Gun Control

[matapule]

Re: Gun Control

I just cannot think of any practical way to get rid of the guns that are already out there.

Tax them and you will see results.

[matapule]

Re: Gun Control

The NRA and its members are an immoral terrorist organization.

On Friday, National Rifle Association vice president Wayne LaPierre proposed a program that would put armed guards and perhaps other adults with guns in every school, saying “good guys” with firearms were the surest way to protect the nation’s children.



Nichols, of the Law Center to Prevent Gun Violence, described the NRA’s proposal as preposterous.



“I think it’s an absurd and dangerous idea,” Nichols said. “But as with so many of their proposals I think its real aim is to encourage the sale of more firearms. The biggest donors to the NRA are firearms manufacturers. Besides, arming and equipping all these people he wants to put in schools, having guns where kids see them daily is a tool to market weapons to the next generation.”


.........just as the tobacco industry attempted to do with their Joe Camel promotion.

[GregLee]

Re: Gun Control

The NRA and its members are an immoral terrorist organization.

On Friday, National Rifle Association vice president Wayne LaPierre proposed a program that would put armed guards and perhaps other adults with guns in every school, saying “good guys” with firearms were the surest way to protect the nation’s children.

LaPierre argued for his proposal by drawing a parallel with armed guards in banks -- if we pay to have good guys with guns protect our money, shouldn't we be equally willing to pay good guys with guns to protect our children? Now, while this argument has some superficial plausibility, there is some reason to doubt that it should really convince us to put armed guards in schools. The problem with the argument is, as an MSNBC commentator poiinted out, that there aren't any armed guards in banks any longer -- not as a rule, at any rate. And of course the argument neglects the side effects of having many additional guns in use, subject to being stolen, as well as the facts that crazy people can sometimes get jobs as armed guards and that good guys with guns can go crazy, too.

A difficulty with calling the NRA a terrorist organization or referring to anyone who disagrees with you as a nut, is that it is obviously untrue. But even if it were true, who could you possibly persuade by continuing to shout that you're right?

[matapule]

Re: Gun Control

A difficulty with calling the NRA a terrorist organization or referring to anyone who disagrees with you as a nut, is that it is obviously untrue.

Your statement is obviously untrue by definition. Believe it is true, don't believe it is true and continue to live in a society of violence.

But even if it were true, who could you possibly persuade by continuing to shout that you're right?

Who do you persuade by remaining silent?

[Leo Lakio]

Re: Gun Control

...who could you possibly persuade by continuing to shout that you're right?

In addition to the ones mentioned earlier in this thread (how many "persuasions" do you require before you drop that silly argument?), I look forward to more along the lines of this one ---
President Bush I resigns from the NRA after LaPierre's statements following the Oklahoma City bombing

And now we add two tabloids from NYC, not exactly known for "left-wing" leanings:

[GregLee]

Re: Gun Control

Who do you persuade by remaining silent?

Typical logic. I post something and am criticized for remaining silent.

[Ron Whitfield]

Re: Gun Control

I'm calling you out for not speaking out against the gun nuts and gun violence.

It happens as frequently as the mass gun violence is happening.

We are influencing countries like England, Australia, and Japan in how to be more gun violent? Ignorant!

This is a statement from someone who is not functioning in the world of reality.

What, at high noon and 20 paces? Do we use a gun or megaphones?
NOBODY likes this killing shit, OK? We've all spoken out about it at some point, big deal. But you refuse to bow to the fact that gun restrictions merely restrict protection of the law abiding citizen from those who will always have a gun.

More crazy talk that you'll never prove.

Ditto

You're raving around reality like a Mexican hat dancer in hyperdrive.

Do the impossible, get rid of every gun in America, keep it that way, and most of us will never again think of owning a gun. But that's not going to stop mass killings in our crazy ass society, there are too many ways to wipe out many people in short order, guns are just the long standing popular method for these mass killers. Would you prefer they poison the water supply, or air, or fly 747s into skyscrapers, or some other method and take out many more? Count your blessings, as tragic as these events are, when it comes to crazy it can be a lot worse. It's the person, not the way they kill that is the problem.

