Mandatory Medical Treatment

[cynsaligia]

Re: Mandatory Medical Treatment

. It is that the govt. has NO just or right business butting into our medical treatment, or our choice of the lack of. You say it does and is already and I say....hmm....where is it?

i will heartily agreee with you that you need to end your habit of reading sloppily and posting from the hip. start with re-reading adri's initial post where she asserts that the government does have a hand in americans' medical care, and where she is raising a question specifically about the HPV vaccine, not vaccines in general.

the reason why you don't "see" goverment intervention re health issues, including medicine, in the US is because the US doesn't have rampant sanitation/disease issues. venture your quaint little self into a nation where the government will not or cannot get involved in health issues, and you'll see that clean water, safe food, clean needles, availability of medicine are daily concerns for the majority of the population--which is not generally true in the US. if you are unaware the US government makes decisions and takes actions affecting the health and well-being of every person on american soil every day via little tiny something called "the US department of health and human services," then you are truly obtuse.

i will stand by my assertion that your comparing forced chemotherapy to mandatory vaccination is like saying apples are like oranges, simply because chemotherapy is a complex process to treat one person of a non-communicable disease, whereas a mandatory vaccination program acts to prevent communicable disease for a population.

lastly, i had hoped it would not be necesssary to say what i had deleted out of my last post, but since you imply i am "confused" and "brainwashed":

WORN, a registerned nurse, advocated vaccinations, has voluntarily vaccinated herself against Hep B, and would consider the HPV vaccine if she had a female child and felt she, as a responsible parent and clinician, were fully informed of its risks and what it can/cannot do.

HT's resident registered nurse advocates vaccines. and mind you, she had training specifically about vaccines, and has made her life working in the health care field (by the way, WORN, if you ever read this--thank you for all you do daily. i couldn't do what you do, and i find it an honor to work in a tangential field that helps others like you give great patient care).

karen, you, on the other hand, outright say all vaccines do harm. what are your credentials? what is the proof of your expertise and experience?

go ahead: write your pages and pages. first of all, this great nation not only oversees the health of its citizens, but allows even conspiracy theorists like you an opinion, and my purpose was never to convince you to change it (refer to the first line in post #10 for my purpose). second of all, unlike you, i have no compulsion to validate myself in such a manner. i'll grant that you might have a small audience who might consider looking more closely into vaccines or who might flat out believe as you do. but the vast majority of us? we've have had our vaccinations, get our flu shots, make sure our kids get vaccinated, and get more vaccinations prior to travelling to certain other countries.

in other words, we're buying what the cdc, who, iom, and the vast majority of physicians and clinicians--you know, real experts?--are selling.

[Karen]

Re: Mandatory Medical Treatment

Adri titled her thread what she did, not specifically about the HPV vaccine, therefore it is perfectly fitting to be discussing not only ALL vaccines but medical treatment and the myriad of things it includes, and how we approve or disapprove of govt. mandating anything within it.


You can stand by...anything you wish, there was nothing stupid about my post concerning it (saying that govt. has no right to force vaccinations or chemo) for reasons I already stated.

I say all vaccinations have the capacity and yes, that there most likely does not exist a vaccine that has done NO harm, and if I were to have the time and keep posting, I know I could prove this, for there's a ton, and that is not an exaggeration, of documentation on harm that vaccines do.

Here's a bit more than I found at a glance....things like this make news somewhere and then most other news sources refuse to pick them up, when to say the least they are! newsworthy.
Documented news stories on mandated immunizations...

Flu vaccines may not save lives of elderly
No solid proof that shots prevent seniors from dying of disease, expert says
Reuters
Updated: 8:19 p.m. ET Sept 24, 2007
WASHINGTON - Getting an annual flu vaccine may not save the lives of seniors, and health officials may want to look at other ways to protect the elderly, researchers said on Monday...
***********
KERRY'S FIGHT FOR LIFE AFTER TB JAB AT SCHOOL
Date: 9/28/2003; Publication: Sunday Mirror; Author: HELEN MORGAN

A TEENAGER has spent five months in hospital and still has to be fed through a tube after a routine TB jab given to her at school. Kerry Watson, 15, had the BCG vaccine, which protects against tuberculosis, while she was suffering from a bug
********

