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  • #16
    Re: HD UH Football Games?

    Originally posted by Media Guy View Post
    Sorry Random, but I doubt any stations are going to invest in improving OTA.
    Less than 5% of Hawaii's viewing audience watches OTA. It's just not economincally feesable to invest that in much capital expenditures for such a small amount of viewers.
    Sighs. I guess we have to subscribe to everything: TV programming, radio (including the Emergency Broadcast System, not including tax subsidies), public toilet use...
    Beijing 8-08-08 to 8-24-08

    Tiananmen Square 4-15-89 to 6-04-89

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    • #17
      Re: HD UH Football Games?

      Originally posted by Random View Post
      Sighs. I guess we have to subscribe to everything: TV programming, radio (including the Emergency Broadcast System, not including tax subsidies), public toilet use...
      You don’t have to. (Unfortunately for you) it’s just the choice 95% of households have already made. You could lobby for OTA and start a campaign to cancel cable subscriptions statewide. But many of the people who considered that, chose to convert to DirecTV® or the DISH™ network in the end. You could find friends among them.

      We can’t be so fixated on our desire to preserve the rights of ordinary Americans.

      — U.S. President Bill Clinton
      USA TODAY, page 2A
      11 March 1993

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      • #18
        Re: HD UH Football Games?

        One evening, after receiving my cable bill, I decided to call Oceanic Cable to have them explain some of the charges on my $143.00 monthly bill. Three times during the explanation I interrupted the representative and asked him to elaborate on a particular point. When I interrupted him the third time, he said to me, "Sir, if you would shut up and listen, you might be able to understand what I am telling you." I bit my tongue, thanked him for his time and hung up.

        The next day I called Dish TV and had them install service. I also had Hawaiian Tel install DSL service. When the new service was in, I cancelled Oceanic Cable.

        I now have better picture quality with Dish TV as well as Sirius/XM satellite music channels. My DSL service is faster and more reliable than the Road Runner service I had before.

        And my total Cable/Internet bill is about $40.00 a month less.

        I'll miss seeing the UH games at home, but Oceanic Time Warner's arrogance finally got to me.

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        • #19
          Re: HD UH Football Games?

          There's no excuse for the customer services agent's arrogance, but let me give all you Oceanic hater's an explaination of why you are billed for watching the service they supply.
          First of all, if any of you remember before cable (early 70s), only about four stations were available OTA for about 45% of the population. Everyone loved when cable came in, although there was only about a dozen channels.
          Oceanic now has over 80 channels on basic analog cable. Digital about 150, Digital HD 175, and another 50 coming by year end.
          Oceanic pays an average of $35 million a month for those channels.
          So Oceanic brings in about $40 million a month for cable subscriptions, and nets $5 million a month from it.
          Now take in consideration what they pay out for the payroll and benefits the hundreds of people it employs, maintance and repairs, equipment purchases, land and building leases.
          They are a business, and most of us don't mind paying for the service they provide, and more importantly don't want to go back to watching three or four fuzzy channels.
          Its a choice everyone can make to do or not to do, but obviously 95% of the population has made that choice. Its the beauty of free enterprise.

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          • #20
            Re: HD UH Football Games?

            Originally posted by Media Guy View Post
            Sorry Random, but I doubt any stations are going to invest in improving OTA.
            Less than 5% of Hawaii's viewing audience watches OTA. It's just not economincally feesable to invest that in much capital expenditures for such a small amount of viewers.
            Yep. I said it before and I'll say it again. This is all, first and foremost, a business. Hence, the decisions are dictated by numbers, not "fairness to all."

            Originally posted by DaleP View Post
            I now have better picture quality with Dish TV
            Better picture quality with satellite? Sure,.... until the days when heavy cloud cover disrupts the reception on all of your channels. And those days will happen. If you can live with those brief periods when the weather plays havoc with your TV reception, then the move to Dish Network will have been a good one for you. I have a couple of other friends (one living in Manoa, the other Nuuanu) who ditched Oceanic for Dish, then switched back because they couldn't stand the disruptions. Of course, they live in areas with higher than average rainfall. The problem may not be as bad in areas with clearer skies.

            Originally posted by Media Guy View Post
            First of all, if any of you remember before cable (early 70s), only about four stations were available OTA for about 45% of the population. Everyone loved when cable came in, although there was only about a dozen channels.
            Much of what you say here is true,..... except that cable TV service on Oahu existed as far back as the 1960s. Back then, there was no cable TV programming (HBO, Showtime, TBS, etc). Just the OTA TV channels and a few FM radio stations. Despite the lack of cable programming, there was a demand for cable service as there were a significant number of households located in valleys where OTA reception was very weak, even with rooftop aerials.
            This post may contain an opinion that may conflict with your opinion. Do not take it personal. Polite discussion of difference of opinion is welcome.

