Wal-Mart on Keeaumoku

[Miulang]

Re: Wal-Mart on Keeaumoku

This is just a rhetorical question: Is it worse to be unemployed than to work for a company like WalMart and be "underemployed"?

At least if you're unemployed, you can apply for government programs. If you're underemployed, you get squat. I think WalMart's stance on equal rights for their female employees and people of the Third World smacks of the kind of paternalism that was once so pervasive...you know, the belief that women are only working so they can earn "pin money" because they all have husbands who bring in the real money for the family and if you pay a 3rd World worker pennies it's still more than his neighbor earns.

How many of WalMart's hourly workers will now qualify for the new Federal pay law that just was enacted which says that if you earn less than $23,500 you are entitled to overtime pay? Not many, if WalMart doesn't hire full time employees, which is certainly their right. The bottom line is WalMart doesn't care about its workers because it deems most of them expendable. If someone quits, there are 3 more standing in line to take that person's place. And that's the unfortunate fact of life in this country right now. The only time I shop at WalMart is because I have to use a gift card that was given to me; I have to really go out of my way to find a WalMart here in the Seattle area.

I would rather kokua the small local business if I can, but most of the family style businesses have also gone by the wayside. It takes a lot of dedication to keep a family business running and rarely is it about making lots of money. Look in your community: KC Drive Inn just closed down; on Maui, places like Shishido Manju and Suda Store in Kihei have disappeared. Ooka Supermarket will close within the next couple of years to become a senior housing project.

Most of the families who run these businesses have to throw in the towel because we don't support them. We instead "vote with our pocketbooks" and go to the price leaders. I would rather pay a little more to help the little guy out if I can.

There's a little bakery in a neighborhood close to where I live. The owner makes the most delicious cheesecakes and other desserts. He's usually at the front counter, and he always recognizes me and asks how I am and have I gone to the restaurant where I first discovered his cheesecake recently? And I only drop by about every other week! Can any of us say we have those experiences on an everyday basis when we shop?

The same thing happens when I go every now and then to this restaurant that serves Hawaiian style food. They always recognize me and spend time talking to me. Can anyone honestly say that they get the same warm and fuzzies when they're greeted by the cheerful retired person who stands at the front door of WalMart? Doubtful.

There's a saying that's been around for quite awhile now: "Think globally; act locally". Yes, with a world economy now we do have to look at the big picture. But I really pray that that doesn't mean that we are complacent about what this global view is doing to us locally.

Miulang

[mel]

Re: Wal-Mart on Keeaumoku

I would rather kokua the small local business if I can, but most of the family style businesses have also gone by the wayside. It takes a lot of dedication to keep a family business running and rarely is it about making lots of money. Look in your community: KC Drive Inn just closed down; on Maui, places like Shishido Manju and Suda Store in Kihei have disappeared. Ooka Supermarket will close within the next couple of years to become a senior housing project.

Most of the families who run these businesses have to throw in the towel because we don't support them. We instead "vote with our pocketbooks" and go to the price leaders. I would rather pay a little more to help the little guy out if I can

In part that may be true of high end, high volume and discount retailers squeezing out the little guys. Been happening for a long time, way before WalMart, Costco and other big boxers arrived.

Many small businesses close because they are family businesses and often times the succeeding generations in that business don't want to take over. Often times the cost is overbrearing upon the small business to keep it going. Other times small business owners have sold out to their competitors or another firm and the business becomes bigger, and if successful sustains itself and grows or gets bought out by another company.

Small business is not only your Mom and Pop retailer. There are service firms, professional firms, businesses consisting of only one person, independent contractors, freight forwarders, charter airlines, and many other businesses.

A lot of that costs that small businesses have had to bear over the years have been brought upon them by government, state government here in Hawaii in particular.

As many know Hawaii has one of the highest taxes in the states and is overregulated with all kinds of mandates that hurt various businesses in the long run.

For example Hawaii is the only state in the nation that has a mandated pre-paid health law requiring all businesses to offer full time employees with a health plan that the businesses themselves have to bear most of the cost.

No other state has this. A health plan should be a benefit of your loyalty and good service to that business, not a right mandated by the state.

There are other costs associated and if you are really interested in reading all about the plight of small business in Hawaii, you can visit the website of Small Business Hawaii where articles from the monthly Small Business News are posted.

Or better yet you may want to call Sam Slom, president of Small Business Hawaii and have him explain to you about the plight of small business. Mr. Slom has been an advocate of small business for many, many years. You can even call him on the radio every Thursday morning between 7 and 8 a.m. on KHVH radio, 521-8383.

[Miulang]

Re: Wal-Mart on Keeaumoku

"No other state has this. A health plan should be a benefit of your loyalty and good service to that business, not a right mandated by the state."

