Unsettled Economy & The Bailout

[GregLee]

Re: Unsettled Economy & The Bailout

This has already been provided for under point # 1 in my last post -
1. APPOINT A SPECIAL PROSECUTOR TO CRIMINALLY INDICT ANYONE ON WALL STREET WHO KNOWINGLY CONTRIBUTED TO THIS COLLAPSE.

But this is just silly. You can't criminally indict someone unless he broke some law. Do you think there is a law against knowingly contributing tp a collapse? What law would that be?

[matapule]

Re: Unsettled Economy & The Bailout

Like any one of us can sway the events. Way beyond my power.

I have to disagree. You have the power to sway the vote of your representative to some small degree. That is what got the bailout defeated in the House the first time. To sit on the sidelines is to not be a participant.

[matapule]

Re: Unsettled Economy & The Bailout

blah!!!

a bit frustrated with the entire hooplah

enough said

You'll be a bit more than frustrated if you find yourself without a job and no way to pay bills. I found out today that my nephew has been laid off in CA. It is more than "blah" and a whole lot more needs to be said.

[matapule]

Re: Unsettled Economy & The Bailout

Do you think there is a law against knowingly contributing tp a collapse? What law would that be?

Yes, I do think there could be a law. However, since I am not an attorney, I can't cite a statute.

[turtlegirl]

Re: Unsettled Economy & The Bailout

Aaaarghhh!! NO!!! It can't be!!!! Nooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!

That ridiculous, pork laden excuse for a bailout PASSED?? NOOOOO!!!!

Link to Yahoo News report here.

NO!!! Can't we the people stop this? OMG, what an awful plan!!

[Leo Lakio]

Re: Unsettled Economy & The Bailout

But this is just silly. You can't criminally indict someone unless he broke some law. Do you think there is a law against knowingly contributing tp a collapse? What law would that be?

There are MANY laws against financial malfeasance. You'd have to investigate those responsible - I'm certain you'd find many laws and regulations flaunted. But I don't think we'll be seeing anyone go to jail here - and I hope to be proven wrong on that.

[GregLee]

Re: Unsettled Economy & The Bailout

There are MANY laws against financial malfeasance.

I see. You regard some unspecified acts as financial malfeasance; there are laws against malfeasance; therefore, these acts were illegal. Do I have it straight? Or maybe the principle is that everything unethical is against some law?

[matapule]

Re: Unsettled Economy & The Bailout

Aaaarghhh!! NO!!! It can't be!!!! Nooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!

That ridiculous, pork laden excuse for a bailout PASSED?? NOOOOO!!!!
NO!!! Can't we the people stop this? OMG, what an awful plan!!

Unfortunately you're right TG. Tax cuts coupled with increased spending. Both Obama and McCain supported it. This bill is tu'u mama'o (I'll let you figure out what that means, your first guess is right). Hunker down friends, it's going to get worse. The State of California is now asking for a $7B bailout! Recession here we come!

[tutusue]

Re: Unsettled Economy & The Bailout

[...]Both Obama and McCain supported it.[...]

Just a curiosity question...might they have supported it 'cuz the alternative (a more rapid tanking of the economy) is even worse?

[Frankie's Market]

Unfortunately you're right TG. Tax cuts coupled with increased spending. Both Obama and McCain supported it. This bill is tu'u mama'o (I'll let you figure out what that means, your first guess is right). Hunker down friends, it's going to get worse. The State of California is now asking for a $7B bailout! Recession here we come!

So are you now saying that a recession would have been avoided by the govt. not passing the bailout bill?

I don't know which sounds more out of touch with reality: this statement or McCain saying (2 weeks ago) that the fundamentals of this economy are strong.

[matapule]

Re: Unsettled Economy & The Bailout

Just a curiosity question...might they have supported it 'cuz the alternative (a more rapid tanking of the economy) is even worse?

Worse than what.....putting off the inevitable? I think they supported it because they both think that the US consumer can spend their way out of a recession by increasing both personal and governmental credit card debt. The average current balance on a personal credit card is now $9,312 paying an average 13.37% interest. The current National Debt is in excess of $10 trillion. The economy is in danger of imploding with this amount of staggering debt. Amercians and their government need to start living within their means. The Obama/McCain strategies do not accomplish that.

[matapule]

Re: Unsettled Economy & The Bailout

So are you now saying that a recession would have been avoided by the govt. not passing the bailout bill?

I'm saying it doesn't matter. The US taxpayer cannot afford this bill.

I don't know which sounds more out of touch with reality: this statement

I am obviously out of touch with reality as far as the US consumer is concerned because I think we (individuals and government) should live within our means and not off a credit card. The fundamentals of our economy are NOT strong. The fundamentals of the average US consumer spending is NOT responsible.

[tutusue]

Re: Unsettled Economy & The Bailout

[...]The average current balance on a personal credit card is now $9,312 paying an average 13.37% interest. The current National Debt is in excess of $10 trillion. The economy is in danger of imploding with this amount of staggering debt. Amercians and their government need to start living within their means. The Obama/McCain strategies do not accomplish that.

[...]
I am obviously out of touch with reality as far as the US consumer is concerned because I think we (individuals and government) should live within our means and not off a credit card. The fundamentals of our economy are NOT strong. The fundamentals of the average US consumer spending is NOT responsible.

Living within our means is a solution, matapule, but not a reality unfortunately.

We are definitely a credit card driven society. Maybe this industry should go the way of gas prices. UP! That is, make it very expensive to buy on credit with outrageous interest rates...really outrageous. Americans have cut back on driving due to exorbitant gas prices. Maybe something similar would happen with exorbitant CC interest rates? In addition, tack on a ridiculously high annual fee to EVERY card. Then regulate (ooooooh...there's that "R" word!) the CC companies/banks that issue them to pay a percentage of the interest and annual fee into a "fund" earmarked for <fill in the blank>...education, health insurance, homeless solutions, well you get the idea; a good cause! Maybe those who pay off their CC bill every month, without exception, could be charged 1/2 the annual fee as a reward. Possibly someone who needs to use his/her card for justifiable medical purposes (not, say, the majority of cosmetic surgery procedures) can deduct part of the interest and fee on their tax return.

And, no, I've not put much thought into this idea. Just throwing it out there.

[salmoned]

Re: Unsettled Economy &amp; The Bailout

A speedy tanking and recovery is the best of alternatives. I don't think a long, drawn out, festering financial system like Japan's bubble collapse is a good model to follow. The devil is in the unknown specifics. If, with this $700 billion, we buy securities at distressed market prices, then we may make a killing when they are sold after the market has resumed normal functioning. However, if we pay more than they're worth, we're hosed. I can only hope for the best. Raising account insurance to $250K looks like a plum thrown to the wealthy (us po' fo'k ain't even got $100K in da bank), among the other pork inclusions.

[matapule]

Re: Unsettled Economy &amp; The Bailout

Living within our means is a solution, matapule, but not a reality unfortunately.

It is all of a solution and a realty and a possibility.

We are definitely a credit card driven society. Maybe this industry should go the way of gas prices. UP!

No, the solution is to put a credit limit on your card that is a formula based on your ability to repay, i.e. a function of income, net worth, and credit history. I agree it is called REGULATION.

I don't why I care so much about this, because my financial house is in order.