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            • #21
              Re: HD UH Football Games?

              Originally posted by Frankie's Market View Post
              Yep. I said it before and I'll say it again. This is all, first and foremost, a business. Hence, the decisions are dictated by numbers, not "fairness to all."



              Better picture quality with satellite? Sure,.... until the days when heavy cloud cover disrupts the reception on all of your channels. And those days will happen. If you can live with those brief periods when the weather plays havoc with your TV reception, then the move to Dish Network will have been a good one for you. I have a couple of other friends (one living in Manoa, the other Nuuanu) who ditched Oceanic for Dish, then switched back because they couldn't stand the disruptions. Of course, they live in areas with higher than average rainfall. The problem may not be as bad in areas with clearer skies.



              Much of what you say here is true,..... except that cable TV service on Oahu existed as far back as the 1960s. Back then, there was no cable TV programming (HBO, Showtime, TBS, etc). Just the OTA TV channels and a few FM radio stations. Despite the lack of cable programming, there was a demand for cable service as there were a significant number of households located in valleys where OTA reception was very weak, even with rooftop aerials.
              You're right. I Mis-remembered, but I knew it was in demand because many households, including mine could only catch one or two stations in Kailua.

              Comment


              • #22
                Re: HD UH Football Games?

                Originally posted by TuNnL View Post
                You don’t have to. (Unfortunately for you) it’s just the choice 95% of households have already made. You could lobby for OTA and start a campaign to cancel cable subscriptions statewide. But many of the people who considered that, chose to convert to DirecTV® or the DISH™ network in the end. You could find friends among them.
                I don't want to cancel cable subscription. The last thing I want is for FM to be mad at me because he can't watch his Disney Channel.

                Like Obama's health insurance plan, I want the free option, while others can still choose the other ones. If that means the government through FCC can provide tax break for OTA stations to upgrade HD OTA equipment, then that's great.

                And you're right, FM it is business. So, not to hijack the thread, but what's in it for us Molokai folk to put up windmill farms to provide Oahu more electricity demand?
                Last edited by Random; August 29, 2009, 09:22 PM.
                Beijing 8-08-08 to 8-24-08

                Tiananmen Square 4-15-89 to 6-04-89

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: HD UH Football Games?

                  Originally posted by Random View Post
                  And you're right, FM it is business. So, not to hijack the thread, but what's in it for us Molokai folk to put up windmill farms to provide Oahu more electricity demand?
                  Good question. The answer is found here:

                  http://www.firstwind.com/aboutFirstW...06c1c3103&test

                  To determine whether Molokai residents would support a large wind farm transmitting power to Oahu, First Wind spent more than two years meeting with Molokai individuals, families, nonprofit organizations, businesses, and community organizations. Residents asked for lower electricity costs, clean and renewable fuel sources for the Molokai electrical grid, community access to any lands where a wind farm is constructed, and control over the lands currently owned by the Molokai Ranch. In response to these concerns, First Wind committed to working with residents to achieve all of these goals.

                  **************

                  “After two years of discussions, we feel comfortable partnering with First Wind,” said Kammy Purdy, a Hawaiian homesteader living in Hoolehua where the proposed project will be located. “They understand the significance of doing this project on Hawaiian Home Lands. This is a win-win situation – we have a productive use of our lands and we contribute to a better environment for our island, our state, our nation and the world – all in a way that preserves our island, respects our lifestyle, generates revenue and uses modern technology.

                  The additional 150 MW of wind generation could be constructed on lands commonly referred to as the Molokai Ranch, and owned by Molokai Properties Limited, a subsidiary of the Hong Kong-based Guoco Group Limited. When First Wind came to Molokai in 2006, community leaders were already working to organize a campaign to purchase Molokai Ranch from Guoco. In November 2007, First Wind made a $50 million pledge to this campaign. The Molokai Community Service Council, a non-profit community development corporation, spearheads the Ho‘i I Ka Pono (“Restore the Pono”) campaign to purchase the Ranch. Executive Director Karen Holt explains that the campaign is based on the conviction that “the only way to protect Moloka‘i’s culture, environment and lifestyle is to give the people who live here the power to decide how to manage our limited resources.” If the community succeeds in purchasing the Ranch, First Wind would lease lands from the community to build its wind farm, and the community would use the income to create jobs, restoring Molokai’s environmental and cultural resources.
                  This post may contain an opinion that may conflict with your opinion. Do not take it personal. Polite discussion of difference of opinion is welcome.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Re: HD UH Football Games?

