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Thread: HPD's online DUI pics

  1. #76

    Default Re: HPD's online DUI pics

    Quote Originally Posted by bjd392 View Post
    of Hawaiian residents. Shunning someone who is "presumed innocent until proven guilty" was HPD's first legal and moral error.
    You have brought up an interesting dilemma. The public wants to know who is the "suspect" when the neighbor woman is stabbed. They want to know who is the "suspect" in a DUI that results in a death. They want to know who is the "suspect" when someone in an official capacity is charged with a crime [say, a politician is charged with embezzling]. The newspapers usually report the names, which is what the public wants.

    So, when someone is charged with a DUI, what is the difference between the HPD putting those names online, and the newspapers putting suspects names of other crimes in articles (which also goes online)?

    Where is the line drawn between "presumed innocent until proven guilty", (thus the right to privacy), and the right for the public to know who is charged with crimes (which is information that is available to the public through the police blotter)?

    A man tosses a baby off a freeway. We [the public] want to know who the suspect is. An man is charged with a DUI. Should the public NOT know?

    Or, is it that the HPD was running the site? Is that the objection?

    Just wondering aloud here.
    Now run along and play, but donít get into trouble.

  2. #77

    Default Re: HPD's online DUI pics

    While some people want to stuff their head in the sand like an ostrich when it came to the impact that the "DUI Wednesdays" Facebook page had in HPD's closing of their DUI mugshot listing, others who have a better grasp on the topic are able to put 2 and 2 together.

    Take it away, Star-Bulletin:

    Honolulu police are not saying why they closed the curtain on a Web page full of drunken-driving suspects two months before the pilot program's final act. However, the copy-and-paste of the suspects' photos to the popular Facebook site on the Internet brought legal questions into play. Those should be addressed in any review of the pilot program, and shared with the public.
    HPD can stay mum all they want about why the pilot program is ending at this juncture. But I strongly suspect that this isn't the last we've seen of this program. That's what a pilot/trial test is all about. There's supposed to be an evaluation at the end to see what worked well and what needs fixing. So anyone who wants to imagine a triumph over the supposed demise of HPD's DUI Wall of Shame, whoop it up while you can, because your celebration might be short-lived.
    Last edited by Frankie's Market; March 12th, 2010 at 09:28 AM.

  3. #78
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    Default Re: HPD's online DUI pics

    Maybe a compromise would be to not show photos but just list the names like how it is done here on the Big Island in the police report column on the back page of the A Section of the daily rag.
    Life is what you make of it...so please read the instructions carefully.

  4. #79

    Default Re: HPD's online DUI pics

    Quote Originally Posted by craigwatanabe View Post
    Maybe a compromise would be to not show photos but just list the names like how it is done here on the Big Island in the police report column on the back page of the A Section of the daily rag.
    I don't know about all of the Big Island papers, but I googled West Hawaii Today and it gives convictions (not arrests) for DUIs. Maybe that is the problem with the HPD site, it gave arrests (prior to any convictions).
    http://westhawaiitoday.com/articles/...al/local10.txt
    Actually, when it comes right down to it, there is less "entertainment factor" in just a name and written blurb than in a photo. That mug shot of the guy having his head held up was much more compelling than just some typed words. I'm betting that way more people looked at the HPD site just to see the goofy mug shots. (Drunks do tend to look rather goofy .... )
    Now run along and play, but donít get into trouble.

  5. #80

    Default Re: HPD's online DUI pics

    Quote Originally Posted by Frankie's Market View Post
    So anyone who wants to imagine a triumph over the supposed demise of HPD's DUI Wall of Shame, whoop it up while you can, because your celebration might be short-lived.
    What happened to our culture of you make A when you make shame?

  6. #81
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    Cool Re: HPD's online DUI pics

    I think the difference here is that in a major crime, we find out who is guilty or innocent. Not so with DUI! It's not going to be 'widely reported' when someone is found innocent of DUI.