Unfortunately, Mel, I disagree with you that a health plan should be a benefit of your loyalty as an employee and not a mandated right. I think it's wonderful that Hawaii had the foresight many years ago to force all businesses in the state to enroll their workers in HMSA. My parents, as retirees, are taking advantage of that fact right now. Would you begrudge your parents getting the care that they need?

The main reason I went to grad school was to get a Master's Degree in Health Administration. I want basic health care to be a right of every American, not a privilege. I'm not talking about plastic surgery or liposuction, I'm talking about an annual physical examination and taking care of basic health needs. I'm talking about people on Medicare being able to afford their medications.

The reason why "socialized medicine" as practiced in places like Canada appears to be failing is not because of the system itself, it's because there are people who are wealthy enough to circumvent the checks and balances that are required in a managed healthcare situation. When Canadians are rejected as candidates for surgery in Canada, they saunter across the border where our doctors are more than happy to take their devalued Canadian currency.

You're right about one thing, though. The reason why a lot of family businesses eventually close down is because the next generation thinks it's "too hard" for them to continue and it's easier to make the fast cash and get rid of the responsibility. It's like Craig Watanabe inferred in another thread (the one about being caught in a dilemma as a Sansei), kids today for the most part don't know what hard work is! If our great grandparents and grandparents and parents hadn't worked hard all their lives, would any of us be enjoying what we have today? Each generation tries to raise their kids so they don't have to struggle as much as they (the parents) did.

What makes you think WalMart didn't get all kinds of financial incentives to agree to build at Keeaumoku? Do the mom and pops get the same kinds of breaks? I don't think so.

Miulang

[Konaguy]

Re: Wal-Mart on Keeaumoku

For example Hawaii is the only state in the nation that has a mandated pre-paid health law requiring all businesses to offer full time employees with a health plan that the businesses themselves have to bear most of the cost.

I don't see the problem with this mandate. Mel you must be millionaire
if you can afford the standalone medical/dental coverage. Thats what
I would have to get if my employer was not required to offer it.

[kimo55]

Re: Wal-Mart on Keeaumoku

I don't see the problem with this mandate.

it is a problem.
many business owners struggle, what with all the aforementioned costs, triple taxing etc. one experiences here in "antismallbusiness hawaii".
This means some small businesses don't give full time hours to as many employees as they would maybe want.

This should not be a responsibility of small business, esp. in Hawaii.
the state should set something like this up, if they want employees to have it given to them.

[Konaguy]

Re: Wal-Mart on Keeaumoku

This should not be a responsibility of small business, esp. in Hawaii.
the state should set something like this up, if they want employees to have it given to them.

I don't think having the government do it either would work.
People like Mel would rap it as a excess big government function.
Which leaves the question whose responsibility it is. The employee
can't do it alone, as standalone dental/medical would run you in
the hundreds of dollars per month.

[kimo55]

Re: Wal-Mart on Keeaumoku

I don't think having the government do it either would work.
People like Mel would rap it as a excess big government function.
Which leaves the question whose responsibility it is. The employee
can't do it alone, as standalone dental/medical would run you in
the hundreds of dollars per month.

yea... whaddya gonna do?!
see the thing is, if you want a good health plan, and you contact blue cross or shield, and they learn you are in hawaii, UP goes the costs. Same with dental.
eh. for that matter, same with car insurance.


Had a good plan; Golden West dental when I was stuck for a while in Cali. very inexpensive and great choice of dentists.
Same with health insurance and the like; hospitals, dermatologists...
but here, fuggedaboudit!

We are over a barrell.

[mel]

Re: Wal-Mart on Keeaumoku

"No other state has this. A health plan should be a benefit of your loyalty and good service to that business, not a right mandated by the state."

Unfortunately, Mel, I disagree with you that a health plan should be a benefit of your loyalty as an employee and not a mandated right. I think it's wonderful that Hawaii had the foresight many years ago to force all businesses in the state to enroll their workers in HMSA. My parents, as retirees, are taking advantage of that fact right now. Would you begrudge your parents getting the care that they need?

Ah yes, and that is why Hawaii is well known as an anti-business state because of socialistic policies advanced by 40+ years of Democratic "leadership". The cumulative effect of state government socialism has been one of the major factors in contributing to the decline and struggle of not only small businesses, but business in general. Sure there are a lot of businesses still around, but because of regulations, taxes, mandates, etc., everything just costs the consumers as well as the businesses themselves more money.

I want basic health care to be a right of every American, not a privilege.

The healthcare system in America is fine as is. We don't need no Clinton/Kerry socialistic welfare programs (and really now, this probably has to be moved to another topic)...... and that is all I have to say for now.

Frankly I am not surprised that most people around here will support socialistic health care since this board is populated by liberal Kerry leaning leftists.

