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Magnetic Anomaly - H-3

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  • #76
    Re: Magnetic Anomaly - H-3

    A UH geophysics prof postulated that the rebar used to construct that stretch of highway had been hit by lightning and magnetized.
    Burl Burlingame
    "Art is never finished, only abandoned." -- Leonardo Da Vinci
    honoluluagonizer.com

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    • #77
      Re: Magnetic Anomaly - H-3

      Originally posted by lensperson View Post
      The antenna in the tunnel was coaxial cable that was slotted every so often to allow the broadcast to "leak out" of the antenna..The slotted aperture antenna structure is now in wide use.As far as anomalous magnetic readings go, they may well exist.
      We pretty much have determined that the anomaly is in the roadbed, since when a compass was held out over the valley, it normalized.

      This slotted coaxial cable theory makes a lot of sense, since the anomaly is intermittent. I'll have to see if I can determine any regularity in distance between 'pulses.' It will require slow driving and observers to watch the compass and determine distance by counting the Jersey Barriers (the odometer reading isn't fine enough).

      I'd like to know where you got this information and how I can find out more. I'd be interested to know the following:
      Is the cable embedded in the roadbed?
      Can the emissions effect magnetics?

      Another question is why is it only on the Pearl Harbor side, and not the Windward side? If the intent was to alert motorists of incidents or danger, both sides need it. And why both approaching and leaving the tunnel?
      Be Yourself. Everyone Else Is Taken!
      ~ ~
      Kaʻonohiʻulaʻokahōkūmiomioʻehiku
      Spreading the virus of ALOHA.
      Oh Chu. If only you could have seen what I've seen, with your eyes.

      Comment


      • #78
        Re: Magnetic Anomaly - H-3

        Originally posted by GeckoGeek View Post
        It's not unusual for roadways to have induction loops to sense traffic. Most commonly used to trigger traffic lights, but also used to sense traffic flow. Given that H-3 has it's own traffic office, it wouldn't surprise me to know that the highway has such sensors - which also work on AC magnetic field. If they're just the right frequency, they could well confuse a flux gate compass.
        According to Wikipedia, there are induction loops every 500 feet INSIDE the tunnel, to monitor traffic flow. I don't know why they would be on the road in both directions (East and West), but OUITSIDE the tunnel and only on the leeward side.

        I like lenspersons idea of slotted 'leaky' coax cables for radio warnings, but can find no references to it online. And again, why only on the leeward side, and why both East and West?
        Be Yourself. Everyone Else Is Taken!
        ~ ~
        Kaʻonohiʻulaʻokahōkūmiomioʻehiku
        Spreading the virus of ALOHA.
        Oh Chu. If only you could have seen what I've seen, with your eyes.

        Comment


        • #79
          Re: Magnetic Anomaly - H-3

          Originally posted by Kaonohi View Post
          Can the emissions effect magnetics?
          A mechanical compass? No freaking way.

          Yes, the emissions are electromagnetic, but they oscillate at a minimum of 540,000 cycles per second (if not 90 millions of times per second). There's just no way that something cycling that fast affect a mechanical compass. Each cycle is roughly even in it's north/south peak. I don't see how it could give a sustained constant/low frequency magnetic field needed to throw off a mechanical compass.

          I think the best theory is that it's just the rebar somehow got magnetized. Perhaps they used a crane with a big electromagnet to move it around.

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          • #80
            Re: Magnetic Anomaly - H-3

            Howdy. I am digging through my archives to find the supporting data re:antennas

            Comment


            • #81
              Re: Magnetic Anomaly - H-3

              A recap of what we know for sure (by request):

              The phenomenon is limited to an area above the H-3 roadbed. Outside the crashbarriers there is no effect. This eliminates microwave antennas or antenna radio waves. Whatever it is is an electromagnetic effect eminating from either the roadbed or within the barriers. Although the effect seems blocked by the Jersey Barriers (crash barriers), it easily penetrates the steel frames and bodies of motor vehicles.

              It is intermittant (turns off and on with distance from the start point), and variable in intensity for some unknown reason.

