Using two routers on one network

[MyopicJoe]

Re: Using two routers on one network

Is it possible to use a combination of a wireless router in one side of a house, connect an ethernet cable to a powerline ethernet adapter ("A"), plug in the second ethernet powerline adapter ("B") on the other side of the house, and then hook it up to an access point or switch from there?

It sounds theoretically possible. I have no experience with, nor done any research on, Ethernet over power lines. If I would hazard a guess, I'd say it can be done, but the performance over the power line segment might be low. Perhaps low enough to make it infeasible. Of course it depends on what your needs are, on the far end.

Try reading the reviews for various power line Ethernet products on NewEgg. Tap the global power of geeks!

[kamapuaa]

Re: Using two routers on one network

Better nerd than dork

If you're talking about a wired network, then a switch is a repeater. Do you mean a hub? A hub is like a switch, except it's cheaper and wasteful of bandwidth (I suppose there are special situations where it's preferable).

There is only one situation in modern networking where the use of a hub would be preferable, and that's if you need to sniff network traffic. The basic difference between a switch and a hub is that a switch learns the MAC addresses of the devices connected to it, and directs traffic to the appropriate port. A hub will send any traffic that it receives out of all of it's ports, leaving connected devices to decide if they are the recipients of the traffic. Additionally, hubs are incapable of operating at full duplex.

Most wireless routers can act as Access Points, but they can't act as Repeaters.

An Access Point turns network traffic carried over a cable (wired) into one carrier over the air (wireless), and vice versa.

A Repeater takes in network traffic carrier over the air (wireless), and repeats it over the air (wireless).

An Access Point needs an Ethernet cable connecting it to your main router. Think of it as wiring up an extra antenna.

Repeaters don't need a cable, but the downside is they have half the bandwidth. They need to toggle between receiving and transmitting (perhaps this depends on the specific design of the Repeater?)

In my opinion, the right way to set up multiple access points is to use WDS:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wireles...ibution_System

Essentially, you just end up with a single wireless network. The important thing to remember when contemplating this kind of configuration is that the slowest permitted device will set the speed of the entire wireless network. Even with a shiny new 802.11 draft-n access point, if you permit 802.11b devices to connect, they will drag everything down to 802.11b speeds.

[Random]

Re: Using two routers on one network

In my opinion, the right way to set up multiple access points is to use WDS:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wireles...ibution_System

Essentially, you just end up with a single wireless network. The important thing to remember when contemplating this kind of configuration is that the slowest permitted device will set the speed of the entire wireless network. Even with a shiny new 802.11 draft-n access point, if you permit 802.11b devices to connect, they will drag everything down to 802.11b speeds.

Read the article. Mentioned the use of a [second] router as a native repeater mode.

[MyopicJoe]

Re: Using two routers on one network

In my opinion, the right way to set up multiple access points is to use WDS

Thanks for the link, kamapuaa. Learn something new every day


Would this be accurate statement I could make?

"Out of the box, most wireless routers can only be Access Points. Out of the box, some can be Repeaters. A few more can be Repeaters with third party firmware."

[kamapuaa]

Re: Using two routers on one network

Thanks for the link, kamapuaa. Learn something new every day

Would this be accurate statement I could make?

"Out of the box, most wireless routers can only be Access Points. Out of the box, some can be Repeaters. A few more can be Repeaters with third party firmware."

I think we might be suffering from namespace collision here. Strictly speaking, the little linksys/netgear/whatever units are not routers, they are NAT firewalls with a built in WAP (I do understand that they have become known as routers in the vernacular). Their actual routing functions are quite limited (private addresses are routed one way, everything else goes out the other). Some are more configurable than others.

Also, I'm not really digging the term repeater - I think that that's a device that receives and amplifies signal strength to combat distance-related signal degredation. I don't think that any of the residential access points perform this specific function, although I may be mistaken. I think "relay" would be a more accurate term, as they are passing layer 3 traffic back to the main base station via a layer 2 802.11(b/g/draft-n) network established via WDS.

It's hard to generalize any of this stuff, as most of the companies will do their own (often proprietary) implementations.

edit: re-read the wikipedia article, and saw the bit about repeater mode. I guess you do learn something new every day.

[Random]

Re: Using two routers on one network

Thanks for the link, kamapuaa. Learn something new every day


Would this be accurate statement I could make?

"Out of the box, most wireless routers can only be Access Points. Out of the box, some can be Repeaters. A few more can be Repeaters with third party firmware."

The first sentence seems redundant since a wireless router is actually a combination of a router and an access point. UNLESS, a wireless router doesn't have any port for WIRED networking. Just a port for plugging your cable from your modem.

The second seems to be true since one of the Netgear routers (WNR834B) can be used as a native repeater with the first [Netgear] wireless router.

[Random]

Re: Using two routers on one network

Also, I'm not really digging the term repeater - I think that that's a device that receives and amplifies signal strength to combat distance-related signal degredation. I don't think that any of the residential access points perform this specific function, although I may be mistaken. I think "relay" would be a more accurate term, as they are passing layer 3 traffic back to the main base station via a layer 2 802.11(b/g/draft-n) network established via WDS.

Meh. We still use the the term "modem" even though broadband modem doesn't function like the old version ("modem" is a shorthand term for "modulator/demodulator").

[MyopicJoe]

Re: Using two routers on one network

I think we might be suffering from namespace collision here.

Yeah. Marketing departments know consumers don't care which OSI layer a network process occurs at. They just want to know if they can web surf while sitting in their outhouse.

[joshuatree]

Re: Using two routers on one network

All devices are repeaters because that's at the physical layer, layer 1. Whether a packet gets routed or switched or simply repeated, the packet is physically regenerated at the outgoing port.

Not all access points are routers. Access points can simply be at the layer 2, which is what bridges/switches operate at. Routing is at layer 3. People get easily confused because manufacturers are trying to cram more features into a single unit. For instance, there are Layer 3 switches now. The common Linksys combo has a router with 4 switched ports and an access point wireless built in. That's basically 3 different products put in one, the power of open source software coupled with ASICs.