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  • Gays in the Armed Forces

    Starting with this quote, lifted from a thread about the bailout plans (where it was already off topic), I thought I'd give it its own home for further discussion...
    Originally posted by Bobinator View Post
    Getting rid of the "Don't ask, don't tell" policy in the military ... is a ton of dismanteling, I'd say.
    So, who wants to be first to tell us why they think its such a morally abhorrent idea to allow homosexuals in the U.S. military? Bobinator? The floor is open to you...

  • #2
    Re: Gays in the Armed Forces

    ...as tho they havn't been there all along and served well, like any other service personel. As is the usual case in the ranks, if someone get's out of line, there's someone waiting to straighten them out.
    Case in point, 2 guy's are caught together in the barracks, catch whoopin's from fellow soldiers, Sargent comes out and barks WTF?!, hears the explanation, say's "carry on"...
    https://www.facebook.com/Bobby-Ingan...5875444640256/

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    • #3
      Re: Gays in the Armed Forces

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRQRbkqlgDQ
      Twitter: LookMaICanWrite


      flickr

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      • #4
        Re: Gays in the Armed Forces

        My biggest concern with gays in the military is that they will go into battle with purse and high heels that don't match.
        Peace, Love, and Local Grindz

        People who form FIRM opinions with so little knowledge only pretend to be open-minded. They select their facts like food from a buffet. David R. Dow

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        • #5
          Re: Gays in the Armed Forces

          Originally posted by Ron Whitfield View Post
          Case in point, 2 guy's are caught together in the barracks, catch whoopin's from fellow soldiers, Sargent comes out and barks WTF?!, hears the explanation, say's "carry on"...
          whoopin aint such a bad idea...i prefer mines with a little....oh never mind

          Originally posted by Mike_Lowery View Post
          he rocks!!!

          Originally posted by matapule View Post
          My biggest concern with gays in the military is that they will go into battle with purse and high heels that don't match.
          lol

          Originally posted by Leo Lakio View Post
          So, who wants to be first to tell us why they think its such a morally abhorrent idea to allow homosexuals in the U.S. military? Bobinator? The floor is open to you...
          *chuckles*
          Last edited by Seeking Penance; February 19, 2009, 07:31 PM. Reason: cackles
          stay forever young

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          • #6
            Re: Gays in the Armed Forces

            I remember when "don't ask, don't tell" was a hot button issue, the folks I knew who were the most adamant about keeping gays out were all members of the armed forces or had family members serving.

            Not surprising, really. The US military establishment has always dragged its feet and struggled to keep up with civilian society when it came to social enlightenment. Let's not forget that army brass resisted President Truman's executive order for troop integration in 1948 for several years, with segregated units existing all the way up to the mid 1950s. And it wasn't until the Tailhook Scandal of the 1990s that the navy started to take the issue of sexual harrassment against women seriously.
            This post may contain an opinion that may conflict with your opinion. Do not take it personal. Polite discussion of difference of opinion is welcome.

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            • #7
              Re: Gays in the Armed Forces

              I was on the "pro-gay" side of a debate on this when I was in the 8th grade. My male opponent's biggest argument was, "But they'd be attracted to me and want to watch me change out of my uniform! I don't want to get raped!"

              I gave him the biggest tongue-lashing ever, starting with, "What makes you think anyone, male or female would even find you attractive enough to want to see you naked?" and then asking, "Should I be afraid of you?"

              He said, "Uhhh, no. Why?"

              "Well, because you like girls. I'm a girl, so you must be attracted to me, right? You're wanting to watch me change clothes, right? And I should be afraid you're going to rape me now, shouldn't I?"

              Impressed the teacher, but unfortunately flew right over his little 13-year old head.

              Can't think of anything creative this time

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              • #8
                Re: Gays in the Armed Forces

                Originally posted by matapule View Post
                My biggest concern with gays in the military is that they will go into battle with purse and high heels that don't match.
                I suspect that those would only be the anally receptive ones. It's their partners that you'd want fighting next to you.
                http://thissmallfrenchtown.blogspot.com/
                http://thefrenchneighbor.blogspot.com/

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                • #9
                  Re: Gays in the Armed Forces

                  Originally posted by Leo Lakio View Post
                  Starting with this quote, lifted from a thread about the bailout plans (where it was already off topic), I thought I'd give it its own home for further discussion...

