Could my apartment be illegal?

[turtlegirl]

Re: could my apt be illegal?

you can pretty much guess if it is legal or not by knowing the various rules for yourself.

she is concerned about her home. I don't blame her - facing possible eviction from an illegal unit is not a small thing. So, lets all get back to helping her out ok?

Thanks! I'm really distressed about my situation! And, no, I can't exactly 'guess' about the status of my apt because I don't know the various rules!! If I did, I might not be so worried, and I would not be pleading for advice!

[surlygirly]

Re: could my apt be illegal?

From what I remember, your place seems legit in all manners described here minus the mail. Has she given you anything in writing yet? Does anyone know if TG can dispute the eviction through the normal process (not having received written notice 45 days advance) or is it just too bad so sad? I don't exactly know what steps the LL could take if it is illegal. But if she hasn't given you anything in writing yet, just a strange conversation telling you to be out in 30 days, I don't think that would stand up. Did you sign any sort of lease or agreement when you moved in? Do you have copies of any monies paid? Illegal dwelling or not, I know in both Texas and Arkansas the tenant cannot just be suddenly put out on the street- the law protects them and is mostly in their favor. And I know the LL would not want the law involved- she'd probably be willing to make some sort of deal if it comes down to that.

I know it's tedious, but keep records of EVERYTHING, TG. I give this advice to everyone going through some kind of legal problem, and most of them are too lazy/don't want to bother with it. But if you keep records and write dates, amounts, conversations, etc- everything- it shows favorably on you, plus there's a written account of what happened, even if it's your view. If you pay with a money order or check, make a copy of it and put it with the records. I'll try to think of more questions and hopefully some answers for you. (Oh, and my Mom's on it )

[tutusue]

Re: could my apt be illegal?

Good points, Amati. I thought about liability after the fact!

TG...have you been given written notice?

FYI...
Landlord Tenant Code
Altho' I don't think it addresses an illegal unit; just a tenant using a unit for illegal purposes.

[matapule]

Re: could my apt be illegal?

TG, I have read the entire thread and I am confused why you are concerned at this time. Apparently, you have lived there for some period of time. Has the LL said something or done something recently? What brings this to a head at this time? As a tenant you have specific legal rights, whether your unit is legal or not.

At one point in my life, for a couple of years, I was an urban planner in a community in California. I was aware of many illegal, "bootleg" units in town, because it was a college community with scarce and expensive apartments. In our case (not necessarily the same in HI) City code definition of a "unit" was a habitable living quarter with plumbed in stove and kitchen sink - permanently affixed. A bedroom with a bathroom and a hot plate was not a "unit" even if rent was charged. However, I didn't go out looking for trouble, even when I knew a unit was illegal. The only time I went out is when I got a complaint, usually from a disgruntled neighbor, because the tenant in the illegal unit was partying all night and keeping him awake. Then I HAD to enforce the zoning ordinance. But if there was no complaint, then "no harm, no foul" and I would concentrate on more important things like implementing the street tree program and installing bicycle paths.

[anapuni808]

Re: could my apt be illegal?

Matapule - thats pretty much how it works here too.

[Amati]

Re: could my apt be illegal?

Here are some guidelines posted online. [But a question might be, if it is an older unit is it grandfathered in under different rules?]

http://honoluludpp.org/downloadpdf/zoning/lupdfaqs.pdf

An Ohana dwelling must be attached to the main house, its size is limited, two parking spaces must be provided on the lot, and only relatives of the family living in the mainhouse may occupy the Ohana unit. An applicant for an Ohana Building Permit must file a restrictive covenant agreeing not to register the property as a condominium, and to abide by the family occupancy requirement.

As I mentioned before, you might be able to go by being a roommate. Of course, the income to the landlord under that arrangement would still be taxable (including GE tax). Does your landlord give you receipts for your rent? That is another hint as to how legal/illegal the unit is.

[turtlegirl]

Re: could my apt be illegal?

She only accepts cash for rent, and usually gets a written receipt to me after a few days. No neighbors have complained, and I'm very quiet. She's been acting paranoid a lot lately. Kicked out her greatgrandson from the house because she hated his girlfriend. Hollered at me the other day when I had to run an extension cord out to my car for a jumpstart. Always telling me to use less water and power, and freaks out over stupid things like my little nightlight, or how and when I water (or don't water) my plants. Street parking only, I am not allowed to use the driveway anymore. I unscrewed my porch light a few months ago because she complained about it. Just revoked my laundry privileges. And after she told me I had to move out, she got mad at me because I was crying and she didn't want the neighbors to hear us. I've been here almost exactly 3 years. No problems. Until lately.

