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  • Hawaiian Home Lands Plans 3500 new homes

    Interesting story in today's Honolulu Advertiser (http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/ar.../ln/ln03a.html).

    Since these homes will be built on Oahu, Maui and the Big Island, it should help those Hawaiians who need affordable housing. BUT the people will only own their house, and not the land underneath (although the lease rate of $1 is negligible). Why can't HHL and the state just let the people buy outright the land on which they build their houses? At some point, what would stop the State from reclaiming the land and forcing people out of their homes?

    Anybody got any ideas?

    Miulang
    "Americans believe in three freedoms. Freedom of speech; freedom of religion; and the freedom to deny the other two to folks they don`t like.” --Mark Twain

  • #2
    Re: Hawaiian Home Lands Plans 3500 new homes

    Because those lands must stay in the hands of Hawaiians who meet the blood quantum.

    I know it seems unfair however consider this: 100% Kanaka Maoli marry one 100% pake = 50% keiki. That 50% keiki marry one 100% haole = 25% Hawaiian. That 25% Hawaiian screws up and marries another 100% Haole, ho boy pretty soon no mo land for the Kanaka Maoli (100%) and the land goes to da haole's anyway.

    The only way one hawaiian family going keep their land is to keep the blood quantum high enough within their family. Haunani's family went screw up already by marrying one haole (Trask). Sorry to the Trask family but you talk stink about your own roots, how can anyone believe you now?
    Life is what you make of it...so please read the instructions carefully.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Hawaiian Home Lands Plans 3500 new homes

      The DHHL land is also part of ceded lands from the Hawaiian Kingdom.
      Thus can't be sold only leased. DHHL is also buying 40 lots in Discovery
      Habour in Ka'u for 2 million dollars to lease to DHHL lessees
      Check out my blog on Kona issues :
      The Kona Blog

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Hawaiian Home Lands Plans 3500 new homes

        Are those 99 year leases, then? And can they be renewed after 99 years? I would hate to think that somewhere down the road the State can change its mind about usage and order those people to leave their homes. I heard stories about the Kamehameha Trust (I think it was them) doing that to some people in Honolulu because the land had become too valuable to use as residential anymore. Granted, the homeowners were being offered par value for their homes, but how do you tell someone who's lived in a place for 50-60 years that the cash they will receive if they move will ease the pain of leaving their life behind? In fact, isn't there still a holdout somewhere in downtown Honolulu?

        Miulang
        "Americans believe in three freedoms. Freedom of speech; freedom of religion; and the freedom to deny the other two to folks they don`t like.” --Mark Twain

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        • #5
          Re: Hawaiian Home Lands Plans 3500 new homes

          Life sucks doesn't it!
          Life is what you make of it...so please read the instructions carefully.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Hawaiian Home Lands Plans 3500 new homes

            Originally posted by craigwatanabe
            Life sucks doesn't it!
            Yeah, and the rest of that quote is "and then you die!"

            Miulang
            "Americans believe in three freedoms. Freedom of speech; freedom of religion; and the freedom to deny the other two to folks they don`t like.” --Mark Twain

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Hawaiian Home Lands Plans 3500 new homes

              Ah but then what? Go to Heaven, become fertilizer? Purchase a house lot in Kea'au before the prices get wayyy to high? Hah?
              Life is what you make of it...so please read the instructions carefully.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Hawaiian Home Lands Plans 3500 new homes

                Originally posted by craigwatanabe
                I know it seems unfair however consider this: 100% Kanaka Maoli marry one 100% pake = 50% keiki. That 50% keiki marry one 100% haole = 25% Hawaiian. That 25% Hawaiian screws up and marries another 100% Haole, ho boy pretty soon no mo land for the Kanaka Maoli (100%) and the land goes to da haole's anyway.

                The only way one hawaiian family going keep their land is to keep the blood quantum high enough within their family. Haunani's family went screw up already by marrying one haole (Trask). Sorry to the Trask family but you talk stink about your own roots, how can anyone believe you now?
                What many don't realize is why blood quantum was implemented for ALL indigenous peoples. Not to mention it is a foreign concept for indigenous people, including Hawaiians. Look at the word "hapa" which comes from the English word "half" to mean half or part. That word was incorporated for a reason.

                In the Hawaiian concept, blood quantum was not measured b/c it just didn't exist. If you have half of your mother's blood (or genes) and half of your father's, what happens if you bleed? Bleed a lot? You are what....now either not of your mom or your dad? That's a concept told to me by a Maori.

