Today is D-Day for The Natatorium

[Ron Whitfield]

At 1pm today at Honolulu Hale (3rd fl.), the desicion will be made on either wholesale destruction of the site, or, something else.
Seem's there are only two sides getting press in the battle, those that brainlessly want it all gone, period. And those who senselessly strain to preserve it in it's golden age entirety.
No middle ground workability to be had from the hard lines.
This meeting today is probably a waste of time as Mufi 'I hate The Nat.' Hanneman will eventually make the no surprise call to tear it down for Nike Town in spite of the many reasons for partial preservation.

[Frankie's Market]

Re: Today is D-Day for The Natatorium

Calls for partial preservation are both "brainless and senseless" without an exact detail of what is to be preserved and most importantly, how its ongoing maintainance it is to paid for. With the city not having a dime to spare in the present economic state and the property owners on this island already being taxed to the hilt, preservationists have to come up with a solid plan to pay for whatever they want to do. If the response is to beg for taxpayer money or "we'll get back to ya when we figure out a way," then let the bulldozers rip!!!!!

Not a penny of taxpayer money for preservation of the Waikiki Natatorium!

Let those preservationists who want a toy, pay for their toy. Leave my hard-earned tax dollars out of it!

[Ron Whitfield]

Nope!

The benefit will be enjoyed by many but payed by all, and those that want to pout about it can stick their heads in the sand next door at Kaimana Beach, or at Queen's Beach, or at Waikiki Beach, or at any of the many beaches Oahu alone has to offer instead of crying for another few yards of sand that will be completely washed away within a year should they get their way.

[Kimo]

Re: Today is D-Day for The Natatorium

Task Force voted 9-3 (four members absent) this afternoon to demolish, move the arches, restore the beach. Recommendation goes to Mufi who has final say - but that's kind of what he wants anyway, right?
Naturally, the Friends of . . .say they'll fight on for preservation.

[Ron Whitfield]

Re: Today is D-Day for The Natatorium

Not one penny of my money for demolishing or moving anything! Let those that want to destroy it use their own money, and let the dozers rip! Let's see how far they get with that.

Ah yes, our City politicians...

[D'Alani]

Re: Today is D-Day for The Natatorium

Restore what beach? I don't believe there ever was a beach there until the Natatorium was built and so called "Kaimana Beach" was created.

[Frankie's Market]

Re: Today is D-Day for The Natatorium

Task Force voted 9-3 (four members absent) this afternoon to demolish, move the arches, restore the beach. Recommendation goes to Mufi who has final say - but that's kind of what he wants anyway, right?

Common sense has prevailed, for once.

Naturally, the Friends of . . .say they'll fight on for preservation.

Naturally. Good luck to the "Friends" being able to raise any appreciable sum of money at the grassroots level in this kind of economy. Good luck finding wealthy benefactors who are willing to burn their money in a futile effort to save what is already far beyond repair and reclamation.

[Ron Whitfield]

D'Alani = akamai

a futile effort to save what is already far beyond repair and reclamation.

Wow, you are good. With an awesome armchair assessment arsenal that you seem to be acquitted, you must also have an incredible resume of past accomplishments in this field that can be presented. No matter that many other pro's with actual hand's on experience have often stated the opposite of your claim these recent years.

[craigwatanabe]

Re: Today is D-Day for The Natatorium

Restore what beach? I don't believe there ever was a beach there until the Natatorium was built and so called "Kaimana Beach" was created.

I remember back in the early sixties when there was a beach front to the right of the Nadatorium with a sandy shoreline. Now the waterline runs right up to the sea wall.

As for the Nadatorium isn't it a War Memorial? As such I would think any memorial should be preserved to some point. I can't imagine the Vietnam Wall memorial being torn down. If it is then whatever structure replaces it should be rededicated to what it represented.

Or it should be demolished and rededicated somewhere else. At least the shoreline will be restored.

[Ron Whitfield]

Re: Today is D-Day for The Natatorium

Craig, and the many thousands who still seem to not understand that there is a beach there now and since The Nat. was built decades ago, because the structure is there.
Remove it, and bye bye Kaimana Beach, just like before it was built. No tax payer's millions worth of groins are going to keep Ma Nature from washing it all away in one cycle, unless it's a huge and probably unsightly monstrousity. For that reason alone, The Nat. pool wall serves a worthwhile purpose, as would my ideas of preservation.

