The Hillary Rodham Clinton Watch

[sinjin]

Re: The Hillary Rodham Watch

Such an important factor in deciding who to vote for.

Then HRC is screwed.

[glossyp]

Re: The Hillary Rodham Watch

Most of us want Barak to get the nod.

I'm very interested to hear the reasons this clearly thoughtful group of ladies have for favoring Obama.

[Pua'i Mana'o]

Re: The Hillary Rodham Watch

Such an important factor in deciding who to vote for. Hey, maybe then we can get a Republican President caught in a (Bill) Clinton-esque web!

I figured I would get a response like this, even though I made every attempt to be honest and clear in how MR gets discussed, to whit:

We muse that we might vote for Mitt just because he has had to defend being a Mormon when the mainstream Protestants would never have to do such a thing. Plus, the dude has the most sex appeal of all of them.

In other words, we pay attention to that candidate because he has had to champion in a context where his values and principles and lifestyle guidelines are contrary to what's commonly accepted.

Ok, and because we are also all fully-ovulating hetero-breeding buncha feral cougarmammas, we cannot help but appreciate our evolutionary right to entertain a bit of bio-speculating, and who among us would disregard presidential material their right to earn our ovarian priviledge? To be clear, this last bit is a humourous sideline, not a reason to pass on a vote.

[Leo Lakio]

Re: The Hillary Rodham Watch

To be clear, this last bit is a humourous sideline, not a reason to pass on a vote.

I knew that - hence the sarcastic smiley at the end.

[Pua'i Mana'o]

Re: The Hillary Rodham Watch

I'm very interested to hear the reasons this clearly thoughtful group of ladies have for favoring Obama.

as one of us said, "in this day of liberal-bashing, he has the guts to be a real liberal." His voting record reflects that. His speeches and his book tells of a deep-thinking man. His experiences as C: None of the Above resonates well with us because that will be the one whose patriotism will be least rooted in blind xenophobia, qualities we need in a president.

Don't get me wrong; I am one of those ledes who has great respect for HRC. She is tough and resolute. But her foreign policy leaves us wanting, and she brings with her a lot of 1990's baggage. In this respect, if we have her for president, our country is still going to be quite divided, because like the last two presidents, she is more flashpoint than conciliator.

Barak? Nobody knows wtf he is. No pedigree. Nothing for the provincials to write home about. And that is a good thing. He's a gamma. And brilliant. And open-minded. And he gets it.

Put them on the same ticket, and I will be really happy.

[Pua'i Mana'o]

Re: The Hillary Rodham Watch

Then HRC is screwed.

is she really ugly?

How come so many men just hate her?

[glossyp]

Re: The Hillary Rodham Watch

Thanks for the detailed response to the Obama question.

I don't think that HRC is so much physically distasteful as she is completely unappealing from a personality perspective. And that voice, it makes my hair stand on end. Can you imagine listening to that voice day after day?

[sinjin]

Re: The Hillary Rodham Watch

is she really ugly?

How come so many men just hate her?

I don't think she's ugly. Besides some ugly women have lots of sex appeal. I don't actually hate her and I won't speak for other men as I know I'm not typical. She lacks that feminine quality I have been avoiding discussing from a while back. Suffice to say that for me, the more a woman's strength mimics that of a strong man, the less I like her.

[Pua'i Mana'o]

Re: The Hillary Rodham Watch

She lacks that feminine quality I have been avoiding discussing from a while back. Suffice to say that for me, the more a woman's strength mimics that of a strong man, the less I like her.

what is "that feminine quality"? Seriously, I am curious.

Although you aren't typical sin, your opinion on HRC is, and she must be heeding the bigger vibe. HRC seems to tailor herself in soft clothing and hairstyles. Her body language also is careful to combat appearing like Rosey the Riveter. (old WWII poster, not comedienne)

People make fun of her cackle (which I didn't notice as unusual). Her femininity is always always on trial, and I want to know what is it? Nothing about her seems the teensiest bit masculine to me. She is a strong woman, quite typical of someone who has been in a 30 yr marriage. Look at a lot of 60 yr old women around you and tell me you cannot see HRC as part of that flock.