"Effects of Chickenpox Vaccine Fade Over Time
Thu Mar 15, 2007 2:02PM GMT
By Gene Emery
BOSTON (Reuters) - Merck's chickenpox vaccine Varivax not only loses its effectiveness after a while, but it has also changed the profile of the disease in the population, U.S. researchers reported on Wednesday."
*******
"Vaccinated Youngsters Still Vulnerable to Killer Disease
04 August 2006

By KIM RUSCOE

Twenty fully vaccinated under-20-year-olds have contracted the epidemic strain of meningitis since immunisation began."
*******
Ten vaccinated kids get disease
12 January 2006
By KELLY ANDREW and NZPA

Ten fully vaccinated children and teenagers have been infected with deadly meningococcal B disease since the immunisation programme began 18 months ago.

********

Pediatrics, August 2003 Journal Scan
From The Pediatric Infectious Disease Journal
July 2003 (Volume 22, Number 7)
"Increase in Deaths From Pertussis Among Young Infants in the United States in
the 1990s" Vitek CR, Pascual FB, Baughman AL, Murphy TV
The Pediatric Infectious Disease Journal. 2003;22(7):628-634
********
Meningococcal C vaccine may cause relapse of nephrotic syndrome in children

Last Updated: 2003-08-08 12:33:14 -0400 (Reuters Health)

NEW YORK (Reuters Health)
********

Marines' Malaria Cases Show Protections Failed

By David Brown
Washington Post Staff Writer
Wednesday, September 10, 2003; Page A01

Despite extensive preventive measures, most of the more than 200 Marines who spent time ashore in Liberia last month apparently contracted malaria, with about 43 of them ill enough to be hospitalized.
*******


"Whooping cough not shot down, but vaccinations up

By JANE E. ALLEN, Los Angeles Times

November 3, 2003

Doctors and public health officials are stumped. Even though vaccination rates are at record highs for whooping cough, cases of the highly contagious respiratory illness have been on the rise nationwide for more than two decades. In recent weeks, outbreaks have taken hold in parts of New York, Pennsylvania, Texas and Illinois. Nationally, cases reached 9,771 last year, the most since 1964."

There's a ton more documentation like this....

[salmoned]

Re: Mandatory Medical Treatment

"Vaccinated Youngsters Still Vulnerable to Killer Disease
04 August 2006

By KIM RUSCOE

Twenty fully vaccinated under-20-year-olds have contracted the epidemic strain of meningitis since immunisation began."
*******
Ten vaccinated kids get disease
12 January 2006
By KELLY ANDREW and NZPA

Ten fully vaccinated children and teenagers have been infected with deadly meningococcal B disease since the immunisation programme began 18 months ago.

********

Pediatrics, August 2003 Journal Scan
From The Pediatric Infectious Disease Journal
July 2003 (Volume 22, Number 7)
"Increase in Deaths From Pertussis Among Young Infants in the United States in
the 1990s" Vitek CR, Pascual FB, Baughman AL, Murphy TV
The Pediatric Infectious Disease Journal. 2003;22(7):628-634
********
Meningococcal C vaccine may cause relapse of nephrotic syndrome in children

Last Updated: 2003-08-08 12:33:14 -0400 (Reuters Health)

NEW YORK (Reuters Health)
********

Marines' Malaria Cases Show Protections Failed

By David Brown
Washington Post Staff Writer
Wednesday, September 10, 2003; Page A01

Despite extensive preventive measures, most of the more than 200 Marines who spent time ashore in Liberia last month apparently contracted malaria, with about 43 of them ill enough to be hospitalized.
*******

I don't really see what this sort of quoting 'proves', other than that vaccines aren't a panacea and may not provide a lifetime of immunity for everyone - but no one seems to make those claims, anyway. Yes, vaccination can be harmful to some. On the other hand, non-vaccination can be harmful to many. Cost/benefit questions cannot be reasonably answered with anecdotal evidence (and studies), but rather require broad analysis of all data, pro and con. If one is not prepared to do such an analysis, following generally accepted practices is the best course of action.

BTW, I'm not aware of a vaccine for malaria (only immune system boosts).

[Karen]

Re: Mandatory Medical Treatment

I don't really see what this sort of quoting 'proves', other than that vaccines aren't a panacea and may not provide a lifetime of immunity for everyone....."

