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  • Teaching in Hawaii

    Hello everyone!

    I've had a dream for a number of years now, and that dream is to teach in Hawaii. I've done my research, and I'm well aware of the fact that teachers are overworked and underpaid in Hawaii, but this is true for teachers in general. I am a teacher by trade, and I did not enter this profession with the hope of become rich - in fact, I teach because it's my calling! Anyway, I'm hoping to get some 'insider' info on teaching in Hawaii. So here goes...oh, and please forgive me for asking so many questions!


    1. Although I am an American/Canadian citizen, I have not lived in the States since I was a child. I have a teaching degree issued by a Canadian Institute, and I know that it's a lengthy process to become certified in the state of Hawaii, and that PRAXIS exams are required for public schools. Are PRAXIS exams required for all schools (public, private and charter)?

    2. Since I don't plan on moving to Hawaii for a year and a half, should I start taking the PRAXIS exams now, even though I might not work in the public school system?

    3. Also, what is the difference in salary for teachers in public, private and charter schools?

    4. How hard is it for a teacher to get a job teaching elementary school children, specifically in Oahu? I've heard that there is a demand for teachers in a few specific disciplines, and not necessarily in regular elementary classrooms. Should I try to have a teaching job lined up before I arrive?

    5. I know that the cost of living is very high in Hawaii, but as a single person living in Paradise, would I be able to survive comfortably on a teacher's salary? I'm currently teaching ESL in Korea to get rid of my student loan debit so that I can move to Hawaii with as little debit as possible.

    6. Lastly, what about ESL teaching in Hawaii? Is there a demand for that?

    Once again I apologize for all of the questions. Thank you all for your input -any info you have about teaching/living in Hawaii is greatly appreciated!

    Lyalo
    There is nothing like a dream to create the future.

  • #2
    Re: Teaching in Hawaii

    Well, I'll just wish you the best of luck. I really don't know enough about the system to answer all those questions intelligently or objectively.

    I will say that I've met other's who've tried to get jobs here as public school teachers and failed and not because of bad resumes, lack of experience or education, etc. Granted others did make it. The whole state system is rediculously complicated, hypocritical and apathetic, IMHO. Expect the worst and you'll be much happier if things actually go smoothly for you.
    If it doesn't, then it was already expected and you won't feel so put out, to put it mildly.

    Others on HT may not be as cynical as this old fart.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Teaching in Hawaii

      Originally posted by Lyalo
      I know that it's a lengthy process to become certified in the state of Hawaii, and that PRAXIS exams are required for public schools. Are PRAXIS exams required for all schools (public, private and charter)?
      Charter schools in Hawaii are public schools in every administrative respect, so there's no point in separating them. The requirements are the same for public schools everywhere in the state. Private schools, however, each have their own requirements, and as far as I know, not a single one requires passage of the PRAXIS or any kind of certification (except for early-childhood educational institutions, but it doesn't sound like you intend to teach ECE).

      2. Since I don't plan on moving to Hawaii for a year and a half, should I start taking the PRAXIS exams now, even though I might not work in the public school system?
      It wouldn't hurt. I am in a certification program right now, and passing PRAXIS I scores were required for admission; passing PRAXIS II scores are required before I begin the required student-teaching. It's expensive, but the PRAXIS I is a piece of cake, so I don't see any reason not to take it ahead of time. I took it cold, with no preparation whatsoever, and scored one point shy of perfect in the mathematics and six points shy of perfect in English. As an English major, I was slightly annoyed by these results.

      3. Also, what is the difference in salary for teachers in public, private and charter schools?
      I teach at a very small private school that tries to keep its salary right at the median for independent schools in Hawaii. In order to make this happen this year, I got a $3000 raise, and am still far, far behind my public-school colleagues with the same experience (ten years). I'll make just shy of $35,000 this year, I think.

      That's the median. For most small schools, you can expect to make less than that, and Catholic schools in general pay less. Three schools here are known for paying teachers very well: Kamehameha, Punahou, and Iolani. I don't know what Iolani pays, but when I sent my resume to every independent secondary school in the state eleven years ago, Punahou was the only one that sent a copy of its pay schedule with the application info. The pay there is very, very good. Um, for education, anyway.

      4. How hard is it for a teacher to get a job teaching elementary school children, specifically in Oahu? I've heard that there is a demand for teachers in a few specific disciplines, and not necessarily in regular elementary classrooms.
      That's where you're going to have to get info from someone else. I'm a high-school teacher and don't know much about what demand is like in the elementary levels. I will say that math and science teachers will never have difficulty finding a teaching job here; even teachers without certification can be taken on as "emergency hires" and "long-term substitutes." I've been in my certification program for just over a semester, and several classmates of mine have been offered full-time emergency-hire positions, all of them in math and science.