                It is in the iwi, the bones that Hawaiians see how you are related and that you are connected to one another. The iwi is very important, which is why they were kept and hidden. It held mana. And what remains after a body rots? The iwi. What is left that scientists can use to determine DNA, etc.? The iwi. Iwi is important, not blood.

                You can have iwi of different groups of people, doesn't make you any "less" of one ancestor.
                He mamo a Hina

                Mai poina i na kupuna kahiko, na lakou e hoonaauao ia kakou.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Hawaiian Home Lands Plans 3500 new homes

                  How is "Iwi" granted to one another? Is it specific to a race or one's ancestral family?

                  If Hawaiians can be traced to another culture (Hokulea) then that culture can be traced to it's actual origins. If we all started from one point then that originating "Iwi" transcends all of us regardless of race or ancestry.

                  That's not good because then Hawaiians have no vested authority in the lands they're trying to reclaim. There has to be some point in which the "Iwi" has to dictate the quantum of Hawaiian (rather than Tahitian) there is in an individual and that dictate is the blood quantum. Where do you draw the line between migration to Hawaii and it's history before that?

                  If it is positively proved that Hawaiians migrated from Tahiti, then that makes Tahitians heirs to the lands of Hawaii by virtue of "Iwi" within them. And if we all contain some level of "Iwi" and that any level is as good as any, then Hawaiians have no greater claim to the lands than anyone else on Earth.

                  It is in the best interests of Hawaiians that the blood quantum be the level in which to claim Hawaiian lands because using "Iwi" as the measurement tool means taking the origin of "Iwi" into consideration like the genesis of Hawaiian ancestry from Tahiti or even before that.

                  It has to start from when the first Hawaiian set foot on Hawaii and guess what..."Iwi" was already in place then from another culture so blood quantum from the first settlers must be used at that point in time. That's where the line is drawn. That's why blood quantum is the only yardstick to measure one's pureness to the culture in the physical sense.

                  If one argues that pureness to a culture is not based on blood quantum, then anyone with the spirit of Aloha can claim to be Hawaiian, even Haole's.

                  The only way Hawaiians can claim the Hawaiian islands by virtue of "Iwi" is to say the "Iwi" was granted to the first settlers of the Hawaiian Islands and guess what...Hawaiians weren't the first.

                  This is just my opinion but I believe blood quantum is the only way to prove one's Hawaiian ancestry over "Iwi" and that puts all non Kanaka Maoli at risk of losing their lands their ancestors founded.
                  Life is what you make of it...so please read the instructions carefully.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Hawaiian Home Lands Plans 3500 new homes

                    Originally posted by craigwatanabe
                    How is "Iwi" granted to one another? Is it specific to a race or one's ancestral family?

                    If Hawaiians can be traced to another culture (Hokulea) then that culture can be traced to it's actual origins. If we all started from one point then that originating "Iwi" transcends all of us regardless of race or ancestry.

                    That's not good because then Hawaiians have no vested authority in the lands they're trying to reclaim. There has to be some point in which the "Iwi" has to dictate the quantum of Hawaiian (rather than Tahitian) there is in an individual and that dictate is the blood quantum. Where do you draw the line between migration to Hawaii and it's history before that?

                    If it is positively proved that Hawaiians migrated from Tahiti, then that makes Tahitians heirs to the lands of Hawaii by virtue of "Iwi" within them. And if we all contain some level of "Iwi" and that any level is as good as any, then Hawaiians have no greater claim to the lands than anyone else on Earth.

                    It is in the best interests of Hawaiians that the blood quantum be the level in which to claim Hawaiian lands because using "Iwi" as the measurement tool means taking the origin of "Iwi" into consideration like the genesis of Hawaiian ancestry from Tahiti or even before that.

                    It has to start from when the first Hawaiian set foot on Hawaii and guess what..."Iwi" was already in place then from another culture so blood quantum from the first settlers must be used at that point in time. That's where the line is drawn. That's why blood quantum is the only yardstick to measure one's pureness to the culture in the physical sense.

                    If one argues that pureness to a culture is not based on blood quantum, then anyone with the spirit of Aloha can claim to be Hawaiian, even Haole's.

                    The only way Hawaiians can claim the Hawaiian islands by virtue of "Iwi" is to say the "Iwi" was granted to the first settlers of the Hawaiian Islands and guess what...Hawaiians weren't the first.

                    This is just my opinion but I believe blood quantum is the only way to prove one's Hawaiian ancestry over "Iwi" and that puts all non Kanaka Maoli at risk of losing their lands their ancestors founded.
                    Sorry if I caused confusion. I was merely pointing out the concept of blood quantum (a western concept) versus iwi, a Polynesian thought.

