Jazz Fusion

[Pomai]

Wow. I was surfing around YouTube for stuff, and stumbled upon this classic video (VIDEO!) of Return to Forever playing the Sorceress (circa 1976). Awesome!

Most folks probably don't know that Phil Collins (solo artist, Genesis) has deep roots in Jazz Fusion with the band, Brand X.

I know it's a limited, specialized genre, but of those, Which Jazz Fusion band(s) is/are your favorite(s)? RTF? Weather Report? Mahavishnu? Dixie Dregs? Other?

[Ron Whitfield]

Re: Jazz Fusion

I've been into Brand X from the get go, and they are deffinitely one of the all time best at the genre.

The other bands mentioned can be found 'in concert' in varying amounts at www.wolfgangsvault.com with lot's of killer MO.

I love The Mahavishnu Orchestra, but Jan Hammer's squidling on various keyboards is annoying as all heck. Ruins what could be stunning. The band tends to wear me out just listening.

Saw RTF with Jaco and then Stanley. Way over my head at the time, but the rythym sections were awesome.

Never saw The Dregs, but did see Steve Morse open and then again join DiMiola/McLaughlin/DeLucia at the end of thier show at The Shell years ago.
Morse owned the stage that night. After an hour and a half by the headliners, which put me to sleep, Morse was invited back out for a 5 min. 'encore', and completely blew the rest off the stage. Not even close. Morse is a relatively famous guitarist, but just doesn't get much attention, even in the G-rags. Of course, his many years now as G-man for Deep Purple has kept him off most peoples radar, but everything he does is excellant.

But, my all-time favorite bone crunching 'prog' band is King Crimson, from thier incept in '68/9 to '74. Nothing competes with them on any level. They cover the hardest stuff along with the etherally sublime with equall aplomb and visceral nastiness. Greg Lake's voice and bass playing was in stunning display on stage and can be enjoyed at the WV site from shows at The Fillmore's in '69. No less an authority on such at the time was Pete Townsend, whom declared KC as "the most incredible music machine I've ever witnessed".

[scrivener]

Re: Jazz Fusion

Now we are blurring the lines between fusion and prog. I never considered the Dregs a fusion band; since I am a prog head (we should make a prog appreciation thread!), I always considered them prog. And King Crimson, while undoubtedly a jazzy experimental band, are still solidly a rock and roll band, making them also prog.

For fusion, I've always liked Chick Corea Elektric Band collectively and most stuff by its members individually. I also dig Jeff Berlin, Steps Ahead, Manteca, Vital Information, and Special EFX. On days when I'm feeling especially honest, I'll admit I also like David Benoit. And we can't forget Miles, the inventor of the form.

[Ron Whitfield]

Re: Jazz Fusion

Overall, I agree, but the lines were blurred and discussed a long time ago, like 'in the day'. To disect the intricate moments when one band is and then isn't fusion or prog will never come to an end, as they often overlap an diverge into areas with no label. I gave up on being a purist long ago and just enjoy listening to what I like, and most 'fusion' leaves me wanting to put on some more KC or something that kicks some butt without being SO smart. Most 'fusion' tends to lack sufficient heart, soul, and balls for me. But, maybe that's what defines 'fusion'.

[scrivener]

Re: Jazz Fusion

I just want to add that as awesome as Steve Morse is, I think he's the wrong guy for Deep Purple. And if there's only one reason to listen to the Dregs, it's Rod Morgenstein, one of my favorite favorite favorite drummers. Have you heard the stuff he's done with Platypus and The Jelly Jam (both with Ty Tabor of King's X)? Amazing.

[Ron Whitfield]

Re: Jazz Fusion

No, and thanx for suggesting them. If I ever have time and inclination to further explore those routes, I'll check them out. But, I'm into other types of music, mainly old Hawaiian with steel guitar, and furthering my education on the steel to get around to listening to the heavy stuff these day's, and having the lessening opportunities to crank it leaves me rather frustrated when wanting that fix, and headphones get irritating.
The good and bad of today's music, is there is too much for me to digest, let alone fully process til I really get into them, and there are too few that hit home today.
I find The Mars Volta to be interesting/promising.

I've not heard a lick from the Morse/Purple efforts, but heard good reviews. Hard for me to accept anybody but Ritchie smokin' on that DP Strat tho.
Thier Mark II redux show at Blaisdell Arena was awesome!

Glad to know there is a kindred progger in the house!

[scrivener]

Re: Jazz Fusion

Aw man, I can't believe I left out Hiroshima and Spyro Gyra.

[Ron Whitfield]

Re: Jazz Fusion

Me too. Yer slippin'!

Rock on, dude!

[tutusue]

Re: Jazz Fusion

Aw man, I can't believe I left out Hiroshima and Spyro Gyra.

Two of my all time faves!

A curiosity question...
While I'm very familiar with the above 2 bands, Chick Correa and David Benoit, the others mentioned in this thread are completely foreign to me. Possibly I don't know the correct definition of "jazz fusion"? Someone please enlighten me. Oh wait, I'll hele on over to wikipedia............

Aha...that's what I thought it was! I'll check iTunes for those groups that are unfamiliar. I always love finding new tunes that give me chickenskin!

I've heard Miles Davis, who is great imnsho, in the straight ahead and avant garde genres; the latter being my least favorite. Scriv, what Davis tunes do you consider jazz fusion? I wanna listen to them.