What does the news ever prove? This is called reporting...facts. Facts that when it comes to immunization the majority of people are unaware of.

It proves that it is wrong to force hundreds of millions of people to be vaccinated, especially without "reporting" the type of facts that I have here, so far. My entire argument on this thread is that we have a constitutional right to CHOICE in medical care, not only the type of choice billary wants us to have, but true choice....to vaccinate or not to, to accept chemo even for our kids, or to not to, to have a mammogram at a certain advised age, or not to...to abort or not to, our choice.

More than "some" are harmed by vaccinations. One report stated that 54,000 reports were received in how many years? another report stated that in only 8yrs. over 450 million dollars was paid out on over 1000 claims of harm done by immunizations.

That's more than "some."

[Miulang]

Re: Mandatory Medical Treatment

I don't really see what this sort of quoting 'proves', other than that vaccines aren't a panacea and may not provide a lifetime of immunity for everyone....."

What does the news ever prove? This is called reporting...facts. Facts that when it comes to immunization the majority of people are unaware of.

It proves that it is wrong to force hundreds of millions of people to be vaccinated, especially without "reporting" the type of facts that I have here, so far. My entire argument on this thread is that we have a constitutional right to CHOICE in medical care, not only the type of choice billary wants us to have, but true choice....to vaccinate or not to, to accept chemo even for our kids, or to not to, to have a mammogram at a certain advised age, or not to...to abort or not to, our choice.

More than "some" are harmed by vaccinations. One report stated that 54,000 reports were received in how many years? another report stated that in only 8yrs. over 450 million dollars was paid out on over 1000 claims of harm done by immunizations.

That's more than "some."

What intelligent people do is take those "facts" and question whether or not they make sense in their own personal contexts. For instance, some women who know they have a family history of breast cancer sometimes choose to have mastectomies of healthy breasts because they have decided that the risk of breast cancer is great enough that they would rather undergo surgery before they need it. I don't think I would yell at them for that choice. Neither do I think parents who get tested genetically for inherited diseases and who decide on the basis of the tests that they will not have biological kids are wrong; they evaluated the risks and decided not to take a chance.

The preservative in some vaccinations (mercury thiomersal) is thought to be a primary cause of autism, but does the possibility of becoming autistic outweigh the therapeutic benefit of those first immunizations that babies get to protect them from everything from whopping cough to diphtheria?

Miulang

[Karen]

Re: Mandatory Medical Treatment

"does the possibility of becoming autistic outweigh the therapeutic benefit of those first immunizations that babies get to protect them from everything from whopping cough to diphtheria?"

Do your homework, do some reading....perhaps even more than I posted here. There is PROOF that the immunizations often, yes often, not occasionally don't even give the protection that you are assuming that they do. Whooping cough.....the amount of infection rose when the percentage of immunized did over a twenty year period. The numbers tell the story....

[Miulang]

Re: Mandatory Medical Treatment

"does the possibility of becoming autistic outweigh the therapeutic benefit of those first immunizations that babies get to protect them from everything from whopping cough to diphtheria?"

Do your homework, do some reading....perhaps even more than I posted here. There is PROOF that the immunizations often, yes often, not occasionally don't even give the protection that you are assuming that they do. Whooping cough.....the amount of infection rose when the percentage of immunized did over a twenty year period. The numbers tell the story....

That is precisely what I'm saying, Karen. It's up to each individual to weigh the risks and benefits in their own contextual frame of reference. Most human beings have been blessed with some intelligence. Not to use it is what causes societies to fail. Everybody's life situation is different; hence a decision that is different from what you or I might make does not make the other person less intelligent or less worthy than us.

Miulang

[salmoned]

Re: Mandatory Medical Treatment

If news reports are facts, then by golly, our mission in Iraq was 'accomplished' years ago - why are we still there? Taking raw numbers of reports, without verifying their substance is meaningless. That 1,000 claims have been paid for vaccination injuries doesn't qualify as more than 'some', per se. 1,000 sounds like a lot by itself, perhaps, but not relative to the numbers receiving vaccinations. When that number is brought into the picture, 1,000 is much less than some - it becomes a rather small percentage.

