Comments on the Akaka Bill?

[kamuelakea]

Re: Comments on the Akaka Bill?

My .25 on this is, I believe too much time has past to undue the overthrow.
It is simply impractical, unfeasible to even contemplate a sovereign Hawaii.
On top of that I remember Sen. Inouye saying it would not be possible
for Hawaii to break away, citing the US Civil War.

Really what should be voted upon by the voters of Hawaii is not the Akaka bill, but who would support a independent Hawaii. Time to put your money where your mouth is.

I agree it is time for real Hawaiians, Native Hawaiians, 50% Hawaiians to "put their money where their mouth is" and start to get things done the American way.......... VIOLENCE.

Yes, I am suggesting that civil disobedience should start. Shut down the airport, shut down Waikiki. Then in the long run, whatever it takes.

I think the immigrants who oppose ANY recognition of Native Hawaiians are shooting themselves in their own foot. They will only ensure that they will always live in a divided, angry, resentful, bitter place called paradise.

[kamuelakea]

Re: Comments on the Akaka Bill?

My .25 on this is, I believe too much time has past to undue the overthrow.
It is simply impractical, unfeasible to even contemplate a sovereign Hawaii.
On top of that I remember Sen. Inouye saying it would not be possible
for Hawaii to break away, citing the US Civil War.

Really what should be voted upon by the voters of Hawaii is not the Akaka bill, but who would support a independent Hawaii. Time to put your money where your mouth is.

By the way, you totally ignored you're little beloved constitution which says that Hawaii could never have been annexed without a treaty.

Did you find the treaty or are you just ignoring this little detail again??

[Konaguy]

Re: Comments on the Akaka Bill?

I agree it is time for real Hawaiians, Native Hawaiians, 50% Hawaiians to "put their money where their mouth is" and start to get things done the American way.......... VIOLENCE.

Yes, I am suggesting that civil disobedience should start. Shut down the airport, shut down Waikiki. Then in the long run, whatever it takes.

It is a no win situation frankly. I don't think the United States will ever
give up Hawaii without a fight. Hawaii is too much of a strategic importance.
Plus the US has invested too much here to walk away. On the flip side
there is a facet of Hawaiians that want the independent Hawaii back.
But I figure the muscle of the United States would smother any Hawaiian
rebellion.

[Konaguy]

Re: Comments on the Akaka Bill?

By the way, you totally ignored you're little beloved constitution which says that Hawaii could never have been annexed without a treaty.

Did you find the treaty or are you just ignoring this little detail again??

My point is in essence due to this technicality the United States should leave
Hawaii according to you.But I believe due to the laches doctrine, the statue
of limitations has run out frankly. Too much time has passed to change anything.

[Konaguy]

Re: Comments on the Akaka Bill?

Like I mentioned previously, instead of putting the Akaka bill
to the Hawaii voters, a vote to see how many people would support
a sovereign Hawaii should be put on the ballot

[kamuelakea]

Re: Comments on the Akaka Bill?

My point is in essence due to this technicality the United States should leave
Hawaii according to you.But I believe due to the laches doctrine, the statue
of limitations has run out frankly. Too much time has passed to change anything.

Statute of limitations ran out on slavery, on Indians, on Eskimos, on womens right to vote. America still did the right thing. But the slavery one took 500,000 deaths.

Hawaiians need to stand up an be ready to die for their country if they want it back. With people like Konaguy, I thing the time for civil disobediance is here and the time for violence is approaching and the time for armed rebellion is probably beyond that. Unfortunately its the only thing your type understands.

I think America is a better country than that and so I hope it doesn't come to any of this, but if history is any predictor, it will.

[kamuelakea]

Re: Comments on the Akaka Bill?

My point is in essence due to this technicality the United States should leave
Hawaii according to you.But I believe due to the laches doctrine, the statue
of limitations has run out frankly. Too much time has passed to change anything.

Never said US leave Hawaii. I support establishing a Hawaiian Nation within a Nation. I do not support total succession. It is not practical.

[kamuelakea]

Re: Comments on the Akaka Bill?

It is a no win situation frankly. I don't think the United States will ever
give up Hawaii without a fight. Hawaii is too much of a strategic importance.
Plus the US has invested too much here to walk away. On the flip side
there is a facet of Hawaiians that want the independent Hawaii back.
But I figure the muscle of the United States would smother any Hawaiian
rebellion.

You mean like they smothered the vietnamese, or Osama Bin Laden, or the mogadishu rebels, or iraq insurgents? America doesn't have a good score card when it comes to wars where they are on the wrong moral side. America loses badly.

[kamuelakea]

Re: Comments on the Akaka Bill?

Like I mentioned previously, instead of putting the Akaka bill
to the Hawaii voters, a vote to see how many people would support
a sovereign Hawaii should be put on the ballot

We don't need a soveriegn Hawaii. You aren't invited. We need a soveriegn Hawaiian Nation for real Hawaiians.

