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  • Warning for photographers

    The following web pages reflect sites on Orkut.com / Google.com.

    The photos of my three young sons have been stolen from the internet.
    My wife is a photographer that had innocent pictures of our kids on a site called Flickr.com and earlier this year we found stolen images on a site called Orkut.com, owned by Google.

    Google has not removed the images despite requests to do so, and per their copyright policy instructions being followed exactly as they say to submit them. (www.google.com/orkut_dmca.html)


    This website, Orkut.com is in my opinion, a creepy, shady section of the world wide web.

    Copyright owner:
    Marina Miller / RedHeartPhoto.com


    If you know someone using Flickr.com to store family photos it might be something to look into...

    Regardless, thank you for your time.

    Jason James Miller

    - Father of three
    - angry
    - reaching out on behalf of others


    Found & Added to list and sent to Google Legal team on 9/1/07

    http://www.orkut.com/Album.aspx?uid=...72170152524181

    http://www.orkut.com/Profile.aspx?ui...32798125955043

    http://www.orkut.com/Profile.aspx?ui...52586839882524

    http://www.orkut.com/Profile.aspx?ui...32798125955043

    http://www.orkut.com/Profile.aspx?ui...85656897956912



    Found & Added to list and sent to Google Legal team on 8/29/07

    http://www.orkut.com/Profile.aspx?ui...03106817753507

    http://www.orkut.com/Community.aspx?cmm=27252735

    http://www.orkut.com/Profile.aspx?ui...52614165363545

    http://www.orkut.com/Community.aspx?cmm=36036830

    http://www.orkut.com/Community.aspx?cmm=34765451

    http://www.orkut.com/Community.aspx?cmm=36357924

    http://img3.orkut.com/images/milieu/...1/48732982.jpg



    Found & Added to list and sent to Google Legal team on 8/28/07

    http://www.orkut.com/Community.aspx?cmm=34989733

    http://www.orkut.com/Community.aspx?cmm=36012821

    http://www.orkut.com/Community.aspx?cmm=36052500

    http://www.orkut.com/Community.aspx?cmm=30626569

    http://www.orkut.com/Community.aspx?cmm=32041459

    http://www.orkut.com/Community.aspx?cmm=33467172

    http://www.orkut.com/Community.aspx?cmm=27004388

    http://www.orkut.com/Community.aspx?cmm=35317912

    http://www.orkut.com/Profile.aspx?ui...83057943534116

    http://www.orkut.com/Profile.aspx?ui...44276288672039

    http://www.orkut.com/Profile.aspx?ui...06905333097820

    http://www.orkut.com/Profile.aspx?ui...36404685782007



    Still online from original FEBRUARY 2007 Letter (Revised letter sent 8/27/07)

    http://www.orkut.com/Scrapbook.aspx?...84326602543529

    and who KNOWS what else since I started contacting these people… or have yet to discover!!
    Last edited by 808shows.com; September 5, 2007, 11:27 PM. Reason: text error
    808shows.com / 808PhotoVault.com / Hawaiian Express Records...

  • #2
    Re: Warning for photographers

    I don't post any photos that i don't want the whole world to see... that's just dealing with the internet, but for someone else to use your photo it's hard to stop

    what i do for my main portfolio is use a flash based viewer. i know it's not fool proof, but it does deter from stealing the image.
    website - http://www.brianhancock.com
    blog - http://blog.brianhancock.com

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Warning for photographers

      Bummer that this happened. And I'd be disappointed at the lack of response, as well, particularly since there's ostensibly a procedure for dealing with things like this.

      But, well, that's the downside to posting photos (or any content) on the internet. You have to weigh the benefits of the exposure or ability to share or interact with friends and strangers with the downsides of what some folks are going to do with it. If photography is your career, things get especially messy (since you want to share your work to get your name out there, but stolen images can devalue them). And photos of kids and family? A very, very tricky area. A lot of folks have a strict policy of never putting photos of their children online. And they've got very sound reasons for doing so.

