Should Civil Unions Be Legalized?

[Fritz]

Re: Should Civil Unions Be Legalized?

It was a politically safe maneuver by Lingle. Exactly like George Wallace standing at the door of the school wielding an axe, it was, what he thought, a politically advantageous move, pandering to the lowest emotions of hate. Lingle is fighting for her political future with her knee-jerk veto after giving people months of hope that soon they would be free and equal citizens. Like when I send email to Dans Inoyue and Akaka asking them to help medical marijuana patients and they email me back saying there are too many dangerous drugs out there and they will not be a party to legalizing any of them. They are like parrots saying what they think people want to hear as opposed to doing what they know is right. This was a cowardly move meant to appease the LCD majority despite the unfairness done.

Some politicians oppose gay marriage/civil unions because they are hateful bigots with personality flaws and the rest of them do it because they are too cowardly to oppose the voting faction made up of hateful bigots with personality flaws. IMO there is no other option! You oppose it? You are either a hater or a coward!!!

Lingle requested that the discourse be kept civil? F--K YOU, BITCH!!!

This is the second big failure of her term, first was Superferry.

[1stwahine]

Re: Should Civil Unions Be Legalized?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jSFLZ-MzIhM

[1stwahine]

Re: Should Civil Unions Be Legalized?

[Kalalau]

Re: Should Civil Unions Be Legalized?

Demonizing gays is so passe. Its Mexicans now. Get with it Lingle. Its like the 15 minutes of hate in "1984", or like switching enemies in the middle of speech. Orwell was so ahead of his time. Remember, you hate Mexicans now. Repeat it. It will be somebody else's turn soon enough. Politics is so cool. Puke.

[Linkmeister]

Re: Should Civil Unions Be Legalized?

hi,i agree with our governor that the people should decide in a vote in november or september is this way,it'll be a vote by the local people and it's good for now that our governor veteo'ed it. this would give everyone a chance to vote and not be legal by our governor.

well thank's for your time

By that reasoning slavery would still be legal and customary, schools would still be segregated, and women would still be unable to vote.

What you're advocating is the tyranny of the majority over the rights of a minority.

[ongre]

Re: Should Civil Unions Be Legalized?

hi,i agree with our governor that the people should decide in a vote in november or september is this way,it'll be a vote by the local people and it's good for now that our governor veteo'ed it. this would give everyone a chance to vote and not be legal by our governor.

well thank's for your time

There is no way any civil rights issue should go to popular vote. If popular vote was the determining factor we would still be able to own slaves and men would be able to legally beat their children and wives. Women would not be able to own land without a Husband to back her up. Blacks and other ethnic groups would not be in the upward achieving movement that is occurring. Environmental protection and OSHA Laws would not exist. There are many other examples.
We have elections to put elected representative in place to make laws. Its their job. Sometimes these laws are unpopular but the correct thing to do none the less.
Make sure you tell your closest homosexual friend that you consider them a less than adequate citizen, that they are a second class human and that you believe they should not be allowed to have the happiness they desire. You may start with your governor. Or the mayor of Maui County.

By the way, The mormon church should lose its non profit tax free status because of this issue and how they have forced their followers to spend their money putting down this civil rights travesty.

[TuNnL]

Re: Should Civil Unions Be Legalized?

What you're advocating is the tyranny of the majority over the rights of a minority.

Why is it tyranny to withhold the rights and privileges of marriage to an unmarried couple?

[Kalalau]

Re: Should Civil Unions Be Legalized?

I saw a breakdown on the vote on prop 8 in California. About 48 % of whites voted in favor of it, surprisingly only about 51 % of Hispanics voted in favor of it, but about 70 % + of Blacks voted in favor of it. First, I was impressed that Hispanics though being overwhelmingly Catholic were able (a lot of them anyway) to blow off the nonsense from the Catholic Church on the issue. It reminded me of how the French and Italians are all sincere Catholics but do not let religious doctrines interfere with their enjoyment of life. Spanish and Irish and Poles are also learning this. Evidently so too are Latin Americans. A friend who is a Latin American scholar has been telling me for years that Mexicans, though sincere and devout Catholics, still hold the clergy in contempt because the church waded into politics during the Mexican Revolution and backed the loser, the hated dictator Porfirio Diaz.