              It is limited to both Westbound and Eastbound lanes of H-3, but begins about an 8th mile outside the tunnels and continues for only a few miles. It is evident ONLY on the Halawa (leeward) side of the tunnels. The Haiku elevated roadway (where the steel grid has been removed from the highway after the closing of the Haiku OMEGA station antenna) loacks the magnetic properties of the Halawa side.

              Lightning? Magnetic crane?

              I'm surprised there is such a lack of interest in this at various levels of government and education.

              K
              The magnetic phenomenon has been noted on other elevated highways on O`ahu, to an undetermined degree.

              Did I miss anything?
              Last edited by Kaonohi; September 14, 2011, 03:32 PM.
              Be Yourself. Everyone Else Is Taken!
              ~ ~
              Kaʻonohiʻulaʻokahōkūmiomioʻehiku
              Spreading the virus of ALOHA.
              Oh Chu. If only you could have seen what I've seen, with your eyes.

              Comment


              • #82
                Re: Magnetic Anomaly - H-3

                Originally posted by Kaonohi View Post
                I'm surprised there is such a lack of interest in this at various levels of government and education.
                1) It's not a problem
                2) No one can figure out how to use the information in their favor. (perhaps by making it a problem they need funding to solve.)

                Comment


                • #83
                  Re: Magnetic Anomaly - H-3

                  After considerable digging around in my numerous drives I found some decent data and a fascinating link. The contractor for a lot of the tunnel electronics was Transdyn inc. to be found at (you guessed it!) at www.transdyn.com. From the home page go to Systems:Transportation systems. The buttons are near the top of the page.One is shown a list of projects including the trans-Koolau H3 tunnel.Take a look at where it says am/fm rebroadcast abilities. I still have to locate some archived data but I am pretty sure that is where I recall the slotted antenna stuff. Still diggin for more. Regards, Chris

                  Comment


                  • #84
                    Re: Magnetic Anomaly - H-3

                    Originally posted by lensperson View Post
                    After considerable digging around in my numerous drives I found some decent data and a fascinating link. The contractor for a lot of the tunnel electronics was Transdyn inc. to be found at (you guessed it!) at www.transdyn.com. From the home page go to Systems:Transportation systems. The buttons are near the top of the page.One is shown a list of projects including the trans-Koolau H3 tunnel.Take a look at where it says am/fm rebroadcast abilities. I still have to locate some archived data but I am pretty sure that is where I recall the slotted antenna stuff. Still diggin for more. Regards, Chris
                    WOW! Thanks, Chris. If we are to solve this mystery we need more folk like you.

                    K
                    Be Yourself. Everyone Else Is Taken!
                    ~ ~
                    Kaʻonohiʻulaʻokahōkūmiomioʻehiku
                    Spreading the virus of ALOHA.
                    Oh Chu. If only you could have seen what I've seen, with your eyes.

                    Comment


                    • #85
                      Re: Magnetic Anomaly - H-3

                      Originally posted by GeckoGeek View Post
                      1) It's not a problem
                      2) No one can figure out how to use the information in their favor. (perhaps by making it a problem they need funding to solve.)
                      Good, logical, insightful call.
                      It's not driving anyone crazy (other than me, which is psychosomatic).
                      It's not causing crashes (though I have seen a LOT of crashes at that end of the tunnel, and even been involved in one, I can't say for sure it's the magnetics).
                      The State doesn't want to dig up old corpses.
                      The news is uninterested until we can explain it, and maybe not even then.
                      I guess I got over-excited by a non-event.
                      Be Yourself. Everyone Else Is Taken!
                      ~ ~
                      Kaʻonohiʻulaʻokahōkūmiomioʻehiku
                      Spreading the virus of ALOHA.
                      Oh Chu. If only you could have seen what I've seen, with your eyes.

                      Comment


                      • #86
                        Re: Magnetic Anomaly - H-3

                        Thanks to Lensperson, this is my email to peter Smith of Transdyne, via their "conact us" mode.

