The impending war with Iran

[Miulang]

Re: The impending war with Iran

Speaking of the US sponsoring regime change all over the world (and sometimes failing miserably), here's a little story about how we're sneaking in about $75 million to non governmental groups in Iran to "encourage" them, probably with some help from some covert Christians in Action "consultants" to overthrow the government. We've done this in Chile, Peru, Cuba, the Baltic States, even in Iran once before...

"... The money is to be spent on empowering civil society, providing supplemental requests, broadcasting into Iran, promoting democracy, offering scholarships and fellowships, and enhancing communication.

But Iranian civil society activists who asked to remain unidentified told IPS they believe this policy will just intensify the Islamic republic's repressive approach toward non-governmental organisations (NGOs), and will be used as an excuse to crack down on their activities...."

Our motto must be, "if we fail at diplomacy, we'll outsource our regime change to the locals so no one can accuse us of butting in where we don't belong..." As everyone knows, "there is no such thing as a free lunch".

[Miulang]

Re: The impending war with Iran

I don't agree completely with everything this writer says, but here's an interesting point to consider: our reasons for considering attacking Iran are way different than the motivation for getting rid of Hitler:

"...And now we are about to liberate the Iranians. We are about to make war against their houses. The difference between our "liberation" of Iraq/Iran and our "liberation" of Germany lies in the vast difference between the types of people involved. The meaning of "collateral damage" has far different connotations then and now. Our hypocrisy in dealing with "collateral damage" is monumental. "Collateral damage" was one of the OBJECTIVES in the war against Germany in order to cause the German worker to slow his efforts towards the defense of the Fatherland as a result of losing his home and his family.

But the objectives of our wars have changed. "Collateral damage" against the Iraqi/Iranian drives him immediately to thoughts and actions of revenge on the perpetrators. While the German was no less devoted to his home and family, his motivating reaction was not revenge. The Muslim (fanatic or not) has been reared in an atmosphere of tribal retribution for real or imagined harm. His religion is his comforter in a normally harsh life and he is more than willing to sacrifice his life for his religion's guarantee of eternal bliss. Regret for "collateral damage" is all right for newspaper PR, but as a weapon of the war being waged by our neo-cons, collateral damage creates a truly dedicated enemy. But of course, that is the "plan"..."

Miulang

[MadAzza]

Re: The impending war with Iran

Here's an interesting scenario that makes so much sense it's scary. If we and Israel decide to attack Iran, that $70/barrel crude oil will cost way way more if Iran and Iraq, Venezuela, Nigeria and the Sudan all form a new cartel and starve us to death.

ROTFL. This is one of the funniest theories floating around about this whole situation. Yeah, all the oil producers are going to stop selling to their top customer. Right.

Does anyone ever think these things through?

Nobody is going to stop selling oil to the United States. They need the money. In fact, they're desperate for it. Without our money, their economies would collapse. They're not that stupid.

I swore I wouldn't get involved in these "controversial" topics, but this one just had to be addressed.

Carry on with the campaign of hysteria and misinformation.

[LikaNui]

Re: The impending war with Iran

Carry on with the campaign of hysteria and misinformation.

Ooooh, there you go being "tough" again, Maddie. Your new fan Middleman is gonna get even more excited.

[Miulang]

Re: The impending war with Iran

ROTFL. This is one of the funniest theories floating around about this whole situation. Yeah, all the oil producers are going to stop selling to their top customer. Right.

Does anyone ever think these things through?

Nobody is going to stop selling oil to the United States. They need the money. In fact, they're desperate for it. Without our money, their economies would collapse. They're not that stupid.
.

Um Maddie? If the Middle Eastern oil producers (with the exception of our buddies the Saudis) all decide to only accept payments in Euros (Iran is expected to start requiring this beginning next month), and if the oil producing countries in South America and Africa do the same, that would be tantamount to our dollar being worth about as much as a postage stamp. The rest of the world doesn't need our money anymore; our $800 billion trade deficit means we owe more to the rest of the world than the rest of the world owes us. So how do you figure they need our money that badly if all China has to do is call in its IOUs and it would sink our economy?

70% of the oil in the Middle East is being sold to Europe. China is fast becoming the buddy of Iran and Iraq and India and Pakistan and making deals to build oil pipelines to get the fuel they need. Venezuela and Bolivia could very easily sell their oil to China rather than to us, partly because of our political posturing against their freely elected governments.

Pax Americana is being sold up the creek by a bunch of greedy men who run multinational corporations.

Miulang

[waioli kai]

not even 40cents on the dollar

.

Miulang= 'If the Middle Eastern oil producers (with the exception of our buddies the Saudis) all decide to only accept payments in Euros (Iran is expected to start requiring this beginning next month) , and if the oil producing countries in South America and Africa do the same, that would be tantamount to our dollar being worth about as much as a postage stamp.'

