Presidential debates

[Frankie's Market]

Re: Presidential debates

I agree that it was boring at times and that it was pretty much a draw. I think a draw in this case equals a slight win for Obama.
I was surprised to see this CNN poll from moments ago:

Who fared better in the first presidential debate?

Sen. John McCain... 28%... 31,232

Sen. Barack Obama... 67%... 75,592

Neither... 6%... 6,303

Total Votes: 113,127

Obama seems to be leading in most of these early polls, asking people who won the debate. I think a lot of it has to do with style over substance.

McCain spent almost the entire evening speaking at the camera. He almost never looked at Obama, even when responding to something his opponent is saying. McCain never directly talked to Obama, as moderator Lehrer encouraged both candidates to do in the beginning. While one might attribute this to McCain feeling uncomfortable in this setting, the fact that he kept saying that Obama "didn't understand" might have contributed to the perception that the Arizona senator was being condescending and dismissive of Obama. This was in sharp contrast to Obama, who looked at McCain throughout when listening to his counterpart and responding to something that was said. Obama also directly addressed McCain numerous times.

In a couple of weeks, both men will be engaged in a town hall setting for their next debate, which supposedly is a format that McCain is more comfortable in. Should be interesting. But first, the veep candidates go at it next Thursday in St. Louis. Being that this is the only veep debate, there will be no topic of focus. Anything goes.

[Vanguard]

Re: Presidential debates

First Presidential Debate scorecard

[TATTRAT]

Re: Presidential debates

McCain spent almost the entire evening speaking at the camera. He almost never looked at Obama, even when responding to something his opponent is saying. McCain never directly talked to Obama, as moderator Lehrer encouraged both candidates to do in the beginning.

I found it to be quite the contrary, McCain talked more to Lehrer then the camera. I felt NO connection at all with his presentation. The fact he did not talk to Obama reminds me of a dog with his tail between his legs.

For someone of that age, and experience, to not be able to look someone in the eye and make a point, is a little discouraging. Just my opinion.

[matapule]

Re: Presidential debates

I have the following general comments about the debate.

1. I wanted the candidates to speak to me through the camera. Both spoke to Lehrer. I think they can best connect to the public by looking straight out of the TV at us. Nixon was a master of always knowing where the camera was.

2. Lehrer did his best to get them to answer the questions he posed. Both candidates had their talking points and wanted to get that information out rather than answer the question directly.

3. McCain refused to acknowledge the presence of Obama. I think this can be attributed to either a lack of respect, an insult that Obama is a person of no importance, or McCain is intimidated by Obama (which is what many behavioral scientists are say on the Internet today). They say that the rapidly blinking eye lids and refusal to look at his opponent is a sign of subservience and feeling intimidating.

4. Obama did look at McCain when addressing him. I thought by calling him the familiar, "John" he was trying to show he was willing to try to build consensus through dialog. However, many bloggers feel Obama was disrespectful by calling him John and "uppity.

5. It is my opinion that it was not good strategy for Obama to say, "You are right." Although, it shows that Obama is a nice guy and willing to concede when his opponent was correct, it also could be interpreted as being obsequious.

6. Although most polls this morning give Obama the edge, McCain did better than I thought he would.

[Vanguard]

Re: Presidential debates

Regarding 4 and 5, I've seen live (local) debates where the future winner of an election called his opponent by their first name and agreed with certain points they made in their debate. None of this seemed to stop their chances of winning the election.

[Peshkwe]

Re: Presidential debates

The first name thing came after the instruction to "talk to each other" came too. I wasn't bothered by it or thought Obama was disrespecting McCain, more that he was trying to do the conversational thing vs the formal thing.

Obama saying "you're right" to things he agreed with wasn't a bad thing. It showed the folks on the fence he wasn't totally against things of the opposition simply because it was the oppositions viewpoint. Shows he's more centrist than what the far right wants to paint him as.

