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Thread: The Falls of Clyde ship

  1. #1
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    Post The Falls of Clyde ship

    http://www.honoluluadvertiser.com/ap...D=200880322005

    The ship needs $32 million for repairs and renovation!

    The historic Falls of Clyde, currently moored in Honolulu Harbor, will need an estimated $32 million in repair and renovation work to be restored to its former glory, according to a recent assessment of the 130-year-old ship.

    The cost of restoring the vessel has Bishop Museum searching for a new benefactor that can demonstrate the desire and the means to take on the tasks of restoring and maintaining the historic ship.

    "While our first choice would be to move forward with a complete restoration of the Falls of Clyde, the reality is such that we do not have the finances or staff resources to undertake a fundraising campaign of this monumental magnitude," said Timothy E. Johns, president and chief executive officer of Bishop Museum. The museum operates the Hawai'i Maritime Center, which owns the Falls of Clyde.

    Bishop Museum has launched a worldwide search for a new benefactor for the Falls of Clyde. Ocean Technical Services, which is conducting the search, has identified more than 500 potential candidates.

    A National Historic Landmark, the Falls of Clyde was last dry docked in 1981 and underwent significant restoration that enabled tours of the ship to resume and thousands of visitors to go aboard and experience it. A preservation plan was developed shortly thereafter and has served as the Museum's guide for ongoing maintenance and repair work.

    In early 2007, Hawai'i Maritime Center made the decision to close the ship to tours for safety reasons and in order to facilitate repairs to the deteriorating tank, which frequently caused the ship to list dramatically. The decision was also made to conduct a more thorough inspection by marine experts.

    The Falls of Clyde was built in 1878 by Russell and Company in Port Glasgow, Inverclyde, Scotland. The ship was launched as the first of eight iron-hulled four-masted ships built for Wright and Breakenridge's Falls line. It was named after the Falls of Clyde, a waterfall on the River Clyde.

    In 1899, Capt. William Matson purchased the ship and brought it to Honolulu, where it was registered under the Hawaiian flag. From 1898 to 1907, the Falls of Clyde was used as a transpacific passenger and freight-carrying vessel. The ship was later sold and converted to a bulk tanker and then to a fuel-oil barge and floating gasoline depot before being decommissioned in 1959. The Falls of Clyde changed hands twice before it was given to the Bishop Museum in 1968, after which it was transferred to Hawai'i Maritime Center in 1988.
    Life is either an adventure... or you're not doing it right!!!

  2. #2
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    Default Re: The Falls of Clyde ship

    That was a sad story to read, as I can't imagine them being able to find any individual or corporation who would cough up $32 million for something that offers almost zero return on investment, and trying to raise that amount through public donations just wouldn't happen. Plus, the FOC is competing with the battleship Missouri for donations and for volunteer manpower too.
    I'm a big fan of the FOC, partly thanks to the late Bob Krauss, but I'm afraid I don't see a happy ending here.

    Well, time for your thanks.
    .
    .

    That's my story, and I'm sticking to it.

  3. #3

    Default Re: The Falls of Clyde ship

    No, this is probably going to end very badly and it's virtually criminal. The vessel's handling has been mismanaged for decades.
    I was an apprentice rigger on her from '80 to '82 and almost nobody has gone aloft since I did, and certainly no work has been done.
    32 mil is just starters at costs today.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: The Falls of Clyde ship


    Click on the photo to see a larger version.

    This ship is definitely deteriorating and is too expensive to restore.
    I'm still here. Are you?

  5. #5
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    Post Re: The Falls of Clyde ship

    I've got some great memories as a child and with my children aboard.
    I did with the varsity theater too! The tide and time waits for no man.

    My suggestion?!
    Salvage anything worthwhile aboard and sink it in an appropriate place.
    It is 130 years old and I doubt any entity will foot the bill to add (?) years to it.
    No matter what, eventually unless placed on land, it'll end up on the ocean floor.

    Thinking forward while remembering the past.
    Life is either an adventure... or you're not doing it right!!!

  6. #6

    Default Re: The Falls of Clyde ship

    This might sound like a corny idea, but I think if anyone wants to save the FOC, they need to dig up some neat story about the ship and have it turned into a movie. That would generate interest with people and it might motivate folks to launch some kind of campaign to save the FOC.

    Trick is, the story would have to be exciting enough to be the basis for a movie. Maybe historians at the Bishop Museum and the Maritime Center can do some research and find an interesting story of real people and actual events that took place on the FOC. If necessary, embellish it just a little by adding pirates, a naval battle with cannons, a damsel in distress, and buried treasure.
    This post may contain an opinion that may conflict with your opinion. Do not take it personal. Polite discussion of difference of opinion is welcome.