                  So, who wants to be first to tell us why they think its such a morally abhorrent idea to allow homosexuals in the U.S. military? Bobinator? The floor is open to you...
                  You haven't been in the military, have you? They don't have separate homosexual bathrooms, living quarters, etc.

                  Kinda ujie, if you know what I mean.
                  Make trouble, have fun, do good stuffs.

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                  • #10
                    Re: Gays in the Armed Forces

                    Originally posted by surlygirly View Post
                    I was on the "pro-gay" side of a debate on this when I was in the 8th grade. My male opponent's biggest argument was, "But they'd be attracted to me and want to watch me change out of my uniform! I don't want to get raped!"

                    I gave him the biggest tongue-lashing ever, starting with, "What makes you think anyone, male or female would even find you attractive enough to want to see you naked?" and then asking, "Should I be afraid of you?"

                    He said, "Uhhh, no. Why?"

                    "Well, because you like girls. I'm a girl, so you must be attracted to me, right? You're wanting to watch me change clothes, right? And I should be afraid you're going to rape me now, shouldn't I?"

                    Impressed the teacher, but unfortunately flew right over his little 13-year old head.
                    Who cares about the gay issue? I want coed barracks, now that you brought it up subtly. Works in firehouses.

                    And yes, you should be afraid. That one little "firewall" inside me is what kept me from straying into the dark side.
                    Beijing 8-08-08 to 8-24-08

                    Tiananmen Square 4-15-89 to 6-04-89

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                    • #11
                      Re: Gays in the Armed Forces

                      Originally posted by zztype View Post
                      You haven't been in the military, have you? They don't have separate homosexual bathrooms, living quarters, etc.

                      Kinda ujie, if you know what I mean.
                      i do agree with you zztype whole heartedly; terribly uncomfortable for the straight male knowing a fag is in the shower or in the same room with them.....i am only guessing for most it all boils down to respect

                      i as a 34 year old fag completely understand both sides; there should always be limits as to what an individual can say or do at what is presented at any moment....i support both sides of the argument...i've heard the worst; seen the worst and have been physically attacked and bashed (of course not here in hawaii - at least not yet)

                      we all have our opinions at the "what mays"....but in the end it is all about respecting ones; ideas; opinions; beliefs etc.etc.....

                      for myself...i know of the limits of when, what and where...what i fancy the most is observing the known hatred and ignorant in detail with most individuals and also with myself (lord knows i have an ugly hatred ignorant side at times)...i can't help but laugh at it at times...i don't become angry or upset....i laugh not at the ugly hatred ignorant part...but at the wasted energy...i observe it with every detail...it is better than t.v (although i am not a t.v fan)...reality-up close and personal

                      be blessed - have a pleasant weekend ht ohana

                      *laughs @ Random "I want coed Barracks"
                      stay forever young

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                      • #12
                        Re: Gays in the Armed Forces

                        [rant]

                        The military needs every gay volunteer that wants to join. It also needs more raging heterosexuals, men, women, whites, African-Americans, Africans, Canadians, Latinos, Asians, atheists, Catholics, Jews, Republicans, Libertarians, Unitarians, and (*gasp*) Democrats. They all need to be patriots. I guess they cannot be conscientious objectors.

                        I don't think sexual orientation has anything to do with a military veteran's potential or skills any more than race, religion, or sports-team preference. They're all dangerous topics of discussion in a barracks or a wardroom.

                        I served with a number of homosexuals during my 20 years in the submarine force. I knew some of them were gay, but I bet that I only knew the sexual preference of about 5% of the homosexuals I served with. It isn't relevant to running a sonar search or operating a nuclear reactor, let alone breaking things & killing people. It isn't relevant in liberty ports, either.

                        My spouse also served with a number of homosexuals during her 25 years in the military. Again, not relevant.

                        Frankly during our military careers we had far more problems balancing work and life, regardless of whether it was heterosexual or homosexual.

