Astounding crash in Kaneohe

[Amati]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

What I want to know is,.... who was the judge that let this guy keep his license after getting clocked at 118 mph? The media should dig that up that idiot judge's name, let he/she face the wrath of public opinion, and be removed from the bench. It's as I said in another thread. Overly lenient judges are almost as bad a menace to society as are the criminals themselves.

http://www.starbulletin.com/news/haw...n_speeder.html
"In August 2003 in the Wahiawa Division, he was cited for going 118 mph - more than twice the speed limit - and fined $200 and other fees totaling $37, the records show."

118 mph, $200 fine = slap on the wrist

[surlygirly]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

$200???!!! That's bullsh!t! The last ticket I got was for 9 over the limit on a straightaway, and honestly, I was just going with the flow of traffic. Yes, I was speeding and deserved the ticket, however the cop that got me flew past me, then pulled me over a full ten minutes after he clocked me because, and I quote, "The back of your car didn't look like I thought it would. I thought you were driving a Mercedes." (I wish!)

Sorry. My point is that for 9mph over...my fine was close to $250!! There has to be some sort of nepotism going on somewhere.

[oceanpacific]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

$200???!!! That's bullsh!t! The last ticket I got was for 9 over the limit on a straightaway, and honestly, I was just going with the flow of traffic. Yes, I was speeding and deserved the ticket, however the cop that got me flew past me, then pulled me over a full ten minutes after he clocked me because, and I quote, "The back of your car didn't look like I thought it would. I thought you were driving a Mercedes." (I wish!)

Sorry. My point is that for 9mph over...my fine was close to $250!! There has to be some sort of nepotism going on somewhere.

Remember when the "VAN SCAM" was in operation? I contested a speeding ticket of 8 mph over the posted limit (58 in a 50 zone) because I was NOT the driver and the photo sent to me of my car could not show whether a man, woman, or animal was at the wheel. The citation was dismissed, but I still had to go to court to find out. The presiding judge announced at the start of the session that he was following the precedence of his fellow jurist in dismissing all tickets in which the driver did NOT exceed the speed limit by 10 miles per hour or more, In other words, you could have had your ticket dismissed.

$250? The last time I paid a fine, it was $125 for going 16 mph over (51 in a 35 zone). My, how times have changed!

[scrivener]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

The presiding judge announced at the start of the session that he was following the precedence of his fellow jurist in dismissing all tickets in which the driver did NOT exceed the speed limit by 10 miles per hour or more, In other words, you could have had your ticket dismissed.

Now THIS is BS on the judge's part. His job is to interpret the law. Did you break the law or didn't you? I'm not judging you personally, OP, because we all drive at whatever speeds we feel are safe, and there are times when 45 in a 35 zone feels safe. However, if we are cited for driving 10 miles (in this case 33&#37 over the limit, I think we should take our lickings like the grown men and women we are. If the law's not a good law, it is in our power to change it. If it's a good law, we should abide by it and we should take our lumps when we're in violation.

I guess this has always rubbed me the wrong way because I am an anarchist at heart, and I think we are better off with fewer laws. People treat me like I'm nuts when they hear me, saying that without laws, society goes into a chaotic tailspin. Yet these same people who think we need laws to keep people in place then get upset when the laws are enforced on them. I'm not saying this is you, OP, and in your case, if it cannot be proven that you broke a law, I agree that you shouldn't be held responsible. I am, however, saying that people who believe in the necessity of speed limits should never complain when the speed limits are enforced by the people we put into place to do it.

[oceanpacific]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

The problem with the VAN-CAM law was that the vehicle's "registered owner" would be held liable for the citation, whether or not he/she was the actual driver. The driver was not issued a ticket on the spot as the police were not involved in the "pinch." The firm running that operation was under the Department of Transportation, not the police.

One of the cited drivers that day was attorney Earl Partington, who had previously represented other drivers successfully in VAN-CAM cases. In my case, I promise you all that I was NOT the driver and that my defense in the written contest, which the prosecutors accepted, was that the photo could not identify who was actually operating the vehicle.