Really, enquiring minds want to know. Not to argue, but because chances are chicks like me are going to turn into 60 yr old broads one day, and what is it that we can/cannot do to assure that we are indeed feminine (now this seems snarky, but I really don't mean it).

[kamuelakea]

Re: The Hillary Rodham Watch

what is "that feminine quality"? Seriously, I am curious.

The example I've heard, and which I relate to, is that Margaret Thatcher was a strong female (still feminine) leader. Hillary is a man wannabee. Thatcher almost always wore a dress and jewelry and did her hair yet somehow was seen as "strong".

Hillary looks odd in a dress. Too Butchy.

[glossyp]

Re: The Hillary Rodham Watch

I will take a stab at what it is that turns many people off about HRC, myself included. She lacks human warmth. I've never heard or seen her act in a way which I felt was natural and from the heart. I always wonder what her agenda is. I don't view her as a strong woman; I view her as a calculating and opportunistic person willing to do/say whatever suits the situation at the time. That's why she seems unwomanly to me. All the pastels, soft highlights and pearls cannot make up for her lack of soul.

[Pua'i Mana'o]

Re: The Hillary Rodham Watch

I will take a stab at what it is that turns many people off about HRC, myself included. She lacks human warmth. I've never heard or seen her act in a way which I felt was natural and from the heart. I always wonder what her agenda is. I don't view her as a strong woman; I view her as a calculating and opportunistic person willing to do/say whatever suits the situation at the time. That's why she seems unwomanly to me. All the pastels, soft highlights and pearls cannot make up for her lack of soul.

I can wrap my mind around that and how much of that is the result of the chipping away of one's soul over the decades by staying in a marriage where you (her) will never be enough for your husband? Did she default into her loveless existence? Her husband, I do believe, loves and respects her on some level. But he doesn't honor her and it is in his blood--there must always be another babe around the corner.

Do we know married couples like this in real life? Aren't the women cold and in their shells, driven there by the constant humiliation over time? Aren't the men, over time, less and less concerned with their tarnished reputations?

That said, I don't feel sorry for HRC or other women like her. They can exhale if they choose. Maybe if HRC did, she would be happier. And probably get her femininity back.

[Leo Lakio]

Re: The Hillary Rodham Watch

I dislike HRC because her policies closely mirror those of her husband, who was a huge failure as a President, in my eyes. He wasted substantial opportunities to correct the cruel directions this country took under Reagan, directions that have led directly to much of the world's dislike of the USA.

Both Clintons represent the wing of the Democratic Party that believes the only way to affect change is to get elected - therefore, with election as the primary goal, traditional values of the Party are open to being trashed along the way, thus taking the Party farther and farther away from its long-time heart, and turning it into GOP-Lite. (Obviously, I am not residing in that wing.)

My attitude is not affected by perceptions of her femininity, coldness or physical appearance; I just don't want the Dems to regain the White House only to waste another eight years.

I am disappointed that Obama does not support gay marriage, but beyond that, he has shown, as Pua`i Mana`o noted, stronger "traditional liberal" views than most of the candidates.

[glossyp]

Re: The Hillary Rodham Watch

I can wrap my mind around that and how much of that is the result of the chipping away of one's soul over the decades by staying in a marriage where you (her) will never be enough for your husband? Did she default into her loveless existence? Her husband, I do believe, loves and respects her on some level. But he doesn't honor her and it is in his blood--there must always be another babe around the corner.

You invoked what I consider one of the single most important values in a successful marriage and that is honor. And it is indeed possible that years of dishonor chipped away at what soul HRC had (or that she keeps so hidden it cannot be found). You also point out that she made a choice to stay with him. I freely admit part of my disdain for HRC is that not only has she stayed with Bill, she has also provided cover for him in circumstances that are inconceivable to me. I am left to conclude that she basically sold her soul and sense of right and wrong for a chance to have a political life and that is not someone I can support.

Coming of age late in the feminist era, I never thought that the first woman to run for president would be there primarily because of her husband. Where is the feminism in that?

[Pua'i Mana'o]

Re: The Hillary Rodham Watch

see what I mean? HRC has too much baggage.

If she somehow made it onto the D ticket, I would vote for her. I don't judge her based on her marriage; that is her business. Would she make a better US president than Giuliani, Romney or McCain? I think so. I really do.