I was very disappointed to see that Black people who had so often been the victims of dumbocracy themselves felt free to vote their bigotry against others. It made me think that maybe the Southern bigots were right all along, that collectively Blacks might not be ready for the right to vote. I mean really, if they can have their right to buy or rent in Cal taken away by the votes of 70 % of the voters back in the '60's then practice the same evil against another minority, maybe collectively they really are the slackers that Southern bigots always claimed they are. The reason for the Black vote was laid to their churches. Some irrelevant third party's religious superstition is no reason to deny equal rights to citizens.

Here is the obvious limiting case for dumbocracy--allowing 50.00001 % of the population to vote to kill the other 49.9999 % of the population. Majority rule, right? No. Obviously you impose limits on the right of the majority to terrorize and tyranize the minority, otherwise you have no legitimate argument with Hitler's holocaust against the Jews--it would have been supported if it had ever been put up for a vote. The German people were just as well propagandized by the Nazis against the Jews as the Blacks of Cal were by their (tax exempt) churches against gays. Its the same thing.

[Linkmeister]

Re: Should Civil Unions Be Legalized?

Why is it tyranny to withhold the rights and privileges of marriage to an unmarried couple?

It's tyranny when a majority decides by plebiscite that a minority should not have the rights and privileges the majority enjoys.

[TuNnL]

Re: Should Civil Unions Be Legalized?

It's tyranny when a majority decides by plebiscite that a minority should not have the rights and privileges the majority enjoys.

It’s also tyranny when the government discriminates against straight couples who want to enter a civil union without getting married (which is what HB 444 would have done). House Bill S.D. 1 444 was even worse since it made marriage irrelevant. With that version, any couple — gay, straight or transgender — could receive full marriage benefits without being married. Like Craig Watanabe said earlier, what business does the government have mixing church and state affairs? The U.S. Constitution is supposed to prohibit that.

[Leo Lakio]

Re: Should Civil Unions Be Legalized?

Like Craig Watanabe said earlier, what business does the government have mixing church and state affairs? The U.S. Constitution is supposed to prohibit that.

Actually, that's a common misconception. There's nothing in the U.S. Constitution regarding the separation of church and state.

[Kalalau]

Re: Should Civil Unions Be Legalized?

Correct. "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting free exercise thereof..." However there is a lot of case law against absolute free expression of religion. Parents who deny their sick children medical treatment on grounds of religion are routinely prosecuted, they routinely seek protection of the 1st amendment and it is routinely denied. David Koresch might have thought he had a right under the 1st amendment to marry multiple child brides but he didn't. You can't sell fake faith healing, do ponzi schemes, etc. Human sacrifice is prohibited. If you kill somebody you can't get off by saying God told you to do it. Its been tried. Churches are tax exempt organizations based on staying out of politics. When bishops speaking for the Catholic Church say that voting for a pro choice candidate violates the teachings of the church I believe they have crossed the line from preaching the gospel of Christ into politics and the Church should pay its back taxes with full penalties and interest. It would help the national debt immensely if political churches like the Catholic or Mormon churches paid all their back taxes with penalties and interest. You or I would have to if we broke the tax laws, why should a particular church get special favorable exemption from not just taxes, but the very tax laws themselves. Same with preaching in favor of prop 8 as many fundamentalist churches did in California, and perhaps also did in Hawai'i. Churches should pay their taxes if they want to do politics. Not doing so marks them as tax criminal hypocrites and the kind of greedy money changers Jesus threw out of his temple. Money, not God, is their God.

[Frankie's Market]

Re: Should Civil Unions Be Legalized?

There is no way any civil rights issue should go to popular vote. If popular vote was the determining factor we would still be able to own slaves and men would be able to legally beat their children and wives.

And your proof of this is....?

[sansei]

Re: Should Civil Unions Be Legalized?

hi,i learned from my mom's youngest sis,my aunt and she shared with me that in california,they are having the same type of issue of the civil union and she shared with me that she kindly say's that im not for same gender marriage's and she shared that the young people wouldnt understand it.

she shared that since she lived here before moving on, that they have some of the same similar issue's that we have since she was born here and lived here half of her life.

well thank's for your time

[Adri]

Re: Should Civil Unions Be Legalized?

Interesting that a federal judge ruled that the Defense of Marriage Act is unconstitutional as violating states' rights. While I am not unhappy that DOMA is being challenged, I fear that this may not be a good precedent for other issues.