                        ------------
                        Mr. Smith,

                        Some of us on O`ahu have noticed that upon exiting the trans-Ko`olau tunnels on the West side, heading West, there are several magnetic anomalies which cause in-vehicle compasses to swing wildly, reverse direction, deflect 90 degrees, spin around and so forth. This also occurs heading East, before entering the tunnels.

                        Through casual study (the State of Hawai`i denies us extended access), we have determined that the magnetic influence begins at a 'Jersey Barrier' marked G18, and extends for at least a mile.

                        The observation is that when transiting this area in either lane, East or West, magnetic deflections are evident. No negative effects are evident, it seems to be a mild magnetic deflection of heretofore unknown origin.

                        Speculation has arisen. UH professors claim it is the effect of lightning strikes upon exposed rebar. It is limited to the roadway; when a compass is held over the valley floor below the elevated highway, it normalizes.

                        Naturally, we are nosy buggers, and we want to know what is causing this anomaly. There is a good chance it is your installed Tunnel Traffic Surveillance & Control System.

                        It appears to be harmless, unless one is trying to determine direction while hiking ON the H-3 (unlikely).
                        This is largely a matter of curiosity, and education for Hawai`i residents, drivers, and schoolchildren (who WILL notice it, eventually).

                        My questions are:

                        1) Can your systems affect magnetic flux in an area where deployed?
                        2) Is the effect intermediate due to 'leaky areas' on the cable (often used to prevent feedback).
                        3) Is it limited in scope? (The concrete Jersey barriers seemed adequate to stop the divergence, although the steel-framed cars seems to have no effect.)

                        ANY data/information you can provide will be helpful. We have been examining this phenomenon for over a year with no solution. I feel confident you can provide the additional information we require.

                        Sincerely,

                        Ed F.G. Lesperance, M.A.
                        Cultural Anthropology, Polynesia

                        ----------------------------------------
                        Be Yourself. Everyone Else Is Taken!
                        ~ ~
                        Kaʻonohiʻulaʻokahōkūmiomioʻehiku
                        Spreading the virus of ALOHA.
                        Oh Chu. If only you could have seen what I've seen, with your eyes.

                        Comment


                        • #87
                          Other ointeresting information re: rapidly changing magnetic fields!

                          From: http://io9.com/5601177/ball-lightnin...ble-phenomenon

                          Please see highlighted portions below:
                          __________________________________________________ __________

                          Ball lightning: a shocking (and totally inexplicable) phenomenonIt skitters across the ground, floats in the air, is cold to the touch, and leaves scorch marks. It's been scientifically explained, or hey, it might be a total hallucination. It's ball lightning!
                          Ball lightning is the name given to a group of phenomena that have not been completely explained, or even agreed upon. Of the two words in its name, only the first is shared by all witnesses. According to most eyewitnesses, it glows and is shaped like a ball.
                          Everything else varies. Most reports say the balls are orange to beach ball size, but some say they've seen ball lightning the size of a bus. The ball can float, roll and bounce around solid objects, or do both. They're seen indoors or out. Ball lightning has reportedly been cold to the touch, left burn marks in rock, and electrocuted people. It fades away, or explodes and sputters out. Anything goes.





