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Thread: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 3

  1. #1
    Join Date
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    Default Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 3

    Great. Another lawsuit to delay the Superferry.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 3

    Yeah, you can blame the whacko environmentalists and the Maui County Council for putting the skids on this one.
    Miulang

  3. #3

    Default Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 3

    At its peak the Superferry is expected to carry just a small fraction of vehicles and passengers moved by other means, including cruise ships, barges and aircraft.

    Yet these other modes of interisland transportation aren't going to be subject to the same environmental impact statement requirements demanded by the Superferry?

    If the Superferry actually gets to run I hope these opposing individuals don't expect to actually use it. If the Sierra Club has a major project on a neighbor island, they can go through the time and hassle of shipping all their equipment and vehicles by barge, take a seperate plane, then figure out how to get to their vehicles and gear, all the while hoping a lot of what was in the trucks didn't "fall off the barge" along the way.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 3

    Well, you can blame Maui County, the Sierra Club and other Maui organizations for again slowing down progress of the Superferry. The judge presiding over the case promised to issue her ruling "soon". Hopefully there's still time for funding to come through on this project.

    Miulang

  5. #5

    Default Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 3

    Looks like the legal barriers have been lifted -- for now.

    Of course the Sierra Club is saying it might file an appeal.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 3

    With all the new competition in interisland air carriers beginning next year (and if market forces work the way they should to lower airfares through competition), would the Superferry become less important, if the prices for the ferry were similar to what some of the smaller, newer air carriers would charge? I'm just curious if the price and convenience of travelling by air would outweigh having their cars travel with the people and less convenient schedules for the ferry? I know the military is just salivating at the arrival of the Superferry because they will be able to use it to transport their equipment and personnel between Oahu and the Big Island for training, but will it make that much of a difference to resident civilians?

    Miulang

  7. #7

    Default Hawaii Superferry

    And I am not talking abot a dragqueen super hero.

    I severyone as stoked about this as I am??

  8. #8
    Join Date
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    Default Re: Hawaii Superferry

    uh... any way you could possibly rephrase the question?

  9. #9

    Default Re: Hawaii Superferry

    Sure,

    Is anyone as stoked as I am to see the Ferry system in Hawaii. My dad lives on the Big Island, and I am an avid kitesurfer and windsurfer, so a maui trip would be AWESOME! Dive on with your gear and family and drive off and visit the folks. KILLER!!!!!!!!!!!!

  10. #10

    Default Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 3

    The superferry just jumped it's last legal hurdle (sp) LET THE GAMES BEGIN!!!!!!!!

  11. #11

    Default Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 3

    Seems I'm not the only one who's suspicious about the reasons why certain businesspeople and governmental entities are waiting anxiously for the Superferry to begin service.

    Herewith an excerpt from a letter to the editor in today's Maui News:

    "...In the ongoing saga of the Hawaii Superferry, it is interesting to note that John Lehman, former Reagan secretary of the Navy, was appointed as a Superferry board member. Lehman’s private equity firm is investing $59 million in the Superferry.

    Seems Mr. Lehman will, under the guise of “Superferry H-3,” operate the Westpac Express, whose mission is “essentially to carry military equipment and ferry vehicles from Oahu to the Big Island on a daily basis” and to make it easier for training when the Stryker Brigade comes to Hawaii. According to Pacific Business News, “Hawaii Superferry provided the Army with a cost analysis and expects to negotiate a long-term contract.”..."

    Hello? Isn't the Superferry being partially subsidized by the State for the benefit of its citizens? If the Army intends to use it to shuttle its troops and equipment between Honolulu and Pohakuloa, perhaps the DoD should also help pay for the cost.

    Miulang

  12. #12
    Join Date
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    Default Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Miulang
    Seems I'm not the only one who's suspicious about the reasons why certain businesspeople and governmental entities are waiting anxiously for the Superferry to begin service.

    Herewith an excerpt from a letter to the editor in today's Maui News:

    "...In the ongoing saga of the Hawaii Superferry, it is interesting to note that John Lehman, former Reagan secretary of the Navy, was appointed as a Superferry board member. Lehman’s private equity firm is investing $59 million in the Superferry.

    Seems Mr. Lehman will, under the guise of “Superferry H-3,” operate the Westpac Express, whose mission is “essentially to carry military equipment and ferry vehicles from Oahu to the Big Island on a daily basis” and to make it easier for training when the Stryker Brigade comes to Hawaii. According to Pacific Business News, “Hawaii Superferry provided the Army with a cost analysis and expects to negotiate a long-term contract.”..."