    The result is that people who now the suspect casually (his/her employer, prospective employers, etc), never knowing they were found innocent, will assume the people are driving drunk. This can affect their lives for years.

    Maybe if they had a companion site: DUI suspects arrested and found INNOCENT! it would be fair - but we know they won't do that.

    You might bring up the fact that most DUI's are convicted, but some are acquitted - I know of one, and I don't have statistics, but they are there.

    This reminds me of the stoning of prostitutes in the courtyard. Barbarous!

    I think the public has a right to know when they are found guilty.

    Quote Originally Posted by Amati View Post
    You have brought up an interesting dilemma. The public wants to know who is the "suspect" when the neighbor woman is stabbed. They want to know who is the "suspect" in a DUI that results in a death. They want to know who is the "suspect" when someone in an official capacity is charged with a crime [say, a politician is charged with embezzling]. The newspapers usually report the names, which is what the public wants.

    So, when someone is charged with a DUI, what is the difference between the HPD putting those names online, and the newspapers putting suspects names of other crimes in articles (which also goes online)?

    Where is the line drawn between "presumed innocent until proven guilty", (thus the right to privacy), and the right for the public to know who is charged with crimes (which is information that is available to the public through the police blotter)?

    A man tosses a baby off a freeway. We [the public] want to know who the suspect is. An man is charged with a DUI. Should the public NOT know?

    Or, is it that the HPD was running the site? Is that the objection?

    Just wondering aloud here.
    Be Yourself. Everyone Else Is Taken!
    ~ ~
    Kaʻonohiʻulaʻokahōkūmiomioʻehiku
    Spreading the virus of ALOHA.
    Oh Chu. If only you could have seen what I've seen, with your eyes.

  7. #82

    Default Re: HPD's online DUI pics

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaonohi View Post
    I think the public has a right to know when they are found guilty.
    I agree. Put up their pictures once they are convicted, not just arrested. [Aren't there judges on the mainland who have made convicted people stand on street corners with signs or something like that?]
    Now run along and play, but donít get into trouble.

  8. #83
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    Default Re: HPD's online DUI pics

    when people are arrested for DUI they have usually failed a breath test. I think that is a pretty definite test for whether someone is guilty or not. Its not quite the same as someone who is accused of burglary for example. This might depend on an eye witness statement or just suspicion. But, I don't think they give breath tests for burglary!

    If someone is arrested for DUI - they should be ashamed. They could have killed someone by driving drunk. They could injure or maim someone by driving drunk. There is NO excuse for driving drunk!
    "Democracy is the only system that persists in asking the powers that be whether they are the powers that ought to be."
    Ė Sydney J. Harris

  9. #84

    Default Re: HPD's online DUI pics

    It's emotional to watch the news when the victim's family stand up and talk to the defendant in court. All they can say is how stupid the defendant is for driving while drunk. You just want to throw the book at the defendant.

  10. #85
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    Default Re: HPD's online DUI pics

    Good or bad I think one should ask themselves if it were their own pictures being plastered publicly, how would one feel then?

    One can say, "well I won't put myself in that situation in the first place" And that's fine, however there are occasions where one will put themselves in a bad spot even when they were trying not to. Sh*t happens!

    And when that happens you can defend yourself in court and win, but the real damage has already been done.

    Honestly, I believe a public announcement of one's arrest should only occur after a conviction has been ruled.
    Life is what you make of it...so please read the instructions carefully.

  11. #86

    Default Re: HPD's online DUI pics

    Quote Originally Posted by Frankie's Market View Post
    I don't think it helped that some idiot on Facebook made a DUI Wednesday page. The names and pic of the offenders were only supposed to be viewable to the public for 24 hours, but that page kept the pics online for way past that.

    I am not sure if the person who made that Facebook page is a member of a local car enthusiast forum, forumshawaii.net

    There is a special sub-forum on their site that is dedicated to DUI Wednesdays.

