Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 5

[LikaNui]

Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 5

Miulang, WHAT?! You're suggesting that in order for me to travel as entitled in the state that I am a resident of I must lobby for another hospital on the island of Maui? I understand their concerns and needs, but you're recommending extortion..."Oahu people do this or else." Please stop speaking on behalf of all the people from Maui or the State of Hawaii in general, you're entitled to your opinion, but please don't insinuate that you have a following.

Nice try, but she has flagrantly ignored those same requests from many many other HT members.
Hey, in one recent case while pretending yet again to be a resident of Mau`i she recommended a restaurant to a newbie here... but that restaurant had been closed for years. Very similar to her willful and negligent dispensation of totally false legal advice. Sadly, she is also the single most prolific poster here, by miles. (Miulang has 8,304 posts, by far the most on HT. The second-place poster has over 1,000 less than that, and the owner of this board has well over 2,000 LESS than Miulang!)
One can only hope and pray that one day soon the powers-that-be will see fit to put a halt (either temporarily or permanently) to her highly disruptive and intentionally misleading posts.

[Miulang]

Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 5

I'm really not sure on how to comment on this one. It sounded more like negotiations, "we'll let you have the ferry if you give us the hospital". Truth be told, even if the ferry was successfully shut down permanently by you anti-anything folks, I would still support Maui getting another hospital. I'm really starting to wonder who actually is worse, Oahuians or Mauians? Just because the state capitol and all the political drones work on Oahu doesn't mean the common Oahuian think like them.

But that's what I mean about "perceptions", Josh. Perceptions will stay the same unless someone/something changes them, either positively or negatively.

Here is the whole pilikia with this stupid HSF controversy. No one is saying no to HSF. But the people protesting want an EIS done. If the EIS was done, then perceptions would change. There is nothing in the results of the EIS that would stop HSF from sailing, outside of making some mitigations. HSF agreed with the DOT to do an EIS if it could start service before they produced it. The protestors want one done before HSF starts regular service so they can see with their own makas what potential problems might be for real. No conjecture, no speculation. What's so weird about that? Before you buy a new car, don't you do some research? Or do you buy the car, trusting it will do everything that's advertised, only to find out, after you've plunked down $25k, that it doesn't perform the way you expected it to?

It's about the TIMING of the EIS and not the EIS itself that has everyone in a tizzy.

Miulang

[infinitypro]

Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 5

Nice try, but she has flagrantly ignored those same requests from many many other HT members.
Hey, in one recent case while pretending yet again to be a resident of Mau`i she recommended a restaurant to a newbie here... but that restaurant had been closed for years. Very similar to her willful and negligent dispensation of totally false legal advice. Sadly, she is also the single most prolific poster here, by miles.
One can only hope and pray that one day soon the powers-that-be will see fit to put a halt (either temporarily or permanently) to her highly disruptive and intentionally misleading posts.

I remain optimistic (not).

[LikaNui]

Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 5

No conjecture, no speculation. What's so weird about that?

Nothing is weird about that at all. Which is why so very many HT members have challenged you repeatedly about your own endless conjectures and speculation and guesses and maybes.
Just thought I'd gently remind you that you yourself almost always do exactly what you just complained about.

[joshuatree]

Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 5

But that's what I mean about "perceptions", Josh. Perceptions will stay the same unless someone/something changes them, either positively or negatively.

Here is the whole pilikia with this stupid HSF controversy. No one is saying no to HSF. But the people protesting want an EIS done. If the EIS was done, then perceptions would change. There is nothing in the results of the EIS that would stop HSF from sailing, outside of making some mitigations. HSF agreed with the DOT to do an EIS if it could start service before they produced it. The protestors want one done before HSF starts regular service so they can see with their own makas what potential problems might be for real. No conjecture, no speculation. What's so weird about that? Before you buy a new car, don't you do some research?

It's about the TIMING of the EIS and not the EIS itself that has everyone in a tizzy.

Miulang

This HSF controversy is downright stupid not because of the EIS, but because of inconsistent demands. People have quoted Chapter 343 stating any use of state lands or state funds mandates an EIS. And you even acknowledged in previous posts that YB is being subsidized so they won't stop their less than full container service (even though they already had made this annoucement before HSF's entry). At what point will people like you realize the double talk you speak? Chapter 343 applies to HSF but not to any of the other shippers, NCL, YB, Matson? Occasionally, one admits it's because HSF can take away some of the established means of livelihood like car rentals but last I check, this is still a market economy where businesses are allowed to compete for a piece of the pie. There's no doubt in my mind when an EIS is done and if HSF gets a clean bill of health, people will then accuse the EIS assessor as being lined in the pocket, etc.

[Miulang]

Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 5

This HSF controversy is downright stupid not because of the EIS, but because of inconsistent demands. People have quoted Chapter 343 stating any use of state lands or state funds mandates an EIS. And you even acknowledged in previous posts that YB is being subsidized so they won't stop their less than full container service (even though they already had made this annoucement before HSF's entry). At what point will people like you realize the double talk you speak? Chapter 343 applies to HSF but not to any of the other shippers, NCL, YB, Matson? Occasionally, one admits it's because HSF can take away some of the established means of livelihood like car rentals but last I check, this is still a market economy where businesses are allowed to compete for a piece of the pie. There's no doubt in my mind when an EIS is done and if HSF gets a clean bill of health, people will then accuse the EIS assessor as being lined in the pocket, etc.