                          Since the exact properties of ball lightning are not agreed upon, a single explanation for the phenomena can't be reached. Those who believe that ball lightning is cool, consider it to be corona discharge – the same thing that is responsible for Saint Elmo's Fire, which produces light but not much heat. Those who believe it burns what it touches believe that it's a bunch of burning dust kicked up and ignited by lightning strikes. It could also be a plasma ball. Many explanations are out there.
                          One theory nosed its way ahead of the others in 2007, when Antonio Pavão and Gerson Paiva of Brazil's Federal University of Pernambuco reported making small glowing balls that bounced around the room and scorched their surroundings. These balls made of silicon particles which were shocked by scientists until they produce a burning vapor. The balls only lasted a few seconds in the lab before dissipating, a shorter time than some witnesses of ball lightning say the phenomenon endures in a natural environment, but otherwise the spitting image of the glowing balls that have baffled people for centuries.
                          But three years after Pavão and Paiva lit up silicon, Alexander Kendl and Joseph Peer from the University of Innsbruck in Austria put forward an alternate theory: ball lightning is just a hallucination brought on by a rapidly changing magnetic field. This is not as unbelievable as it sounds. Subjecting someone's brain to rapidly changing magnetic field can cause electrical activity, which in turn cause the neurons to cook up something good an crazy for the brain to see, hear, or think about. Psychiatrists sometimes use this technique to cause their patients to hallucinate (how forcing someone to hallucinate is therapeutic is something only your psychiatrist can explain). Seeing glowing lights is a common hallucination, so it makes sense that a lot of people would see such a thing if the very atmosphere around them is messing with their head.
                          There are problems with the idea. To hallucinate strongly, people would have to be closer to an area of intensely shifting magnetic fields than many observers of ball lightning have been. There have been plenty of accounts of ball lightning killing people and doing property damage. And of course there are those balls skittering around a lab.
                          Some statistics say that as many as one in thirty people have seen ball lightning, which means that there must be quite a few io9ers who have witnessed it. Have you seen it? How long did it last? How did it behave? Did you see any other strange things at the same time?
                          [Via: National Geographic twice, Universe Today, and USA Today.]

                          _________________________
                          Perhaps our magnetic anomaly is not as harmless as it may seem. I know from personal experience that otherwise inexplicable accidents occur around the Western end of the Trans-Koolau tunnels. I've seen two and been involved in one.
                          K

                          Yeah, I know, obsessive-compulsive disorder.
                          Be Yourself. Everyone Else Is Taken!
                          ~ ~
                          Kaʻonohiʻulaʻokahōkūmiomioʻehiku
                          Spreading the virus of ALOHA.
                          Oh Chu. If only you could have seen what I've seen, with your eyes.

                          Comment


                          • #88
                            MORE on magnetic diversions.

                            Nothing new, actually, but that theyy are still there.

                            I(t seems they are magnetic loop-ables (which the State won't ta;lk about) thatb do a 'copuimnting of cars' eiting the tnnel.
                            No reason is offerred re: only having the counters on the leeward side, or why,

                            T%hink it's top secret??? Neihyer do I

                            Who knows how to access public info?


                            .
                            Be Yourself. Everyone Else Is Taken!
                            ~ ~
                            Kaʻonohiʻulaʻokahōkūmiomioʻehiku
                            Spreading the virus of ALOHA.
                            Oh Chu. If only you could have seen what I've seen, with your eyes.

                            Comment


                            • #89
                              Re: MORE on magnetic diversions.

                              Originally posted by Kaonohi View Post
                              I(t seems they are magnetic loop-ables (which the State won't ta;lk about) thatb do a 'copuimnting of cars' eiting the tnnel.
                              I'd think they'd be using the same technology as the loops by traffic lights - an AC signal that would never show up on a mechanical compass.


                              Originally posted by Kaonohi View Post
                              No reason is offerred re: only having the counters on the leeward side,
                              Why would they need that? Do you expect cars to disappear in the tunnel?

                              Comment


                              • #90
                                Re: MORE on magnetic diversions.

                                Originally posted by GeckoGeek View Post
                                I'd think they'd be using the same technology as the loops by traffic lights - an AC signal that would never show up on a mechanical compass.

                                Why would they need that? Do you expect cars to disappear in the tunnel?
                                Sorry for my awful typing last message!

                                Traffic light car detection technology is visible in the roadway - I thought it was based on the old pressure-switch technology. If there are loopsin H-3, they are based on magnetic fields, nor roadway pressure.

                                I don't know why they are different, nor why they are only on one side of the tunnels.
                                Be Yourself. Everyone Else Is Taken!
                                ~ ~
                                Kaʻonohiʻulaʻokahōkūmiomioʻehiku
                                Spreading the virus of ALOHA.
                                Oh Chu. If only you could have seen what I've seen, with your eyes.

                                Comment

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