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  • A Hawaiian Language Thread?

    Would anybody be interested in trying a thread in the Hawaiian language? Or about the Hawaiian language? It could be anything at all, from asking questions about the language to writing on any topic in it. E oluolu, kou mana'o, which I hope means please, your opinion.

  • #2
    Re: A Hawaiian Language Thread?

    Yes, I would be.

    I'll start with this. In Captain Cook's journal, he mentioned Kamehameha. But the words he used was something like Tama'a ma'a.

    Which makes me wonder, which one is more correct?

    We like to say Kamehameha is correct, but we can list other examples of how Missionaries or people during the plantation days chop up and translate the words pretty bad. Like last names Ah-Soon, Ah Sing, Ah Mok Sang. Maybe not good examples, but anyhow.

    The word Ka and Ta sounds different. Most part of Polynesia uses the words T instead of K. So could some of the Hawaii words be "wrong?"

    Any comments to add?

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: A Hawaiian Language Thread?

      Originally posted by cabanalane View Post
      The word Ka and Ta sounds different. Most part of Polynesia uses the words T instead of K. So could some of the Hawaii words be "wrong?"

      Any comments to add?
      You are correct. Tongan is the one polynesian dialect that relies most heavily on the K sound. Capt. Cook visited Tonga before his last fateful trip to Hawai'i. I'll take your word that Cook called the king Tama'a ma'a, but it was common in those early days for Palangi's (foreigners) to get the sounds all mixed up. Yet, the Hawaiian language is full of the K sound - kai and makai for example. I would be interested on how the king's name evolved to the popular spelling today. I would guess (I'm not a scholar)that the correct spelling of his name was Kamea mea. I wouldn't rely too heavily on Cook's logs.
      Peace, Love, and Local Grindz

      People who form FIRM opinions with so little knowledge only pretend to be open-minded. They select their facts like food from a buffet. David R. Dow

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: A Hawaiian Language Thread?

        Originally posted by matapule View Post
        I would be interested on how the king's name evolved to the popular spelling today. I would guess (I'm not a scholar)that the correct spelling of his name was Kamea mea.
        Part of the problem is the definition of "correct spelling." Remember that `olelo Hawai`i was not a written language at that time, only oral; the written form and the pi`apa were developed by foreign missionaries, not by the kanaka maoli themselves. Thus, there would have been no "correct spelling" of Kamehameha's name at that time - every written version has origins created by non-Hawaiians.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: A Hawaiian Language Thread?

          Another question.

          In English, I can take any two words and put it together.

          Dog + Food = Dog Food. That would be correct.

          Is it correct in Hawaiian?

          Wai - Water

          Luna - Boss/Manager

          But there is no such word as Wailuna. Again, my example may not be the best, but I hope you can see the question

          Are new words added to the Hawaiian language? Can and should it be added? How far back should be start or stop?

          When the foreigners arrived, there were new items that Hawaiians never seen before, so how did they described it? Creating a word? Or piece it together? If so, who decided back then? A Chief? How did it became "official?"



          .

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: A Hawaiian Language Thread?

            Originally posted by cabanalane View Post
            Are new words added to the Hawaiian language?
            Yes - there are a number of linguistic experts in Hawai`i who are constantly keeping the language alive, active and contemporary. Chief among them is Keola Donaghy at UH/Hilo. He's also been working with Google in recent years, to make Hawaiian a viable search language.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: A Hawaiian Language Thread?

              Ka= The, Mehameha=Solitary or lonely, Kamehameha, the lonely or solitary one.
              (Ke = the for words beginning with K, E, A, O; na = the plural)

              Hawaiian as a living language adds new words, for example...
              Ka'a = car
              Lekio = Radio (Leo= Voice, so Leo Lekio = Radio Voice)
              Kiwi = TV
              Lolu Uila = Brain Electric = Computer

              I think you can combine the concepts of dog, ilio, with food, mea 'ai, into mea 'ai ilio, I think thats correct, but for clarity it might be better to call it mea 'ai no ka ilio, food for the dog.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: A Hawaiian Language Thread?

                Originally posted by Kalalau View Post
                Lekio = Radio (Leo= Voice, so Leo Lekio = Radio Voice)
                Or "Lakio" - and now you know the translation of my HT moniker.
                Originally posted by Kalalau View Post
                Lolu Uila = Brain Electric = Computer
                Also accepted is the transliteration of the English word into "kamepuila."

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: A Hawaiian Language Thread?

                  Originally posted by matapule View Post
                  I would be interested on how the king's name evolved to the popular spelling today. I would guess (I'm not a scholar)that the correct spelling of his name was Kamea mea.
                  Originally posted by Leo Lakio View Post
                  Part of the problem is the definition of "correct spelling." Remember that `olelo Hawai`i was not a written language at that time, only oral; the written form and the pi`apa were developed by foreign missionaries,
                  Leo, of course you are right. There was no written language prior to the missionaries. I didn't explain myself clearly. My guess is that the Kings name was pronounced, Kameamea. The "meha" in the written form is very unusual and my guess is that the missionaries didn't spell the pronunciation correctly.

