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  • Grandparents Raising Grandkids

    Perhaps it's because hanai is widely practice, and perhaps it's because we're losing a whole "middle" generation to drugs and other problems, but it seems remarkably common to see grandparents becoming parents again in Hawaii. Of course, this growing situation of low-income seniors becoming primary caretakers for minors means that situations like Jane Kamanu's are going to become more common...

    Resident evicted over grandchild stirs debate
    Mary Vorsino, Honolulu Star-Bulletin, Monday, June 13, 2005
    Jane Kamanu knew the rules before she broke them: No children allowed. But what if, she argues, the rules are unfair? The 72-year-old will be evicted July 15 from a Waimanalo low-income housing complex for native Hawaiian seniors where she pays $299 a month in rent, nearly half of her $682 monthly income, after she chose to take in her 11-year-old great-granddaughter, Kehealani... "I thought it could be done. I didn't see anything that was really bad that she could do. The only thing is that it's the rules and the regulations."

  • #2
    Re: Grandparents Raising Grandkids

    Unfortunately, it's not just limited to Hawai'i. It's a national trend. Why? Because the generation that are the parents of the young children are dropping out, either from drugs, alcohol or mental conditions.

    I blame Dr. Benjamin Spock for this phenomenon. Many of our parents read Dr. Spock who basically said don't punish your kids with physical force, reason with them. I think that's why we had the "love not war" movements in the 1960s. When we became parents in the 70s and 80s, we said, as generations of parents before us said, "we want our kids to have more than we did". And for Boomer kids (who pretty much had anything they wanted), this meant spoiling their kids (the X-gen) even more.

    Now the X-gen kids, who really have a hard time distinguishing between what's good for me v. what's good for someone else because they got everything they wanted (and sometimes more), are having kids. When they get tired of taking care or are too busy to care for the kids, and if family is around, they resort to dropping the kids off to be "babysat". If there is no family around, the kids are sent to "day care".

    The Boomer generation was the first where the mothers were out in the workforce in droves so there were a lot of latchkey kids. My mom worked full time, so my brother and I went to grandma's after school.

    Nowadays, the X-gen is having kids, and they are only doing what they grew up with: not believing that raising a kid is the most important job in the world. The economics of living today makes it very hard for one parent to be able to stay at home a la June Cleaver, on top of it all. No wonder the X-gen thinks kids are great until they act up, or get sick. And if the worries of the world fall too heavily on their shoulders (because they don't get their way), then they resort to becoming drug addicts, alcoholics, or schizophrenics. At least most of their parents (the Boomers) still have a shred of knowledge that taking care of one's family is more important than going out on Friday night drinking with the guys.

    My parents swatted me sometimes when I misbehaved. Now the kids rule the roost. When I was in high school, very few kids drove cars to school, and they were mostly used cars. Nowadays, you go to any high school parking lot and what do you see? Kids filling the parking lots with brand new cars, all decked out with high performance engines and boom boxes, while their parents drive around in 10 year old clunkers. Sheesh.

    The reason why the young parents of today have no patience with their kids (hence the large numbers of abuse cases) is because they themselves were not raised with the same kinds of family values the kupunas had.

    Miulang
    "Americans believe in three freedoms. Freedom of speech; freedom of religion; and the freedom to deny the other two to folks they don`t like.” --Mark Twain

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    • #3
      Re: Grandparents Raising Grandkids

      What an interesting approach you have. In a recent generations-related course I took, they suggested almost the opposite: That the Generation having children now will do anything in their power to spend time with their children, because their parents didn't spend enough time with them. (i.e. mothers in the workforce.)

      I didn't agree with the course's view. Yours makes more sense. Although the reason I was raised by my grandparents is a monetary one. My parents are at the tail-end of the baby-boomer generation, with my grandparents being at the very beginning transition phase. My grandparents had/have a lot more money due to stock/bonds/better investments/opportunities. My mother just couldn't afford us without going on welfare for the rest of her life.

      Thank you for your view, Miulang!