                    However, going SPECIFICALLY back on topic, as for awarding lands, Hawaiians as you know, or at least I hope you knew are not "owners" of the land. They never, ever were. They were stewards of the land. I'm sure you have heard of references of that, not to mention 'olelo no'eau in relation to the land. "Keiki o ka 'aina" has a metaphorical meaning as well as a literal one. The story of creation, and of Wakea and Papa, ancestors to the Hawaiian people, and the death of Wakea's first born Haloa, who later became the kalo, an older sibling to the 2nd son also named Haloa. It is that metaphor that shows the relationship kanaka has with ka 'aina. They go hand in hand, not one has domain over the other.

                    With that haole concept, if Hawaiians are encouraged to be xenophobes, but they resist and continue to intermarry (unlike NUMEROUS other ethnic groups), then what happens if in yours and other westerner's eyes of "blood quantum" when that minimum isn't met? What of all the homestead land 2 centuries from now? Sold?

                    Another thing you seem to be confused on is why homestead land was granted, by whom and most importantly for what purpose.

                    http://www.hawaii.gov/dhhl/

                    That should help you understand the intricacies of homesteading.

                    You should also realize that "the spirit of Aloha" was coined by the Hawaii Visitors and Convention Bureau and is a new concept. Our ancestors never believed in this "aloha spirit". It is foreign.

                    I don't understand what you mean by "Hawaiians" weren't the first to these lands. Polynesians had settled the islands since 400 A.D. by both archeological reckoning as well as genealogy.

                    But again, this argument is not about who arrived in the islands first. Go read the link I provided as to why Hawaiian Homestead came about. Of course that wouldn't be too much info. b/c the reason behind all of this begins mainly in 1843. But I think we all know the history of that, right?
                    He mamo a Hina

                    Mai poina i na kupuna kahiko, na lakou e hoonaauao ia kakou.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Hawaiian Home Lands Plans 3500 new homes

                      Originally posted by Kalani
                      I was merely pointing out the concept of blood quantum (a western concept) versus iwi, a Polynesian thought.

                      But again, this argument is not about who arrived in the islands first. Go read the link I provided as to why Hawaiian Homestead came about. Of course that wouldn't be too much info. b/c the reason behind all of this begins mainly in 1843. But I think we all know the history of that, right?
                      Mahalo nui loa Kalani for the history lesson! Even though my 'iwi isn't Hawaiian, I am a keiki o ka 'aina because I see what's happening to Hawaii from this far away (the Mainland) and I get sadder and sadder with every news story I read about how development is encroaching on the land that was meant to feed and support the people who live on it (ahu pua'a).

                      The funny thing is, I never even really thought about this stuff until after I left the 'aina! Now I'm trying to play catch up and learn as much as I can about ancient Hawaii. I think the kanaka maoli need to learn lessons from the American Indian nations so they do not repeat the sad story of those people as they continue to fight for their sovereignty.

                      I hope discussion on this thread continues, because everyone in Hawai'i needs to understand how things started and why it's important not to let the temptations of the mainland turn Hawai'i into another LA.

                      Miulang
                      "Americans believe in three freedoms. Freedom of speech; freedom of religion; and the freedom to deny the other two to folks they don`t like.” --Mark Twain

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Hawaiian Home Lands Plans 3500 new homes

                        Originally posted by Miulang
                        The funny thing is, I never even really thought about this stuff until after I left the 'aina! Now I'm trying to play catch up and learn as much as I can about ancient Hawaii. I think the kanaka maoli need to learn lessons from the American Indian nations so they do not repeat the sad story of those people as they continue to fight for their sovereignty.
                        Exactly! I went through the same thing, and I was exposed to all those things growing up. But it's easy to take things for granted. You really appreciate them when you no longer have them. And for many of us, our eyes have been opened.

                        I have many cousins, probably more than what I'd want, who don't appreciate what they have. They like living there, but they don't really "know" what's there. I'm referring to resources, history, etc.

                        And not all Hawaiians know of these things. So your statement is true, that some need to learn lessons from the N. Americans, but it's a 2 way street where even N. Americans could learn from Hawaiians. A good example would be language perpetuation.

                        I hope discussion on this thread continues, because everyone in Hawai'i needs to understand how things started and why it's important not to let the temptations of the mainland turn Hawai'i into another LA.

                        Miulang
                        a 'oia. It helps us all understand one another, understand ourselves too.
                        He mamo a Hina

                        Mai poina i na kupuna kahiko, na lakou e hoonaauao ia kakou.

                        Comment

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