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  • Your Ideal Liberal World

    OK, I am only going to start this and not reply. This is for all the liberals here. If you could play "God" and create the ideal liberal society, what would you do and how would you shape it? What kinds of laws, economic system, standards of morality or whatever would your ideal liberal society be like? I am curious and would find this just interesting to read. So folks, if you are so inclined go for it and create a hypothetical liberal society where you can all be happy.
    I'm still here. Are you?

  • #2
    Re: Your Ideal Liberal World

    Err. Why is this thread in The Laboratory? Shouldn't it go into Hawaii Hall?

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Your Ideal Liberal World

      I believe Mel put it here because you want to take out any personal bias out of the loop and focus on the merits of a Liberal government under the scrutiny of a petri dish to see just how this bacteria will flourish or flounder.

      To start it off we should define exactly what is Liberalism? I think John Lennon best described Liberalism in the words to Imagine. In order to have a Liberal government you must remove all aspects of Religious teachings (Imagine there's no Heaven).

      You can still make common sense laws that sound religious (Thou shalt not kill).

      What economic engine will be used to drive this economy?

      And let's keep the trash talk out. This is an experiment to see if a 100% Liberal government can work without ANY inclusions of any other form of government. We as readers to this thread will determine if any suggestion sounds...shall I say, "Republican" in nature.

      And finally, remember a realistic government is not a fair one to all. Some will benefit more than others, some will suffer more than others. Life isn't fair, it never was even in nature. As Darwin put it, survival of the fittest and that's not fair to the meek and the timid

      So our Liberal government will seem fair theoretically like most models of reform, however this open dialogue to build a template of the Ideal Liberal government will have moments of disagreement from those who will suffer from those laws put forth and that's where the problem of any form of an ideal government will surface because you cannot satisfy everybody all the time.

      Okay I'll put the first law on the books:

      I. No reference to any form of religion in it's doctrines, mandates, celebrations and symbols. This is a government made by man for man.
      Life is what you make of it...so please read the instructions carefully.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Your Ideal Liberal World

        This is a government made by man for man.
        Addendum: insert "of laws" following the word government.
        http://www.linkmeister.com/wordpress/

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Your Ideal Liberal World

          This thread is here because the very idea IS an experiment, one that's never been succeeded in. Heck, even the terms "Ideal" and "liberal" contradict each other, yes? no? (G)
          Stop being lost in thought where our problems thrive.~

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Your Ideal Liberal World

            No it's not when you consider the Ideal Liberal government in one breath. The ideal government is a realistic one and like I said before, a realistic government isn't a fair one. Heck kinda like the way it is now!
            Life is what you make of it...so please read the instructions carefully.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Your Ideal Liberal World

              I would not want either a liberal world or conservative world. As I do not
              like either the right OR the left for that matter. Both sides of the coin
              have their good points and their bad points.
              Check out my blog on Kona issues :
              The Kona Blog

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Your Ideal Liberal World

                Originally posted by mel
                If you could play "God" and create the ideal liberal society, what would you do and how would you shape it? What kinds of laws, economic system, standards of morality or whatever would your ideal liberal society be like?
                As Mel posited this question, a very famous piece of literature (philosophy, actually) came to mind: has anyone ever read "Candide", by Voltaire? It's a longish short story, but the crux of the story is you can go searching all over the place for one, perfect world but there is no such thing. (Link to the whole story: http://www.hawaiithreads.com/newrepl...ewreply&p=7919

                The excerpt below (from the very end) kind of sums up what Voltaire's vision of "the best of all possible worlds" is:


                "You are in the right," said Pangloss; "for when man was put into
                the garden of Eden, it was with an intent to dress it; and this proves
                that man was not born to be idle."

                "Work then without disputing," said Martin; "it is the only way to
                render life supportable."