      Should I try to have a teaching job lined up before I arrive?
      That won't hurt, of course, and if you go for private, it won't be hard to work out; private schools here start interviewing for the following year right around March and April (so get that resume out!). One way the public school system here is really screwed up (and it's not REALLY; it just doesn't do well by its teachers) is that it doesn't settle on non-tenured faculty hires until sometimes the first or second week of school! Schools have to wait until enrollment numbers are in, and those numbers dictate how many teachers schools hire.

      5. I know that the cost of living is very high in Hawaii, but as a single person living in Paradise, would I be able to survive comfortably on a teacher's salary? I'm currently teaching ESL in Korea to get rid of my student loan debit so that I can move to Hawaii with as little debit as possible.
      It will be tough. Having a room-mate to help with rent (which will be your biggest expense, of course) will help, so if you're open to that option, you've got a much, much better shot. But almost all of my friends who teach are single and have managed just fine, with or without room-mates.

      6. Lastly, what about ESL teaching in Hawaii? Is there a demand for that?
      There is, but I don't know the details. One of my classmates in the certification program was offered full-time work in ESL.

      Once again I apologize for all of the questions.
      Hey, no apologies. Compared to some of the other first-posts we've had here lately, this is a welcome relief. Fire away.
      Last edited by scrivener; February 25, 2006, 08:10 PM. Reason: "what's so funny 'bout peace, love, and understanding?"
      But I'm disturbed! I'm depressed! I'm inadequate! I GOT IT ALL! (George Costanza)
      GrouchyTeacher.com

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Teaching in Hawaii

        There is a term echoed by many Public School teachers and that term is: I've been DOE'd.

        These bright-eyed and bushy-tailed fresh out of college teachers eager to teach the world enters the world of the DOE and within a year their eagerness has been diminished or extinguished completely as they try to teach their best yet have to fight the beaucracy of the DOE.

        Eventually they simply give up to the dark side and resign themselves to a union-scale paycheck and do minimum level work to sastisfy the DOE and they become zombies uttering that phrase that pays: I've been D-O-E'd.

        They have one mantra: I come to work I pass da kids...I come to work I pass da kids...oh den I go to da teacher's lounge and smoke till I drop.
        Life is what you make of it...so please read the instructions carefully.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Teaching in Hawaii

          Originally posted by Lyalo
          Hello everyone!

          I've had a dream for a number of years now, and that dream is to teach in Hawaii. I've done my research, and I'm well aware of the fact that teachers are overworked and underpaid in Hawaii, but this is true for teachers in general. I am a teacher by trade, and I did not enter this profession with the hope of become rich - in fact, I teach because it's my calling! Anyway, I'm hoping to get some 'insider' info on teaching in Hawaii.
          I am go to Punahou and if you are looking for a job, go there. It is an awesome school.
          backwoodlessons2

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Teaching in Hawaii

            Originally posted by backwoodlessons2
            I am go to Punahou and if you are looking for a job, go there. It is an awesome school.
            And they teach grammar their real good too.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Teaching in Hawaii

              Hi everyone,

              I just wanted to say thanks for all of the information - it's been very helpful. I will definitely be taking into consideration your thoughts and comments!

              Good luck with your studies Scrivener - and thanks for taking the time to write such a detailed post about your teaching perspective!

              As for the comments made by craigwatanabe,
              Originally posted by craigwatanabe
              These bright-eyed and bushy-tailed fresh out of college teachers eager to teach the world enters the world of the DOE and within a year their eagerness has been diminished or extinguished completely as they try to teach their best yet have to fight the beaucracy of the DOE.
              I'm not quite sure if your comments were intended to be more general, or if you were in fact making the assumption that I'm a new teacher(?), which is actually not the case. Yes, I would be a new teacher IN HAWAII, but I actually have a few years of experience in the classroom. I am perfectly aware of the extremely high turnover rate for new teachers and the bureaucratic problems associated with teaching. But these are issues and concerns related to teaching IN GENERAL, and are not entirely exclusive to teaching in Hawaii.

              Originally posted by craigwatanabe
              Eventually they simply give up to the dark side and resign themselves to a union-scale paycheck and do minimum level work to sastisfy the DOE and they become zombies uttering that phrase that pays: I've been D-O-E'd.
              As for this comment, I wish I could say that it was entirely false, but sadly it is true in SOME instances. But this is not the case for many teachers, and I don't think that making a negative generalization about all new teachers is warranted. I'm also curious to know why you have such a negative opinion about teachers... Just wondering!