I agree we each retain individual rights concerning our health care, just as we each chose to give-up some individual rights when we form governments. As vaccinations are not generally forced upon anyone, why be so adamant about the potential harm without addressing the potential benefit as well?

[Karen]

Re: Mandatory Medical Treatment

I didn't say ALL news reports are facts, now did I?

That door swings both ways, if NO news is fact, how does news thrive, why do most of us pay attention to it, to say the least, and discuss it here as if it is true? Furthermore, since most of us never meet any presidential candidates and even the few that do barely get a handshake how on earth do we choose who to vote for? Just by reading their printouts and what little they say on tv? Part of our choice is what we GASP......hear on the news.

You need what, ten thousand news reports on the adverse reactions of shots so that you can admit that at least, cough cough, some.......of them are true? Brace yourself, but news is full of facts and of course, just as there are dishonest people, etc...some news surely is distorted, etc.

Only the supposed good the shots do is all we've ever been told about, hence I have been "giving the other side" here. Why come here and spout the party line, singing to the choir and saying what we've been told about them all of our lives? Makes more sense to come here and report what we haven't been, in many instances "allowed" to know.


As I said, I can write a book here, report after report about the harm vaccines have done and about how every time we have an outbreak of any childhood disease, what does not make the news is that a good percentage of the kids that come down with it are FULLY immunized. It is questionable how well vaccinations work. In fact, for many healthy people when one weighs the good against the bad a person is much better off to let nature do it's job and not have any vaccinations.

A govt. that forces kids to have shots to go to school except for the few parents that know they can push back and their kids can attend without the shots, this is the govt. that now says kids need two, not one MMR...but the CDC's own words say that the second shot "is not a booster" verbatim their website says that, or did not two mos. ago. There are doctors that don't know this and the CDC has to tell them. this govt. that mandates the shots forces millions of kids to have a second MMR because a TINY "two to five percent" don't form immunity to the first, and the shots do harm to many, so sacrfice the many for the few? THAT is govt. in action. THAT is what doesn't make the news because they don't want to inform so many parents that compliance with the shots goes way down.

"Herd mentality" is the opposite of individual rights and freedoms. Speaking of news, and the accuracy or lack of in it, there is such a thing as "lies of ommission!" Yeah....how much of the news is true?

I can post here till christmas and be reporting more and more truth about vaccinations, their harm and the admitted lack of their efficacy.


HUGE website, called the National Vaccine Information center....surely they aren't so big that all 200,000 reports of adverse reactions are here, yet googling I had a page come up with ages, details of reactions, etc....very specific documentation.

http://www.nvic.org/

Oh great! this is live flu virus in a nasal mist....here's a small quote from that website...


"The fact that the FDA had to recently slap MedImmune on the hands after inspectors reportedly found excessive amounts of mold and bacteria during early stages of the production process of FluMist doesn't help. A September 10, 2007 Washington Post article said the company was cited for "significant deviations for current good manufacturing practice."
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/09/09/AR2007090901612.html?nav=rss_business"

rest of article on this page...

http://vaccineawakening.blogspot.com/

[Miulang]

Re: Mandatory Medical Treatment

The goal of public health people is to provide treatments to the largest number of people with the greatest efficiency. Sometimes, in protecting the majority of people, some people do get injured. But that is why informed consent (and the reason for all the fine print with contraindications, etc. are always included with meds) is provided so that people can determine for themselves whether a therapy is worth the risk.

With regard to thiomersal as a preservative in childhood vaccines, most drug companies, at the request of the feds, have started eliminating or dramatically reducing the amount of the preservative in their vaccines. And yet the number of autistic children has not dropped significantly since the changes. The numbers are still 1 in 6 children will be affected to some degree by autism. Therefore, the only conclusion a person can make is that if thiomersal was indeed a factor in autism, then there must be other causes as well, since the autism rate is unchanged. Children can die from whooping cough or diphtheria.

Miulang

[Karen]

Re: Mandatory Medical Treatment

I need to research the dates on how recently thimerosal has been greatly reduced in immunizations. I'm not clear on the date or dates that this has taken place while I knew that finally the consumers had been heard on it.

I don't understand your speaking in "future tense" when you say that the numbers are still 1 in 6 "will be" affected by autism. If you are referring to a group of kids that have developed autism since thimerosal was reduced then you would say "are being" affected by it. How can you say how many or how few "will be?" Is that number some "experts" predict or something?

