Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Aloha Air files bankruptcy, again

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #76
    Re: Aloha Air files bankruptcy, again

    Originally posted by joshuatree View Post
    By the way, am I the only one here who thinks Banmiller is a jerk on simply just dropping the bomb with little time for people to react and prepare? So much for family within Aloha. As CEO he knew when the call was being made. And if you want a refund, they tell you to take it up with bankruptcy court. What is his severance package? Because Aloha is private, we may never know. More reason I don't support throwing public money into this basket case.
    You're not alone here. The abruptness of it all is a telling story. Financially Aloha airlines had enough working capital for just one more day of service but he decided to pull the plug early. Why? Maybe it's his golden parachute.

    If he knew he had only one day left why did he wait two days before to decide to do what he did. Even if Lingle could have pulled that rabbit out of her magical hat, his bean counters should have known that leniency on the part of the bancruptcy court judge would be virtually non-existant. Where was his contingency plan? If he couldn't forcast a day in advance of their operational status, I can see why Aloha died the way it did. As if he knew Aloha had a finality and played it up all the way to the end.

    He blames the competition but never named go! as the means of Aloha's demise. If that's the case then how did Hawaiian seem to come out smelling like a rose, even adding flights and leasing larger jets?

    Questions questions questions. But in the end I believe it was Banmiller's lack of ability that led Aloha down the trail of disaster. The economy and go! simply prodded Aloha along.

    And it will come to pass that Banmiller was a lousy CEO when all the facts come out. Did you see his reaction to an Aloha Airlines employee's questions? He just brushed her off like a bug on a windshield.
    Life is what you make of it...so please read the instructions carefully.

    Comment


    • #77
      Re: Aloha Air files bankruptcy, again

      Crossposting - with TV memories

      I wonder what Aloha Airlines pilot Tasha Kobashigawa will be doing now?

      Comment


      • #78
        Re: Aloha Air files bankruptcy, again

        Originally posted by cynsaligia View Post
        hmm. so the legislature is all gung ho to exempt one airline out of three from GET when, should that airline fail, the others can pick up the slack?

        yet the legislature laughs long and hard when a hospital (that serves a patient population that is 70% medicare/medicaid/non paying patients, compared to 50% or less in other hospitals) asks for the same thing? and they wipe away tears of laughter knowing if that hospital fails, the remaining medical organizations cannot make up the several hundred beds that will suddenly disappear, nor will they take over the only ER on the ewa plain?
        Silly girl, how much have the hospitals and health care unions been donating to political campaigns?

        Seriously, yeah, that sucks. <sigh> The best government that money can buy.

        Comment


        • #79
          Re: Aloha Air files bankruptcy, again

          Originally posted by craigwatanabe View Post
          Financially Aloha airlines had enough working capital for just one more day of service but he decided to pull the plug early. Why?
          I think the timing has to do with the start of the month. New month = more bills to be paid.


          I'll have to dig just a bit, but I blame the whole thing on Mesa. Why? If you look up the airline's estimated cost for a passenger seat, you'll see that Mesa has the highest costs. But who's been driving the low ticket prices - at a loss? Mesa intended to run Aloha out of business and they've succeeded. They had the deep pockets to do so.

          Granted, Aloha's admins isn't a stunning example of good management. But that all just made Aloha rather then Hawaiian the more venerable one.

          I think if we look back to before Go!'s entry, Hawaiian had no plans to lower the ticket prices to run Aloha out of business. The other factors, like fuel would have affected them both.

          Comment


          • #80
            Re: Aloha Air files bankruptcy, again

            Originally posted by craigwatanabe View Post
            You're not alone here. The abruptness of it all is a telling story. Financially Aloha airlines had enough working capital for just one more day of service but he decided to pull the plug early. Why? Maybe it's his golden parachute.

            If he knew he had only one day left why did he wait two days before to decide to do what he did. Even if Lingle could have pulled that rabbit out of her magical hat, his bean counters should have known that leniency on the part of the bancruptcy court judge would be virtually non-existant. Where was his contingency plan? If he couldn't forcast a day in advance of their operational status, I can see why Aloha died the way it did. As if he knew Aloha had a finality and played it up all the way to the end.

            He blames the competition but never named go! as the means of Aloha's demise. If that's the case then how did Hawaiian seem to come out smelling like a rose, even adding flights and leasing larger jets?

            Questions questions questions. But in the end I believe it was Banmiller's lack of ability that led Aloha down the trail of disaster. The economy and go! simply prodded Aloha along.

            And it will come to pass that Banmiller was a lousy CEO when all the facts come out. Did you see his reaction to an Aloha Airlines employee's questions? He just brushed her off like a bug on a windshield.