              Thanks again everyone!
              Regards,
              Lyalo
              Last edited by Lyalo; February 28, 2006, 10:55 PM.
              There is nothing like a dream to create the future.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Teaching in Hawaii

                I didn't read Craig's response as negative towards teachers nor as a generalization. Like anyone going into a new job, they have high expectations of doing a lot of good things until they start getting caught up in the quagmire of politics and micro managing and soon become disillusioned with the whole process.

                I'm a parent with kids in school (one reason why I don't see this as negative or a generalization). I've seen and heard about some teachers who really shouldn't be there. Kids' school performance can quickly degrade if they happened to get assigned to one of these "zombies" and a lot of really good, bright kids get hurt and never reach their full potential in these classes. I've seen fluctuations in my own son's performance during his primary education. He shined when he had teachers he could talk about positively and we could work with, and lagged when even I didn't like the teacher.

                To these teachers, teaching has become just a job, no more, no less, and just go through the motions. Now how do you think it makes us parents feel about getting involved and helping that teacher? There's always the small percentage that, unfortunately, our kids will be "taught" by one of them at some point. It affects our children's school performance and attitude and affects home life. You can defend teachers all you want, but they are not infallible.

                I am perfectly aware of the extremely high turnover rate for new teachers and the bureaucratic problems associated with teaching. But these are issues and concerns related to teaching IN GENERAL, and are not entirely exclusive to teaching in Hawaii.
                Being that we are so isolated, most of us parents could really care less about similar problems elsewhere. Maybe we should, but this is our home, our schools and our children. We have our own "unique" problems to worry about much less being concerned about problems in...say...South Dakota..

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Teaching in Hawaii

                  Far be it from me to interpret Craig, but I think he was exhibiting a sort of distaste we often find out here: the Dept of Ed is looked upon as this humongous bureaucracy which seems to have 3 administrators for every teacher. Not even the US Army is quite that top-heavy.
                  http://www.linkmeister.com/wordpress/

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Teaching in Hawaii

                    Originally posted by Linkmeister
                    Far be it from me to interpret Craig, but I think he was exhibiting a sort of distaste we often find out here: the Dept of Ed is looked upon as this humongous bureaucracy which seems to have 3 administrators for every teacher. Not even the US Army is quite that top-heavy.
                    As well as 3 secretaries for every administrator

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Teaching in Hawaii

                      Thanks for the support and I may have sounded a bit negative (Hah!) but it's the sad truth. But even for a seasoned teacher with a ton of battle scars to brag about, Hawaii's DOE can be a formidable beaurcracy to blow your whistle at. The fact that the DOE here is the only school system in the United States that centralizes all of it's counties into one monolithic government department should scare the hell outta you.

                      Coming from the mainland and entering this school system, you have to be prepared to deal with the cronyism, the prejudice, and the union system that has totally fragmented our local school system into an inefficient education medium for our children.

                      The fact that many of our state Legislators, business leaders, Union leaders, even our own public school teachers send their children to private schools should tell you just how bad it is here.

                      Even the poor middle class parents will work several jobs and drive way outta their districts to afford to send their kids to private schools.

                      You want to work in Hawaii's school system? Then teach in our private schools where support for the teacher and academic principles are taught there. I've had too many friends study hard, get certified and then get a job for a public school only to find them years later with a burned out fire. Basically a smoldering wreck of a teacher. Those that shine knew how to beat their administrators at their own game and I salute them as some of Hawaii's finest teachers. But unfortunately they are the few and our kids deserve many more like them, not some zombie union-paid government worker cranking out minimum effort just to stay alive. We call it "treading water?" yeah we've all been there but unless the DOE decentralizes themselves into smaller workable county level boards, our educational system here will always be less than stellar.

                      You want to teach? Then utilize your desires in the private school sector where they appreciate those like yourself. Good luck!
                      Life is what you make of it...so please read the instructions carefully.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Teaching in Hawaii

                        Originally posted by craigwatanabe
                        The fact that the DOE here is the only school system in the United States that centralizes all of it's counties into one monolithic government department should scare the hell outta you.
                        People often complain about the Hawai'i DOE's centralized approach. I found a report that sheds some light on this idea. The Hawai'i DOE is the 10th largest district in the country -- the ones that are even larger are New York City (NY), Los Angeles (CA), Puerto Rico, Chicago (IL), Dade County (FL), Broward County (FL), Clark County (NV), Houston (TX), and Philadephia (PA).