[Kalalau]

Re: Gun Control

I have to agree that getting rid of guns would not eliminate killings but how could it not cut down the number? Say you are crazy, armed with a knife or even a standard hand gun: you can't kill that many people before your targets scatter, but if you have a military style assault weapon, really, you can blow off dozens of shots in a minute, you can spray a room full of victims before anyone has a chance to react. And its true the really determined nut case can set off a bomb but my God this country goes after so many harmless activities (cannabis for one, but only one) why not try for once to do something about something that actually does hurt people, a lot. If the country put half the money into eliminating military assault weapons that it has put into jailing cannabis users how could this possibly help but be a much safer place to live in.

[Ron Whitfield]

Re: Gun Control

A determined gunman armed with 2 or more full clip handguns (which will always be legal) can quickly kill 20 people, easily. The AR15 really wasn't the important factor here, it was overkill in this situation. The whole point is getting/keeping the guns out of the bad guys hands, not taking them away from everybody else and eliminating an even fight. If that can be done I'll be the first to cheer.

[matapule]

Re: Gun Control

Typical logic. I post something and am criticized for remaining silent.

You jumped to the wrong conclusion and personalized it. I will restate in this manner: Who does one persuade by remaining silent?

[matapule]

Re: Gun Control

What, at high noon and 20 paces? Do we use a gun or megaphones?

Logic.

But you refuse to bow to the fact that gun restrictions merely restrict protection of the law abiding citizen from those who will always have a gun.

I have presented the research and statistics that demonstrate that you are factually incorrect.

You're raving around reality like a Mexican hat dancer in hyperdrive.

Yes, I am raving angry about the massacre of 20 children and six adults trying to protect them. I will not apologize for that.

Do the impossible, get rid of every gun in America, keep it that way, and most of us will never again think of owning a gun.

I have submitted a program that will make owning a gun not in the owner's best interest. Nobody will take their gun away from them, they will turn them in voluntarily. That's my plan.

But that's not going to stop mass killings in our crazy ass society,

But research shows that the incidents will be dramatically reduced.

Would you prefer they poison the water supply, or air, or fly 747s into skyscrapers, or some other method and take out many more?

I prefer to live in a world at peace and will continue to work to that end. I was a member of the Peace Corps. Remember?

Count your blessings, as tragic as these events are, when it comes to crazy it can be a lot worse.

I've seen evidence of crazy in the NRA and its supporters, some of whom are members of HT.

It's the person, not the way they kill that is the problem.

It is a problem with several components with gun ownership and resultant gun violence being a major aspect. One step is to get rid of assault weapons and clips and gun violence and murder will become less efficient and much less frequent.

[matapule]

Re: Gun Control

More than 100 people have been killed through gun violence since the San Hook massacre.

Time to end the insanity now!

[Kaonohi]

Re: Gun Control

Hahaha! You don't realize how 'nuts' you sound while saying others are matapule. Decided to make it personal since you have repeatedly done so to others yourself. Sure hope you never own a gun you freak!

So true. I don't own guns, but nuts like Matapule make me paranoid enough to go get one - to protect me from HIM!
Soon he will be advocating killing all those he labels as "gun nuts."

[Kalalau]

Re: Gun Control

Four firefighters shot, two dead in western New York State. We must send out armed guards with our firefighters and EMTs now. This is clearly the solution to the unemployment problem! In fact, we may even need to increase immigration to fill all the job openings for armed guards we will be needing. Paying them, well that will be a problem, especially since we won't be raising taxes any time soon.

[matapule]

Re: Gun Control

We must send out armed guards with our firefighters and EMTs now.

Careful Lopeti, some people will take you seriously.

In fact, we may even need to increase immigration to fill all the job openings for armed guards we will be needing.

Paying them, well that will be a problem, especially since we won't be raising taxes any time soon.

Actually that may not be true since the Teapublicans are pushing us off the "fiscal cliff" and all our taxes will go up. Hey, if the gun nuts have to spend more on taxes, maybe they won't have as much to spend on guns and ammo!