These days, I'm just about the slowest one on our freeways as it seems that virtually EVERYONE whizzes by me. I was on the freeway a few days ago cruising along between 55-60 mph (55 limit) with small pick-up trucks passing me by going at least 65 mph. Then, a small motorcycle blasted by us all at an estimated 75-80 mph. Where are the police when you need them?

[TuNnL]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

I was on the freeway a few days ago cruising along between 55-60 mph (55 limit) with small pick-up trucks passing me by going at least 65 mph. Then, a small motorcycle blasted by us all at an estimated 75-80 mph. Where are the police when you need them?

I think that’s a silly question, knowing that HPD did not catch the driver that this thread is about, before it was too late. I think the lesson of scrivener's post is, some people live to break the rules. HPD can’t be in all places at all times, but they do come out every rush hour to ticket solo drivers using the Zipper lane.

Try asking an officer from the Hawai‘i Kai substation how much ground their tiny storefront operation is expected to cover each evening, and you will be amazed. HPD has already said that they can’t keep a full force because recruits they train quickly leave for higher paying jobs on the mainland. There is enough crime in Hawai‘i that they can’t afford to put too many officers on radar gun duty, and with this economy, it’s likely to get worse.

[/Excuses]

[Ron Whitfield]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

Where are the police when you need them?

Usually in Chinatown and Waikiki, giving as much tickets as possible to anyone that lives here and commiting the most manini of infractions. The exception, in Chinatown at night where violence is now on the increase due to druggie action and fellow basic lowlifes, they are nowhere to be seen except when going to or from thier cars at the Hotel St. station.

[Frankie's Market]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

Usually in Chinatown and Waikiki, giving as much tickets as possible to anyone that lives here and commiting the most manini of infractions.

Hmmm, me thinks you actually need to come out to Waikiki and see what goes out on the streets. Prostitution, purse snatchings, and nearly every weekend, at least one big fight involving groups of drunk G.I.s mouthing off at locals.

All that is "manini?" Pray tell me what you consider as higher priority meriting HPD's constant presence?

[leashlaws]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

Usually in Chinatown and Waikiki, giving as much tickets as possible to anyone that lives here and commiting the most manini of infractions. The exception, in Chinatown at night where violence is now on the increase due to druggie action and fellow basic lowlifes, they are nowhere to be seen except when going to or from thier cars at the Hotel St. station.

Well on Saturday night there lots and lots and lots and lots of
them at Steve Miller. They actually went up into the upper level seats looking for where the aroma of weed was wafting from.

[MyopicJoe]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

On the other hand your lack of reaction could have been what saved you. Had you reacted, you could have crashed.

True. If I had over reacted, I could have lost control, hit an innocent driver, while the SUV drove off

But I'm beginning to wonder if some of these guys with Escalades/Hummers and the like feel that these signals means they can be less careful in making safe lane changes.

Someone once suggested car makers should have a spike coming out the center of the steering wheel, to encourage people to drive safer.

I’m thinking the other way. If the SUV hit the front of your car it would “steer” you in one direction. On the other hand the SUV has its wheels turned and hitting your car would push the rear end in the opposite direction. The SUV would turn sideways and most likely roll over.

Hmm, that makes sense. Kinda like a PIT maneuver?

Hypothetically speaking, would it be better to slightly turn with the bump, until I have the car under control; or do I keep the wheels straight? I'm pretty sure jerking the wheel in the opposite direction is bad.

[alohacandy]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

Well on Saturday night there lots and lots and lots and lots of
them at Steve Miller. They actually went up into the upper level seats looking for where the aroma of weed was wafting from.

Yep...spending their time/energy on victimless crimes instead of protecting people from violent crimes and dangerous drivers. Grrrrrrr!

[Composite 2992]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

Hypothetically speaking, would it be better to slightly turn with the bump, until I have the car under control; or do I keep the wheels straight? I'm pretty sure jerking the wheel in the opposite direction is bad.

If it hits your front end, you can apply steering into the other vehicle. But if it hits your back end, you apply steering to match the shift of your rear end or you'll fishtail.

