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  • Mongeese?

    I'm posting this on behalf of my wife.

    The organization she works for has a significant mongoose related problem; such that, apparently, the little varmints occasionally get into their work vehicles and cause a small rodents amount of destruction and mess. In order to rectify this issue the organization (which shall remain nameless) has purchased mongoose traps and, upon capture, phones the Humane Society to have the creatures "disposed of."

    Now, my wife and I are both animal lovers; and while were are aware that mongoose are viewed as a pest species here, neither of us are comfortable with the idea of killing these creatures for the sake of not having to clean up a little poo.

    My question to you folks, the long-time residents of the Islands is; Have you managed to find a cost effective way to dissuade these critters from infiltrating and damaging your property without resorting to killing or harming them? We would love it if we could suggest to the management a better way to deal with the issues they are concerned with while keeping everyones hands a little cleaner.

    Thanks in advance.
    Grab some goggles and answer to nobody.

  • #2
    Re: Mongeese?

    Originally posted by Zovo View Post
    My question to you folks, the long-time residents of the Islands is; Have you managed to find a cost effective way to dissuade these critters from infiltrating and damaging your property without resorting to killing or harming them?
    You will probably get an answer you like form someone other than me. These big rats are not of Hawaii. They are immigrants like so many others. They should all die. Kill them all. They were imported by the Sugar fools. Fools cuz they didn't realize the mongoose were nocturnal.

    They should all die a horrible death. Hawaii existed for thousands of years without them and will continue to thrive without them. They serve no purpose.

    Aloha

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Mongeese?

      While I understand your concerns; there are number of other immigrants to said Island (myself included) who don't agree with the immigrants must die attitude.

      Even the original inhabitants of the Islands brought with them non-native species which undoubtedly affected the Islands' ecosystem in ways which it is no longer even possible to track.

      Are you this hostile to pigs? chickens? dogs? cats? At a point you runout of native species and without the "imigrants" as you call them you wll simply be without wildlife at all.

      Might I remind you that Hawaii existed for thousands of years without people as well. . .
      Grab some goggles and answer to nobody.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Mongeese?

        Mongeese. Mongooses? Mongi?
        http://thissmallfrenchtown.blogspot.com/
        http://thefrenchneighbor.blogspot.com/

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Mongeese?

          Originally posted by SusieMisajon View Post
          Mongeese. Mongooses? Mongi?
          Damn, she beat me!

          I prefer Mongorellies
          "The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers."
          Socrates.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Mongeese?

            Originally posted by Zovo View Post
            Are you this hostile to pigs? chickens? dogs? cats? At a point you runout of native species and without the "imigrants" as you call hem you wll simply be without wildlife at all.
            Benefits?

            Pigs - Kalua, taste good
            Dogs - Help to hunt pigs
            Cats - Warm and fuzzy friends of people
            Chickens - Teriyaki - taste good.

            Mongoose? Nothing. If the Chinese haven't figured a way to make them taste good then they are good for nothing.

            See da diff?

            Might I remind you that Hawaii existed for thousands of years without people as well. . .
            Those were just islands. There are thousands of uninhabited islands in the Pacific today. None of them are Hawaiian. These islands become Hawaiian by the people who came from them.

            By the way, you and your type always assume that it is a fact that Hawaiians immigrated to Hawaii based upon language and other historical evidence. But I say you all got it reversed. Maybe life started in Hawaii and Hawaiians immigrated to the Marquesas? Prove me wrong. I dare you.

            Aloha

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Mongeese?

              Originally posted by kamuelakea View Post
              Benefits?

              Pigs - Kalua, taste good
              Dogs - Help to hunt pigs
              Cats - Warm and fuzzy friends of people
              Chickens - Teriyaki - taste good.

              Mongoose? Nothing. If the Chinese haven't figured a way to make them taste good then they are good for nothing.

              See da diff?



              Those were just islands. There are thousands of uninhabited islands in the Pacific today. None of them are Hawaiian. These islands become Hawaiian by the people who came from them.

              By the way, you and your type always assume that it is a fact that Hawaiians immigrated to Hawaii based upon language and other historical evidence. But I say you all got it reversed. Maybe life started in Hawaii and Hawaiians immigrated to the Marquesas? Prove me wrong. I dare you.

              Aloha
              Hmmm. . . You're gonna be fun.

