Astounding crash in Kaneohe

[TuNnL]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

I heard that the investigators found no sign that the guy tried to brake at all.

If that's true, it’s mind-boggling. You have to think drugs or alcohol was involved. Who doesn't brake before the tunnel? I’ve always done so and never witnessed anyone do otherwise in more than a hundred trips I’ve taken on Likelike to the Windward side.

[LikaNui]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

KHON news just reported that HPD says the driver was drunk... three times the limit.

[LikaNui]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

An update to my previous post -- The Advertiser is now reporting that all three people in the car had alcohol levels above the legal limit.

[tutusue]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

But only one was driving, LN. Passengers don't have the same legal restrictions on them.

[MyopicJoe]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

RNs from Massachusetts who were tired of seeing lots of drunk driving deaths and injuries.

I'm glad to hear the program lasted for so long. Unfortunately you'll never know how many lives it helped save, but even a few helps.

When I see motorcyclist wearing only a t-shirt and no helmet, I want to show them pictures of people whose faces have been peeled when it went up against asphalt.

my parents insisted that I first volunteer to work in an ER for two weeks.

That's a pretty cool idea. Children, and even adults, are isolated from death. Our favorite actors die heroic deaths, only to reappear in another movie. We don't even see the animals slaughtered, to fill our plates.

In my 24 years as a news photographer I saw and heard my share of people trapped, crushed and shredded in bad accidents.

*whistle* I can only imagine the things you've seen, the sounds you've heard, and sometimes the smells which don't wash off. I hear a lot train operators need counseling for all the people they see getting killed, trying to cross in front of a train, while they're helpless and can only watch.

Maybe. But I'll bet I know part of what was going though the driver's mind. The driver thinks speed is fun, and it's all controllable.

It really is a video game or a movie to most people.

And there's nothing scarier than being in the passenger in a car with a driver like that who won't slow down

Yeah. I'm wondering whether the passengers protested the speed, or encouraged it (depending on how drunk they were and such). In the end we'll never know.

The speed limits on most roads are calculated by engineers

Don't forget to include lawyers. At least that's my theory. The government wants to set it low enough so they can't be held liable for any death or destruction. Of course they do turn to engineers for the numbers.

But only one was driving, LN. Passengers don't have the same legal restrictions on them.

True, since they aren't driving. Though intoxication might hint (only) at whether they encouraged the driver to speed or not. Most likely they kept quiet and didn't care enough. No one will know. It's all speculation anyways.

[tutusue]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

[...]Though intoxication might hint (only) at whether they encouraged the driver to speed or not. Most likely they kept quiet and didn't care enough. No one will know. It's all speculation anyways.

Or, scared into semi-sobriety, screaming at the driver to slow down. But, yeah, we'll never know.

[LikaNui]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

MJ caught my point. Clearly there is no limitation on passenger's alcohol levels, but it goes toward showing what was happening before they got into the car (or even during?). And clearly no designated driver, too.
Proof once again that youth is wasted on the young.

[tutusue]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

[...]And clearly no designated driver, too.[...]

That, to me, is the primary problem. But was it even a topic of discussion? We'll never know but with all those previous speeding tickets one has to wonder...

Too late.

[GeckoGeek]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

The speed limits on most roads are calculated by engineers

Yahbut, there are a number of factors that come into play. At that location, I think it's limited sight distance that sets the limit. But then when you go flying though at more then double the posted limt....

Who doesn't brake before the tunnel?

Hmmm, I don't. I back off the gas just before cresting that little hill. Remember, we're talking about Kaneone bound, not Honolulu-bound.

And I wonder if the police statement is based on statements by witnesses? Light breaking won't leave any marks.

Proof once again that youth is wasted on the young.

At age 30, I think the driver was well out of the "young and stupid" phase of life. Wasn't Bucky Lake 18 at the time? (Ohhhh, I'm dating myself for remembering that name.)

[Frankie's Market]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

But only one was driving, LN. Passengers don't have the same legal restrictions on them.

That is true. However,....