                        The highlights of the report had some really interesting statistics, such as the fact that although there are 17,140 school districts in the USA, the 100 largest of them account for 23% of all the students.

                        Here's another interesting one. Take a look at this table, which shows expenditures. Hawai'i DOE: $6,531/student. New York City: $9,472/student. Boston: $11,503/student. Who says funding doesn't matter?

                        Even the poor middle class parents will work several jobs and drive way outta their districts to afford to send their kids to private schools.
                        Speak for yourself. I send my kids to public school and they are doing well.

                        You're a good guy Craig, but you've got a real grudge against the state government in all its forms.
                        Last edited by Glen Miyashiro; March 1, 2006, 02:16 PM.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Teaching in Hawaii

                          Craig has made it clear that he harbors no illusions (or idealisms) about public school education and public school teachers; we have often been on opposite ends of opinion in education-related topics. However, I can't deny the truth and validity of many of his points, and he usually backs his arguments well.

                          I didn't see his post as "negative" so much as "cynical." Cynicism has its place, no doubt.

                          However, there are some pluses to having one state-wide school system, among them the fact that there is no built-in inequity caused by different districts' differences in property values. Yeah, yeah. I know there's PRACTICAL inequity, but that can be worked out. I don't know if it ever will be worked out, but I know that it NEVER will if rural schools in Hawaii are suddenly dependent on property taxes in their own areas for funding.

                          Craig, it is certainly true that a huge number of our parents send their kids to private schools, but we have more private schools here than anywhere in the nation for several reasons, some of them completely unrelated to any shortcomings the public school system has.

                          I am a huge believer in public education, even in Hawaii. Still, if I ever have kids (I guess I need to have a date first, though ), I will send them to private schools because I want my kids to go somewhere where their teachers can speak openly about their faiths, and where kids are free to explore their faiths openly and honestly. That has nothing to do with gigantic bureaucracies or jaded teachers and just everything to do with one of the huge differences between public and private education.

                          I went to a public elementary school and am glad I did. I wouldn't have any problem sending my kids to public schools, either at elementary or secondary levels.
                          But I'm disturbed! I'm depressed! I'm inadequate! I GOT IT ALL! (George Costanza)
                          GrouchyTeacher.com

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Teaching in Hawaii

                            Thank you for all of the comments. You’ve painted a very clear picture about how the DOE is perceived in Hawaii. It saddens and frustrates me that the government has allowed the education system to deteriorate to this sub-par condition, and I agree that every child deserves a proper (and fulfilling) education. I do the best that I can for all of my students, and it sickens me whenever I hear that other teachers are not doing the same. Teachers have an uphill battle to fight, as we are always struggling to please the bureaucrats, the parents and of course, the children, all of whom usually want different things. We do not need shoddy teachers and a DOE which offers little to no support (for the teachers and the parents) generating negativity towards teachers and our profession. I am not directing this comment to anyone in particular, but for those people who have given up on teachers and the education system, please remember that not all teachers are bad! It makes our lives a little easier when we are at least given a chance to prove that we do care without encountering negativity and resentment from the beginning. Please understand that some of us are trying to do the best that we can with the resources provided.

                            Again, thank you for all of the comments. You have given me a lot to think about in terms of whether I want to become part of an education system which is so obviously questioned by many residents of Hawaii.

                            Lyalo
                            Last edited by Lyalo; March 1, 2006, 04:05 PM.
                            There is nothing like a dream to create the future.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Teaching in Hawaii

                              Hawaii's' school system is exactly as it needs to be. Natural forces at work. Hawaii is a 2 tier society in terms of education. The private schools educate the administrators and professionals who might remain in Hawaii and the highly educated who are sure to leave Hawaii.

                              The public schools educate everyone else. I'm all for education for personal enrichment. But as far as improving Hawaii, the place? Forget it. The biggest goal of most people in Hawaii is survival. Survival has little to do with education. In fact, education can hurt you.

                              Plus, why excel academically when the local economy consists of;

                              1) Great paying jobs that are based entirely upon "connections". AND
                              2) Jobs that suck.

                              In Hawaii, you are more likely to succeed based upon who you know. WE all know that fact. IN addition, I think you are more capable of keeping your head down, mouth shut so that you can toe the line when you are not the brightest of all. Ignorance is bliss. Street smarts are critical in Hawaii. Being able to read, write and speak are liabilities. Intellectual apptitude will only frustrate a Hawaii resident. Better to be dumb and happy.

                              WOT, U tink U smot? Haah? High Makamaka.

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