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  • #91
    Re: Lenient state judges

    Originally posted by MyopicJoe View Post
    Kaneohe people tend to follow the "let he who is without sin cast the first stone".
    Does this last bit also apply to Nicholas Iwamoto?
    This post may contain an opinion that may conflict with your opinion. Do not take it personal. Polite discussion of difference of opinion is welcome.

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    • #92
      Re: Lenient state judges

      Originally posted by MyopicJoe View Post
      Kaneohe people tend to follow the "let he who is without sin cast the first stone".
      HUH??? I'm sure you did not mean that in terms of Kaneohe folks not caring about protecting themselves and others from harm..... otherwise Makuola Collins and the Pali Golf Course shooters would not be in jail.
      Now run along and play, but don’t get into trouble.

      Comment


      • #93
        Re: Lenient state judges

        Originally posted by Frankie's Market View Post
        Does this last bit also apply to Nicholas Iwamoto?
        It only applies to Nicholas Iwamoto if Nicholas Iwamoto wants it to apply to Nicholas Iwamoto. Nicholas Iwamoto doesn't care what I think. Nicholas Iwamoto chooses to spend what's left of Nicholas Iwamoto's life however Nicholas Iwamoto chooses to spend it.



        Originally posted by Amati View Post
        HUH??? I'm sure you did not mean that in terms of Kaneohe folks not caring about protecting themselves and others from harm
        I would say Kaneohe people are VERY smart when it comes to protecting themselves and others from harm. They live with enough crazy to smell it coming. If something bad goes down, they'll be the first to leave, while the clueless people look around, asking, "Uh, pardon me, why are you all leaving?"
        "By concealing your desires, you may trick people into being cruel about the wrong thing." --Steven Aylett, Fain the Sorcerer
        "You gotta get me to the tall corn." --David Mamet, Spartan
        "
        Amateurs talk technology, professionals talk conditions." --(unknown)

        Comment


        • #94
          Re: Lenient state judges

          Originally posted by MyopicJoe View Post
          It only applies to Nicholas Iwamoto if Nicholas Iwamoto wants it to apply to Nicholas Iwamoto. Nicholas Iwamoto doesn't care what I think. Nicholas Iwamoto chooses to spend what's left of Nicholas Iwamoto's life however Nicholas Iwamoto chooses to spend it.
          After your rather lengthy and philosophical commentary on Davis, it appears that your thoughts re: Iwamoto are downright trite.

          Which is perfectly fine. Everyone's free to express their thoughts in this forum. I know I will continue to use this forum to continue pressing for victim's rights.
          This post may contain an opinion that may conflict with your opinion. Do not take it personal. Polite discussion of difference of opinion is welcome.

          Comment


          • #95
            Re: Lenient state judges

            Originally posted by Frankie's Market View Post
            After your rather lengthy and philosophical commentary on Davis, it appears that your thoughts re: Iwamoto are downright trite.
            If my comment appears trite, it's probably because it IS trite.

            I found "Does this last bit also apply to Nicholas Iwamoto?" to be trite in itself. If all we're gonna do is invoke the name of the victim and call that a "discussion", then I might as well use his name SEVEN TIMES and have us a REAL debate.


            Which is perfectly fine. Everyone's free to express their thoughts in this forum. I know I will continue to use this forum to continue pressing for victim's rights.
            Do you think you're the only one capable of feeling sympathy for the victim? Do you think because I don't completely agree with you, I possess less humanity than you? Dehumanizing people gives us an excuse to not listen.


            Now, if you are truly interested in being philosophical, then consider this:

            If Ben succeeds in his studies and his life, he's naturally going to want more freedom. As much as I like him, I think he will always need to be monitored and his movements limited. I'm no psychiatrist, but he'll have to take medication for the rest of his life, even if it makes him feel less human.

            Though it may be long and hidden, he'll always be on a leash.

            Of course, there will be debate about how long that leash should be. I can't speak for the victim, but I have to imagine a small part of him would enjoy (or think he'd enjoy) seeing Ben hung by that leash. Would revenge make him feel more like a man? Would that help him find joy in his life?

            Do you know what the real problem is? It's not what is or isn't being done to Ben. It's that very little is being done for Nicholas.