[Peshkwe]

Re: Presidential debates

Here ya go, a highlight reel...it's saying Senator McCain then comes the 'talk to each other' then comes the first name thing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s1-zNYqW2i0

[matapule]

Re: Presidential debates

Time magazine writer, Mark Halperin, has graded the debate here. It is an interesting read. It is just one person's opinion and could have been graded just the opposite by someone else. However, it appears that Halperin is in agreement with the morning after analyses (being the plural of analysis).

[timkona]

Re: Presidential debates

Somebody better check McCain's heartbeat. Deadpan, stoicism seems to be his MO, until he gets angry. That's what a lifetime of military training will do.

My view of McCain is unchanged. My view of Obama is slightly elevated. He held his own, factually speaking, and appeared confident in his answers. Obama is the best thing to ever happen to Punahou enrollment PR.

But the truth is, I feel like I'm watching a replay of the last election, where Bush and Kerry were BOTH not qualified to lead this nation.

I still can't believe that Dems ignored Bill Richardson. What gives? Wait, don't answer that. I don't want to be accused of hijacking another thread.

[Frankie's Market]

Re: Presidential debates

3. McCain refused to acknowledge the presence of Obama. I think this can be attributed to either a lack of respect, an insult that Obama is a person of no importance, or McCain is intimidated by Obama (which is what many behavioral scientists are say on the Internet today). They say that the rapidly blinking eye lids and refusal to look at his opponent is a sign of subservience and feeling intimidating.

4. Obama did look at McCain when addressing him. I thought by calling him the familiar, "John" he was trying to show he was willing to try to build consensus through dialog. However, many bloggers feel Obama was disrespectful by calling him John and "uppity.

These 2 observations interwine with each other. Note that Obama used "John" only when directly talking to McCain, not when he was addressing the audience. The fact that you never heard McCain say "Barack" is because he never once talked to his fellow senator. Since the debate rules allowed (and the moderator even encouraged) both senators to talk to each other when it came time to respond to answers and to ask each other questions, who's really being disrespectful here? Seems to me that by not acknowledging Obama's presence while at the podium, McCain was not according Obama the proper courtesy and respect.

And any blogger who would use the word "uppity" in reference to Sen. Obama,.... that alone says a lot about the blogger and his/her views on race. Uppity is used to describe someone who supposedly doesn't know his proper place in the world. Since that word has often been used in the past to denigrate and demean African-Americans, it does carry racial connotations, whether the blogger intended it or not. No journalist or talking head on TV (well, maybe with the exception of Michelle Malkin) would dare use uppity in reference to any racial minority, or they're going to be mercilessly hammered and criticized from every quarter.

[matapule]

Re: Presidential debates

Uppity is used to describe someone who supposedly doesn't know his proper place in the world.

Exactly, it is a code word used by racists, in particular about black people who don't know their place. I guess they feel Obama should address him as, "Massa McCain, Suh." Racism is going to play a bigger part in the campaigning as the election gets closer IMO.

[Vanguard]

Re: Presidential debates

Exactly, it is a code word used by racists, in particular about black people who don't know their place. I guess they feel Obama should address him as, "Massa McCain, Suh." Racism is going to play a bigger part in the campaigning as the election gets closer IMO.

It's actually been used by US Representative Lynn Westmoreland (R-GA).

[timkona]

Re: Presidential debates

Uppity is a great example of a word whose meaning has morphed over the years, due to social realities, such that the majority of speakers would now cower from the use of the word so as not to appear racist. Uppity has become the first half of a statement (you all know the 2nd half) used throughout the Jim Crow south.

Uppity is also a descriptive word, having nothing to do whatsoever with the racial connotation. I am certain that I could possibly be described as 'uppity' by my fellow HT'ers, God bless'em one and all. Obama, with a Punahou/Harvard pedigree, could prolly be fairly called uppity, regardless of color.

I will choose the road away from racism.

[Ron Whitfield]

And there he goes!

CNN has a poll showing out of 524 polled -
51 - 38% thot BO did better than JMc overall
58 - 37% thot BO did better on the economy
52 - 47% thot BO did better on the war

Next week, the fun one - Palin VS Biden

[matapule]

Re: Presidential debates

with a Punahou/Harvard pedigree,

Actually via Occidental College in Pasadena, a place near and dear to me. Go Tigers!