What is your attitude towards Pidgin?

[Johanna]

Aloha,
hope there are still guys out there who want to share their views on Pidgin... going through some threads, I have noticed most of you speak Pidgin (of course) and sometimes write in Pidgin.
Were you allowed to speak Pidgin at school, were you refused a job because you speak pidgin? I am from Germany and I am totally interested in that stuff ( i am working on my masters thesis in English linguistics about Hawaiian Pidgin, or Hawaii Creole English) -- I would love to know more about your experiences, good and bad ones . Anybody who wants to share their views is invited. Mahalo and Aloha

[Lalalinder]

Re: what is your attitude towards Pidgin?

Anybody can share their views?

Well, ok. My experience is with a classmate at college here on the mainland. He moved here from Hawa'ii and spoke Pidgin. A lot. Right or wrong, instructors and classmates alike tried to explain to him that it seemed to cripple him in many ways. But the habit was too entrenched and he just couldn't, or wouldn't, speak Standard English.

After graduation a couple of years ago, he couldn't keep a good job because of this language barrier, and I have since lost track of him.

[Leo Lakio]

Re: what is your attitude towards Pidgin?

On another board where I am a regular, there is a huge thread about this very subject (the longest ever on that board) - and it has both generated a tremendous amount of heat, and some wonderful writing in Pidgin.

Some people "get" it - others don't.

[Vanguard]

Re: what is your attitude towards Pidgin?

Suddenly, this lovely gem of a thread comes to mind.

[admin]

Re: what is your attitude towards Pidgin?

Pidgin is frequently discussed here on HawaiiThreads.

[Johanna]

Re: what is your attitude towards Pidgin?

On another board where I am a regular, there is a huge thread about this very subject (the longest ever on that board) - and it has both generated a tremendous amount of heat, and some wonderful writing in Pidgin.

Some people "get" it - others don't.

oooh, sounds interesting.. would you let me know which board? I honestly appreciate your help

[MyopicJoe]

Re: What is your attitude towards Pidgin?

Dave Chappelle said it best on Inside The Actor's Studio:

Every Black American is bilingual. We speak street vernacular and we speak interview.

[Composite 2992]

Re: What is your attitude towards Pidgin?

Certain regional accents are equated with people who are unsophisticated and ignorant. Unfortunately our pidgin is one of them. Take a look at how local Hawaiians are portrayed on TV, and the "big, dumb kanaka" is talking pidgin. Unnatural and forced pidgin (don't you hate it when they do that!?).

I grew up speaking proper English, even though I grew up here. I picked up pidgin hanging out with some fishermen in Nanakuli. When I visited a friend in the mainland, his kotonk buddies were wondering what language I was speaking -- apparently pidgin became a habit when talking to certain friends.

Among family and friends there's nothing wrong with pidgin. But if you find yourself in a professional environment and want to get somewhere in your career, learn to turn it off. Sadly, unlike certain regional accents, pidgin isn't very endearing to many.

[TuNnL]

Re: What is your attitude towards Pidgin?

Among family and friends there's nothing wrong with pidgin. But if you find yourself in a professional environment and want to get somewhere in your career, learn to turn it off. Sadly, unlike certain regional accents, pidgin isn't very endearing to many.

Generally, I would agree with this attitude. However, it also depends on where you work. There are many employers in the workforce where pidgin is spoken almost exclusively. But I would agree with Lalalinder that there are some individuals who never learn standard English at all. And that is a serious mistake.

[Adri]

Re: What is your attitude towards Pidgin?

I was taught that it was important to learn to read and speak "standard English" but clearly not speaking standard English is not a sign of lack of intelligence. (Historical note: There was a time that one had to pass a speech test in order to graduate from the University of Hawaii.) I have found that speaking and understanding pidgin can be tremendously useful here in Hawaii (a sincere effort, not a condescending or "I'm a tourist who thinks it's funny" kind of thing). The ability to put others at ease, to fit, and be able to communicate effectively cannot be underestimated. I know some highly educated people with good jobs who routinely speak in pidgin. Some of those people only speaks pidgin to people they regard well and would like to be friends with or whom they consider a friend.