A postage stamp?

Too kind of a comparison. Am sure you are just tryng to cushion the blow. Plenty of us, domestic and foreign. know that the dollar is not now, will even less likely to be later, truly worth as much as the U.S. postage required to send by USPostalService an ounce worth of $100 bills (including the envelope containing those paper notes) across the street. Employing your earlier That $0.39 for that envelope paper contents of promise-sorry U.S. treasury certificates would come out to almost 40cents on the dollar, when, in truth, only as the immorally amazing success of the grandest international scam in the history of the mankind, the U.S. dollar, sustains the illusion that a U.S. dollar is not even worth as much as the cost of one envelope from a package of a hundred envelopes.

M= 'The rest of the world doesn't need our money anymore'

Right at the moment 'our money' originates from us taxpayer' and 'our money, is owed to some average individual U.S. citizen taxpayers; yet, most is owed to the Social Security Trust Fund account, and via U.S. Treasury scam, to JapanUS, Inc/KuwaitUS, Inc/ SaudiUS, Inc/IsraelUS, Inc/BritainUS, Inc/NigeriaUS, Inc/US corporatUSt$, Inc., and owed of course to The Peoples' Republic of China so far as they are extended into the US $cam.
....... .... ...

M= 'our $800 billion trade deficit means we owe more to the rest of the world than the rest of the world owes us. So how do you figure they need our money that badly if all China has to do is call in its IOUs and it would sink our economy?'

That's $800bln per year that the U.S. Treasury adds onto its nearly 10,000 billion dollar debt., and added to its 10's of thousands billion dollar unfunded liabilties/commitments/contracts.
.... ... ..

M=' Pax Americana is being sold up the creek by a bunch of greedy men who run multinational corporations.'

Pax Americana has, like lands in Hawaii, been sold/stolen for decades. Today's corporatUSts forebearers served the United States up to our moment's 'bunch of greedy men who run multinational corporations'. US War Iraq is one of their ongoing exercises.

[Miulang]

Re: The impending war with Iran

If/when we do it, this is how our "sturm und drang" operation in Iran will work. Of course, then again, we might just let the Israelis do it for us instead.

Miulang

[waioli kai]

Madame Rice vs. Sanity

Listening (pbs newshour31mayO6) to perhaps "the main architect" of the U.S.s' USWarIraq"OperationIraqiLiberation", USrael's Madame U.S. Secretary of State Rice speaks of the evils of anyone but United States' USrael bearing weapons of mass destruction in the Middle East and Afghanistan.... the day will come, else USrael will have totally succeeded in rendering Earth more secure and livable in its Stone Age than it is to be in its post-USrael Age, the day will come when today's video/audio of Madame Rice will be seen to be of the greatest fascist tradition of the recently past centuryCE.

[waioli kai]

second or third strike? re:impending US war:Iraq

Bunkum From Benador**

' The neoconservative campaign to equate Iran with Nazi Germany received a setback in May. Bloggers and a few journalists quickly exposed as wholly concocted a story about a new law that would require Iranian Jews to wear yellow insignia. ... The debunking of a PR agency that circulated a bogus story about persecution of Jews in Iran exposed the moving parts of a media machine bent on preparing the American public for another war...a media machine intent on priming the public for war with Iran--as it did earlier with stories about Iraq's nonexistent WMD.

**The Nation July 3, 2006 issue: Larry Cohler-Esses, editor-at-large for the Jewish Week of New York.

' Ubiquitous in this campaign, as it was with Iraq, is the PR firm Benador Associates. ... Its stable of writers and activists, a Who's Who of the neocon movement, includes Richard Perle, Michael Ledeen, Frank Gaffney, Charles Krauthammer, Victor Davis Hanson and Iranian exile journalist Amir Taheri--the author of the bogus piece. Even among a crowd notable for wrongheaded analyses, Taheri stands out, with a rap sheet that leaves one amazed that he continues to be published. It is here that the role of Benador is key; the firm gives Taheri a political stamp of approval that provides entree to hawkish media venues, where journalistic criteria are secondary.

In a New York Post column last year, Taheri identified Iran's UN ambassador, Javad Zarif, as one of the students involved in the illegal 1979 seizure of hostages at the US Embassy in Tehran. San Francisco State University professor Dwight Simpson wrote the Post politely to request a correction. "This allegation is false," he explained. "On November 4, 1979 [the day of the seizure], Javad Zarif was in San Francisco. He was then a graduate student in the Department of International Relations of San Francisco State University. He was my student, and he served also as my teaching assistant." ...

