U-Down vandalism

[FreaknHaole]

These U-Down stickers appearing on public signs are beginning to piss me off. It's just corporate-sponsored vandalism. It's no different than if Halliburton logos were plastered on public property.

[pzarquon]

Re: U-Down vandalism

Yeah. They were at best amusing when they were a supposedly an underground antic ("How'd they get up there?"), but now that the U-Down folks are plain, cold businessfolk, the stickers are corporate vandalism, plain and simple. Not cool.

Here's a little U-Down write up (with photo) at sister site HawaiiAnswers.com.

[mel]

Re: U-Down vandalism

Geez... I never noticed these before. Thanks for the link to HawaiiAnswers. I guess I may be driving too fast to notice the modified U's on the street signs. I think the State Dept. of Transportation ought to make the firm responsible for these stickers take them down and/or pay for the cost of removal and clean-up. This is the same as grafitti IMO, except in this case the culprit is easy to identify.

[craigwatanabe]

Re: U-Down vandalism

I know a great place to put those arrows...on the No U-Turn signs. Those signs would then have the U-Down logo with a big red slash cutting thru it and the word: NO emblazened over it.

NO U-DOWN!

[lavagal]

Re: U-Down vandalism

I know a great place to put those arrows...on the No U-Turn signs. Those signs would then have the U-Down logo with a big red slash cutting thru it and the word: NO emblazened over it.

NO U-DOWN!

There's one on Kalianaole Hwy between the first lookout and the Blowhole, in a very precarious place for a person to be standing and putting down a yellow U sticker that matches the street stripes. It's limited sight from both diretions. You kinda think while driving over it what IDIOT would risk their life doing that? Would I want my daughter dating someone like that? I guess I'm not cool enough to appreciate life on the edge. And you couldn't tell the person who did it how stupid you think they are. They'd just say I'm some old fuddy duddy.

[MadAzza]

Re: U-Down vandalism

Oh, Lavagal, you're such an old fuddy duddy!

[pzarquon]

Re: U-Down vandalism

Interesting developments reported in today's Star-Bulletin.

State seeks removal of vandals' Web photos
The UDown Web site also endangers safety, officials say

Officials threatened UDown Shop owners in Kailua with a criminal investigation, alleging that it promotes vandalism and encourages the public to put stickers in far-removed places and endangers safety... On the Web site's gallery, a note states, "Submit to us a picture of you next to the (symbol). ... By doing so, you give UDown the rights of ownership to the image(s)..." In the letter, the Department of Transportation requested the removal of certain photos from their Web site, including a silhouette of a person standing next to a freeway sign and a female holding another female on her shoulders while she stuck the logo sticker on a one-way sign.

Of course, for a business that capitalizes on a counter-culture image, you can't buy better publicity.

Amazing that there aren't grounds for harsher action. I mean, the whole design of the UDown website is based on a 'road sign' theme. If that's not encouraging and endorsing vandalism (and basic boneheaded behavior), I don't know what is.

[scrivener]

Re: U-Down vandalism

Of course the responsible thing to do would be to take the pictures down, but I don't get why it's illegal to encourage others to do illegal things. Even if the UDown guys said, "Hey! Go out and stick stickers on public property," which they didn't do, I don't think the state has any business telling others what to say and what not to say. Nobody's making anybody do anything.

If I encourage Lt. Watada not to go to Iraq, or if I tell kids to stay out past curfew, why am I guilty of anything presecutable?

[Leo Lakio]

Re: U-Down vandalism

I don't get why it's illegal to encourage others to do illegal things...If I encourage Lt. Watada not to go to Iraq, or if I tell kids to stay out past curfew, why am I guilty of anything presecutable?

Or a Muslim imam, telling those attending your mosque to go out and slaughter infidel non-believers. Fuzzy zone, what's legal/illegal to say these days.

[scrivener]

Re: U-Down vandalism

Well. You already know what I'm going to say about this. Telling someone to do something illegal, especially if you truly believe it should be done, is one of those "certain inalienable rights." If you tell someone to do it, and he or she doesn't do it, have you done something the government should punish you for?

