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  • "Peak Oil"

    Very interesting 12-minute video produced by ABC Australia about the world's "peak oil" problem (the time when the amount of new oil discovered goes down rather than up).

    The film implies that it could be as soon as 3 years from now or as long as 30 years from now, but most experts in the business agree that that time of oil scarcity is on the very near horizon.

    Even though we might have alternatives for fuel for cars, heating, and other petroleum-based goods, the one thing I never even considered was that thus far NO ONE has talked about alternative fuel sources for airplanes.

    For Hawai'i, because of its relative geographic isolation, this could really become an extremely serious problem for the residents.

    "What would happen if the world were to start running out of oil? Conventional wisdom says we’ve got 30 years, but there’s a growing fear amongst petroleum experts it’s happening much sooner than we thought – that we are hitting the beginning of the end of oil now. So how soon will the oil run out, and can we stop our economy collapsing when it does? How prepared are we for the real oil crisis? "

    Miulang

    P.S. here's a thought piece related to scarcity of most resources.
    "...Let's stop claiming to dominate nature and the world; let's stop making possession a superior end. Let's put our cherished deviancies, such as the manufacture of desire and its bulimic satisfaction, back in their place. Today's progress must be situated on the side of being rather than of having. Moreover, tending toward equitably-distributed wellbeing compatible with our planet's capacities at home and toward helping the most destitute to live better supports rational growth. The measure of this new growth must be taken according to scales integrating the human and ecological impacts.
    Last edited by Miulang; July 7, 2006, 03:05 PM.
    "Americans believe in three freedoms. Freedom of speech; freedom of religion; and the freedom to deny the other two to folks they don`t like.” --Mark Twain

  • #2
    Re: "Peak Oil"

    Well either someone finds a way to make gasoline and jet fuel out of other raw materials (it's not like we don't know the chemical formula) or switch to something like hydrogen for fuel.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: "Peak Oil"

      The problem isn't that we won't be able to make fuel for aircraft. Like Helen said, if we need to, we can synthesize conventional jet fuel, or distill alcohol, or develop workable hydrogen-fueled jet engines.

      The problem is that, assuming that we continue to subsidize the oil industry, all of these solutions will appear to cost more than using petroleum-derived jet fuels and will therefore not receive the political support they'd need to get implemented. And of course, anything other than business as usual will have significant short-term infrastructure-retooling costs as well.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: "Peak Oil"

        Don't forget the United States sits on some of the world's largest deposits of Shale Oil. Mostly in our wetlands that Clinton had set aside as federally protected areas.
        Life is what you make of it...so please read the instructions carefully.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: "Peak Oil"

          Originally posted by craigwatanabe
          Don't forget the United States sits on some of the world's largest deposits of Shale Oil. Mostly in our wetlands that Clinton had set aside as federally protected areas.
          See, that's why the whole "we're gonna run out of oil" meme is a bad idea. It's inaccurate and it makes people like Miulang sound like Chicken Little.

          It's not that we are going to run out of oil. It's that we are going to run out of oil that is really cheap and easy to get, and if we still want oil we will have to get it in more expensive ways.

          Eventually, we will get to the point where we will have to decide, as a society, whether oil is more valuable to us as an energy source, or as a base feedstock for manufacturing all the plastics, pesticides, and other chemical products we use in modern life.

          Because remember -- without chemicals, life itself would be impossible.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: "Peak Oil"

            Back when oil was cheap, extracting oil from shale was considered too expensive, now however with the rising cost of crude, oil from shale is looking more reasonable.

            Once the United States starts refining gasoline from shale oil, we will pretty much be the number one producer of oil as our shale deposits dwarf the crude oil deposits of the Middle East.

            But do we want to go there? We may have to unless we as consumers of gasoline and other petroleum products start to conserve what we already have. I actually like the idea of moving away from petroleum because it's still a finite source of fuel whether it be shale or crude.
            Life is what you make of it...so please read the instructions carefully.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: "Peak Oil"

              Problem with shale oil extraction is its very costly and inefficient. And it involves strip mining large tracts of land. The Rocky Mountain states are already seeing this occur (esp. Montana, Utah and Idaho). Of course, those are fairly sparsely populated areas so not many human beings would be impacted. And I suppose that is one of the White House's justification for drilling in ANWR, too, to the detriment of the world's climate.

