concept of Christmas was put there to replace what was already a religious observance: Saturnalia. And St. Valentine's Day, not a religious day no matter how you look at it, was created to replace Lupercalia, a day of naked revelry.

The only peaceful and fair way to deal with all of this is to get the religious holidays off the official calendars. Nobody's saying you can't still take Good Friday off, but why should Christians get a special, official day off for this when my Jewish students have to actually miss days of school in order to observe Rosh Hashanah? Not fair.

[1stwahine]

What a blessed and refreshing way to get-up and read this on HT! You go Scriv!

Mahalo,

Auntie Lynn :D

[craigwatanabe]

And St. Valentine's Day, not a religious day no matter how you look at it, was created to replace Lupercalia, a day of naked revelry.


Naked Revelry...now that's a fun thought in the dead of winter :D But Hey!!! Here in Hawaii that would be a GREAT Holiday cuz we can celebrate it year round! Yeah! Now that the Mardi Gras is a wash for now Lupercalia can replace it here in Paradise. So instead of passing around beads, we pass around sun screen!

Oh sin sin sin :eek:

[MadAzza]

I can understand Easter and maybe Christmas being an issue but the other holidays like Veterans Day, Thanksgiving, Memorial Day and New Years Day being off the calendar as well? Since when those four are considered religious?

Nobody said they were religious. The article said they were only going to have certain days off as holidays, and that there would be no religious holidays. Two separate statements. Read it again:

"Students in Hillsborough County, Florida will now have only three days off during the school year - Labor Day, President's Day and Martin Luther King Jr. Day. All religious holidays have been eliminated ..."

[Miulang]

Nobody said they were religious. The article said they were only going to have certain days off as holidays, and that there would be no religious holidays. Two separate statements. Read it again:

"Students in Hillsborough County, Florida will now have only three days off during the school year - Labor Day, President's Day and Martin Luther King Jr. Day. All religious holidays have been eliminated ..."

If I was a student in Hillsborough County, FL, I would be upset at only having 3 days off during the school year, unless I also got time off for days that the teachers had to do class preparation or something like that.

Parents should be elated...no having to worry about what to do with the kids...except, what about Thanksgiving and Christmas? It would suck bigtime if kids didn't get those off (although the parents might like it because they wouldn't have to worry about the kids... :D )

Since I think there's a minimum number of days in a school year (I don't know who sets the standard in each school district), does that mean that the school year would start later and end earlier or start later and end on time in June?

Miulang

[Leo Lakio]

I can understand Easter and maybe Christmas being an issue but the other holidays like Veterans Day, Thanksgiving, Memorial Day and New Years Day being off the calendar as well? Since when those four are considered religious?
Memorial Day (sometimes) and New Year's Day (always) fall during times schools are not in session anyway.

Thanksgiving began as a Christian holiday - to whom do you think the (devoutly religious) Pilgrims were giving thanks, the natives?

Veteran's Day hasn't been a school holiday for a long time.

[Leo Lakio]

when there is someday a non-Christian in the White House and when the majority of both houses of Congress are non-Christian?
Wow. And I thought MadAzza was a "crazy dreamer." If I thought this was ever a distinct possibility, I would invest in cryogenics - just so I could be brought back someday to see it.

[helen]

Memorial Day (sometimes) and New Year's Day (always) fall during times schools are not in session anyway.

Thanksgiving began as a Christian holiday - to whom do you think the (devoutly religious) Pilgrims were giving thanks, the natives?

Veteran's Day hasn't been a school holiday for a long time.
Well in Hawaii school is in session during Memorial Day and Veteran's Day is a holiday here as well.

[Leo Lakio]

Well in Hawaii ... Veteran's Day is a holiday here as well.
Another reason to say "lucky you live Hawai`i"!

I recall Veteran's Day being a school holiday when I was a kid, but that support eroded over the years - glad to see that's NOT the case in at least one place.

[craigwatanabe]

Another reason to say "lucky you live Hawai`i"!

I recall Veteran's Day being a school holiday when I was a kid, but that support eroded over the years - glad to see that's NOT the case in at least one place.

I would think Veteran's day should be a day off for...well...Veterans! Not a sale to buy an underwire bra at Macy's for 50% off! Okay it'll work for female veterans.

But Memorial day is a day to remember our fallen comrades who died for our country. I don't see any religious connotation there.

Halloween, Thanksgiving and other religious days/holidays should be kept out of schools. Yes Halloween...you know them Wiccans?

Actually why should schools have any holidays off anyway? It seems this is more for the teachers unions than the kids. I say keep the kids in school during these holidays so the parents can have a day off and walk naked in their homes once in a while when they get the day off from work.

Teachers? Nah they already get Spring, Summer and Winter off to do what they want, not to mention the ever increasing Teacher Institute days that seem to be taking over the school calender every year.

[Leo Lakio]

I say keep the kids in school during these holidays so the parents can have a day off and walk naked in their homes once in a while when they get the day off from work.
YAH!
Besides, if kids know that's what their parents are doing that day, I suspect they'd rather be in school than around the house.