There is no solid proof that the thimerosal was the culprit, not from what I've read. Therefore we have no reason to believe it was the "only" culprit even if it was part of.

We are slamming kids with more immunizations, as time passes and have some new ones, so that's new Combinations of things into them. What if, for example, it's one ingredient in the HIB, one ingredient in the chickenpox, combined with something in an old shot, possibly new recipe...etc. etc? Thimerosal may be part of it, not sure.

Is formaldehyde still allowed in at least one type of shot? I've read about more than thimerosal.

Yet another culprit is the shooting several of these into a young body at one time, AND directly into the bloodstream. the reason? CDC says that parents would be unlikely to go to the doc for as many visits as would be required to shoot that many shots, so they are given even 5 diseases at once, and way too many in one year, unlike what nature would ever throw at them in realistic settings, and the immune system to have to deal with, and on top of that the immune system confronts these things by way of a Natural route into the body, not by having this and foreign things like the preservatives shot directly into the bloodstream.

[cynsaligia]

Re: Mandatory Medical Treatment

hey, karen! no need to do more research! just read my previous posts more carefully! i had already given the answer to your question before you even asked it:

1999.

(what year did health organizations/vaccine manufacturers start initiatives to remove/reduce thimerosol in vaccines?)

Even though the risk of thimerosal is hypothetical, thimerosal began to be removed from childhood vaccines in 1999. The federal government, the American Academy of Pediatrics, and others agreed that thimerosal should be reduced and eliminated in vaccines as a precautionary measure. The FDA encouraged companies to comply with this recommendation. Currently, all routinely recommended vaccines manufactured for infants in the United States are either thimerosal-free or contain only trace amounts.

"We moved in this direction to address public concern and because it was feasible to eliminate mercury from vaccines," Midthun says. "We could eliminate thimerosal in vaccines as a way to reduce a child's total exposure to mercury, whereas other environmental sources of exposure are more difficult to eliminate."

additionally, as shown by a link i provided before, the institute of medicince found no link between mercury/thimerosol and autism:

"There is no convincing evidence of serious harm from the low doses of thimerosal in vaccines," says Karen Midthun, M.D., deputy director for medicine in the FDA's Center for Biologics Evaluation and Research (CBER). CBER regulates vaccines in the United States and works with the CDC and the NIH to study and monitor vaccine safety and effectiveness.

thirdly, the evironmental protection agency has been working with healthcare organizations to reduce the use of mercury in the healthcare setting in general, not just in vaccines, as shown by yet a third link i had previously provided.

check this nifty link to an fda/cber site (whoa! it's another government site!). it not only reiterates the stuff i've already provided governmental links with statistics and facts for before, but it nicely presents, in easy-to-read table form, thimerosol content in a myriad of vaccines. this site also provides a bibliography on reference material so y'all can research til the cows come home.

but guess what? many vaccines never ever had thimerosol and if they did, they've switched to thimerosol-free formulations or contain only trace amounts.

as for formaldehyde? well, looky looky! the website i provided above addresses that, too! must be just another day for US government in overseeing our medical affairs! *cheers*

additionally, this is what the children's hospital of philadelphia says (they provide a table of vaccines, too):

The average quantity of formaldehyde to which a young infant could be exposed at one time may be as high as 0.2 mg (see table below). This quantity of formaldehyde is considered to be safe for two reasons. First, formaldehyde is essential in human metabolism and is required for the synthesis of DNA and amino acids (the building blocks of protein). Therefore, all humans have detectable quantities of natural formaldehyde in their circulation (about 2.5 ug of formaldehyde per ml of blood). Assuming an average weight of a 2-month-old of 5 kg and an average blood volume of 85 ml per kg, the total quantity of formaldehyde found in an infant’s circulation would be about 1.1 mg — a value at least five-fold greater than that to which an infant would be exposed in vaccines. Second, quantities of formaldehyde at least 600–fold greater than that contained in vaccines have been given safely to animals.

in conjunction with comments by salmoned & miulang re risk from vaccination versus risk from the disease one is being vaccinated against:

from the cdc site i linked to earlier which compare the odds of contracting a more serious infection as a result of contracting the disease for which there is a vaccine/dying versus the chances of adverse effects from the vaccine to treat the disease:

Risk from Disease versus Risk from Vaccines

....