[D'Alani]

Re: Today is D-Day for The Natatorium

The same could probably said about Ala Moana Beach, take away Magic Island and a lot of the sand would eventually move away. Before Magic Island was built there was a jetty on the Diamond Head side to help keep the sand there. For those of you who may not know, Ala Moana is also man made.

[craigwatanabe]

Re: Today is D-Day for The Natatorium

Like I said there used to be a beach on the right side of the Nadatorium, now it's gone, only a shallow watery rocky section up to the sea wall fronting the Aquarium. Kaimana beach used to extend all the way to the Kapahulu groin with nice expanses of beachfront. Even Ala Moana Beach had more beachfront, then they expanded Magic Island out to where it is now and it has deteriorated ever since. Kahala beach is another example. Before Kahala Hilton built those two islands to separate the hotel grounds from the public beach itself, Kahala beach (Waialae beach park) had a lot of sand. Now look at it, nothing but coral heads everywhere. You could swim in that area, now you can't even walk barefoot on the shoreline there because of the coral poking out everywhere. The sand bar in the canal wasn't there before, just lots of water to pass under the bridge. Now there's so much sand in the canal the city and county has to periodically dredge the sand out.

You may lose Kaimana "Dig Me" beach but you'll gain more beachfront further down where the sand used to be.

[Frankie's Market]

Re: Today is D-Day for The Natatorium

The same could probably said about Ala Moana Beach, take away Magic Island and a lot of the sand would eventually move away.

Hmmm. Even with Magic Island today, sand is still being trucked into Ala Moana Beach in order to keep it at its current size.

[Frankie's Market]

Re: Today is D-Day for The Natatorium

Not one penny of my money for demolishing or moving anything! Let those that want to destroy it use their own money, and let the dozers rip! Let's see how far they get with that.

Yep, you would rather spend $57 million to rehabilitate the Natatorium rather than $15 million to tear it down.

Fine. I give the preservationists one month to raise $42 million on their own. If they can't raise it, down goes the Natatorium. It's time for folks like Ron to put up or shut up with their own money. Spending time thinking of smarmy rebuttles to everything that is posted here doesn't raise one red cent.

I agree completely with what this gentleman had to say on the Advertiser website.

On my first visit to & swim at the Natatorium,in roughly 1947, it was obvious the facility needed significant service, repair & or replacement ... even though efforts were made to provide changes the basic needs still remained & more time & money will not change those realities ... change & modifications to a plan that was not a good one at its outset continues to be called for even after so many years. Make the changes and honor those who served in a new and correct way ... holding on to the past for the sake of 'holding on' serves nobody well or properly. My view has not changed despite the passage of --- now 62 years +/-. 808Tom

Well said, Tom.

[Ron Whitfield]

Re: Today is D-Day for The Natatorium

Yep, you would rather spend $57 million to rehabilitate the Natatorium rather than $15 million to tear it down.
It's time for folks like Ron to put up or shut up with their own money. Make the changes and honor those who served in a new and correct way ... holding on to the past for the sake of 'holding on' serves nobody well or properly.

If you think the total costs of tearing it all down and disposing of it, while protecting the immediate environment (...lest the endless litigations make 15 mil look like toy money), move and then reconstruct the arch after it crumbles, plan and build the groins (which will itself provide much court involvement/$), plus whatever else would be involved will be limited to just a measley 15 mil, well good luck! When it's all said and done, the downers will be crying way more, big time.
It's going to cost huge amounts that we don't have either way, so instead of wanking on for the silly pipe dream of even more beach, put the efforts into something positive and tangible that can provide a worthwhile now and future for the area.

Yep, if I had all the kala needed I'd have (tried anyway) taken stewardship of The Nat. long ago and many people around the world, not just Oahu/Hawaii, would have been benefitting from my plan for decades already, and The Nat. may have eventually been making money.

The oldtimer had it pretty right, but holding on for the sake of holding on worked enuf for 3 decades to get us to the point now where those without blinders have come close to reconstructing and preserving the memorial permanently.

Some, like the idiot manager from The New Otani and Mufi, see The Nat. as an eyesore that should have been gone long ago dispite it's importance and possibilities. That's pathetic.