    Hello? Isn't the Superferry being partially subsidized by the State for the benefit of its citizens? If the Army intends to use it to shuttle its troops and equipment between Honolulu and Pohakuloa, perhaps the DoD should also help pay for the cost.

    Miulang
    Of course, defense was also the excuse used to build the Interstate system... talk of the "military industrial complex". ouch.

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Rickyrab
    Of course, defense was also the excuse used to build the Interstate system... talk of the "military industrial complex". ouch.
    On the other hand, it would allow folks with some disabilities to travel more easily in the islands, and it's bigger and much more luxurious than the old Boeing Jetfoils...

  14. #14
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    Default Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 3

    The Advertiser reports that the Hawaii Superferry people have gotten their financing. The target date for starting interisland ferry service is April 2007. Can't wait.

  15. #15

    Default Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Glen Miyashiro
    The Advertiser reports that the Hawaii Superferry people have gotten their financing. The target date for starting interisland ferry service is April 2007. Can't wait.
    You may have to plan your trips around the times that the DoD wants to comandeer the first ferry that will be in service for use in transporting its troops from Oahu to Pohakuloa!

    Miulang

  16. #16

    Default Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Miulang
    You may have to plan your trips around the times that the DoD wants to comandeer the first ferry that will be in service for use in transporting its troops from Oahu to Pohakuloa!
    The military already has ways to get its gear anywhere in the world. And they move just about anything to Pohakuloa at will. As for moving troops, there's a bunch of twin-rotor helicopters and other aircraft that can move fully equipped personnel without going through the hassle of transferring them through civilian carriers.

    Imagine trying to board 50 soldiers with rifles, grenade launchers and ammo onto a boat at Honolulu Harbor.

  17. #17

    Default Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Composite 2992
    The military already has ways to get its gear anywhere in the world. And they move just about anything to Pohakuloa at will. As for moving troops, there's a bunch of twin-rotor helicopters and other aircraft that can move fully equipped personnel without going through the hassle of transferring them through civilian carriers.

    Imagine trying to board 50 soldiers with rifles, grenade launchers and ammo onto a boat at Honolulu Harbor.
    It has previously been disclosed that the Superferry folks have been in discussions with the DoD to use the ferry as a way to get personnel and equipment to Pohakuloa. The DoD had already admitted that the current ways of transporting troops and equipment between Oahu and the Big Island is too costly, thus they haven't been able to conduct many training sessions on the Big Island. With the Stryker training on both Oahu and the Big Island shifting into high gear, no doubt the DoD has its eyes on the Superferry as a more cost effective way to get stuff to and from the Big Island.

    In the 60s and 70s, military personnel in uniform could fly on any flight on a standby basis as long as there was a seat available on a flight. Now private citizens will have to travel on a standby basis on the Superferry...how times have changed!

    Miulang

  18. #18

    Default Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Miulang
    It has previously been disclosed that the Superferry folks have been in discussions with the DoD to use the ferry as a way to get personnel and equipment to Pohakuloa. The DoD had already admitted that the current ways of transporting troops and equipment between Oahu and the Big Island is too costly, thus they haven't been able to conduct many training sessions on the Big Island.
    Travelling by commercial carrier isn't going to be any cheaper than travelling via their own means. And as for speed on the water, the Navy is already developing high-speed ships. And right now there's a 300-foot monohull hydrofoil being tested here by the same company that runs the Navatek.

    When the band of the Hawaii Army National Guard attended the unveiling of the 442nd and 100th Battalion memorials at Camp Shelby Mississippi, they went via a Hawaii Air National Guard KC-135 tanker/cargo jet.

    The Army has its own vessels -- not the US Navy -- to transport equipment interisland. One of those ships was standing by to move tons of equipment to Kauai immediately after Hurricane Iniki. It was ready to get there within 12 hours of a "go" signal, but Kauai's government delayed that call for two or three days.

    The Marines also have ships available -- the Navy -- and use these ships to get their equipment around. Some of these ships are specialty vessels that are designed to launch landing craft, amphibious vehicles or helicopters. These can be observed operating offshore of Bellows Field every year.

    Army CH-47 helicopters can move about 40,000 pounds of equipment or personnel per flight.

    If the Superferry becomes part of that process it might not be a bad thing. It'll help ensure additional cash flow. And those trips could take place during non-passenger hours so it doesn't necessarily have to affect scheduled runs. The airlines do the same thing with cargo runs. Aloha flies freight in the middle of the night using the same aircraft used for their daytime passenger flights.

    Overall, I'd say it's not a whole lot to worry about just yet. After all, the Superferry doesn't even begin to operate until 2007. And you can bet they're not about to wreck their reputation as an interisland carrier by cancelling a lot of scheduled trips. Not when they're trying to make a huge first impression on a fickle travelling public.