DISEASE
Measles
Pneumonia: 6 in 100
Encephalitis: 1 in 1,000
Death: 2 in 1,000

Rubella
Congenital Rubella Syndrome: 1 in 4 (if woman becomes infected early in pregnancy)

VACCINES
MMR
Encephalitis or severe allergic reaction:
1 in 1,000,000

Diphtheria, Tetanus, and Pertussis vs. DTap Vaccine
DISEASE
Diphtheria
Death: 1 in 20

Tetanus
Death: 2 in 10

Pertussis
Pneumonia: 1 in 8
Encephalitis: 1 in 20
Death: 1 in 1,500

VACCINES
DTaP
Continuous crying, then full recovery: 1 in 1000
Convulsions or shock, then full recovery: 1 in 14,000
Acute encephalopathy: 0-10.5 in 1,000,000
Death: None proven

if any future child i have is unvaccinated and contracts measles, she will have a 6 in 100 chance of contracting pneumonia; a 1 in 1,000 chance of contracting encephalitis, and a 2 in 1,000 chance of dying! conversely, same hypothetical child-o-mine will have a 1 in 1,000,000 chance of contracting encephalitis or having a severe allergic reaction as a result of the MMR vaccine which prevents from measles.

one in one thousand...versus one in one million...

i work in healthcare risk management, but i wouldn't need to have my job's skill set in order to know which choice is best for me and my child... if the powers that be make the HPV vaccine a requirement, sure! hey, it saves me money, protects my imaginary child, and is another form of pro-female legislation, which i would be happy to support. i'm just bummed i'm too old and "experienced" now for the HPV vaccine to have any real efficacy for me.

[Karen]

Re: Mandatory Medical Treatment

Hey back, Cyn! I found the date not two hours after I posted here....as for me not needing to do more research, you clearly need to research immunizations at least one-tenth what I have in the last more than 20yr, but nope, I won't cease mine. Always living, forever learning is my motto.

As I already stated, it most likely isn't thimerosal but a combination of the shots that causes autism, while one thing leaves little doubt and that is that it IS the shots that have caused dramatic increases in autism, childhood onset diabetes, cancers and asthmas, as well as the vogue new label, "ADD" being so rampant now.

Mercury isn't alone in this tragedy, but aluminum and formaldehyde are also still used in immunizations. They are mostly needed in vials of multi-dosage and single dose vials are reportedly being more widely used, and this is good news for consumers.

I'll post more damaging findings as time permits.

http://www.thinktwice.com/measles.htm

"Dr. med Martin Hirte writes on page 20 of his book 'Vaccination--Pro and Contra': "To create fear among parents to strengthen their motivation to vaccinate is an important part of the publicity used to promote vaccinations. A whole branch of research is examining the question: 'What level of fear needs to be created to appear as convincing as possible?'"---Dr Buchwald (The Decline of Tuberculosis despite "Protective" Vaccination by Dr. Gerhard Buchwald M.D. p104)

"Probably 20% of American children—one youngster in five--- suffers from "development disability". This is a stupefying figure…...... the primary cause of encephalitis...... is the childhood vaccination program. To be specific, a large proportion of the millions of US children and adults suffering from autism, seizures, mental retardation, hyperactivity, dyslexia, and other shoots or branches of the hydraheaded entity called "development disabilities", owe their disorders to one or another of the vaccines against childhood diseases."—Harris L. Coulter, Ph.D.

They say that if children are not vaccinated against measles millions of children could die during a measles epidemic. They know this is nonsense. What they are using is examples taken from developing countries with poor nutrition and poor immune function in which such epidemic death can occur. In the United States we would not see this because of better nutrition, better health facilities and better sanitation. In fact, most deaths seen when measles outbreaks occur in the United States occur either in children in which vaccination was contraindicated, the vaccine did not work or in children with chronic, immune-suppressing diseases. In fact, in most studies these children catching the measles or other childhood diseases have been either fully immunized or partially immunized. The big secret among "vaccinologists" is that anywhere from 20 to 50% of children are not resistant to the diseases for which they have been immunized. THE TRUTH BEHIND THE VACCINE COVER-UP By Russell Blaylock, M.D.