On May 30--just days after the National Post's apology for running his false story on Iranian Jews--Taheri was one of a group of "Iraq experts" brought to the White House to consult with George W. Bush on the disastrous situation there. '

Floundering at the helm of the debacle it gleefully began in Iraq in early 2003, the civilian CheneyBush regime does not even consider extracting itself from one quagmire as it designs to push the U.S. Military into an even more disastrous US civilian, sworn-to-Israel, neo-con militarist adventure scripted by interlocking cabals of wars-for-Israel enthusiasts: Tie and suit intellectuals and fianancial interests, mostly of the East Coast, who have hijacked the United States government via a fatally stagnant and corrupt democracy; who have turned by deception, flattery, unlimited monies and insurances of unaccountability a significant faction of former and present officers of the U.S. Military.

Which makes the condition of what remains of democracy in the United States U.S. all the more powerless to extract itself from the rapids of dishonesty, dishonor and dis-ease on which the CheneyBush regime has launched the United States, if not indeed launched the West as a whole. A nation that was founded mostly by civilains is being run into the ground, or otherwise driven to Hell, by civilians. It is ironic that now the only thing that can save the United States from a final plunge into foreign policy madness is a full awakening of the United States Military to the criminal folly of their civilian superiors. On the way to "Strike Three! You're Out!!", was US War:Vietnam the first or second strike called by the U.S. Military on the U.S. Congress and Executive Branch?

Will US War:Iraq be the second or third strike? And, if US war criminals are called Out by the U.S. military should they be prosecuted in civilian courts or special military courts?

[chriscollado]

Re: The impending war with Iran

According to Scott Ritter, a former Marine and a former member of the UNSCOM weapons inspection team, a plan to bomb Iran was submitted and approved by the President. The date of the aerial attack was scheduled for June, 2005.

"...On Iran, Ritter said that President George W. Bush has received and signed off on orders for an aerial attack on Iran planned for June 2005. Its purported goal is the destruction of Iran’s alleged program to develop nuclear weapons, but Ritter said neoconservatives in the administration also expected that the attack would set in motion a chain of events leading to regime change in the oil-rich nation of 70 million -- a possibility Ritter regards with the greatest skepticism. ..."

In light of the report by Seymour Hersh last month and the admission by the White House that we have been flying drone spy planes over Iran for over a year, something like this would not surprise me in the least.

Miulang

uuummmmmmmm..... it is now July of 2006..... I haven't heard of any bombs being dropped in Iran. Have you? You know for sure they would have complained......nice conspiracy theory website....

[chriscollado]

Re: The impending war with Iran

The consistant regurgitation of ignorant bliss is making me laugh so hard my stomach hurts.... lack of sensible research, knee jerk statements, huge amount of ignorance....LMFAO

[Miulang]

Re: The impending war with Iran

The consistant regurgitation of ignorant bliss is making me laugh so hard my stomach hurts.... lack of sensible research, knee jerk statements, huge amount of ignorance....LMFAO

It's just a matter of time, my friend...just like our involvement in Iraq, the decision has already been made that we will get involved in Iran (either directly or indirectly, through Israel). The only question now is WHEN, not if. We might not actually put boots to the ground in Iran, but we will have bombs dropped on that country, because Dick Cheney/Donald Rumsfeld believe that bombs are the answer for everything.

Miulang

[War_Resisters_Canada]

Re: The impending war with Iran

You cannot deny that all empires in the history of mankind have crumbled in due time. The United States is next. Just like Rome, they will stretch their troops so thin and spend so much money on war that the empire that was created by those wars will be unable to stay afloat.

[chriscollado]

Re: The impending war with Iran

You cannot deny that all empires in the history of mankind have crumbled in due time. The United States is next. Just like Rome, they will stretch their troops so thin and spend so much money on war that the empire that was created by those wars will be unable to stay afloat.

Then Canada ... the 51st state will follow...

If we keep electing morons like Bush and crew... Then Yes I agree with you.. The US will out live its worth to the world... We need to worry about ourselves... A little of mind our own business would be nice for a change.

I still support our troops.

[waioli kai]

Israel, U.S. exists for super state

"...Canada ... the 51st state..."

Try Israel for that state, although Israel is more like the 49th state, with Alaska and Hawaii following. The U.S. gives to Israel billion$ in grants and loan guarantees every year. The U.S. insulates Israel from all United Nations actions, arms Israel to the max, provides Israel with nuclear weapons technology and components, allows Israel free reign to oppress Palestinians, and on and on....all the while getting nothing in return from Israel but the international ill-will resulting from the rogue nation activities of Israel. Of course, Israel is not a state of the United States like any other state of the United States. Israeli citizens contribute zero to the U.S. Treasury but they are the U.S. Treasury's greatest beneficiaries, the U.S. Military's greatest beneficiaries since before the first U.S. invasion of Iraq.