  7. #7
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    Thumbs up Re: The Falls of Clyde ship

    You never know FM!

    Here's a link to a Wikipedia page about FOC.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Falls_of_Clyde
    Life is either an adventure... or you're not doing it right!!!

  8. #8

    Default Re: The Falls of Clyde ship

    The best thing to do is bring her out of the water into a land based cradle of sorts to more than support but also showcase her entire hull which is very impressive on it's own. But it would take the whole parking lot nearby to house the whole thing.

  9. #9

    Default Re: The Falls of Clyde ship

    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Whitfield View Post
    The best thing to do is bring her out of the water into a land based cradle
    The Japanese have done that for some of their historic ships.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: The Falls of Clyde ship

    Speaking of the FOC...

    Family folklore says my great-grandfather Nagasawa was a cook on the FOC. I've consequently always felt an attachment to the FOC and was very disappointed to not be able to tour it last time I was on Oahu a few months ago. Its current woes or uncertain fate is of course very saddening.

    At the risk of shattering long held assumption/hope that my great-grandfather's claim was true, I've done some very limited research to confirm his story through looking at some books at the library and visiting and contacting the Maritime Center. None of this was conclusive, I can't seem to find ships records or anything for the 1898 - 1907 Matson period when he would likely have been sailing. Most info I've found is for the post 1916 Cpt. Kleibingat (I think that's it) period. Before rolling up my sleeves and really looking into it, I thought I might throw his story out on this thread and hope to get lucky. So does anyone know of existing FOC crew lists or published ship records from the pre-1916 era?

    I don't really doubt he served on ships, his naturalization papers show he was fishing all over the Pacific Rim on other vessels. I just don't know if he sailed on the FOC. As for being a cook, well, I always thought it unusual a man from Japan would spend his life cooking New England boiled dinners, roasted turkeys, stew, and never anything Japanese. There was supposedly a plaque associated with the repatriated FOC which mentioned my great-grandfather's name as cook. But no one at the Maritime Center has heard of such a plaque (and they would be the ones who know!).

  11. #11

    Default Re: The Falls of Clyde ship

    Mr. Bob, I wish I could help somehow, but please, if you succeed in finding some pertainent info, post it here!

  12. #12
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    Default Re: The Falls of Clyde ship

    isnt Bishop museum associated with Kamehameha schools and bishop estate?
    if so.... there should be no shortage of money...surely this can be considered educational and a great way to give back to the community and create jobs as well......
    the bigger the government the smaller the citizen.

  13. #13
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    Default Re: The Falls of Clyde ship

    Quote Originally Posted by escondido100 View Post
    isnt Bishop museum associated with Kamehameha schools and bishop estate?
    if so.... there should be no shortage of money...
    No, unfortunately the estate does not share resources with the Bishop Museum (parent of the Hawaii Maritime Center).

  14. #14
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    Post Re: The Falls of Clyde ship

    Quote Originally Posted by escondido100 View Post
    isnt Bishop museum associated with Kamehameha schools and bishop estate?
    That's a common misconception.
    The building that was/is the original campus for the school is on museum grounds. It's in the "Historical Landmarks" registry and badly needs renovation, but our big sister up the hill won't even help with that.

    So, no real association. Too bad.
    Life is either an adventure... or you're not doing it right!!!

  15. #15

    Default Re: The Falls of Clyde ship

    MM, that she is 130 years old is one of many reasons to continue keeping her in good condition for generations to enjoy and study. She's the last of all the '4 masted ships' (this term notates the fact that all masts are square rigged) and has immense historical ties to Hawaii and nothing like her exists in a state where sailing was a foundation for it's very being. For the State to throw her away is pointless and less than short-sighted. If they want a waterfront that is worth a damn, then the FOC is irreplaceable and a must save, and then put a focus on her. She's a great selling point for Hawaii, but has instead been ignored until she's about to rot away.
    We already have substantialy so little to show of our superbly interesting past, that every bit is precious, and few are as much as this vessel.
    Last edited by Ron Whitfield; June 7th, 2008 at 09:15 AM.

  16. #16
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    Question Re: The Falls of Clyde ship

    Yes Ron. All valid points. I wish it was a perfect world too.

    The biggest problem is that she is a 130 year old "STEEL" hull. Rust?!
    And that's just the beginning...

    We're not talking a few hundred thousand, but millions of dollars.
    Where will that come from?
    Life is either an adventure... or you're not doing it right!!!

  17. #17

    Default Stupid imperfect world...

    ...I know..., I just can't stand the thot of it taking the plunge.

    FYI, she's made of iron, probably even worse for the rust factor!