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      • #4
        Re: Grandparents Raising Grandkids

        You are very lucky you have a kupuna wahine who was able to take you in and raise you. One of the things that Hawai'i should cherish and try to hold on to for as long as possible is the concept of "ohana" and "hanai". Too many of the newcomers to the islands bring with them their emotional baggage from wherever they last lived, and many of the locals have had to move away for various reasons (mostly economic). So the expats (like me and you) have an obligation to our own families to make sure we remember "ohana" and not become totally like everybody else up here who is too busy to worry about anyone but themselves.

        Part of that course you took is probably correct, though. There's some bigtime guilt going on in the minds of the X-gen parents. But many of the younger parents believe "quantity" (as in buying more stuff for the kids) has to replace "quality" (as in spending real family time with the kids). The ones who are trying to spend more time with their kids are the older parents (the ones who waited until their 30s and 40s to have their first kid) because they have already established themselves in careers, so they can afford to become stay-at-home parents.

        Maybe there ought to be a law someplace that you can't become a parent until you're 30 and have had a chance to blow off all your youthful exuberance! But then again, some people never grow up, either.

        Miulang
        "Americans believe in three freedoms. Freedom of speech; freedom of religion; and the freedom to deny the other two to folks they don`t like.” --Mark Twain

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        • #5
          Re: Grandparents Raising Grandkids

          Hey, I belong in this catagory! I'm a grandma since January! Then, never mind..all of a sudden grandma to six.(another story) Oh, well. I love to take care my grandchildren, especially Antonio. Smell his hair and baby scent is utterly heaven. I love to cradle and kiss him. Make gurggle sounds and sing to him crazy and baby songs. Yeah, the joy of raising grandkids, babysitting, spending quality time with them is much to precious to waste...buying expensive toys, gagets, etc. was never my style so I don't expect to shower my grandchildren with the same. I will shower them with love, understanding, teach them morals, values, spiritual beliefs, compassion, and whatever else it takes to make them into productive citizens of society.

          Yep, I'm one Pupule Grandma that will be there for them if they ever need me!

          Auntie Lynn aka Auntie Pupule
          Be AKAMAI ~ KOKUA Hawai`i!
          Philippians 4:13 --- I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me.

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          • #6
            Re: Grandparents Raising Grandkids

            This is a lot to think about. I'm not sure where the blame rests.

            My mother was raised by her grandmother, because her mother dealt with alcohol problems and couldn't deal with the stresses of life.

            I know many, many couples who have either given over their children to the grandparents, or rely very heavily on the grandparents for help in raising the children. There are pros and cons to this.

            Pros...the children learn to value family, the grandparents get to teach and discipline "the old fashioned way" (yes, I'm biased on this. I subscribe to the old school here. No bribing my kids, no negotiations, no concessions), "the more, the merrier" (large families=large love), and I've heard kids keep you young.

            Cons...the parents of the children learn they can run to the grandparents over every little stress, and don't really learn to deal with the family's tougher challenges. The grandparents become a "built-in babysitter," and are taken advantage of. (What's worse, I've heard parents remark it's the grandparents' "duty" to be there whenever the parents want. ??? I think not. Grandparents are people, too. They have lives. They need privacy and time alone. They are not 24/7 drop-off babysitters.)

            --On a personal note, Mom taught me early, early on: I'm the mother, she's not a babysitter. I don't call her up every time I want to go out or expect her to take my kids whenever. So I can't help but scoff when I hear of parents who take their kids to the grandparents' house at the drop of a hat.--

            I don't mean to make it sound as harsh as it probably does. I think it's a wonderful, healthy thing for grandparents to take part in raising the grandkids. I just think it's a sad thing when grandparents are taken for granted and taken advantage of.
            ~'Ailina

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            • #7
              Re: Grandparents Raising Grandkids

              My grandparents are raising one of my aunt's two kids right now, have been for several years now. The kids drive them nuts. It really sucks, 'cause my grandma has health problems now and they do nothing but aggravate her. Plus, one of those kids was apparently stealing money from my grandpa (and nearly all our relatives threatened to break his fingers, heh). Their dad won't take them, but he'll send money and talk on the phone. No idea why he won't just take them...he has no good excuse not to take them. Their mom can't take them because she can't even take care of herself. She was (is?) doing drugs, then got arrested, and just got out, no better than she was before, or so I hear. It's hard for all of them, but it's just like what can I do? We can't take them, we have zero room and my mom would likely kill them. Both of those kids are usually okay, but are entering the teens and have a tendency to, well, be brats.