Whats really bugging me is that she says her son is coming from the mainland to live in my unit. I think she's making that up - the man is like 60 years old with a wife and career. Its one of the oldest tricks in the landlord handbook! Cuz, really, how can it be proven? I'm almost positive she's lying to me.

[tutusue]

Re: could my apt be illegal?

Oh dear, TG. If LL is old enough to have a great grandson who is old enough to have a girlfriend, you just might be dealing with a LL with a medical problem. Do you really want to stay there under the conditions you described? Do you think she'll stop mistreating you as fast as she started it? And, yes, booting you saying a relative is moving in is an old trick. I've used it myself!!!

[68-eldo]

Re: could my apt be illegal?

The official land lord tenant code can be found here:
http://hawaii.gov/dcca/ocp/hrs/lt_code/
My experience as LL is that the LL does not need to provide a reason for asking a tenant to leave, but must provide 45 days notice. The LL can not enter the unit; turn off the power or water or take any other action to make a tenant leave. The only recourse to remove a tenant that does not leave is court action. Lawyer cost is in the $2000 range to start.

A real Estate agent told me it takes three things to make a kitchen; sink, refrigerator and stove. Any two out of the three is OK in a room that might be a studio apartment but is not a rental unit.

I have no experience with illegal units.

Just my 2 cents.

[turtlegirl]

Re: could my apt be illegal?

OMG! I just finished connecting the dots and putting this puzzle together.
LL wants to move in a local married couple she knows, who I've met, so that the husband can continue to do the yard and house work, and his wife can continue to clean house for her, for rent trade!!!! Since she tossed her great grandson, and S moved out, she wants free rent caretakers, and a man around!! Dirty! She didn't have to lie to me!! Also, I've got a friend, nice intelligent man, has been living across the street from here since he was a child 40+ years ago, and he thinks that LL has been 'losing it' recently. I agree! I am NOT leaving without a court order! This situation is unfair and crazy! No 45 day notice yet, so Ima gonna hang tight until then, because, yeah, I really do want to stay here! Even if it means having to ignore this LL situation!
Oh, and I don't need a lawyer, I've got a ton of experience in this field! (my momma's a landlady, too!)

[matapule]

Re: could my apt be illegal?

LL is buying a heap of trouble for herself! The unit may be illegal and she probably hasn't been paying tax on cash rent receipts. She really hasn't thought through all the ramifications if she boots you out. If she wants to pursue this, she will never be able to rent the unit again and she will owe a bunch of back taxes to the State and Feds. She can legally force you to leave, after due process, but that process hasn't started yet.

But as this is playing out, I think you better plan on moving sometime in the future, TG.

monomanumonia, ta'ahine

[Leo Lakio]

Re: could my apt be illegal?

Do you really want to stay there under the conditions you described?

But as this is playing out, I think you better plan on moving sometime in the future, TG.

I'd have to agree with these points, TG. As much of a hassle as it is to move, it sounds like this is already starting down a path that is unlikely to get better. It sounds like a bad relationship, and it's often easier to stay in a bad one than to get out - but it never ends well. Even if you get over this headache, garans there will be more pilikia from the LL.

As long as you've not received notice, you don't HAVE to move out - but make the effort to find something more stable, and leave under YOUR terms.

[tutusue]

Re: could my apt be illegal?

I agree, lying sucks. A curiosity question, TG...If LL had leveled with you from the beginning...iow, told you that, because of her age, she needed ongoing house and yard work and could afford it only with a rent exchange, would you have amicably agreed to move?

[Frankie's Market]

Re: could my apt be illegal?

However, I didn't go out looking for trouble, even when I knew a unit was illegal. The only time I went out is when I got a complaint, usually from a disgruntled neighbor, because the tenant in the illegal unit was partying all night and keeping him awake. Then I HAD to enforce the zoning ordinance. But if there was no complaint, then "no harm, no foul" and I would concentrate on more important things like implementing the street tree program and installing bicycle paths.

Matapule - thats pretty much how it works here too.

Oh, but things have already changed, at least in Honolulu. The C&C building inspectors have been more proactive and on the lookout in certain "problem" neighborhoods like Kalihi, which are notorious for homeowners using their property as illegal boarding houses. Maybe in the past, these inspectors were willing to turn a blind eye to some of the violations unless there was a complaint. But now that the city is being impacted by the furloughs, targetting LLs who are not paying their fair share of taxes have become a priority.

[SusieMisajon]

Re: could my apt be illegal?

So it comes down to taxes vs housing crisis...and taxes win? Gotta hope they use that extra tax money to build better housing for those who need it, eh?