[Leo Lakio]

Re: U-Down vandalism

have you done something the government should punish you for?

The operative word being "should." Even if you answer "no," you still may get punished in today's world.

[pzarquon]

Re: U-Down vandalism

Ah, Scrivener. Libertarian extraordinaire. Sure, "thoughts" and "words" are different than "acts." And in a perfect world, free of slippery slopes, you'd have a bright, sharp line, rather than a fuzzy area. But, our laws and courts exist because of those fuzzy areas, and "just telling someone to do something illegal" can still be a crime. From outright incitement of violence to coordinating a white-collar criminal conspiracy, you can be jailed even if you didn't pull the trigger, or click the mouse.

It's complex territory, to be sure... just read up on the legal battle over the site that maintained that publishing abortion doctors' names and faces on "Wanted: Dead Or Alive" posters was protected political speech, and not actionable threats.

But, hey, if the website wants to claim that it's not encouraging people to be dumbasses, and merely document its customers idiocy, that's fine. What the criminal court can't fix, the civil courts can. I am absolutely no fan of the overly litigious nature of Americans today, but I will confess to some degree of satisfaction when the parent of a UDown fan sues the company after their kid falls to their death on the H-1 viaduct.

Maybe a cop can get a picture of the UDown sticker next to the chalk outline. That'd be a great visual.

[scrivener]

Re: U-Down vandalism

I am absolutely no fan of the overly litigious nature of Americans today, but I will confess to some degree of satisfaction when the parent of a UDown fan sues the company after their kid falls to their death on the H-1 viaduct.

Okay, then. You know what? I want credit for every positive act committed by any kid I've ever taught. Because if I'm liable for the bad stuff, I want to be liable for the good stuff. In fact, if I can be monetarily punished for bad influence, I want to be monetarily rewarded for good influence, and that includes all the pharmacists, doctors, and engineers I taught. Thank you is no longer enough, especially not if I'm to assume responsibility for the bad stuff my former students do, too.

Why do parents get credit when kids do well, and everyone else get the blame when they don't? Hey, I pay for those street signs. I want those parents to compensate me.

If one thousand kids see the website but only ten of them actually stick the stickers, why aren't the UDown guys responsible for the 9990 kids who had brains not to do such stupid stuff?

McDonald's encouraged my kid to eat Big Macs. Survivor encouraged him to live a risky lifestyle. Judas Priest told him to kill himself. His mom never insisted he wear his seatbelt while driving. All of these people, whether my kid lives or dies, are telling him to do bad things. I want them all sued.

[pzarquon]

Re: U-Down vandalism

All of these people, whether my kid lives or dies, are telling him to do bad things. I want them all sued.

No problem. Please take a ticket.

Scriv, I said I didn't like it. But it's also inevitable. Kid falls off a cliff in Mililani? Lawsuit. Woman spills coffee in her lap? Lawsuit. Kid kills self after listening to too much Michael Bolton? Lawsuit. It's a shame. It's ridiculous. But if UDown isn't going to do the simple, responsible thing here, and instead claim they're totally in the clear? Like I said, I won't exactly jump to their "free speech" defense when the subpoena arrives.

My civil action comment was a tangent, anyway. I think the key question here still is, is UDown encouraging reckless behavior and vandalism or not.

Even if the UDown guys said, "Hey! Go out and stick stickers on public property," which they didn't do...

Er, okay. You're right. They just post pictures of their logo stuck on public and private property, and pictures of the people doing the sticking, and say, "send us your picture," on a website modeled after freeway signage. But they really mean, stick it on your Trapper Keeper.

[damontucker]

Re: U-Down vandalism

I'm wondering if the pressure on UDOWN would be on them ... say if they were a bigger company such as Youtube?

I mean you see people actually doing illegal stuff on youtube...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3BF2U...elated&search=

However, youtube doesn't seem to be taking to much legal heat.