If one of my children were dead in that accident.... the fact that they were a drunk passenger rather than a drunk driver wouldn't make it any less tragic for me.

I had a talk with my family before, but in light of what happened on the Likelike, I had it again yesterday. If you get drunk, use your cell phone and call home. The problem with relying on a "friend" at the same party is if your judgement is impaired to the point that you're not even capable of deciding if your friend is in a condition to drive.

Getting into a car driven by someone who is drunk can obviously be as deadly a mistake as getting behind the wheel yourself.

[Frankie's Market]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

If that's true, it’s mind-boggling. You have to think drugs or alcohol was involved. Who doesn't brake before the tunnel? I’ve always done so and never witnessed anyone do otherwise in more than a hundred trips I’ve taken on Likelike to the Windward side.

Hmmm, I don't. I back off the gas just before cresting that little hill. Remember, we're talking about Kaneone bound, not Honolulu-bound.

Ah, but the Kaneohe-bound lanes at Wilson Tunnel have patches of areas where the road is perpetually wet and mossy due to moisture and runoff from the moutain slopes. This is true, even when the weather is relatively sunny and dry around the rest of the island, which it hasn't always been this past week.

The wet/mossy patches come before and right at the Kaneohe bound entrance of the tunnel. In addition, the ending of that same tunnel also is wet, which is dangerous for any driver whose vehicle hydroplanes and is not able to negotiate that curving exit. (You see all those nasty scrape marks on the side of the walls?)

Whether any driver needs to brake before entering the tunnel,.... it all depends on how fast they are driving on the highway in the first place. I will say this. Whenever I'm driving in the Wilson Tunnel going Windward-bound, I see too many drivers nowadays breezing through there at speeds I would estimate at 60+ mph. That can be scary, if they should suddenly lose control just as they are going past me. Sometimes, even your best efforts to drive safely can go for naught if a reckless motorist creates a dangerous situation for everyone else around them.

My solution? HPD needs to set up an occasional speedtrap right outside the tunnel. That will get drivers to slow down and drive at sane speeds when they go through the tunnel.

[TuNnL]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

Who doesn't brake before the tunnel?

Hmmm, I don't. I back off the gas just before cresting that little hill. Remember, we're talking about Kaneone bound, not Honolulu-bound.

Wow, I’m sure if more people drove like you, there wouldn't be any accidents on Likelike! Unfortunately, I think it’s safe to say you are in the minority. The vast majority of drivers I’ve seen are going as fast or faster than I am to get up that “little hill,” and I’m usually going anywhere from the speed limit to five miles over. Frankie’s post seems to confirm this. Anyhow, that forces at least some incidental breaking as the road quickly becomes a downward slope into the Kāne‘ohe-bound entrance to the Wilson tunnel. Particularly on a typically wet day in Windward O‘ahu.

[LikaNui]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

Ah, but the Kaneohe-bound lanes at Wilson Tunnel have patches of areas where the road is perpetually wet and mossy due to moisture and runoff from the moutain slopes.

Exactly like the hairpin curve on Pali Highway.

[GeckoGeek]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

My solution? HPD needs to set up an occasional speedtrap right outside the tunnel. That will get drivers to slow down and drive at sane speeds when they go through the tunnel.

At the risk of thread drift and out of curiosity, what would consider a "sane speed" though the tunnel? Or more to the point, do you consider the 25 MPH speed limit in the tunnel to be too low?

[Frankie's Market]

Re: Astounding crash in Kaneohe

At the risk of thread drift and out of curiosity, what would consider a "sane speed" though the tunnel? Or more to the point, do you consider the 25 MPH speed limit in the tunnel to be too low?

It's been nearly a year since I last took the Likelike to go to Kaneohe. Is the speed limit in the tunnel now 25? If so, I have no argument against that. Better for speed limits to be on the more cautious side than the opposite.

Once upon a time, I recall the speed limit inside Wilson as being 35. That is about what I would consider as being a "sane" speed. But if there is anybody here with a professional safety/traffic engineering background who would disagree with my assessment, I would gladly defer to their opinion.