What makes you think WalMart didn't get all kinds of financial incentives to agree to build at Keeaumoku? Do the mom and pops get the same kinds of breaks? I don't think so.

Yes, I am sure all you WalMart haters believe a conspiracy involving the firm lurks at every corner.

[mel]

Re: Wal-Mart on Keeaumoku

I don't see the problem with this mandate. Mel you must be millionaire
if you can afford the standalone medical/dental coverage. Thats what
I would have to get if my employer was not required to offer it.

You don't know me. How can you make an assumption?

[craigwatanabe]

Re: Wal-Mart on Keeaumoku

What surprizes me is that for as long as I can remember working in the Kakaako area for 21-years and living in Honolulu for over 40 years, there have always been bones being dug up whenever a site was developed, but I've never seen the kind of backlash from the Hawaiian community as I've seen when this Wal-Mart project started. Nobody complained when the HMSA building came up, nor that building that is in forever repair on the corner of Kapiolani and Keeaumoku.

As a matter of fact the Wal-Mart site was previously developed and what was there was such an eyesore and a disgrace to those ancestors buried underneath I'm a bit concerned that these people complaining didn't do anything for the decades these auto repair shops dumped their waste oil and cleaners on their ancestor's bones or those brothels and massage places dishonored the area. There were strip bars and the area was frequented by drunks, drug dealing, prostitution and other forms of urban trash.

If my great great grandparents were buried underneath this kind of filth I would have protested wayyyyyy long before Wal-Mart was even considered there.

I know for a fact that there were bones unearthed at that building at the corner of Ward and Ala Moana (Bank of Hawaii), and at the Gas Company on Kamakee street. As a matter of fact Kakaako was the site of tens of thousands of mass burials with the small pox epidemic many generations ago before that area was developed. To dig and NOT find any bones in the Kakaako area would be more surprizing.

I'm not like Albert where he has no spirital feelings for bones however I do share his resentment towards those who are only now making such a big fuss over their ancestorial bones. They should be thanking the developers of the Wal-Mart site for finding their lost ancestors and should make an effort to repatriate them in a more suitable place of mourning, not that rat-infested and motor oil stained place being redeveloped into something a bit more pleasing on the senses than what was there before.

I'm all for honoring the dead but for what that area became and what it is now, I think its' a better place but I'd still want my bones reburied somewhere else regardless. Wal-Mart should pay to have those bones relocted in an inspiring place to those living to care for their ancestors' remains. America honors it's war dead with places like Punchbowl and Arlington National cemetary.

Diamond Head would be a great location for such a cemetary for repatriated Hawaiian ancestrial bones. It's rim walls would protect it's departed from urban sprawl and flooding from rain. It's proximity to the ocean and it's towering height over Honolulu would make it an ideal memorial that can be seen for miles as well as around the world because of it's image. The lookout could become the place of ceremonial rebirth and a place of solitude for both the living and the dead.

I'd rather pay a dollar to visit and honor this memorial rather than the tourist attraction it has become and it's another way Hawaiians can regain such an important Hawaiian landmark.

[craigwatanabe]

Re: Wal-Mart on Keeaumoku

You don't know me. How can you make an assumption?

I think we're getting away from the subject of bones at Wal-Mart but since we're at this topic in this thread, I must mention that I used to be a small business owner in Hawaii and although I'm glad to have a health plan mandated for me, as a business owner I had a very hard time subsidizing health plans for my 11 employees while having to pay for TDI insurance and all the rest of the hidden costs of business.

The problem with my business was that I couldn't pass the costs over to my customers because I wouldn't be able to compete effectively in that market. I had to absorb the costs and it resulted in very little profit margins. Those profit margins determined my tax liability so in a way I was paying less tax because more of my gross income was being diverted to paying for someone elses medical coverage. And since I was mandated to make those payments, there was very little left for end of the year bonuses. I ended up taking my employees out to dinner on my tab with what little I earned as a result of creating and managing my company.

Now getting on the subject of Wal-Mart versus the Mom and Pop stores, from a tax perspective, Wal-Mart will be hiring mostly younger able bodied people who are in a higher tax bracket than Mom and Pop so the tax revenue will be greater just from that fact alone. Wal-Mart has deep pockets meaning they can finance health care costs better than Mom and Pop as well as other benefits such as vacation, sick leave, educational subsidies and other benefits granted by a larger employer.

In other words Wal-Mart will take care of their employees' needs better than Mom and Pop could ever do. Wal-Mart will also create more jobs than Mom and Pop could ever commit to. More jobs means the government gets more taxes and less subsidy recipients. With more tax dollars in the general fund, our legislators can direct more funds to greater causes like education and human services while reducing those on subsidies.