              So, by your philosophy; if it isn't good for putting food on the table, it shouldn't be there regardless of it's actual environmental impact. May as well import alligators, they're yummy, or bears, or buffalo. . . have you ever eaten buffalo? Mmmmmmm.

              An invasive species is an invasive species regardless of how good they taste. The only difference I see is that all the ones you mention fall into a racial sterotype you've concocted, where-as you can't think of a way to rationalize the Mongoose yet. Give it time, as soon as you can find some way to make an ignorant statement relating them to another culture you'll be more comfortable with them.

              As for me, and my type, (whatever that means) I can of course see where you find it unreasonable to base theories of mankind's existence on evidence and historical record when the arbitrary notion that humanity began on a tiny little volcanic dot in the middle of the ocean makes everything so much simpler, right? Stupid me, and my type.

              Maybe life did begin on a barren volcanic pacific island (cause it wasn't Hawaii yet, am I right?). Bu the fact remains that what you are "daring" me to do is prove a negative; which is impossible. See in order to prove anything there must be evidence; if something didn't happen or does not exist, it cannot leave behind traces of it non-happening or non-existence. Therefore, evidence cannot be presented to prove life did not first present itself on a small volcanic island in the middle of the Pacific.

              What you are doing is perpetrating a common logical no-no known as "Logical Positivism;" or "the you-can't-prove-me-wrong-so-obviously-I'm-right" mentality. See, you can't prove that there isn't an invisible pink unicorn that lives in the house next door to me; but that doesn't mean there is.

              The only way to argue with a Logical Positivist is to present an opposite positive. Ie: In reference to your argument; while I cannot prove human life didn't originate in what would one day become Hawaii, I can provide you with reference points to thouands upon thousands of pieces of evidence which suggested human life originated elsewhere. (though I won't, because this is not the thread for that particular discussion.)

              BTW: They're still just islands.

              Ok, so, mongoose; any ideas from anyone?
              Grab some goggles and answer to nobody.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Mongeese?

                So, what are you after? Keeping them out of vehicles? Close the windows and doors. Cover with tarps. Keep food out of them.

                I think the mongeese will be there as long as they reproduce. Unfortunately, it seems you are left with finding a symptomatic way of treating the problem. Unless you get rid of them.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Mongeese?

                  Originally posted by ExtraScoop View Post
                  So, what are you after? Keeping them out of vehicles? Close the windows and doors. Cover with tarps. Keep food out of them.

                  I think the mongeese will be there as long as they reproduce. Unfortunately, it seems you are left with finding a symptomatic way of treating the problem. Unless you get rid of them.

                  I agree, and yes, I believe the issue is them getting into vehicles. Frankly I find it to be somewhat of a non-issue. the vehicles are used on a daily basis so there is really little chance for the little critters to set up shop in the engine or anything; the worst you might have to contend with is a small mongoose related mess on the floor or seat or something (and that's only if they find their way into the interior).

                  Fact is, there is just as much liklihood that a cat could find itself up in the engine or wheel-well; bu they don't have a bunch of cat traps lying around. And honestly, even getting rid of them isn't going to solve anything; the building is located right next to a giant open field. . . get rid of one Mongoose and another will be there to take it's place.
                  Grab some goggles and answer to nobody.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Mongeese?

                    Originally posted by Zovo View Post
                    have you ever eaten buffalo? Mmmmmmm.
                    I have. Buffalo burger. I prefer cows.

                    The only difference I see is that all the ones you mention fall into a racial stereotype you've concocted,
                    It's not a racial stereotype, in fact I mentioned Hawaiian Kalua, Japanese Teriyaki and liberal haole Kitty lover. See? What stereotype?

                    Stupid me, and my type.
                    Asss okay. Not your fault. Its your education and culture.


                    Maybe life did begin on a barren volcanic pacific island (cause it wasn't Hawaii yet, am I right?). Bu the fact remains that what you are "daring" me to do is prove a negative; which is impossible.
                    I don't know either way. My comment was that I believe Hawaiian life began in Hawaii and moved outward while you believe the opposite. The facts actually can support both directions. The facts merely paint a trail but they don't necessarily conclude a direction. Niether of us can prove the other wrong.


                    Ok, so, mongoose; any ideas from anyone?
                    I say they look like they are perfect size and weight to shove a stick up da elemu and roast over an open fire with marshmallows.