                  Originally posted by cabanalane View Post
                  When the foreigners arrived, there were new items that Hawaiians never seen before, so how did they described it? Creating a word? Or piece it together? If so, who decided back then? A Chief? How did it became "official?"
                  As explained to me, it was all of the above. For example, when the first Europeans arrived in Tonga, the Tongans had never seen a tall ship or a light skinned person before. The Tongans had to invent a word. They thought that the ship's masts "touched the sky" and that the occupants were some sort of Gods from the sky. Consequently the word to describe Europeans was palangi from pa = "touch" and langi = "sky."

                  Other words were transliterations. For example sikaleti = "cigarette" or uaifi = "wife."

                  Yet other words were descriptive. For example, an outboard motor for a boat became misinifakapipiki.......misini = "machine", faka = "(a word modifier) of the type", pipiki = "outside."

                  That shoulld thoroughly confuse things!
                  Last edited by matapule; November 30, 2010, 10:45 AM.
                  Peace, Love, and Local Grindz

                  People who form FIRM opinions with so little knowledge only pretend to be open-minded. They select their facts like food from a buffet. David R. Dow

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: A Hawaiian Language Thread?

                    I keia kakahiaka ua ike au i elua hoku lele.
                    This morning I saw 2 shooting stars.

                    Ua akaaka o ka lewa, no laila ua ike au i Hoku Pa'a, Na Hiku, a me Hoku Le'a ki'eki'e maluna o ke kulanakauhale.
                    The sky was clear so I saw Polaris, The Big Dipper, and Arcturus high above the city.

                    Ua anuanu o ke kakahiaka, aka malie.
                    The morning was cold but peaceful.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: A Hawaiian Language Thread?

                      When Hawaiians first saw British ships they called them Moku, meaning island. It came to mean Ship. When airplanes were developed they came to be called Flying Ships, Mokulele. And airport, Kahua Mokulele, base for flying ships.

                      Another modernized concept is Shopping Center, Kikowaena Ku-'ai, center (of) shopping. So you can kalaiwa (drive) your ka'a i(to) ke kikowaena ku-'ai.

                      Kalaiwa au, I drive
                      Ke kalaiwa nei 'oe, you are driving.
                      Ke kalaiwa nei oia i ke kikowaena ku-'ai, he/she is driving to the shopping center.

                      You can also kalaiwa i kahakai, drive to the beach. Hele wawae i kula, walk to school. Holo i ka panako, run to the bank.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: A Hawaiian Language Thread?

                        Kekahi mau mea i kahakai
                        Some things at the beach

                        One, sand
                        one wela, hot sand
                        laupapa, reef
                        akoakoa, coral
                        limu, seaweed
                        kawele, towel
                        lole 'au'au, swimsuit
                        aila pale la-, sunscreen
                        makaaniani la-, sunglasses
                        nalu, wave
                        mea he'e nalu, surfer
                        papa he'e nalu, surfboard
                        wa'apa, boat
                        pe'a, sail (n)
                        muhe'e, squid
                        nai'a, dolphin
                        kohola-, whale
                        niu, coconut

                        Ua komo au ka'u lole 'au'au hou i kahakai, I wore my new swimsuit at the beach.

                        Ua he'e nalu o Kawika i kona papa he'e nalu hou, Kawika surfed his new surfboard.

                        Ua moku ko'u wawae i ke akoakoa, I cut my foot on the coral.

                        Makemake au e moe i ka malu o na niu i kahakai, I like to lie in the shade of coconut trees at the beach.

                        Makemake is one of the handiest words, meaning to want or like.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: A Hawaiian Language Thread?

                          Originally posted by Kalalau View Post
                          Kekahi mau mea i kahakai
                          Some things at the beach.
                          About 1/3 of the words have the same meaning in Tongan.
                          Peace, Love, and Local Grindz

                          People who form FIRM opinions with so little knowledge only pretend to be open-minded. They select their facts like food from a buffet. David R. Dow

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: A Hawaiian Language Thread?

                            I have not seen the guy in a few years, but I knew a guy who was half Tongan, half Norwiegan, related to the Tongan royal family. He did massage and naturopathy here in SD, a very mellow guy. I'd bring up images of Tonga on Google Images, he had a story for just about every place that came up.

                            When you think about the distances involved, the difficulty and infrequency of travel, its amazing there is as much similarity among Pacific languages as there is.

                            The word for breast and for milk in Hawaiian is waiu-. Somewhere I read that the word for breast is the most similar among different languages.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: A Hawaiian Language Thread?

                              Originally posted by Kalalau View Post
                              I have not seen the guy in a few years, but I knew a guy who was half Tongan, half Norwiegan, related to the Tongan royal family.
                              Every Tongan is realted to the Royal family (wink, wink). There were three different branches of the Royal Family with only one family being dominant.

                              The word for breast and for milk in Hawaiian is waiu-.
                              In Tongan, it is huhu.

                              K, check your PM.
                              Peace, Love, and Local Grindz

                              People who form FIRM opinions with so little knowledge only pretend to be open-minded. They select their facts like food from a buffet. David R. Dow

                              Comment

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