              But on a somewhat happier note, most of my aunts and uncles usually end up taking care of their children's children more often than the kid's parents. But they usually enjoy it. I'm just wondering when my brother will have a kid that will end up staying with us more than he visits...
              myspace | facebook | puppy moonwalk

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              • #8
                Re: Grandparents Raising Grandkids

                My mother in law (who is haole) kind of made it known also, that she is not the babysitter. But she's not the babysitter AT ALL! When we want to go to the movies, don't ask her to watch the keiki. If we need to run to the store 5 minutes away to grab diaper rash ointment, don't ask her to watch them. She's to the point where she's missing out on a lot of her grandchildren's big steps, because neither of my children enjoy being alone with her. My daughter says she has a bad attitude. It's no surprise she's so close with MY mom. In fact, when we returned to Utah from Molokai, my daughter began to cry at the top of the stairs. When my mother inlaw asked her to "come here and tell Grama what's the matter," my daughter responded with, "I miss my grama Laura in Hawai'i," and began to bawl her eyes out!

                I hope that was an eye-opening message to my mother-in-law. She's cutting herself off from my kid's life, when they want nothing more than to be a part of her life.

                It's like my tutu used to say. 'Everybody get one grama dey love, and one grama dey love more. Da grama dey love moa, is da one dat makes dem feel da most loved.' (sorry, little off-topic)

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                • #9
                  Re: Grandparents Raising Grandkids

                  Interesting timing. There was a segment on NPR from Youth Radio Network about grandparents raising children. They cited a U.S. Census figure that reveals that six percent of children in America are living in a grandparent-headed household. (The most common reasons, not surprisingly, are parent death and parent incarceration.) I imagine the real number is somewhat higher, especially in places like Hawaii where multigenerational households in general are common.

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                  • #10
                    Re: Grandparents Raising Grandkids

                    I stay at home with my children as I would never want my parents
                    or in-laws taking care of them. Its not their job anyways, so we live off
                    of a teacher's salary with a mortgage like anyone else and survive.

                    Its as simple as that. My son is too wild and wooly for my mother in law
                    anyways, she cant handle him at her age.

                    I think its absolutely ridiculous for both parents working and dropping
                    off their kids or having grandma live at home so you can go make
                    all this money you want to make.

                    Some grandmothers I know have to take care of 2 or 3 small keiki
                    when at least one of the parents make enough money to survive.

                    That is not only being greedy, its WRONG. If you can by all means
                    stay at home with your children and take care of them. You made them
                    so you go and take care of them. If you say you cant afford to stay
                    at home then your probably spending too much money anyways
                    to support whatever lavish lifestyle you want to lead.

                    And why should I send my kids to daycare/preschool at average
                    costs of $500 a month, for some people that is either half of
                    their salary or most of it.

                    KalihiBoy

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                    • #11
                      Re: Grandparents Raising Grandkids

                      Originally posted by molokai
                      What an interesting approach you have. In a recent generations-related course I took, they suggested almost the opposite: That the Generation having children now will do anything in their power to spend time with their children, because their parents didn't spend enough time with them. (i.e. mothers in the workforce.)

                      I didn't agree with the course's view. Yours makes more sense. Although the reason I was raised by my grandparents is a monetary one. My parents are at the tail-end of the baby-boomer generation, with my grandparents being at the very beginning transition phase. My grandparents had/have a lot more money due to stock/bonds/better investments/opportunities. My mother just couldn't afford us without going on welfare for the rest of her life.

                      Thank you for your view, Miulang!