            Quoting article:

            David Banmiller, president and chief executive of Aloha, said the airline nearly went under five times during the last three years and that up until Sunday -- the day it announced the shutdown -- he was trying to work a deal to keep the carrier alive.

            But he said that after talking to the CEOs of five airlines and potential hedge-fund investors over a period of months, as well as Lingle and lawmakers two weeks ago, he had exhausted all options. The airline was at a point that it would be unable to financially make it through this week.


            This guy knew how shakey the company was for the last three years and told nothing to his employees. Way to go. Did he even take a paycut as a symbolic gesture during the last three years?

            UBS announced they lost $12 billion dollars today and one of the first things that happened? The CEO resigned. Why did this never happen with Aloha during the last bankruptcy? I think if Aloha had a different CEO three years ago, it wouldn't have to end like this. Come to think of it, every airline Banmiller was in charge all died.

            Comment


            • #81
              Re: Aloha Air files bankruptcy, again

              Originally posted by timkona View Post
              Union labor prices don't help either. Is go! union?
              Which part? Some of their employees are unionized, some are not.
              Originally posted by joshuatree View Post
              Come to think of it, every airline Banmiller was in charge all died.
              Not quite - Air Jamaica & Sun Country are still around, and he was part of the turn-around team for the latter, post-bankruptcy.
              Last edited by Leo Lakio; April 1, 2008, 06:39 AM.

              Comment


              • #82
                Re: Aloha Air files bankruptcy, again

                Originally posted by joshuatree View Post
                This guy knew how shakey the company was for the last three years and told nothing to his employees. Way to go.
                What would that have accomplished? Wouldn't that just encourage Mesa letting them know just how close they were to their goal? Wasn't part of the game to stay alive hoping that Mesa would bleed too much and bail (or at least raise prices)?

                Also, wouldn't that just scare people away making it a self-fulling prophesy?

                Comment


                • #83
                  Re: Aloha Air files bankruptcy, again

                  Originally posted by Leo Lakio View Post
                  Which part? Some of their employees are unionized, some are not.Not quite - Air Jamaica & Sun Country are still around, and he was part of the turn-around team for the latter, post-bankruptcy.
                  Air Jamaica he wasn't CEO and for Sun Country, they actually did close under Banmiller and was later revived by a group of investors.

                  Maybe Aloha will get an investor now that it has closed it's pax portion. Who knows, but it sure seems Banmiller is really good at shutting down airlines rather than growing them.

                  Comment


                  • #84
                    Re: Aloha Air files bankruptcy, again

                    Originally posted by craigwatanabe View Post
                    Thank God Hawaiian has a decent air cargo set up. When I worked for the Gas Company, I preferred Hawaiian's air cargo facility at HNL. I used to ship out so much stuff, the guys there gave me the shipping forms (had to sign out for the number series) and the colored island destination tags so I could fill out the forms and tag the parcels ahead of time.
                    This is the first I have heard of a “facility.” My understanding is that Pacific Wings is the next best thing to Aloha Air Cargo, and they are very humbug. Isn’t Hawaiian’s cargo division only “counter-to-counter” (limited hours/days, slow turnaround time, no accounts kept so must pay cash, etc.)? The point of shipping something via plane is timeliness. Otherwise, you can ship via boat, U.S. Mail/UPS/DHL/FedEX, etc. Aloha Air Cargo is the only outfit I know of that can get something from island to island on a Saturday within an hour or two after being shipped.

                    We can’t be so fixated on our desire to preserve the rights of ordinary Americans.

                    — U.S. President Bill Clinton
                    USA TODAY, page 2A
                    11 March 1993

                    Comment


                    • #85
                      Re: Aloha Air files bankruptcy, again

                      Originally posted by joshuatree View Post
                      Air Jamaica he wasn't CEO and for Sun Country, they actually did close under Banmiller and was later revived by a group of investors.
                      He was COO at Air Jamaica, certainly a big part of the leadership team.

                      At Sun Country, he became CEO in Sep. 2001, when the family that owned the airline put it up for sale. No investors were found (you may recall that the economy in the US was a bit rattled in Sep. 2001 by a little event that had a dramatic effect on all airlines) and they filed for bankruptcy in Dec. 2001, under pressure from creditors.

                      Investors came on board in Feb. 2002, and he left the airline in May 2002. You can't really say "the airline he was in charge of died" in this case; filing for bankruptcy doesn't accurately fit that description, especially since he was instrumental in finding new buyers.

                      But my point is that saying:
                      every airline Banmiller was in charge all died
                      is an over-simplification. It's all semantics, though, and I get your point - his track record ain't exactly golden.
                      Last edited by Leo Lakio; April 1, 2008, 08:01 AM.