Speaking of Miles Davis...I saw him at the Shell during the 80s. He played the entire time with his back to the audience. I later learned that was more the rule than the exception. That was also the time he played almost entirely avant garde. I was told by a jazz musician that it was easier to spontaneously create the music without the sensory input of the audience. Dunno if that held true for Davis, however. Still, was interesting to see someone play that way.

[scrivener]

Re: Jazz Fusion

I think the definitive fusion album is Miles's Bitches Brew, 'though I'm no expert. That's always just been sorta the landmark for me.

[Da Rolling Eye]

Re: Jazz Fusion

A curiosity question...
While I'm very familiar with the above 2 bands, Chick Correa and David Benoit, the others mentioned in this thread are completely foreign to me. Possibly I don't know the correct definition of "jazz fusion"? Someone please enlighten me. Oh wait, I'll hele on over to wikipedia............

Aha...that's what I thought it was! I'll check iTunes for those groups that are unfamiliar. I always love finding new tunes that give me chickenskin!

No worries, Tutu. I just listen to what I like. Some already mentioned and to include The Rippingtons, Kilauea, Acoustic Alchemy, Dan Siegel, Earl Klugh and a few others. Don't know how many of my list is "fusion". I simply find the music conducive to most of the physical activities I take part in or just doing nothing at all.

[tutusue]

Re: Jazz Fusion

I'm familiar with all the bands you listed, DRE. You and I have the same taste in music! And, yes, I too listen to what I like, regardless of the genre. It just happens that the majority of what I like falls under "jazz". Like father, like daughter! I must've gotten the jazz gene!

[LikaNui]

Re: Jazz Fusion

Weather Report, for sure!
(And not just because Joe Zawinul was a friend and neighbor, back in the day. Sitting in his home studio and listening to rehearsals was a blessing beyond words.)

[Leo Lakio]

Re: Jazz Fusion

Saw RTF with Jaco and then Stanley.

I believe you're showing your age, my friend - TTBOMK, Jaco Pastorius never toured or recorded with Return To Forever; he replaced Alphonso Johnson in Weather Report. Stanley Clarke was the only bassist for RTF; one reason often cited for disbanding was Chick Corea's displeasure with Clarke leaving the Church of Scientology.

While I'm very familiar with the above 2 bands, Chick Correa and David Benoit, the others mentioned in this thread are completely foreign to me.

Based on your enjoyment of Hiroshima & Spyro Gyra, Sue, you would definitely like David Benoit. (Some of Chick Corea's material might be a bit farther out than your tastes, however.) He's got ties to Hawai`i as well.

Speaking of Miles Davis...I saw him at the Shell during the 80s. He played the entire time with his back to the audience. I later learned that was more the rule than the exception.

There is a classic joke in the jazz world, about a musician who dies and goes to heaven. St. Peter meets him and gives him a tour of the place, finishing up with heaven's jazz club, featuring all the great players of the past - Duke Ellington's at the piano, Gene Krupa's playing drums, etc. The recently-deceased player is ecstatic, but asks St. Peter about the old, bearded trumpet player with his back to them, a guy he doesn't recognize. St. Peter responds: "Oh, that's just God; he thinks he's Miles Davis."

The Rippingtons, Kilauea, Acoustic Alchemy, Dan Siegel, Earl Klugh

Now you're talking more recent "smooth jazz" artists, a sound that definitely evolved from fusion. Fusion took a lot of its instrumentation and sonic structure from the rock world and placed the musical structure of jazz into it, using modern recording and playing techniques, but leaving wide room for improvisation. Smooth jazz is more of an instrumental pop, with a pop song's melodic framework overall. (Not denigrating the style by any means - I like it all and know it very well; I was a jazz DJ from 1977-1984, in the heart of the "fusion" years, and I programmed "smooth jazz" from 1996-2007.) Kilauea, as the name might suggest, also has a connection to Hawai`i, in that its leader was Daniel Ho.

Weather Report, for sure!

I think they might be at the top of my list as well. Sad to see Zawinul's passing last September, and of course, Jaco's tragic death back in 1987.

[tutusue]

Re: Jazz Fusion

[...]Based on your enjoyment of Hiroshima & Spyro Gyra, Sue, you would definitely like David Benoit. (Some of Chick Corea's material might be a bit farther out than your tastes, however.) He's got ties to Hawai`i as well.

As I mentioned above in a poorly constructed sentence () I am familiar with both Benoit and Corea. Both reside on my iPod. Yes, I know, it's a HUGE ipod! IIRC, I saw Corea at the same concert where I saw Davis. Come to think of it...I think they played at least one song together. By the time this thread is dead and buried I'll probably remember more about that incredible concert!

Loved the Miles Davis joke, btw!!!

[...]Now you're talking more recent "smooth jazz" artists, a sound that definitely evolved from fusion. Fusion took a lot of its instrumentation and sonic structure from the rock world and placed the musical structure of jazz into it, using modern recording and playing techniques, but leaving wide room for improvisation. [...]

Ok, now this is making more sense to me! From Wikipedia..."Although the meaning of 'fusion' became confused with the advent of 'smooth jazz'...". I, too, consider many of the above mentioned bands to be smooth jazz. Bottom line is...if I like it, I like it! Makes no difference to me what it's called or what category it falls into. It's still an interesting subject, tho'.