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  • Re: Star-Bulletin on the Web

    BTW, the pop-ups and other Web design things aren't Star-Bulletin decisions. They're handed down from corporate. Essentially, that adds another layer to response time, but they are listening to your complaints, and have tweaked things.

    Some people don't like them -- freeloaders! -- but most people simply accept them as the cost of obtaining content.

    The day they cost us more than they bring in, they'll vanish.
    Burl Burlingame
    "Art is never finished, only abandoned." -- Leonardo Da Vinci
    honoluluagonizer.com

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    • Re: Star-Bulletin on the Web

      Originally posted by buzz1941 View Post
      [...]
      Some people don't like them -- freeloaders! -- but most people simply accept them as the cost of obtaining content.[...]
      Exactly!

      This issue reminds me of the time, several years ago, when I was whining about spam to the owner of a computer business in my building. He listened then calmly offered his simple 'fix'..."Just hit the delete key." Of course, I'd been doing that but it was his "ain't no beeg ting" demeanor that resonated with me. Now I just click on the 'close ad' button.

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      • Re: Star-Bulletin on the Web

        Originally posted by buzz1941 View Post
        BTW, the pop-ups and other Web design things aren't Star-Bulletin decisions. They're handed down from corporate.
        Ah, another sore spot. Out of curiosity, from a reader's point of view, what benefit is there to "corporate"? Are they just tyrants who demand "more profits", or do they actually give something to Hawaii's readers in return?

        I suspect much of journalism's ruination is Wall Street. A look at the transcript of Long Story Short with Bob Sevey that airs tonight seems to support that.

        I think some outlets are experimenting with a non-profit model. It will be interesting to see how that progresses.



        Originally posted by buzz1941 View Post
        The day they cost us more than they bring in, they'll vanish.
        The only way I can see them "costing" more than expected is in lost readers. Unfortunately, the day the numbers revel it - it's too late. The damage is done.



        Originally posted by Nords View Post
        If S-B's not going to change their annoying marketing tactics, then what setting could other readers apply to these annoyances?
        In checking out your observation, I've found that placing the SB in my browser's "restricted sites" strips off not just the annoying ad, but all the ads in the right column as well as all the AP stuff. Seems to do a good job of decluttering the site. Loads faster too.

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        • Re: Star-Bulletin on the Web

          come march 1st, any complaints regarding the SB website will be more likely than they are now not to be acted upon as the staff of four webmasters will be cut down to two.
          superbia (pride), avaritia (greed), luxuria (lust), invidia (envy), gula (gluttony), ira (wrath) & acedia (sloth)--the seven deadly sins.

          "when you wake up in the morning, tell yourself: the people i deal with today will be meddling, ungrateful, arrogant, dishonest, jealous, and surly..."--meditations, marcus aurelius (make sure you read the rest of the passage, ya lazy wankers!)

          nothing humiliates like the truth.--me, in conversation w/mixedplatebroker re 3rd party, 2009-11-11, 1213

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          • Re: Star-Bulletin on the Web

            Originally posted by GeckoGeek View Post
            In checking out your observation, I've found that placing the SB in my browser's "restricted sites" strips off not just the annoying ad, but all the ads in the right column as well as all the AP stuff. Seems to do a good job of decluttering the site. Loads faster too.
            Ok, now I'm a happy camper!
            Pop ups gone, switched to the mobile version for my Blackberry, complaints done for now.
            That was simple, why didn't someone just suggest that three pages ago?

            Comment


            • Re: Star-Bulletin on the Web

              If I were an advertising client and discovered that readers were so annoyed that they were installing utilities to block all ads, I'd be very concerned. Maybe find some other venue to buy my advertising.

              If the pop-ups are annoying enough to make readers find ways to block all ad content, that will certainly affect a website's bottom line. The website loses visitors. And worse yet, it loses ad clients.

              Comment


              • Re: Star-Bulletin on the Web

                Originally posted by 808golfer View Post
                If pop up ads are so the death rattle for newspapers then why on a site like this ( Hawaii Threads) with access to so many do you only hear from the same 6 or 7 people??
                It's good that there are that 6 or 7 people who post serious stuff. My posts are silly. So, the serious posters have been informative and keeps a balance for the board.

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                • Re: Star-Bulletin on the Web

                  For all the time people take to complain about pop-ups, they could just as easily have looked up ways to get around said ads. I've been reading the SB mobile edition on my WinMo phone since day one. And there's been a "Mobile Edition" link on the upper right-hand corner of starbulletin.com proper since the latest format was rolled out. In fact, the SB is the only Honolulu daily that gives you the option of a fast, no advertisement version of the full site that gives you access to all the day's stories. Check out the Honolulu Advertiser's mobile edition if you don't believe me.

                  And if you're like me and prefer to use Firefox to do most of your surfing but you still insist on viewing the full version of the sb site, you can always request to have pop ups not sent to your IP address(es) in the first place. Just go to whatismyip.com, copy and paste your address in an e-mail to SB's director of online advertising requesting to add your address to the pop up blacklist.
                  "If it's brown, it's cooked. If it's black, it's f***ed" - G. Ramsey

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                  • Re: Star-Bulletin on the Web

                    Originally posted by Composite 2992 View Post
                    If I were an advertising client and discovered that readers were so annoyed that they were installing utilities to block all ads, I'd be very concerned. Maybe find some other venue to buy my advertising.