                The little society, one and all, entered into this laudable design
                and set themselves to exert their different talents. The little
                piece of ground yielded them a plentiful crop. Cunegund indeed was
                very ugly, but she became an excellent hand at pastrywork: Pacquette
                embroidered; the old woman had the care of the linen. There was
                none, down to Brother Giroflee, but did some service; he was a very
                good carpenter, and became an honest man. Pangloss used now and then
                to say to Candide:

                "There is a concatenation of all events in the best of possible
                worlds; for, in short, had you not been kicked out of a fine castle
                for the love of Miss Cunegund; had you not been put into the
                Inquisition; had you not traveled over America on foot; had you not
                run the Baron through the body; and had you not lost all your sheep,
                which you brought from the good country of El Dorado, you would not
                have been here to eat preserved citrons and pistachio nuts."

                The best of all possible worlds includes every human experience, because without suffering, how would we know joy? If we didn't experience pain, how would we know what it felt like to be pain-free? If there were no conservatives, how would liberals know what liberalism meant (and vice versa) and who would they be able to joust with if everyone thought the same?

                Miulang
                "Americans believe in three freedoms. Freedom of speech; freedom of religion; and the freedom to deny the other two to folks they don`t like.” --Mark Twain

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Your Ideal Liberal World

                  I agree, kinda like that Steve Miller song Jet Airliner with the lyrics, "You gotta go thru Hell before you get to Heaven".

                  That's why when an idiot cuts me off in traffic and I got my kids in the car so I can't mumble,"You F#@n Idiot", I just remind my kids there's a reason why God put jerks on the road...it makes the rest of us look good."
                  Life is what you make of it...so please read the instructions carefully.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Your Ideal Liberal World

                    Originally posted by Miulang
                    As Mel posited this question, a very famous piece of literature (philosophy, actually) came to mind: has anyone ever read "Candide", by Voltaire? It's a longish short story, but the crux of the story is you can go searching all over the place for one, perfect world but there is no such thing. (Link to the whole story: http://www.hawaiithreads.com/newrepl...ewreply&p=7919

                    The excerpt below (from the very end) kind of sums up what Voltaire's vision of "the best of all possible worlds" is:


                    "You are in the right," said Pangloss; "for when man was put into
                    the garden of Eden, it was with an intent to dress it; and this proves
                    that man was not born to be idle."

                    "Work then without disputing," said Martin; "it is the only way to
                    render life supportable."

                    The little society, one and all, entered into this laudable design
                    and set themselves to exert their different talents. The little
                    piece of ground yielded them a plentiful crop. Cunegund indeed was
                    very ugly, but she became an excellent hand at pastrywork: Pacquette
                    embroidered; the old woman had the care of the linen. There was
                    none, down to Brother Giroflee, but did some service; he was a very
                    good carpenter, and became an honest man. Pangloss used now and then
                    to say to Candide:

                    "There is a concatenation of all events in the best of possible
                    worlds; for, in short, had you not been kicked out of a fine castle
                    for the love of Miss Cunegund; had you not been put into the
                    Inquisition; had you not traveled over America on foot; had you not
                    run the Baron through the body; and had you not lost all your sheep,
                    which you brought from the good country of El Dorado, you would not
                    have been here to eat preserved citrons and pistachio nuts."

                    The best of all possible worlds includes every human experience, because without suffering, how would we know joy? If we didn't experience pain, how would we know what it felt like to be pain-free? If there were no conservatives, how would liberals know what liberalism meant (and vice versa) and who would they be able to joust with if everyone thought the same?

                    Miulang
                    Sorry, eh, Here's the real link:http://www.literature.org/authors/voltaire/candide/
                    "Americans believe in three freedoms. Freedom of speech; freedom of religion; and the freedom to deny the other two to folks they don`t like.” --Mark Twain

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Your Ideal Liberal World

                      Originally posted by Miulang

                      apologies accepted...boy I thought I spent too much time writing on this board
                      Life is what you make of it...so please read the instructions carefully.

                      Comment

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