"A study by Ronne (Lancet, 5/5/85 1-5) showed that adults who had had natural measles with a rash had a decreased incidence of various cancers, including cervical. Another study showed that women are less likely to contract ovarian cancer if they have had mumps during childhood."--Dr Jayne Donegan


In view of the rarity of the disease (diptheria), the effective antibiotic treatment now available, the questionable effectiveness of the vaccine, the multimillion dollar annual cost of administering it, and the ever-present potential for harmful, long-term effects from this or any other vaccine, I consider continued mass immunization against diphtheria indefensible"---Dr Mendelsohn MD


"The BNF for 1985 states (page 385) that mumps and its complications are rarely serious. For this reason it goes on to suggest that there is little indication for the routine use of mumps vaccine."--Dr JK Anand (10/2001 BMJ)

"We concluded that the DPT shot causes a minimum of 12,000 cases of severe neurological damage every year, in addition to the 6000 deaths diagnosed as Sudden Infant Death Syndrome. The neurological damage includes juvenile-onset diabetes, so-called "congenital" blindness, deafness, mental retardation, autism, epilepsy, seizures, various kinds of paralyses and palsies, and other neurological disorders."--Harris Coulter Ph.D.

"Children younger than 14 are three times more likely to die or suffer adverse reactions after receiving hepatitis B vaccines than to catch the disease," ---- Jane. M. Orient, M.D.,

Up to 90% of the total decline in the death rate of children between 1860-1965 because of whooping cough, scarlet fever, diptheria, and measles occurred before the introduction of immunisations and antibiotics."---Dr Archie Kalokerinos, M.D.

All three children had different doctors. The little girl under Klenner's care was given 10,000 mg of vitamin C as a slow intravenous "push" with a 50 cc syringe every eight hours for the first 24 hours and then every 12 hours for two more doses. Following this she was given 1,000 mg of vitamin C every two hours by mouth. Klenner also notes that a 40,000-unit dose of antitoxin was injected into the little girl's abdomen. The other two children received the antitoxin as well, but they did not receive any vitamin C. They both died but Klenner's patient survived, later becoming a nurse. ......The incredible clinical success that Klenner had in treating diphtheria with vitamin C, along with early laboratory evidence looking at the interactions of vitamin C and diphtheria, clearly shows that diphtheria is a disease that can be readily cured with properly dosed and administered vitamin C. ---Vitamin C, Infectious Diseases, and Toxins: Curing the Incurable by Thomas E. Levy, M.D., J.D.

"A critical point which is never mentioned by those advocating mandatory vaccination of children is that children’s health has declined significantly since 1960 when vaccines began to be widely used. According to the National Health Interview Survey conducted annually by the National Center for Health Statistics since 1957, a shocking 31% of U.S. children today have a chronic health problem , 18% of children require special health care or related services and 6.7% of children have a significant disability due to a chronic physical or mental condition. Respiratory allergies, asthma and learning disabilities are the most common of these." Philip Incao, MD. ----Incao's Hepatitis B Vaccination Testimony

[cynsaligia]

Re: Mandatory Medical Treatment

naaaaaah, i don't need to do more research. as i said before, the fda, cdc, iom, who, the joint commission et al. have done more than enough research for me, and they've got scads more money, time, and personnel than i to put into continued research. i base my health/risk-related decisions on expert studies using real data and scientific method, not haphazard collection of (alarmist?) articles gleaned from the internet.

i only posted what i posted because of miulang's and salmoned's (albeit rhetorical) questions, in case they needed the numbers to back up their apparent opinions re vaccination, which mirror mine more than they mirror yours.

[Karen]

Re: Mandatory Medical Treatment

Nahhh, as I said before you don't want to be confused by FACTS you haven't already encountered. I do understand.

Just wait till I start posting the reports that are coming in on the adverse reactions to the very new HPV vaccine! Oh yes, it's still "experimenting" on folks, some deaths reported and many going to the hospital. don't have time to post it now but I just read at three sites, not only in the US but australia had a bunch go to hospital.

I'll get it posted at time permits, while I continue researching.

Try to not bury your head.....there's "experts" on both sides of this one, and the numbers tell the stories so far as documentation. I'll post more quotes by doctors of all kinds, as time permits. There's so much......so little time.