      I've posted personal photos online for about as long as you've been able to, and of course generate more than my share of other stuff on the web. So I've had my kids pictures used to make fake mom profiles on Friendster, I've had images of my pregnant wife show up on ... sites of ill repute, I've had inappropriate comments turn up on photos, videos, and stories featuring my loved ones. And yes, sometimes its affected other people, not just me.

      And I've definitely had some of my photos taken and used in publications and on websites with no credit, authorization... and much of the time, they add insult to injury by serving said images from my server! If you're going to steal my photos, at least don't steal my bandwidth.

      A lot of people simply don't see anything wrong with using stuff they find online. It's right there for the taking, after all, and it's perfect for whatever project or website or profile they're working on. I wouldn't have posted it if I didn't want other people to see and use it, right? I find ignorance just as frequent a cause as malicious intent.

      On the other hand, I've never been a fan of watermarking, or Javascript hacks, or other ways of "locking down" my stuff. Information wants to be free, and if someone wants my web content bad enough, they'll get it. They might even try harder to if they get the feeling I'm trying to stop them. (People are weird that way.) Basically if it's something I want control over, I don't post it on the web at all.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Warning for photographers

        I put a watermark on all of my photos, but now I'll have to step it up a bit.

        (and I'll do what I say, by not steal anyone else's photos w/out their permission)
        How'd I get so white and nerdy?

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Warning for photographers

          Does it help to have an online photo album passworded?
          Aloha,
          Mokihana

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Warning for photographers

            I think it does, as long as you don't give your password out. For me I maintain a few private albums on Kodak Gallery and Picassa. All password protection. If I want someone to look at said photos, I must be on the computer with them because I only log in and they can look while I am there. Otherwise I don't give the password out, because once it's out there, then it could be passed on to someone else to see and possibly take the photos and use them someplace else.

            For the photos I have posted publicly, most are taken in public places of mainly objects or a few candid public shots. Most are also uploaded to sites not in their highest resolution, but instead all dumbed down to generally web only resolution so that if they want to steal them and use em in a print publication, they may get less than satisfying results.

            I've had a few of my photos taken without my authorization and published to other websites that I don't approve on, most recently a photo that for some reason ended up on the MidWeek website in one of the columns. I haven't complained about it; I probably should.... but then I think it may have been lifted from the BuzzNet site where I think the licensing is creative commons... but still MidWeek is a for profit business.

            Most of the times people have asked me to use photos and in most cases I have granted it.
            I'm still here. Are you?

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Warning for photographers

              A couple of years ago I had photos of me and my competitor/friend (we gave seminars together at the time) lifted from my site and placed on the site of a nere-do-well in our local film industry. He proceeded to volunteer our services as industry professionals to people who could help his pocketbook. Then he lifted my film credits and listed them under both my name and my competitor's name on his aforementioned site. He never once discussed any of his intentions with the 2 of us. We found out when a friend called me to ask if I'd really consented to be a volunteer for a guy who has such a lousy reputation. Oooowheeeee, baby...hell hath no fury like a tutu scorned! I usually have a very long fuse but I instantly became a pit bull...for days! <wave to Lika Nui!!!>

              A couple of weeks ago I received an email from a local entertainer saying that some of his web site's photos (of him) were recently found on porn sites and he just wanted all of us to know that he had nothing to do with it!

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Warning for photographers

                How do you know if the photos have been kakaroached? I mean, if you don't happen to see them on other sites, how do you know?
                Aloha,
                Mokihana

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Warning for photographers

                  There's a lot of valid comments up there, but what continues to astound me is the fact that I'm talking about stuff that is being HOSTED by GOOGLE.COM and I have alerted them to the fact but they have done nothing.

                  Sure, photos can be at risk online... but if it's taken without permission, and the owner is asking for resolution... is it too much to ask from a major American company that action be taken?