[Random]

Re: What is your attitude towards Pidgin?

Were you allowed to speak Pidgin at school, were you refused a job because you speak pidgin?

Whoa! A two-part question, but I can handle.

Were I allowed to speak Pidgin at school? Sometimes. Usually during English class, I minimize if not avoid Pidgin-speech. But if a (local) teacher talk to me in Pidgin, I going respond likewise.

Were I refused a job because I speak Pidgin? I try not to show my true self when trying to land a job. You know what they say, "Alway make a good first impression." So I hide my Pidgin. Fool my (caucasian/mainlander) employer that I'm an <air quote> "educated A-me-ri-can."

After I got the job, then I show what a true snake I am. Kidding.

[oggboy]

Re: What is your attitude towards Pidgin?

Main thing you need to know is when and where to use pidgin. I get plenty transplants who live here 20-30 years, and pidgin is what they understand.
My Boss is formally form So. Cal., lives here now and after 8 years, finally understands how local`s talk.

[Opihimonster]

Re: What is your attitude towards Pidgin?

I've always been able to turn on/off speaking pidgin. Going to college and now living in the mainland, clearly one learns to drop the use of pidgin English. But whenever I come back home, I can turn it back on <snap> li'dat when I'm around friends and family.

Funny story... after graduating college I got stationed back here on Oahu for a few years. My Maxima fog light got cracked and they wouldn't pass my safety inspection until I got a new one. So I went to the Nissan Dealership and walked back to the parts & service counter and asked in perfect English about getting a replacement light for my car. The service guy tapped into computer for a minute and then told me, sorry looks like they didn't have any, but they could order one and they would have it in a few weeks. So I shifted gears into pidgin and said something to the effect of, "fo' real! ass full long time...u sure u no mo' one extra one in da back?" His whole demeanor changed and he said "try wait let me go check." He came back 5 minutes later with a new fog light.

Now I'm Potagee, so I can easily pass for white, but I just found it so interesting on how much of an impact the use of pidgin has in Hawaii.

I've found that growing up in Hawaii, knowing pidgin English which incorporates aspects of so many different languages and dialects helps when talking to non-native English speaking people. I find in so many situations in the mainland when I run into someone who speaks very broken or heavily accented English (like a strong Spanish, Japanese, Chinese accent), I'm usually the one in the group that can understand what they are saying and usually have to "translate" for the others in the group. I think its mainly because I grew up in Hawaii with the Filipino neighbor, Japanese friend's parents, etc. and you learn what different languages sound like and the pronunciation differences from English. It funny ( or I guess you could sad) how many mainland folks lump all Asian languages into a single pot. I mean I can't speak Japanese, Chinese, Thai, Korean or Filipino fluently but I can pretty much at least tell from listening which language it is.

[Likeke]

Re: What is your attitude towards Pidgin?

Me too, I can turn it off and on but, it was hard for me at first. When I left Hawaii for good back in 97. I promised myself that I'll never speak pidgin english again but, I go home to visit. The standard english is still there, 'UNTIL' when my friends and family come over and when they are talking, "SNAP" the pidgin comes back.

I get very upset with myself on doing that but, later on when I'm heading back to the mainland. The standard english is still there.

Hana Hou!

[Leo Lakio]

Re: What is your attitude towards Pidgin?

But whenever I come back home, I can turn it back on <snap> li'dat when I'm around friends and family.

The standard english is still there, 'UNTIL' when my friends and family come over and when they are talking, "SNAP" the pidgin comes back.

You two have nailed a key part of using pidgin; it's highly transactional.

I'm not from the Islands, but the Alpha Female is. She only shifts into pidgin when in conversation with another person from Hawai`i (and there are many in the Seattle area). I can speak a small amount that I have picked up from being tied into the Hawaiian music scene here - but generally, I do not call myself a pidgin speaker, and for the most part, it would be too embarrassingly uncomfortable if I tried (for those listening, as well as myself).