              If you watch that video you will learn some interesting things (at least I thought it was interesting)...like when peak oil is reached in an oilfield, they use water to bring up the remaining oil (when there isn't enough pressure for the oil to reach the surface on its own). So as the oil reserve goes down, more water has to get pumped in. One segment of that video shows what the "oil" looks like when it's 90% water and 10% oil (looks more like an oil slick on the water). This is when it takes so much energy to recover. One of the reasons why the coastlines of Texas and Mississippi and Louisiana are sinking is because they have to pump so much fresh water into the oil wells now to bring up the oil. And Congress just rolled back some EPA rules so there's supposed to be drilling off the coast of FL and probably more drilling off California.

              One way to slow down oil consumption is to move away from buying and using petroleum-based products (and in the process, leaving the petroleum for fuel), but like the pervasiveness of corn products, it would leave store shelves pretty bare.

              As with bird flu, there's a fine line between being a "chicken little" and being in denial.

              Miulang
              "Americans believe in three freedoms. Freedom of speech; freedom of religion; and the freedom to deny the other two to folks they don`t like.” --Mark Twain

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: "Peak Oil"

                Were in Hawaii...

                Coconut Oil

                Kukui Nuts for Gas lamps... etc...

                Were on small islands... if we need to... we can walk....etc.

                When my wife was pregnant.. I would leave her with the car and ride a bike from Waikiki to Mapunapuna area daily!

                I don't know anyone who relies on oil to heat there place as places in the mainland need to be kept warm during the cold seasons.

                We could adjust to cold water...

                Like the phrase goes... Lucky we live in paradise.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: "Peak Oil"

                  Originally posted by manoasurfer123
                  Were in Hawaii...

                  Coconut Oil

                  Kukui Nuts for Gas lamps... etc...

                  Were on small islands... if we need to... we can walk....etc.

                  When my wife was pregnant.. I would leave her with the car and ride a bike from Waikiki to Mapunapuna area daily!

                  I don't know anyone who relies on oil to heat there place as places in the mainland need to be kept warm during the cold seasons.

                  We could adjust to cold water...

                  Like the phrase goes... Lucky we live in paradise.
                  That's true, Manoa, no need oil for heat. But gotta watch out for those air conditioners people are using! That's the reason why when I move back to Hawai'i, I gotta live Kula or someplace up in the mountains. My blood too thick now. Cannot stand da heat and humidity.

                  Miulang
                  "Americans believe in three freedoms. Freedom of speech; freedom of religion; and the freedom to deny the other two to folks they don`t like.” --Mark Twain

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: "Peak Oil"

                    Originally posted by Miulang
                    That's true, Manoa, no need oil for heat. But gotta watch out for those air conditioners people are using! That's the reason why when I move back to Hawai'i, I gotta live Kula or someplace up in the mountains. My blood too thick now. Cannot stand da heat and humidity.

                    Miulang
                    a/c a luxury.... no need if were having an oil crisis... let em sweat!

                    I'm from the mainland and I don't have A/C!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: "Peak Oil"

                      Originally posted by Miulang
                      As with bird flu, there's a fine line between being a "chicken little" and being in denial.
                      I completely disagree. Why get all stressed and ruin a perfectly good day
                      when there isn't really much you can do to prevent the bird flu or
                      the day we run out of oil.
                      Check out my blog on Kona issues :
                      The Kona Blog

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: "Peak Oil"

                        Originally posted by Miulang
                        As with bird flu, there's a fine line between being a "chicken little" and being in denial.
                        I knew it. Miulang and Susie are actually the same person.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: "Peak Oil"

                          Originally posted by Glen Miyashiro
                          I knew it. Miulang and Susie are actually the same person.
                          Susie is in France and I'm..NOT!

                          Miulang
                          "Americans believe in three freedoms. Freedom of speech; freedom of religion; and the freedom to deny the other two to folks they don`t like.” --Mark Twain

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: "Peak Oil"

                            Originally posted by Glen Miyashiro
                            The problem isn't that we won't be able to make fuel for aircraft. Like Helen said, if we need to, we can synthesize conventional jet fuel, or distill alcohol, or develop workable hydrogen-fueled jet engines.
                            I remember a lecture from a few years ago at the UH that Germany during World War II made fuel for the V-2 rocket from potatoes.

                            Another issue is not fuel for planes but fuel for ships since most of the products that gets here is by ship. However there are more alternatives to power ships than planes.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: "Peak Oil"

                              If the wind blows, the ships can carry goods. RAISE SAILS !
                              FutureNewsNetwork.com
                              Energy answers are already here.

                              Comment

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