  18. #18
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    Exclamation Re: The Falls of Clyde ship

    A Breaking News story, just posted:
    Safety concerns lead to repairs for historic Falls of Clyde

    The historic Falls of Clyde, closed to the public since last year because of its deteriorating condition, is getting some much-needed repairs as a safety precaution, Bishop Museum officials announced today.
    The Museum, through a news release, said a company from Port Townsend, Wash., has been hired to de-rig the ship and shore up its hulls. An estimated $32 million would be need to repair and restore the vessel, which was built in 1878 in Scotland and has been in Hawaii since 1899.
    The ship is currently moored at Honolulu Harbor.
    Workers from Brion Toss Yacht Riggers will begin this week to remove the ship's four spars, topmasts and associated rigging, standing and running rigging, steel yards, wooden yards, jib boom, and main side supports. Other materials from the ship will be removed and the hull will be reinforced with steel to stabilize the ship.
    "We decided to de-rig the Falls of Clyde and shore up its hull as safety precaution," said Timothy E. Johns, President and Chief Executive Officer of Bishop Museum, the not-for-profit operator of Hawai'i Maritime Center, which owns the ship. "We plan to eventually move the ship and wanted to be sure that it could be relocated without further compromising its condition."
    The ship would need an estimated $32 million in repair and renovation work to restore it, a news release from the Bishop Museum said. The estimate was given by ship consultant Joseph W. Lombardi and his company, Ocean Technical Services. Museum officials said the ship has has suffered continued deterioration despite considerable ongoing efforts at restoration and preservation that has cost in excess of $2 million over the past 10 years.
    (...)
    More of the story is at the link above.
    .
    .

    That's my story, and I'm sticking to it.

  19. #19

    Default Re: The Falls of Clyde ship

    I had to scoff recently at reading in one of the local dailies of a Bishop Museum exec stating that "the ship hasn't been neglegted" (!).
    His spin, typical of suits these day's, was that blah blah has been spent on whatevers..., over the last few decades.
    True, money has been spent, but not nearly enuf, and not in the right places. All that money has now been shown to have been wasted for the most part, as the restored areas are now back in disrepair or totally shot, with many more problem spots haven arisen or escalated, and the vessel is now in serious decline.
    That's neglect and mismanagement.

    That 32 mil. figure is far from the real amount to put her back in ship shape, and that these 'professionals' are still of the mind set of keeping her future in the water, shows that they probably don't have a real plan for a positive future concerning this most valuable asset to the State of Hawaii.

  20. #20

    Default Re: The Falls of Clyde ship

    As I remember things, there was a big fund-raising effort for the Falls of Clyde over forty years ago. It seems that continued maintenance was not kept-up with, leading to the present state of affairs.

  21. #21

    Default That's when men were men...

    ...and sheep were scared!

    The FOC deserves another Bob Krause. He's the one responsible in large part for the fund raising and public awareness that is probably a thing of the past.

  22. #22
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    Default Re: The Falls of Clyde ship

    Arrrgggh, it ain't a ship, any more anyway. If it can't get underway, making way, it's just a hulk. A pretty hulk, maybe, but not much else.
    Last edited by salmoned; June 25th, 2008 at 02:54 PM.
    May I always be found beneath your contempt.

  23. #23

    Default Re: The Falls of Clyde ship

    In total, you couldn't be more wrong. Would you say the same about the Aloha Tower, Iolani Palace, or any other historic place?
    Last edited by Ron Whitfield; June 26th, 2008 at 05:51 PM.

  24. #24
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    Post Re: The Falls of Clyde ship

    I'm all for preserving history, if it's practical.
    What a weird world we live in. Too often in my opinion "things" hold more importance than people. Sheesh! What was in the past is just that. Let's take care of the present. "And the Beat goes on"

    I wish that the Bishop Museum would quit being confused with the Bishop Estate.
    The museum is in a tight financial situation. Yesterday about 20 employees were let go just for money reasons.
    They were all doing their jobs. The museum is downsizing to save money.
    I haven't seen it in the news yet, but it'll come up soon.
    Life is either an adventure... or you're not doing it right!!!

  25. #25
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    Default Re: The Falls of Clyde ship

    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Whitfield View Post
    In total, you couldn't be more wrong. Would you say the same about the Aloha Tower, Iolani Palace, or any other historic place?
    Well, I'd say EXACTLY the same thing about the War Memorial pool right now. If the Aloha Tower or the Iolani Palace were on decrepit barges, yes, I'd say the same thing for those structures, too. Look, we won't be losing any history when the FoC goes away - the history IS preserved, it's only the physical hulk that will go away (and make room for something new).
    May I always be found beneath your contempt.

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