            "Knowing that he's free, getting an education while I can't even afford an education makes me sick," Iwamoto said.
            So why aren't people expressing outrage for Nicholas not getting more help? Why aren't a ton of people donating money to him?

            Maybe it's because deep down we really don't care about Nicholas. Maybe all we care about is our own safety and having Ben locked up. Maybe Nicholas Iwamoto is a name we invoke for our own selfish needs.
            "By concealing your desires, you may trick people into being cruel about the wrong thing." --Steven Aylett, Fain the Sorcerer
            "You gotta get me to the tall corn." --David Mamet, Spartan
            "
            Amateurs talk technology, professionals talk conditions." --(unknown)

            Comment


            • #96
              Re: Lenient state judges

              Hmmmm, ono food for thought.

              Comment


              • #97
                Re: Lenient state judges

                It looks like something worthwhile is being done in this tragic event.

                University of Hawaii administrators were so touched by his positive spirit they gave the former UH student a four-year scholarship.

                ...

                Anyone interested in donating to the Friends of Nicholas Iwamoto Fund can visit any Bank of Hawaii branch.
                "By concealing your desires, you may trick people into being cruel about the wrong thing." --Steven Aylett, Fain the Sorcerer
                "You gotta get me to the tall corn." --David Mamet, Spartan
                "
                Amateurs talk technology, professionals talk conditions." --(unknown)

                Comment


                • #98
                  Re: Lenient state judges

                  Originally posted by MyopicJoe View Post
                  It looks like something worthwhile is being done in this tragic event.
                  Yes, that wonderful gesture was announced a couple of weeks ago as was a fund at BoH. Once Iwamoto's plight was reported, people did express outrage. Me included.

                  Comment


                  • #99
                    Re: Lenient state judges

                    Originally posted by MyopicJoe View Post
                    If my comment appears trite, it's probably because it IS trite.

                    I found "Does this last bit also apply to Nicholas Iwamoto?" to be trite in itself.
                    Well, if you actually took the time to read my previous posts in this thread (to be precise, #78, 81, and 86), you'll see that I had quite a bit to talk about re: Iwamoto and his near-death incident at the hands of Davis.

                    Originally posted by Frankie's Market View Post
                    Which is perfectly fine. Everyone's free to express their thoughts in this forum. I know I will continue to use this forum to continue pressing for victim's rights.
                    Originally posted by MyopicJoe View Post
                    Do you think you're the only one capable of feeling sympathy for the victim? Do you think because I don't completely agree with you, I possess less humanity than you?
                    Let's see. I made the simple statement that you, I and everyone else have the freedom to express our views on this issue. And for that, you fire back with a very defensive post.

                    Listen, if you have a personal relationship with Davis and the comments that I make regarding him are upsetting you, then maybe I shouldn't have said anything. And honestly, I wouldn't have posted a response to your post.... except that you threw in that last part about "let he who is without sin cast the first stone." Maybe you didn't intend it, but that comes across as preaching.

                    IMO, Iwamoto doesn't need to lead a sin-free life in order to express his grave reservations re: the advisability of Davis being allowed to attend WCC w/o an escort. And to make it clear: this is just my opinion.

                    Originally posted by MyopicJoe View Post
                    Do you know what the real problem is? It's not what is or isn't being done to Ben. It's that very little is being done for Nicholas.
                    You're right. That is a problem. But even with the UH scholie offer, even if Iwamoto's considerable medical/rehab bills were taken care of, all that wouldn't have stopped me and others from expressing our concerns about Davis being allowed to attend WCC without an escort a mere 3 years removed after coming perilously close to taking a couple of lives.

                    I personally hope that Iwamoto gets all the help he needs to pay off his medical debts, become a teacher, and lead as normal a life as possible. But the fulfillment of that hope doesn't nullify or erase the issues I have with the way the state hospital and the courts initially handled the matter of how Davis was going to receive his education.
                    Last edited by Frankie's Market; September 8, 2012, 07:16 PM.
                    This post may contain an opinion that may conflict with your opinion. Do not take it personal. Polite discussion of difference of opinion is welcome.

                    Comment


                    • Re: Lenient state judges

                      Well, if you actually took the time to read my previous posts in this thread (to be precise, #78, 81, and 86)
                      Thank you for the post numbers. After reading them, this is my understanding of your main point:

                      Three years is too short a time for Ben to be reintegrated into society. He is too dangerous, or potentially dangerous, to be trusted around the general public.

