1.9 Million Fine for Illegal Downloads of Songs

[Leo Lakio]

Re: 1.9 Million Fine for Illegal Downloads of Songs

Do we have a point here any longer (or at least one related to the thread's title)? Or may I stop checking updates to a thread that once held interest for me?

And I see that (a) I have my answer, and (b) old habits die hard.

[Kaonohi]

Warning! Off-topic discussion!

First of all, an aside to Leo, whom I respect immensely:
I hope my change of subject line will give me your forgiveness for my part in the hijacking of this thread. It gives you more choice this way.
In conversations one topic often leads to another, and,
"Not all who wander are lost."

What I did not give the benefit of the doubt to was someone calling me "Gramps." You may be okay with someone calling you that, but I'm not. And here are my reasons:

To put it simply, it's rude to refer to anyone you just met or don't know well enough as gramps. It's the kind of term you might use with a relative or someone else you have a close enough relationship with. But with anyone else, it's rude. Out in the real world where people talk to each other face-to-face, who in this forum would refer to an elderly person they just met as "gramps?" Who wants to admit they don't have manners? Uh huh.

Thank you for the clarification, and for answering my request for clarification, even though it is off-topic and a personal agenda. I did ask and I'm glad you abandoned your avowal to not answer such posts, at least in my case.

As far as 'Gramps' being insulting - I guess each of our individual cultures or subcultures judge rudeness or imposed familiarity differently, and differently in different situations. Here in Hawai`i of all places we should know there is no one standard for manners. Some places I go I can't tough a child's head, other places I can't rest one leg across another. Anyone on HT is welcome to call me 'Gramps,' after all, I earned it and I'm proud of it, and I feel warmly enough about most of the people here on HT that I'd just take it as kidding around.

At a party with neighbors if the teens don't know or forget my name and call me 'Gramps' it seems more like a term of endearment, kinda like a modern version of Kupuna for modern local kids. It's happened, though more often its 'Grandpa.' If they added the other derisive terms you mentioned - then clearly it's an insult. Still, I try hard to not take offense.

A stranger.... or panhandler.... would get a cold shoulder and stink-eye. I understand more where you are coming from, but there is no longer any one standard of proper conduct. Consequently I judge respect or lack thereof more by actions than by words. It is very easy to insult someone with polite language - I've had it happen to me here.

Actually, one term I do resent is "sir," but knowing it is never meant as an insult I either make a comment such as, "Not me, I work for a living," or to the military (who must assume if you're out of uniform), "Not necessary, I'm one of you," which when going through the base gates almost always gets me a knowing smile.

Hoping we're all OK on this, and understanding more.



K.

[Frankie's Market]

Re: Warning! Off-topic discussion!

Do we have a point here any longer (or at least one related to the thread's title)? Or may I stop checking updates to a thread that once held interest for me?

Instead of merely decrying the problem, why not be part of the solution in getting this thread back on track, Leo?

I'll ask you the same questions that I did to Kaonohi. What is your take on the matter? What course of action do you think Jammie Thomas will next take? Surely as someone with as much interest in music as you do has some viewpoint and insight to offer.

As for me and what I have to share,..... there was a court case in Germany this week where Rapidshare was fined $34 million for hosting a file-sharing site where copyright violations was taking place.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/hr/...eafd877858b3a1

Doing the math, this is how the 2 cases (tried in different countries with different laws) compare to each other. Jammie Thomas was found liable for $80,000 for each of the 22 songs in which she violated the copyright. Rapidshare was fined $6,800 for each of the 5,000 songs posted on its site. No doubt there is a big disparity in how each court assessed monetary value to copyright infringement on a file sharing site, which is why I said in an earlier post that Capitol v. Thomas would be far more important in how online music piracy cases will be argued, rather than the monetary judgement. While I still think Jammie Thomas was rightfully found guilty for copyright violations, I do think that the jury award of $80,000 per song is way too high and is a figure that will very likely be adjusted downwards in future cases.

As far as 'Gramps' being insulting - I guess each of our individual cultures or subcultures judge rudeness or imposed familiarity differently, and differently in different situations. Here in Hawai`i of all places we should know there is no one standard for manners. Some places I go I can't tough a child's head, other places I can't rest one leg across another. Anyone on HT is welcome to call me 'Gramps,' after all, I earned it and I'm proud of it, and I feel warmly enough about most of the people here on HT that I'd just take it as kidding around.

At a party with neighbors if the teens don't know or forget my name and call me 'Gramps' it seems more like a term of endearment, kinda like a modern version of Kupuna for modern local kids. It's happened, though more often its 'Grandpa.' If they added the other derisive terms you mentioned - then clearly it's an insult.

Your point is taken. I took offense at the remark because I didn't feel a level of familiarity sufficient enough for MPB to call me gramps. Outside of any personal information I've posted about myself here, he knows nothing about me. That he's called me an octogenarian proves it! I'm not anywhere close to being 80. I'm a lot closer to half of it! At least one other HT'er knows that, for a fact.

Regardless of how old I actually am, I will also say that it was under strange circumstances for the issue of age to suddenly be brought into the thread. Hey, I'm all for having discussions and debates (hopefully respectful) where differences of opinions and viewpoints can be hashed out. But when a remark about a person's age is invoked, seemingly out of the blue,..... it didn't feel right. Clearly, it wasn't meant to be a compliment. And that is why I took exception to being called "Gramps" under these circumstances. The subsequent posts containing overt insults proved my instincts were right.