                  We had friends alert us to the fact, and now the jig is up... but I have been met with a lack of response by Google and outright defiance and foul language from the perpitraitors in south america. Some have even blocked me from contacting them, and all i had sent to them were some completely polite requests that they simply stop showing photos of my 3 young boys.

                  to me, this is absurd and I'm doing my part to speak up, not just shrug my shoulders... it's a GOOGLE-owned company and i have followed their procedures for copyright issues... only to be ignored!
                  Last edited by 808shows.com; September 6, 2007, 09:16 PM. Reason: typo
                  808shows.com / 808PhotoVault.com / Hawaiian Express Records...

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Warning for photographers

                    Originally posted by 808shows.com View Post
                    There's a lot of valid comments up there, but what continues to astound me is the fact that I'm talking about stuff that is being HOSTED by GOOGLE.COM and I have alerted them to the fact but they have done nothing.
                    How have you alerted them? Just a normal email, or by a take-down copyright violation notice?

                    To everyone: How does watermarking help? If I understand it right, it only proves that it's yours when it's analyzed. It doesn't stand out.

                    Has anyone thought about labeling the photos? Such as along the bottom edge? Granted, it can be cropped, but it's more work. And it will show if it's being pulled from another server.

                    As for bandwidth-stealers, there's ways of dealing with that. I don't know the details, but it may be the server won't allow the download unless that IP address as also requested the html. People who try to steal the bandwidth, just ends up with blanks on their pages.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Warning for photographers

                      Originally posted by Mokihana View Post
                      How do you know if the photos have been kakaroached? I mean, if you don't happen to see them on other sites, how do you know?
                      Well, if they're stupid, then they would hotlink it from your site (like how some people did with me). I look at my web stats every couple of weeks and I've seen a few images at sites I didn't originally post it at. I've solved that by replacing the image with image text that says "image stealer" and shows the proper address to view the pictures.
                      How'd I get so white and nerdy?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Warning for photographers

                        Originally posted by GeckoGeek View Post
                        Has anyone thought about labeling the photos? Such as along the bottom edge? Granted, it can be cropped, but it's more work. And it will show if it's being pulled from another server.
                        I put the regular copyright info in one of the corners, but I also put a small copyright text somewhere in the middle. Although, it doesn't work when you have a small image.
                        How'd I get so white and nerdy?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Warning for photographers

                          Originally posted by adrian View Post
                          Well, if they're stupid, then they would hotlink it from your site (like how some people did with me). I look at my web stats every couple of weeks and I've seen a few images at sites I didn't originally post it at. I've solved that by replacing the image with image text that says "image stealer" and shows the proper address to view the pictures.
                          Well....with the artists I know if they find someone hotlinking to one of their pieces they swap out the pic for something like the goatse guy, or the tubgirl image.


                          For 808shows it sounds like you'll have to get a lawyer to contact google to get anything done.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Warning for photographers

                            Originally posted by GeckoGeek View Post
                            How have you alerted them? Just a normal email, or by a take-down copyright violation notice?

                            To everyone: How does watermarking help? If I understand it right, it only proves that it's yours when it's analyzed. It doesn't stand out.

                            Has anyone thought about labeling the photos? Such as along the bottom edge? Granted, it can be cropped, but it's more work. And it will show if it's being pulled from another server.

                            As for bandwidth-stealers, there's ways of dealing with that. I don't know the details, but it may be the server won't allow the download unless that IP address as also requested the html. People who try to steal the bandwidth, just ends up with blanks on their pages.

                            I have sent emails to Google, I have made calls to Google, I have used the "help" forums on Orkut.com, and I have submitted the Copyright violation information that they ask for at www.google.com/orkut_dmca.html pretty much every other day since August 27th, and I have contacted the theives directly. They respond with foul language and block me from contacting them. It's absurd. But at least they respond! I can't say the same for google.

                            My wife did call a law office that specializes in copyright law, but they wanted $300 per hour to even start a conversation, and we simply don't have that kind of money t our disposal so we've had to continue to ask Google to reply to our messages.

                            To date, no reply of any kind. Again, we know that photos can be at risk online (and you can bet that pictures will not be available again in the future) but these stolen photos have been discovered and we've done what we've been asked to do but Google is doing nothing about it, and that's just not right.
                            808shows.com / 808PhotoVault.com / Hawaiian Express Records...

                            Comment

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