                        In the military (and in the rest of the world's occupations, too) sexual orientation is a distraction and shouldn't even be dignified with the term "issue". Here's a real military issue: the submarine force's annual junior-officer retention has been running in the single digits over the last few years. Over 90% of them serve their minimum obligated service and get out. The majority paid for four years of college on the Navy's dime, spent another 15 months in advanced training, and served only three years (or less) of sea duty. At that rate it doesn't take long for dinosaur institutions to become extinct. Unfortunately the submarine force's leadership (ironically all male and overwhelmingly white) has been almost criminally negligent in correcting those issues. If they don't get in front of improving the demographics, instead of wringing their hands over gender & sexual orientation, then it won't take long for them to becone irrelevant too.

                        [/rant]

                        In occupations that involve a high degree of personal risk-- like police, firefighters, and military-- the recruiters can't afford to be choosy about demographics... only potential & qualifications.
                        Youth may be wasted on the young, but retirement is wasted on the old.
                        Live like you're dying, invest like you're immortal.
                        We grow old if we stop playing, but it's never too late to have a happy childhood.
                        Forget about who you were-- discover who you are.

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                        • #13
                          Re: Gays in the Armed Forces

                          Originally posted by Nords View Post
                          [rant]

                          The military needs every gay volunteer that wants to join. It also needs more raging heterosexuals, men, women, whites, African-Americans, Africans, Canadians, Latinos, Asians, atheists, Catholics, Jews, Republicans, Libertarians, Unitarians, and (*gasp*) Democrats. They all need to be patriots. I guess they cannot be conscientious objectors.

                          I don't think sexual orientation has anything to do with a military veteran's potential or skills any more than race, religion, or sports-team preference. They're all dangerous topics of discussion in a barracks or a wardroom.

                          I served with a number of homosexuals during my 20 years in the submarine force. I knew some of them were gay, but I bet that I only knew the sexual preference of about 5% of the homosexuals I served with. It isn't relevant to running a sonar search or operating a nuclear reactor, let alone breaking things & killing people. It isn't relevant in liberty ports, either.

                          My spouse also served with a number of homosexuals during her 25 years in the military. Again, not relevant.

                          Frankly during our military careers we had far more problems balancing work and life, regardless of whether it was heterosexual or homosexual.

                          In the military (and in the rest of the world's occupations, too) sexual orientation is a distraction and shouldn't even be dignified with the term "issue". Here's a real military issue: the submarine force's annual junior-officer retention has been running in the single digits over the last few years. Over 90% of them serve their minimum obligated service and get out. The majority paid for four years of college on the Navy's dime, spent another 15 months in advanced training, and served only three years (or less) of sea duty. At that rate it doesn't take long for dinosaur institutions to become extinct. Unfortunately the submarine force's leadership (ironically all male and overwhelmingly white) has been almost criminally negligent in correcting those issues. If they don't get in front of improving the demographics, instead of wringing their hands over gender & sexual orientation, then it won't take long for them to becone irrelevant too.

                          [/rant]

                          In occupations that involve a high degree of personal risk-- like police, firefighters, and military-- the recruiters can't afford to be choosy about demographics... only potential & qualifications.
                          nords, with this post, you have become my hero. thank you also for your military service. *salute*
                          superbia (pride), avaritia (greed), luxuria (lust), invidia (envy), gula (gluttony), ira (wrath) & acedia (sloth)--the seven deadly sins.

                          "when you wake up in the morning, tell yourself: the people i deal with today will be meddling, ungrateful, arrogant, dishonest, jealous, and surly..."--meditations, marcus aurelius (make sure you read the rest of the passage, ya lazy wankers!)

                          nothing humiliates like the truth.--me, in conversation w/mixedplatebroker re 3rd party, 2009-11-11, 1213

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                          • #14
                            Re: Gays in the Armed Forces

                            Originally posted by Nords View Post
                            Here's a real military issue: the submarine force's annual junior-officer retention has been running in the single digits over the last few years. Over 90% of them serve their minimum obligated service and get out.
                            Great post.

                            As for the part above - isn't that linked to a shortage of movement above the junior-officer rank? I have no personal experience, but I have heard comments from elsewhere that what happens is the officers reach a level, make some calculations on their chance for promotion - and bail. There's just no where to go.

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                            • #15
                              Re: Gays in the Armed Forces

                              Originally posted by zztype View Post
                              You haven't been in the military, have you? They don't have separate homosexual bathrooms, living quarters, etc.

                              Kinda ujie, if you know what I mean.
                              Gives a whole new meaning to the term, "sub sandwich", huh?

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