                    Originally posted by Frankie's Market View Post


                    Better picture quality with satellite? Sure,.... until the days when heavy cloud cover disrupts the reception on all of your channels. And those days will happen. If you can live with those brief periods when the weather plays havoc with your TV reception, then the move to Dish Network will have been a good one for you. I have a couple of other friends (one living in Manoa, the other Nuuanu) who ditched Oceanic for Dish, then switched back because they couldn't stand the disruptions. Of course, they live in areas with higher than average rainfall. The problem may not be as bad in areas with clearer skies.

                    Almost a year with only a couple of minor outages during heavy rainfall. That's about the same number of outages I had in a similar time frame with cable.

                    I could make a long list of other things that added to my dissatisfaction with Time Warner (at the top of the list would be the sub-par digital DVR box), but that really isn't the point of this thread.

                    My memories of life before cable are fuzzy...not because I'm getting older, but because most of the OTA video was...fuzzy. Cable has provided a wonderful service, but I decided that they really didn't care if they had my business or not, so I moved on to Dish TV.

                    On another off-thread note, I believe we are just a few years away from seeing the end of OTA TV as a delivery medium for network television. Over twenty years ago, when I was working in 30 Rock, a friend of mine on the television side told me of plans being discussed by NBC to bypass the affiliates altogether. It was (and still is) considered an inefficient and expensive delivery system. And that was before the Internet entered the picture.

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                    • #25
                      Re: HD UH Football Games?

                      That was because until recently the networks used to pay their affiliates to run network programming. Now there's reverse compensation, where station are paying to be affilates. FOX in New Orleans and upstate. NBC is trying to go that way with most of its affiliates when it renews their contracts.

                      http://www.tvweek.com/news/2008/07/n...re_to_swal.php

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                      • #26
                        Re: HD UH Football Games?

                        Compensation never really amounted to more than about 5% of a station's revenues. I never negotiated any TV comp agreements, but I handled a few CBS Radio agreements in the 1970's for a station for which I was working. In order to qualify for any compensation at all, we had to carry an awful lot of CBS programming each hour. Six minutes of news at the top of the hour, a feature at :25 past the hour, sometimes another feature at :30, and drive time sports shows at :45. But, it was less than it had been prior to 1972, when "Arthur Godfrey Time" was on every weekday. By the 1980's, all of the radio networks were a lot more flexible about what you could and couldn't carry.

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                        • #27
                          Re: HD UH Football Games?

                          No, it may not add much to a station's revenue, but when a network has to pay out to all its affilates it adds up. Also, as you know, unlike radio, TV stations do air a lot of network content.

                          With reverse compensation added to the downturn in advertising revenue, a lot of struggling local affilates are going to be squeezing for positive BCF.
                          Last edited by Media Guy; August 31, 2009, 05:43 PM. Reason: accidently posted before finishing

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                          • #28
                            Re: HD UH Football Games?

                            Originally posted by Media Guy View Post
                            That was because until recently the networks used to pay their affiliates to run network programming. Now there's reverse compensation, where station are paying to be affilates. FOX in New Orleans and upstate. NBC is trying to go that way with most of its affiliates when it renews their contracts.

                            http://www.tvweek.com/news/2008/07/n...re_to_swal.php
                            These three paragraphs were quite interesting to say the least:

                            But there has been some concern verbalized for the numerous stations—one person familiar with the landscape put the number at 75 to 100—that are on the bubble and for whom paying reverse comp might mean the loss of local news because the stations could no longer afford to produce it.

                            Since the meeting, there also have been occasional sounds of pushback from affiliates who say that if they are going to have to pay for network programming, perhaps they will consider signing up with a network whose programming lineups are stronger.

                            At the meeting with local stations, Mr. Zucker also raised the possibility of reducing the number of prime-time hours NBC programs. He did not say whether NBC might consider going black on one night—more than one broadcast network has pondered walking away from low-viewership Saturday nights—or during an hour at the end of some nights.

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                            • #29
                              Re: HD UH Football Games?

                              Yep,
                              TV as we know it is going to be a lot different in a couple of years. Even the large station groups are struggling to survive, so the KFVE, KHNL, KGMB shared services agreement isn't that surprising.
                              It's an expensive, money-losing proposition to own a tv station now days.

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                              • #30
                                Re: HD UH Football Games?

                                This best way to make a small fortune in broadcasting in Hawaii....is to start with a big fortune.

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