                    BTW, did you know that the Mongoose are blamed for contributing to the extinction of many bird species and threaten endangered turtles because they love to eat the helpless eggs? As a mongoose hugger, you should find a way to let the mongoose know they are helping to permanently remove certain animal species from the face of the Earth.

                    Great job mongoosies.

                    Now, as far as what sauce would work? Maybe something spicey like a Jamaican Rub.???
                    Last edited by kamuelakea; November 21, 2007, 07:59 PM.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Mongeese?

                      Originally posted by kamuelakea View Post
                      It's not a racial stereotype, in fact I mentioned Hawaiian Kalua, Japanese Teriyaki and liberal haole Kitty lover. See? What stereotype?
                      I believe this: "If the Chinese haven't figured a way to make them taste good then they are good for nothing." would be the one I'm refering to.

                      Asss okay. Not your fault. Its your education and culture.
                      Or right, my education and culture which you know so much about. What else do you know about me?

                      I say they look like they are perfect size and weight to shove a stick up da elemu and roast over an open fire with marshmallows.
                      There you go. Now you know how to eat them, now you can be ok with 'em being here.

                      BTW, did you know that the Mongoose are blamed for contributing to the extinction of many bird species and threaten endangered turtles because they love to eat the helpless eggs? As a mongoose hugger, you should find a way to let the mongoose know they are helping to permanently remove certain animal species from the face of the Earth.

                      Great job mongoosies.
                      Right. . . speaking of as a member of the species which is contributing to the greatest quantity of animal extinctions world-wide, homosapiens (I assume you're human), you certainly have room to call the kettle black now don't you. Esspecially since the mongoose came here of their own volition simply for the sake of destroying native species. Seriously, I saw the agenda, it's on there:

                      "Step 7 of Eventual Hawaiian Take-over: Contribute to destruction of native bird and turtle species."

                      I wonder though, as mere contributors, they can't be acting alone. . . I wonder who else might be causing species extinction here in Hawaii.

                      I don't know either way. My comment was that I believe Hawaiian life began in Hawaii and moved outward while you believe the opposite. The facts actually can support both directions. The facts merely paint a trail but they don't necessarily conclude a direction. Niether of us can prove the other wrong.
                      Your comment was that you dared me to prove a negative. I explained to you why I could not do so even though you requested evidence here: "Prove me wrong." after already stating that you see both evidence and historical/linguistic records as irrelevant, here: ". . .assume that it is a fact that Hawaiians immigrated to Hawaii based upon language and other historical evidence. But I say you all got it reversed."

                      I see now where I went wrong; I humored you and gave you the benefit of the doubt. I looked beyond the fact that you felt it was your obligation to answer my initial question in a way which was not only unhelpful but also completely irrelevant, then followed it up with a post where you opted to make a blanket generalization about me while knowing zero about my background/heritage; and I assumed that perhaps you were attempting to have a serious discussion. But I see now that all you really wanted to do was to make me aware of your opinion and ignorance; and perhaps remind a couple of other board members who may have forgotten, all the while making an effort to intimidate the new guy.

                      Nice to meet you, too.
                      Grab some goggles and answer to nobody.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Mongeese?

                        Originally posted by Zovo View Post
                        The organization she works for has a significant mongoose related problem; such that, apparently, the little varmints occasionally get into their work vehicles and cause a small rodents amount of destruction and mess. In order to rectify this issue the organization (which shall remain nameless) has purchased mongoose traps and, upon capture, phones the Humane Society to have the creatures "disposed of."
                        That seems to me to be the best solution right there. It may help with the immediate problem though will not eradicate the mongoose species from Hawaii.

                        So many creatures (insects, animals "all kinds", plants, fish, etc,) have accidentally and on purpose been brought to Hawaii.
                        So now they live here too!
                        Life is either an adventure... or you're not doing it right!!!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Mongeese?

                          Actually, it seems like a pretty pointless act. Killing a couple of mongoose isn't going to solve the problem, all it's going to do is make room for more mongoose to move in.

                          Additionally (this is an update) a cat was caught in one of the traps the other day and everyone freaked out and had to make sure the cat got out safely and wasn't hurt and whatnot. Now doesn't it seem counter productive to trap and dispose of ne pest while coddling another one? No one took the cat home, it was feral, and last I checked cats have the same tendency to crawl up in car engines and kill birds that mongoose do.