                      Nothing I can say will change how you feel, which is fine. All I can say is I felt safe working with Ben, and I wouldn't hesitate working with him again.

                      Of course, I would keep an eye out for any signs that his medication wasn't working. There is a risk that failure of his medication would result in a sudden break, as opposed to a slow break we'd have time to escape from, but I've chosen to trust that his doctors don't think it's a likely risk.

                      I also hope they can perform urine/blood tests which verify Ben is taking his dosages.



                      Is that too long? Well, it took John Hinckley Jr. some 20 years after shooting President Reagan before he was given the green light to start going out of the hospital to visit his family.
                      As far as one can trust Wikipedia, it says Hinckley was diagnosed with:

                      "narcissistic and schizoid personality disorders, dysthymia and borderline passive-aggressive features"

                      "SPD is not the same as schizophrenia, although they share some similar characteristics"

                      Are we comparing apples and oranges? How much do we trust Ben's doctors? How much do we trust Hinckley's doctors?



                      Maybe you didn't intend it, but that comes across as preaching.
                      I reread what I wrote, and I agree that I was preaching. I'm realizing I'm protective of Ben, because I've gotten to know him, and in my opinion he's a good person.

                      I've sat across from people, who don't know Ben, say he should be put down like a dog. I understand why they're afraid, but it still makes me sad.

                      So yes, I was preaching, and if that rubbed you the wrong way, I understand.



                      I know I will continue to use this forum to continue pressing for victim's rights.
                      Do you feel the doctors are accurate in diagnosing Ben with schizophrenia? Do you feel a schizophrenic has little control over their actions? Do you think treatment of schizophrenia is effective?

                      If the answer is yes, then isn't Ben a victim also? Shouldn't he be given a chance to be a part of society again? Do we trust his doctors' judgement?

                      If any of your answers is no, then it'd be helpful to know which ones you have issue with.
                      "By concealing your desires, you may trick people into being cruel about the wrong thing." --Steven Aylett, Fain the Sorcerer
                      "You gotta get me to the tall corn." --David Mamet, Spartan
                      "
                      Amateurs talk technology, professionals talk conditions." --(unknown)

                      Comment


                      • Re: Lenient state judges

                        Originally posted by MyopicJoe View Post
                        I reread what I wrote, and I agree that I was preaching. I'm realizing I'm protective of Ben, because I've gotten to know him, and in my opinion he's a good person.

                        I've sat across from people, who don't know Ben, say he should be put down like a dog. I understand why they're afraid, but it still makes me sad.

                        So yes, I was preaching, and if that rubbed you the wrong way, I understand.
                        That biblical quote was the only thing in your post that compelled me to write something.

                        That you have reached out to Davis and gotten to know him better,... that's great and I sincerely mean it. I take no issue with any of your personal assessment and beliefs re: Davis. My ire was mostly directed at the system (the court and the hospital) in how they tried to handle the situation of Davis receiving his schooling.
                        This post may contain an opinion that may conflict with your opinion. Do not take it personal. Polite discussion of difference of opinion is welcome.

                        Comment


                        • Re: Lenient state judges

                          Mark Wolf is a federal judge. But I wanted to post about him here, as he made a particularly stupid judgement, ruling that convicted wife killer Michelle (formerly Robert) Kosilek is entitled to having a sex change surgery paid for by taxpayers in Massachusetts. As if that wasn't bad enough, Judge Wolf is also making taxpayers foot Kosilek's legal bills, which is expected to run into the hundreds of thousands.

                          http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/0...n_1890043.html

                          I understand that prisoners are entitled to receiving necessary medical care. But since when does a sex change operation fall under that category? Is such a procedure considered a "necessity" just because Kosilek attempted suicide?

                          Who was the President that gave this idiot judge a lifetime appointment? A liberal? Surprise, surprise.... it was Ronald Reagan.
                          This post may contain an opinion that may conflict with your opinion. Do not take it personal. Polite discussion of difference of opinion is welcome.

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                          • Re: Lenient state judges

                            http://khon2.com/2015/09/24/kapiolan...o-weeks-prior/

                            He has to update his resume.

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