[Konaguy]

Re: Comments on the Akaka Bill?

Statute of limitations ran out on slavery, on Indians, on Eskimos, on womens right to vote. America still did the right thing. But the slavery one took 500,000 deaths.

Hawaiians need to stand up an be ready to die for their country if they want it back. With people like Konaguy, I thing the time for civil disobediance is here and the time for violence is approaching and the time for armed rebellion is probably beyond that. Unfortunately its the only thing your type understands.

I think American is a better country than that and so I hope it doesn't come to any of this, but if history is any predictor, it will.

*sigh* you didn't bother to read any of what I wrote ?
Why should I bother to have a conversation with you
when you selectively pick from my comments.As I said,
IT IS A NO WIN SITUATION FOR EITHER THE HAWAIIANS
OR THE UNITED STATES.

Do you really expect the United States to get up and leave
from Hawaii ? I for one do not expect that to happen anytime
soon. Considering Hawaii's strategic importance to the US
and the billions invested here by the United States.

[kamuelakea]

Re: Comments on the Akaka Bill?

It is a no win situation frankly. I don't think the United States will ever
give up Hawaii without a fight. Hawaii is too much of a strategic importance.
Plus the US has invested too much here to walk away. On the flip side
there is a facet of Hawaiians that want the independent Hawaii back.
But I figure the muscle of the United States would smother any Hawaiian
rebellion.

So the US Constitution is ignorable when convenient?

Interesting.

[Konaguy]

Re: Comments on the Akaka Bill?

So the US Constitution is ignorable when convenient?

Interesting.

Considering recent events with the NSA snooping on phone records, I'm
afraid that is correct. That being said, it would be enormously difficult to undue over 100 years of occupation by the United States.


On related note I understand what happened in 1893 and thereafter. I am
far more sympathetic to the plight of Hawaiians than you would ever know.
Thus I don't appreciate you blacklisting me as this bad guy.

[waioli kai]

justUS ideologues fear and despise Hawai'i Nei ,Re: Comments on the Akaka Bill?

.

Miulang= "This article is in tomorrow's (Sunday)NYT about the Akaka Bill and its future. At least it's still getting some national coverage."

The NYT article, "Hawaiians Weigh Options as Native-Status Bill Stalls" By Janis L. Magin spends half the article on "H. William Burgess, a lawyer in Honolulu and the leader of a group called Aloha for All", presenting his perspective. Ms. Magin is obviously one of the experience and mind of the average American Jo who equates Hawai'ians to Hawaiians, Hawai'i to Hawaii. Most likely it's due to her ignorance, but it could be intentional like the case of the lawyer Mr. Burgess, who no doubt considers himself to be Hawaiian. Burgess' et.al "Aloha for All " name of their campaign to further disenfranchise Hawai'ians would be laughable were it not for their success in distorting what is injustice and what should be justice: he is of the justUS ideologues who will not rest until they can have Remax, Century 21, Caldwell Banker signs on every acre of Hawai'ian lands that are not otherwise occupied or planned to be occupied by the federal government.

[Leo Lakio]

Re: Comments on the Akaka Bill?

But what Seattle does has no relevancy whatsoever to what O`ahu needs. Apples and oranges.

Not always true, friends. Any time you put this in terms of absolutes ("no relevancy whatsoever"), you are headed for trouble.

If a posting that says "here in Whatsitsville, we did this..." is viewed through a lens of "let's learn what other communities did when they experienced similar situations to those of us in Hawai`i," be it a dramatic influx of newcomers, or rising costs of affordable housing, or post-storm flooding of lowlands, or a brain-drain - that posting could be informative and helpful.

But that exact same phrase, looked at with an attitude of "our situation is so unique, no other community in the world has anything to teach us," then the reaction will tend to be one of "shut up and stop telling us what to do, outsider."

Yes - Hawai`i has a huge list of issues and concerns that are distinct from those of Mainland areas, but some issues are similar enough to what others have dealt with before (either successfully or not) that the comments of those others and their experiences just might be helpful from time to time - especially in avoiding mistakes that were made.

I'm tired of people who automatically negate the comments of the handful of us HT'ers who are off-island, simply because we are not there at present. Some have never lived there, others have spent most of their lives in Hawai`i but are not there now, and others will be returning there someday. But if the poster is not, right at this point and for whatever reason, a resident of Hawai`i, does that mean they can not ever contribute something useful to the discussion?

If that's the case, then admin may as well boot off all of us who don't reside in the Islands. Until that day, I ask that when you read the phrase "here in Whatsitsville, we...", don't assume that it implies "...and you people in Hawai`i ought to do the same." Just take the experiences and offerings of people who live a different life than yours as an opportunity to learn, whether it is relevant to you at present or not.

[Leo Lakio]

Re: Comments on the Akaka Bill?

So the US Constitution is ignorable when convenient?

Under the present administration in Washington, D.C., apparently so.