That said, unless you've done it at least a few times, it's counter-intuitive and could be hard to deal with. I messed around with a jeep on a very slick muddy pineapple road on Lanai and had a chance to see what countersteering was about. Not a very good lesson but it's better than nothing.

The best advice would be to resist the urge to do something that can quickly lead to over-control and a roll-over. When cars come out of a violent maneuver it tends to heel over and snap back, veering one way and then the other. It's the springy suspension that's at fault. Racing cars can get away with that kind of snappy maneuvering because their suspensions are so stiff.

If you let go of the steering wheel these oscillations will gradually dampen themselves out and the car will run true. I was in a Honda Civic when a rally car racer (and Honda salesman) did some sliding turns and wild maneuvers to demonstrate what a Civic could do. But quite often drivers will try to correct for these oscillations and make things worse.

A good option would be to hold the wheel steady and let the oscillations (which are caused by the car's suspension) to dampen out. I did that when avoiding a collision on H1 with a Ford Explorer. The oscillations can be violent but don't let that freak you out. Just hold steady and it'll settle down.

I did see a Ford Explorer do a 180-degree slide when avoiding a flying tire on the freeway. That was on dry pavement. The wheel came from the opposite lanes (I don't know where the heck it came from) but it bounced, cleared my vehicle, and then went straight for the guy behind me who suddenly swerved. The driver's attempt to recover (and over-control) eventually led to the slide. What was surprising was the Explorer didn't roll over. Then again, Secret Service agents can do what's called a "J Turn" with a GMC Suburban -- a fast reverse which leads to an intentional 180 slide, then driving off. They can even do it with an armored Lincoln Continental. Impressive.

[GeckoGeek]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

Now THIS is BS on the judge's part. His job is to interpret the law.

No, and yes. "The Law" is not just what's written by the legislature, but also what's been decided in prior cases. If prior cases have all dismissed tickets under 10MPH, then that's the law.

If it hits your front end, you can apply steering into the other vehicle. But if it hits your back end, you apply steering to match the shift of your rear end or you'll fishtail.

The best advice would be to resist the urge to do something that can quickly lead to over-control and a roll-over. When cars come out of a violent maneuver it tends to heel over and snap back, veering one way and then the other. It's the springy suspension that's at fault. Racing cars can get away with that kind of snappy maneuvering because their suspensions are so stiff.

A good option would be to hold the wheel steady and let the oscillations (which are caused by the car's suspension) to dampen out. I did that when avoiding a collision on H1 with a Ford Explorer. The oscillations can be violent but don't let that freak you out. Just hold steady and it'll settle down.

I agree with what I quoted back. I think it boils down to keep the wheels pointed the direction you want to go and don't over-react.

[oceanpacific]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

[QUOTE=GeckoGeek;227458]No, and yes. "The Law" is not just what's written by the legislature, but also what's been decided in prior cases. If prior cases have all dismissed tickets under 10MPH, then that's the law.


The judge I paraphrased about the 10mph "rule" may have been applying that only to VAN-CAM cases brought before him, but not to cases in which the drivers were "clocked" by HPD officers.

Further, drivers who argued that the pictures did not identify them as the drivers got the tickets dismissed, while others who did not offer any defense and pleaded "no contest" ended up with the appropriate fines being imposed.

[Kaonohi]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

So it really ticks me off when people continue to drive carelessly or recklessly. I'd like to see excessive speeding turned into a felony, on par with someone standing on the road shooting a rifle at random. Put these guys in prison for ten years. No parole. The lives saved could be my own family members.

From what I've heard, there is no longer a place to legally (safely) race cars in Hawaii. Yet our popular culture (movies, TV) glorify speed, equate it with 'manliness' and such, and even our local culture younger drivers sometimes equate being passed as 'being weak,' which leads to road-rage issues.

Stupid drivers speed up to prevent someone from pulling into line in front of them, cut people off, etc.

When I see speeding cars (and I'm hypervigilant), I move out of the way, and send them a blessing of safety.

In this case drinking and driving and recklessness created tragedy and sadness for many families.

It all starts with how we bring up our children: Love them unconditionally, and let them know how much they would be missed if it happened to them, and find safe ways for them to let off steam. It's a start.