Mom and Pop may have been a tradition, but it's an expensive burden on society because they provide limited jobs and thus miniscule tax revenue. Mom and Pop cannot provide for their employees in the form of benefits the way Wal-Mart can.

When it comes to putting food on the dinner table, keeping my kids well and paying for their education, Wal-Mart takes care of it's employees. Mom and Pop wants you to open the store, keep it clean, transact it's goods, balance the cash register receipts, close the store, and paint the facade for below minimum wage and expect you to do it without a paid vacation, paid sickleave and paid healthcare. They tell you not to report a safety infraction because they can't afford the TDI insurance increase in their premiums for making a TDI report. They tell you if you want more money, then to work Sundays for half day.

People looking for jobs embrace businesses like Wal-Mart because it's an equal-opportunity employer, government loves Wal-Mart because it brings in tax revenue and addresses public health and safety by improving the land around the building. Shoppers love Wal-Mart because the prices are cheaper than anything Mom and Pop can sell.

People hate Mom and Pop stores because they'd rather hire their nephew than you, government hate Mom and Pop stores because whatever personal income is derived is already taxed at a reduced rate simply because of Mom and Pop's age so there is less tax collected. Shoppers hate Mom and Pop stores because there is little selection available on the shelves and the prices are higher because Mom and Pop cannot wholesale buy the way Wal-Mart can.

The only thing Mom and Pop has over Wal-Mart is nostalgia. The problem with nostalgia is that it doesn't pay for your health coverage, it doesn't put food on the table for your family, it doesn't bring in enough tax revenue to take care of our needy on subsidies, or repave Kapiolani Blvd, or pay our government workers like police, fire, ambulance, trash.

We live in a modern world that keeps evolving. We cannot live in the past where it was simpler and less complex. More people are depending on government services, who'll pay for them? Us the taxpayers. How do we pay taxes? We work. For whom? Businesses. How do we get more people off government subsidies while raising more tax revenue without killing the business? We employ those on subsidies. What will that do? When they work they don't need subsidy tax dollars. When they work they pay taxes that increase tax revenue. More tax revenue means less tax dollars collected per individual because there are more taxpayers to share the burden. Less tax burden means more disposable income. More disposable income means greater spending power which benefits the businesses you shop at. Successful businesses ultimately mean lower consumer prices, greater spending ablilty, and a better life for the consumer. Consumer confidence and spending go up and guess what are the indicators of a healthy economy?

One thing Wal-Mart cannot do that has hurt the Bush administration is to out source it's cashiers and stock clerks to an overseas company, so jobs created stay in the borders of the U.S.

Sounds like republican gibberish? Heck it's capitalism and it's the structure that forms the basis for our society. It sounds republican because republicans embrace this economic model. What is your other choice if you cannot work? WELFARE! And who embraces that model of government subsidies by taxing the rich (which by the way fuel our economy). You tax the rich, they no longer remain rich. And when they're no longer rich, who will pay those taxes now that there are no more rich people to tax?

Wal-Mart won't make you rich, but it'll keep you off welfare and keep your family fed and healthy. From a family and economic perspective, Wal-Mart is a good thing.

[Mocha]

Re: Wal-Mart on Keeaumoku

I don't think people "hate" Mom & Pop stores. True some of them do charge more for items, but the more personal service they give to people is worth the extra money...and some mega stores have pushed out the Mom & Pop places, there used to be a very nice kiosk that served GOOD tasting coffee in Kahala Mall...then came Starbucks...no more kiosk! So now I order coffee on-line from small breweries on the mainland.

[craigwatanabe]

Re: Wal-Mart on Keeaumoku

You're right, they/I don't hate Mom and Pop stores. I should have said "preferred" Maybe Wal-Mart can secretly buy out these hole in the walls and rename them WM-Superette and still pass on the bulk purchase savings while hiding behind the facade of a small time store. Now that would be cool!

BTW I hate Starbucks coffee. They burn it! I have tasted better coffee at Columbia Inn in Kaimuki. This younger generation drinking their Latte don't have a clue as to what a good cup of Java should taste like. When you pour in 1/3 cream into your coffee it ain't coffee, it's coffee-flavored cream.

Sorry I'll stick to a good cup of black diner coffee, the way it's supposed to taste.

[kimo55]

Re: Wal-Mart on Keeaumoku

You're right, they/I don't hate Mom and Pop stores. I should have said "preferred" Maybe Wal-Mart can secretly buy out these hole in the walls and rename them WM-Superette and still pass on the bulk purchase savings while hiding behind the facade of a small time store. Now that would be cool!

and true to keeping with sprawlmart deception!

[craigwatanabe]

Re: Wal-Mart on Keeaumoku

it's not a deception, they're actually doing it