                      Comment


                      • #86
                        Re: Aloha Air files bankruptcy, again

                        Originally posted by Leo Lakio View Post
                        But my point is that saying:is an over-simplification. It's all semantics, though, and I get your point - his track record ain't exactly golden.
                        I stand corrected on some of the details but yes, just seems like he's the grim reaper of airlines.

                        Comment


                        • #87
                          Re: Aloha Air files bankruptcy, again

                          Originally posted by TuNnL View Post
                          This is the first I have heard of a “facility.” My understanding is that Pacific Wings is the next best thing to Aloha Air Cargo, and they are very humbug. Isn’t Hawaiian’s cargo division only “counter-to-counter” (limited hours/days, slow turnaround time, no accounts kept so must pay cash, etc.)? The point of shipping something via plane is timeliness. Otherwise, you can ship via boat, U.S. Mail/UPS/DHL/FedEX, etc. Aloha Air Cargo is the only outfit I know of that can get something from island to island on a Saturday within an hour or two after being shipped.
                          Hawaiian Air Cargo has a Jet Express which allowed "next flight availabilty" status on outbound goods from pouch to pallatized material.

                          Once I had to Jet Express 50 commercial sized gas meters to Hilo from Honolulu. Basically five full pallets, five feet high on the next available flight out. I brought everything down by 10:30am, and it was received in Hilo by 12:30 that afternoon and that included drop off to the cargo facility to receiving in The Gas Company's warehouse in Hilo.

                          I've had items delivered to Hawaiian Air Cargo and by the time I got back to the the shop to call Hilo to confirm the outbound shipment, Joe at the Hilo warehouse tells me he got it already (damned traffic from the Airport to Kakaako). HAL beat me.

                          Hawaiian does keep accounts. But they won't accept walk in cargo. You must have a standing P.O. with them (ever since 9-11).

                          Granted Aloha did weekend cargo service, however when I had a farm business here in Hilo delivering live plant material to points all over Oahu and the mainland, I relied on FedEx. They have a mutual agreement here in Hilo with some of the growers co-ops to deliver at a discount door to door.
                          Life is what you make of it...so please read the instructions carefully.

                          Comment


                          • #88
                            Re: Aloha Air files bankruptcy, again

                            Did any of you see that most recent post from TalkStink?

                            I clicked on that go! link. Now I have to wash my eyes out and say the Rosary. Shoulda known NSFW really meant NSFW!
                            Tessie, "Nuf Ced" McGreevey shouted
                            We're not here to mess around
                            Boston, you know we love you madly
                            Hear the crowd roar to your sound
                            Don't blame us if we ever doubt you
                            You know we couldn't live without you
                            Tessie, you are the only only only

                            Comment


                            • #89
                              Re: Aloha Air files bankruptcy, again

                              so, i received a letter from fhb regarding their upgrading clients' credit cards to the priority card. my understanding is that the accrued mileage from aloha, or points, will not transfer over to the new card. but, when your first purchase is made, you will get 10000 points immediately--good enough for one interisland round-trip ticket.
                              "chaos reigns within.
                              reflect, repent and reboot.
                              order shall return."

                              microsoft error message with haiku poetry

                              Comment


                              • #90
                                Re: Aloha Air files bankruptcy, again

                                So here we go Banmiller is blaming go! for up to $75M in losses but more than $70M from rising fuel costs.

                                Coming out of bancruptcy three years ago, Aloha was slated to bring in $25M in revenue.

                                So even if go! hadn't entered the local airline market, they would still have folded because of the rising fuel costs alone.

                                From today's Star Bulletin:

                                Banmiller said Mesa's below-cost pricing "was a clear attempt to destroy this company."

                                "That has cost this company $60 (million) to $75 million annually, and we proposed making $25 million when we came out of bankruptcy (in February 2006)," he said.

                                Banmiller also said that because of soaring oil prices, the airline now has an additional $71 million in annual fuel expenses that it did not have two years ago when it emerged from its first bankruptcy.

                                Aloha attorney Paul Singerman told Judge King that Aloha had lost $125 million since its first bankruptcy in February 2006 and lost money every month in 2007, en route to $81 million in losses for the year. He said Aloha had $1.7 million in cash as of yesterday and that it costs $1.5 million a day to operate the airline.


                                Aloha would've gone broke with or without go! So what happens to the remaining assets? How much is Banmiller going to get as his exit fee?

                                Remember it wasn't only go! that reduced their rates, Hawaiian did as well with bigger jets. Talk about fuel costs, Hawaiian managed to come out pretty good, why couldn't Aloha? It all comes down to bad management and Banmiller's past performance IS indicative of that.

                                Bottom line, Hawaiian did good, Banmiller F*CKED UP.
                                Life is what you make of it...so please read the instructions carefully.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X