  19. #19

    Default It Ain't a Done Deal Yet on Maui...

    Three environmental groups on Maui just filed another suit contesting the results of the final Environmental Assessment that cleared the way for the Hawai'i Superferry people to start work on a terminal at Kahului Harbor.

    "...conflicting information in the draft environmental document and the final product as well as the operating agreement signed just a few months ago between Superferry officials and DOT. For instance, a distinct two-lane roadway from Puunene Avenue to Pier 2 to accommodate vehicles and passengers loading and unloading from the Superferry is part of a map in the operating agreement and the draft EA. But it is not included in the final EA, replaced by a broken line between Puunene and Pier 2, he said.

    The Superferry’s operating agreement makes it clear that traffic for that operation will enter and exit from Puunene and the draft EA states that “the north end of Puunene Avenue . . . will have to be renovated to accommodate the increase in traffic.” The final EA, however, says that Superferry traffic will “be primarily limited” to Wharf Street or Hobron Avenue.

    The traffic study cited was completed in 2002 for a retail project at the intersection of Hobron and Kaahumanu avenues although Superferry officials have indicated traffic from the ferry will use the intersection at Puunene and Kaahumanu avenues. A passenger terminal and other facilities are proposed to be located on the property that now accommodates a Valley Isle Motors used car lot.

    It’s not the first time the Superferry has caused some head scratching. In October, legislators indicated they were surprised by the lack of answers from Transportation Director Rod Haraga and other harbors officials about the ferry’s proposed operations. Legislators took a site visit to the busy harbor on a day when a single car parked out of place brought Pier 2 to a standstill...."



    This could push launch of the ferry back a little longer. I know where the Superferry wants to put their terminal, and I also know the intersection where the cars offloading from the ship are supposed to enter traffic. I don't see how they could redesign that part of Puunene Ave. to allow for an extra stream of cars. It's so bad on that stretch now during rush hours that the ferry would have to dock at Kahului at some very weird and inconvenient times (for those using the ferry) in order for the additional traffic not to impact other commuters.

    Miulang

  20. #20

    Default Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 3

    The operational plan states that there will be one arrival at Maui per day in the beginning. It will increase to two when the second superferry starts operating.

    Each arrival could mean having up to 250 vehicles and up to 900 people come ashore. That's assuming a full load.

    If this is measured against how many cars use those routes on a daily basis, I'd wager that it's a small fraction of the number of vehicles that pass through that area during Kahului's rush hour. And that assumes these vehicles arrive during rush hour which is probably unlikely.

  21. #21

    Default Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 3

    Quote Originally Posted by Composite 2992
    If this is measured against how many cars use those routes on a daily basis, I'd wager that it's a small fraction of the number of vehicles that pass through that area during Kahului's rush hour. And that assumes these vehicles arrive during rush hour which is probably unlikely.
    If you've ever had to wait for a green light in that stretch of highway between the airport road and say, Kaahumanu Center to the north and Dairy Road to the south (where there's a stop light about every block), even another 50 cars is going to be a big deal. And having the ferry dock at midnight? Might not be too desirable for the people on the ferry, either, to have to disembark at midnight. Rush hour now is from about 5:30 to 10 a.m. and about 3 p.m. to 7 p.m. I think they'd be smarter to have the ferry land at Ma'alaea. Oh wait. They probably couldn't do that. They'd be endangering the humpbacks in the winter.

    Miulang
    Last edited by Miulang; January 23rd, 2006 at 08:35 AM.

  22. #22
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    Default Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 3

    Traffic stay already screwed along the Kaahumanu Ave. when the NCL Ship`s dock at Kahului Harbor. Going be one nightmare when SuperFerry arrives. Again, lack off planning, go for the big buck`s............

    CAN?????/CAN!!!!!!

  23. #23
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    Default Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 3

    Wasn't "Hawai'i Superferry" a character that danced at da Glade's?

  24. #24

    Default Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 3

    Quote Originally Posted by kimo55
    Wasn't "Hawai'i Superferry" a character that danced at da Glade's?
    Yeah, his name was "Ms. Aloha Oy"!

    Miulang

  25. #25

    Default Re: Hawai'i Superferry - Chapter 3

    Quote Originally Posted by oggboy
    Traffic stay already screwed along the Kaahumanu Ave. when the NCL Ship`s dock at Kahului Harbor. Going be one nightmare when SuperFerry arrives. Again, lack off planning, go for the big buck`s............

    CAN?????/CAN!!!!!!
    Yeah, imagine...when the NCL cruise ship docks, you're only talking about foot traffic. When the Superferry docks, it'll mean cars AND foot traffic.

    Miulang

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