    Pretty embarassing if you ask me, makes our State look like it's populated by a bunch of morons.

  12. #87
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    Default Re: HPD's online DUI pics

    Quote Originally Posted by craigwatanabe View Post
    Honestly, I believe a public announcement of one's arrest should only occur after a conviction has been ruled.
    Some medicatons also have alcohol. Combined with a glass of wine with lunch, and you may be DUI via breath, but not blood. Able to drive, but not pass a breath test.
    INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY! It's in our constitution!

    Quote Originally Posted by pumpkinboy View Post
    Pretty embarassing if you ask me, makes our State look like it's populated by a bunch of morons.
    Look like? Do you mean 'expose?'

    KKKKKKKKKv
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    Kaʻonohiʻulaʻokahōkūmiomioʻehiku
    Spreading the virus of ALOHA.
    Oh Chu. If only you could have seen what I've seen, with your eyes.

  13. #88
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    Default Re: HPD's online DUI pics

    Quote Originally Posted by pumpkinboy View Post
    Pretty embarassing if you ask me, makes our State look like it's populated by a bunch of morons.
    Hey hey hey...stop talking about our elected officials like that!
    Life is what you make of it...so please read the instructions carefully.

  14. #89
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    Thumbs up Re: HPD's online DUI pics

    Got a letter from ACLU (sorry Bobinator, I know you think they are part of the NWO).

    "This is in response to your letter to the American Civil Liberties Union of Hawaii (ACLU) requesting assistance.

    (...) Thank you for bringing to our attention this matter, and for advocating for everyone's civil rights. As you may know, the practice of posting the photos of those arrested for DUI has been discontinued. (...)

    No word as to whether it was through their actions or attentions, but I'm glad it happened.

    Post instead those CONVICTED of DUI - that's not a violation of their civil rights.

    K!
    Be Yourself. Everyone Else Is Taken!
    ~ ~
    Kaʻonohiʻulaʻokahōkūmiomioʻehiku
    Spreading the virus of ALOHA.
    Oh Chu. If only you could have seen what I've seen, with your eyes.

  15. #90

    Default Re: HPD's online DUI pics

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaonohi View Post
    Post instead those CONVICTED of DUI - that's not a violation of their civil rights.
    Yep, that would be a reasonable and "within rights" approach.
    Now run along and play, but donít get into trouble.

  16. #91
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    Thumbs down Re: HPD's online DUI pics

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaonohi View Post
    I think the difference here is that in a major crime, we find out who is guilty or innocent. Not so with DUI! It's not going to be 'widely reported' when someone is found innocent of DUI.
    The same can be said when you're accused of anything sexual, even if you didn't do it at all.

    The mere mentioning that you may have committed a sexual act is a permanent branding, regardless of a dismissed case or an innocent verdict.

  17. #92
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    Default Re: HPD's online DUI pics

    I don't think you can really compare an arrest for DUI with an arrest for anything sexual. A person arrested for DUI usally has a pretty strong reason for being arrested in the first place. Yes, there are innocent people being accused of a sexual crime every day - being drunk? not so much! if you don't want to pay the consequences, don't drink & drive - it's a pretty simple concept.
    "Democracy is the only system that persists in asking the powers that be whether they are the powers that ought to be."
    Ė Sydney J. Harris

  18. #93
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    Default Re: HPD's online DUI pics

    The comparison isn't so much about the arrest of the alleged drunk or alleged sex offender; it's the permanence that comes from parading these individuals before they're ever even convicted. (Oops! Sorry, you're really innocent! Well, the crime's off your record, but everyone now thinks you're a drunk/rapist.)

    Yes, far more guilty people get away than there are innocent people who get arrested. Unfortunate. But Police Officers are human too, and yes they do make errors in judgement.

  19. #94

    Default Re: HPD's online DUI pics

    http://www.khon2.com/news/local/stor...7r1zzJ15A.cspx

    Why would he brag about endangering innocent people's lives?

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