                      Today's generation of young adults would want to do everything for their children, but with the emphasis on getting that killer job or wanting that material possession like slick car with GPS or that IPod with all the gizmos attached to it, how can one focus on someone else?

                      It's all "ME" and like I mentioned before I think today's 20-year old generation should be dubbed the "IPod" generation where you close the world off by silently listening thru earbuds and ignoring life around you.

                      It's Simon and Garfunkle's "Sounds of Silence" words coming true like prophecy: People listening without hearing (chat rooms).

                      We are in a world with Big Brother with webcams virtually everywhere. Who needs government to spy on us, we're doing it to each other and willingly: www.anacam.com is one place where vanity takes a backseat to voyerism.

                      This is the modern world in which our children are growing up in and will influence the growth of their children. Virtual reality is no place for kids of any age and it doesn't replace a grass soccer field I took my kids for practice or for their saturday games.

                      I too despise the Dr. Spock mentality and history will prove that his ideals were misleading an entire generation into a false hope of early childhood education and discipline. It's apparent now with kids questioning authority and showing no respect for their elders. You can see it in the classrooms across America.
                      Life is what you make of it...so please read the instructions carefully.

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                      • #12
                        Re: Grandparents Raising Grandkids

                        Okay, let's see. Where to start? My wife and I are just into our forties and have raised two people. My wife is Fijian along with our son who I met when he was seven(in Fiji), he's now 21. And I have a daughter from my first marriage who's now 23.That marriage disolved not by my choice. We didn't comprehend the difficulties when both them were not from both of us. Differences in ideas of discipline, spoiling, etc. arose. In the Fijian culture many grandparents raise them and it's totally accepted. I didn't feel that's right, but may have been wrong in my judgement. My point of view came from the fact that I didn't even have grandparents. I feel the biggest problem is that many don't take the responsibility of "Till death do us part" seriously. And so many kids have to deal with the aftermath of the breakups. So if there are grandparents that are willing with love to take them in, it may be what's best for the children. Both of ours are doing okay even with their upbringing. There is so much more to say. I guess we need to realize that there are reprocussions to everything we do and the children count on us to do the right things for them. 'nuff said
                        Life is either an adventure... or you're not doing it right!!!

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                        • #13
                          Re: Grandparents Raising Grandkids

                          Originally posted by Buddy2
                          In the Fijian culture many grandparents raise them and it's totally accepted.


                          dass da Polynesian way.

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                          • #14
                            Re: Grandparents Raising Grandkids

                            You're right Kimo!
                            Life is either an adventure... or you're not doing it right!!!

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                            • #15
                              Re: Grandparents Raising Grandkids

                              What to say? My parents were married young around nineteen. They had about five kids me being the second oldest. We did go to visit our grandparents on the weekends but sometime's rarely. Both my Father and Mother worked Dead End jobs, but amazingly we got by. We weren't spoiled and often I watched as friends took trips and did things as a familly well I stayed home and sulked in my room. As a teenager growing up, all the in things I couldn't really participate, because we didn't have the money, too. One thing I wasn't really raised by my grandparents I mostly stayed home and watched my sibling, and rarely were my parents home but when they did come home they were too tired to deal with us, but than again they did deal with us. My Mom since she was raised by my grandpa who was a very strict man, she knew how to deal with us acting up, she took no crap from us but she did put up with us when we got bored and had us doing things crafty things that didn't require much money. For our spending money we sold pickle mango ice cake's and other sweets by the side of our door. We started rolling in some mad dough. As much money as we had is as much money my father took from us, so we were sort of penniless. My parents raised us and we turned out well I like to think. My eldest brother got into a scuffle with my parents and left to live with my Uncle during his teeny years untill he was 18, while one of my brothers went to live with my aunty. She sort of adopted him long story. My mother told me and my brothers and sister many times if ever we get kids she was never going to raise them because her job is done. Well all of us are out of highschool. My last brother just graduated.
                              Last edited by Pedro; June 28, 2005, 12:08 PM.
                              A Warrior does not give up on what he loves he finds the love in what he does.

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