                    If the pop-ups are annoying enough to make readers find ways to block all ad content, that will certainly affect a website's bottom line. The website loses visitors. And worse yet, it loses ad clients.
                    Uhhhh.....TiVo....DVR's....
                    Ad clients will go away whe they stop getting results for the money they pay to advertise. They are obviously getting the desired results or they wouldn't still be there. It's just that simple.

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                    • Re: Star-Bulletin on the Web

                      Originally posted by 808golfer View Post
                      Uhhhh.....TiVo....DVR's....
                      Ad clients will go away whe they stop getting results for the money they pay to advertise. They are obviously getting the desired results or they wouldn't still be there. It's just that simple.
                      Not true. We and many other businesses advertise in both papers for two basic reasons: To keep the pricing competitive, so the Advertiser gives us deals. Also because the Bulletin offers combo rates with Midweek, which may not be the bastion of journalsim, but it has incredible reach, delivered to almost every household on Oahu.

                      The Advertiser — Circulation: 141,934 Morning 155,932 Sunday
                      Star Bulletin — Circulation: 64,000 Monday -Sunday

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                      • Re: Star-Bulletin on the Web

                        Originally posted by Media Guy View Post
                        That was simple, why didn't someone just suggest that three pages ago?
                        I guess I wasn't motivated enough. I only look at SB's site when someone links to it. That's not my normal mode for local news.


                        Originally posted by 808golfer View Post
                        If pop up ads are so the death rattle for newspapers then why on a site like this ( Hawaii Threads) with access to so many do you only hear from the same 6 or 7 people??
                        Question: How many people regularly post to HT? How many of them read the SB site? And how many others are going to bother to post "me too" when it's already clear there are several who are unhappy. In other words, how many people would you expect to see on HT if it is/was a major issue?


                        Originally posted by MixedPlateBroker View Post
                        you can always request to have pop ups not sent to your IP address(es) in the first place. ... e-mail to SB's director of online advertising[/EMAIL] requesting to add your address to the pop up blacklist.
                        Well, that works until the ISP changes your IP address.


                        Originally posted by 808golfer View Post
                        Uhhhh.....TiVo....DVR's....
                        Ad clients will go away whe they stop getting results for the money they pay to advertise. They are obviously getting the desired results or they wouldn't still be there. It's just that simple.
                        Depending on how people skip over them, they may still see the ad. I've been known to rewind to see an engaging new ad.

                        I also read some of the ads in the paper. Anything that I might be interested in. The problem is how to create the same opportunity in a on-line format.

                        Comment


                        • Re: Star-Bulletin on the Web

                          Originally posted by Walkoff Balk View Post
                          It's good that there are that 6 or 7 people who post serious stuff. My posts are silly. So, the serious posters have been informative and keeps a balance for the board.
                          And you are wiser than I have given you credit for being.

                          Comment


                          • Re: Star-Bulletin on the Web

                            The two separate threads on the Star-Bulletin website have been merged into one after I received a request to do so by one of our users. Totally makes sense to me. It's done.
                            Last edited by mel; February 23, 2009, 04:29 PM. Reason: fix typo
                            I'm still here. Are you?

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                            • Re: Star-Bulletin on the Web

                              Often advertising isn't just to get immediate sales.

                              At other times it's to help keep the name familiar. For example, Hawaiian Electric doesn't advertise to increase sales. After all, where's the competition? But they'll do it for PR purposes. That kind of effect isn't easily measured.

                              And, as Gecko Geek mentioned, a clever ad is likely to draw attention and even warrant replays. Bud Light is a very good example. But if the ads are completely blocked from view, then that could be a problem for the advertising client. So the media outlet has an interest in making certain its clients gets the exposure they deserve.

                              If pop-up ads become so annoying that it drives viewers to employ blockers, or if it just drives them away entirely, it defeats the purpose of the ads.

                              And as for "free" readership or viewership being a type of parasitic activity, that's the way it is for a lot of media. TV. Radio. The internet in general. Newspapers could go the route of subscribership but that business model will teeter on a risky "you first" game. Few publications would be bold enough to lose its readership to a competitior that may already be providing similar content for free.

                              What would readers be willing to pay? How compelling does the content have to be?

                              IPTV Hawaii is trying to market a service where they can bring Hawaii-originated television programming to the Mainland and elsewhere via the internet. But they're facing some serious drawbacks: The material they're providing is dated and limited. The quality is on par with what you'd expect from a highly compressed video file. Viewers have to pay for a box, then subscribe to the service. How many people are willing to pay $125 for a box, then another $22 a month to watch OC16 reruns? The daily news is available, but then the news is also available for free via the stations' websites. The argument is that these shows can be watched on a regular TV, but is that worth the initial investment and the monthly fee?

                              With the growth of YouTube, Apple TV and other internet-based delivery systems for a broader variety of high-quality programming, that subscription model is unlikely to take root very quickly -- if at all.

                              It's the same for newspapers. With TV stations providing text-based news stories on the web, the fast turnaround of breaking news, and with content that includes video and sound, the rules of the game are changing fast. The newspaper industry has to stop thinking of itself as a print-based medium and integrate a lot more 21st Century technology into its news gathering and delivery systems.

                              Comment


                              • Re: Star-Bulletin on the Web

                                Originally posted by GeckoGeek View Post
                                Well, that works until the ISP changes your IP address.
                                Which is maybe once a year as long go online at least once every three days (with RR at least). And again, it takes the same amount of time to request a new IP address blacklisting as it does to post a complaint to an online forum.
                                "If it's brown, it's cooked. If it's black, it's f***ed" - G. Ramsey

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