                          So, this being the case, doesn't it just make more sense to find a way to dissuade the creatures from getting into the vehicles rather than just killing them?

                          I'm not a "mongoose hugger" as it was so eloquently put, but I don't see the point in frivolously killing anything. I even catch and release the few cockroaches I find in my house. I think "The Jungle Book" put it best; "Kill only to eat or to avoid being eaten."

                          As for the destruction of native species; yes, it's a bummer. No one likes to see animals go extinct; but that natures way. Mongoose (or any other invasive species) arriving here as a result of human action is really no different than an invasive species arriving in a more metaphysically natural way (ie: hitch a ride of floating debris, a parsite carried by a migrating bird, etc). Animal species spread or they die. You can't really blame them for doing exactly what they are programmed to do; survive. I'm sure these native birds or turtles would do the same if they were put in similar circumstances.

                          For that matter, what constitutes a native species anyhow? A species that was here before the Europeans showed up? I'm not being critical or difficult, I'm actually curious. The reason I ask is because look around, look at all the little Jay Birds all over the place. Jay birds aren't native to the island, but since their arrival these birds have "speciated" (multiple times) meaning they are no longer the same species which arrived originally. Doesn't that technically make them a "native species," since they originated here and exist as such no where else on Earth? Or are they pests as well because they interfere with the NATIVE native species?

                          Like I said before, it's a chain of volcanic islands. Nothing originated here (genetically), everything (terrestrial) on the islands had to come here from somewhere else and evolve over time into what it is now.

                          So many creatures (insects, animals "all kinds", plants, fish, etc,) have accidentally and on purpose been brought to Hawaii.
                          So now they live here too!
                          Exactly. So what gives one species priority over others? Tenure? If something showed up (completely by accident) and started killing all the wild pigs (butwas otherwise harmless); would we be alright with it because pigs aren't native to the island and they destroy native foliage by digging out and eating the roots? Or would there be a public uproar to eradicate the new species beause we like to eat pigs?
                          Last edited by Zovo; November 23, 2007, 07:39 AM.
                          Grab some goggles and answer to nobody.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Mongeese?

                            Originally posted by Zovo View Post
                            1)Actually, it seems like a pretty pointless act. Killing a couple of mongoose isn't going to solve the problem, all it's going to do is make room for more mongoose to move in.
                            2)So, this being the case, doesn't it just make more sense to find a way to dissuade the creatures from getting into the vehicles rather than just killing them?
                            3)Like I said before, it's a chain of volcanic islands. Nothing originated here (genetically), everything (terrestrial) on the islands had to come here from somewhere else and evolve over time into what it is now.
                            1) I think they would learn to stay away?

                            2) Haven't seen any other serious suggestions.

                            3) Not all scientists would agree.
                            Here's a link to 'Opae fresh water shrimp. Did they evolve here or brought? Hmmm...
                            http://hbs.bishopmuseum.org/good-bad/opae.html

                            Good luck with your mongeese!
                            Life is either an adventure... or you're not doing it right!!!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Mongeese?

                              Originally posted by Menehune Man View Post
                              1) I think they would learn to stay away?

                              2) Haven't seen any other serious suggestions.

                              3) Not all scientists would agree.
                              Here's a link to 'Opae fresh water shrimp. Did they evolve here or brought? Hmmm...
                              http://hbs.bishopmuseum.org/good-bad/opae.html

                              Good luck with your mongeese!
                              1. Animals don't learn from dead animals; esspecially dead animals who's corpses are removed. If that were the case they'd have all fled the island already, since being anywhere around humans = death trap. Animals learn from survivors. Instinct isn't passed down by those who are killed; it's passed on by those who live long enough to procreate.

                              2. Yes; and perhaps there is no better suggestion, that's why I asked.

                              3. I believe I specified "terrestrial" as in "land-based." A shrimp would hardly qualify. Of course a species could evolve here (hence the jays) my point is, no terrestrial genetic lineages could originate in Hawaii unless they were once confined to the sea and crawled out of the ocean. Of course, that too would make them immigrants.

                              Interesting website though, thank you.
                              Last edited by Zovo; November 23, 2007, 10:00 AM.
                              Grab some goggles and answer to nobody.

                              Comment

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