No, I didn't mean the State was subsidizing YB to provide LCL service. It's that YB is subsidizing the cost of the service because it's unprofitable for them. Sorry if you misinterpreted what I was saying by the way I wrote it.

Chap. 343 applies to all the harbor users now. It wasn't in place when YB, Matson and NCL were started. Pasha might have gotten exempted because they share facilities with another harbor user. HSF's barges are for their own use, no one else can use them at this point. If YB, Matson or NCL requested changes to their facilities now, it would be up to the DOT to determine whether those changes are enhancements (which would not require an EIS) or something new (which would). If you read the OEQC rules, you will find that each Dept. within the State offices has a list of exemptions. The DOT has its own list of exemptions. But at the bottom of that list is a little caveat about when exemptions are not excluded from the OEQC rules (I've already quoted that previously): when impacts of an otherwise insignificant change have a significant effect on a sensitive environment. In the case of Kahului Harbor, having HSF move in meant that YB had to give up 25% of the footprint it had at Kahului Harbor. That's a significant impact, IMO. But the DOT decided it wasn't.

Miulang

[joshuatree]

Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 5

No, I didn't mean the State was subsidizing YB to provide LCL service. It's that YB is subsidizing the cost of the service because it's unprofitable for them. Sorry if you misinterpreted what I was saying by the way I wrote it.

Chap. 343 applies to all the harbor users now. It wasn't in place when YB, Matson and NCL were started. Pasha might have gotten exempted because they share facilities with another harbor user. HSF's barges are for their own use, no one else can use them at this point. If YB, Matson or NCL requested changes to their facilities now, it would be up to the DOT to determine whether those changes are enhancements (which would not require an EIS) or something new (which would). If you read the OEQC rules, you will find that each Dept. within the State offices has a list of exemptions. The DOT has its own list of exemptions. But at the bottom of that list is a little caveat about when exemptions are not excluded from the OEQC rules (I've already quoted that previously): when impacts of an otherwise insignificant change have a significant effect on a sensitive environment. In the case of Kahului Harbor, having HSF move in meant that YB had to give up 25% of the footprint it had at Kahului Harbor. That's a significant impact, IMO. But the DOT decided it wasn't.

Miulang

Post #259

All I know is, HSF took away about 25% of YB's footprint in Kahului Harbor. The State bought a little bit more A&B land to help out YB in the short term.

[Miulang]

Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 5

Post #259

All I know is, HSF took away about 25% of YB's footprint in Kahului Harbor. The State bought a little bit more A&B land to help out YB in the short term.

What YB got in new A&B land does not equal what they had to give up. Dick knows that area. The land that YB got in exchange for giving up 25% of their footprint is the parking lot behind the Old Kahului Bldg (space for about 20 cars). That does not equal the part of Pier 2 that they had to give up.

Miulang

[LikaNui]

Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 5

That's a significant impact, IMO. But the DOT decided it wasn't.

And since the DOT was put in place by we residents of Hawai`i and our elected officials, it is THEIR opinion that matters, and only theirs. Not the opinion of a mainland resident.

[joshuatree]

Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 5

What YB got in new A&B land does not equal what they had to give up. Dick knows that area. The land that YB got in exchange for giving up 25% of their footprint is the parking lot behind the Old Kahului Bldg. That does not equal the part of Pier 2 that they had to give up.

Miulang

Oh boy.....this is getting to be monotonous. Does how much land, equal or not, matter under Chapter 343 which states any use of state land or funds?????????

At the end of the day, who does Pier 2 belong to? YB or the state? If a landlord wants to stop leasing property to a tenant, what recourse does a tenant have if the landlord did the process by the book? You're displaying a squatter's mentality.

[Star of Gladness]

Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 5

Sarcasm right?

I mean seriously is your vehicle an extension of your ego? Is the value of your vehicle the focus of your self-worth?

i drive an old POS that is paid for and nobody wants to steal. I like to leave the windows down and the doors open when I go surfing so... not me personally, but just look out your window while driving anywhere on Earth and for MANY people this is true.

[infinitypro]

Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 5

i drive an old POS that is paid for and nobody wants to steal. I like to leave the windows down and the doors open when I go surfing so... not me personally, but just look out your window while driving anywhere on Earth and for MANY people this is true.

Your recommendation to Craig to forward his post to the Advertiser and Star Bulletin is an endorsement to his opinion that one's vehicle being an extension of one's ego, thereby being the true cause of the chaos surrounding HSF. Are you really intimidated by my vehicle or anyone elses that does resides on other islands?

[oceanpacific]

Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 5

My vehicle registration and insurance is valid and applicable in all county jurisdictions in the state. So, it's legal for it to be transported for me by HSF or Young Brothers anywhere in the state that they service.

Every year, hundreds of vehicles are purchased from Honolulu dealerships and shipped over to neighbor island buyers. Why? Perhaps because the "local" dealer wouldn't negotiate a better price or simply did not have what the buyer wanted in stock. Or, there might not have been a local dealer for that manufacturer.

[LikaNui]

Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 5

Very strange that there's no word at all about what's happening with the court case today. Not a peep anywhere.

[Leo Lakio]

Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 5

Very strange that there's no word at all about what's happening with the court case today. Not a peep anywhere.

What time is today's hearing scheduled to take place? If it's going on right now --- then nobody's got nothin' to report yet. Sure makes things itchy, though...

ETA: Hearing was scheduled for 1:30, so it just got underway.