The Iraq War - Chapter 4

[Miulang]

Re: The Iraq War - Chapter 4

So I have a question for everyone who cares: if the Iraqi government asked the Coalition to leave Iraq by the end of the year because of the increasing violence to its people, what do you think the White House would say/do?

Miulang

[1stwahine]

Re: The Iraq War - Chapter 4

So I have a question for everyone who cares: if the Iraqi government asked the Coalition to leave Iraq by the end of the year because of the increasing violence to its people, what do you think the White House would say/do?

Miulang

Up Yours!
(I wuz going to say sumting else but dis not my Blog)

Auntie Lynn

[damontucker]

Re: The Iraq War - Chapter 4

So I have a question for everyone who cares: if the Iraqi government asked the Coalition to leave Iraq by the end of the year because of the increasing violence to its people, what do you think the White House would say/do?

Miulang

"Um.. Did we ever leave Hawaii!"

[waioli kai]

interminable U.S. occupation, Re: The Iraq War - Chapter 4

So I have a question for everyone who cares: if the Iraqi government asked the Coalition to leave Iraq by the end of the year because of the increasing violence to its people, what do you think the White House would say/do?

Chaos, mayhem and insecurity are what terrorists are perpetuating in Iraq and the U.S. occupation of Iraq is their cover for doing so. Those in the U.S., mostly of the Congressional majority, who argue against setting up a timetable for U.S. troop withdrawl claim that once the terrorists have a date of U.S. troop withdrawl to aim for, the terrorists will just keep up the terror, or intensify the terror until that time when they will just take over Iraq. The failed reasoning that took U.S. forces to Iraq is the same failed reasoning that keeps U.S. forces there.

If terrorists and those who would be terrorists believed the U.S. was withdrawing in six months, they would not step up their terror on Iraqi society. The foreign anti-U.S. terrorist elements might step up their attacks on U.S. forces because they would want to take advantage of the proximity and vulnerability of U.S. forces as long as U.S. forces are in Iraq. Such foreign (non-Iraqi) terrorists would hate to see U.S. forces cease to be sitting ducks for foreign terrorists' initiatives.

Iraqi terrorists on the other hand, would view a U.S. timetable for withdrawl as a contract for de-occupation by U.S. forces, which timetable, if reasonably brief, would translate into reasons for Iraqi terrorists to cease their drive toward ever greater chaos and insecurity meant to destabilize what is seen by Iraqis as, what is projected by BushCheney as, an interminable U.S. occupation.

[Mahi Waina]

Re: The Iraq War - Chapter 4

A friend of mine that was in aerial reconnaissance in Vietnam told me that there were always oil tankers lined up in the Gulf of Tonkin during the war. Once the oil was depleted, the US was out in weeks, without regard to the slaughter of our "allies" left behind.

If troops are withdrawn in our lifetime, it will be based on The Corporation's interests, not on the condition of the Iraqui nation.

[Leo Lakio]

Re: The Iraq War - Chapter 4

Up Yours!
(I wuz going to say sumting else but dis not my Blog)
Auntie Lynn

Auntie: I hope you are saying that this would be the White House's likely response - and that you are NOT saying this from you to Miulang.

Miulang poses a good question here: what do you think we should do if it's the new Iraqi government, the one that the U.S. is supporting and fighting to defend, saying to us "okay, America - we'd like to take it from here; thanks for everything, but we think it's time for you to let us fly or fail on our own"?

NPR's "Morning Edition" ran a segment today, featuring American troops in Iraq responding to questions about whether we should leave Iraq by a specific date, such as year's end. The majority of them said (and felt that most troops would also say) "we shouldn't leave by a specific date - we should leave only when we have accomplished our mission."

Putting aside past mission goals (search for WMDs, removal of Saddam Hussein) and assuming that the mission is now stabilizing the Iraqi government, what should we do when that government says they are stable enough to take charge?

[Miulang]

Re: The Iraq War - Chapter 4

NPR's "Morning Edition" ran a segment today, featuring American troops in Iraq responding to questions about whether we should leave Iraq by a specific date, such as year's end. The majority of them said (and felt that most troops would also say) "we shouldn't leave by a specific date - we should leave only when we have accomplished our mission."

And that's the sad thing...according to a recent Zogby poll, about 42% of the active duty forces in Iraq who were asked if they knew what their mission was in Iraq said they didn't really know.

Miulang

[1stwahine]

Re: The Iraq War - Chapter 4

Auntie: I hope you are saying that this would be the White House's likely response - and that you are NOT saying this from you to Miulang.

Leo, Heavens NO! I love Tita Miulang Dearly. She knows me better than me sometimes. Never in my Life, I would say anything of that nature to my Tita Miulang.

Auntie Lynn

[nachodaddy]

Re: The Iraq War - Chapter 4

So I have a question for everyone who cares: if the Iraqi government asked the Coalition to leave Iraq by the end of the year because of the increasing violence to its people, what do you think the White House would say/do?

Miulang

I try to stay out of these "if monkeys flew out of my butt, would they be wearing striped pants or sensible slacks" kind of discussions but I was so seriously impressed by waioli kai's response that I will add to this thought process.

There would need to be a transition with the UN peacekeeping forces, similiar to what has been done in eastern Europe. No "I had it, you got it" but a real transition with the eye on stabilizing the democracy there.

The real trick is how to do that and I am all for dividing the country to make that happen (just like what was done in the former Yugoslavia). I stated in prior correspondence that the vote for the ratification of the Iraqi constitution helped identify the ethnic and religious lines. Might be a good place to start.

This is not a new game, it has played out a countless amount of times for over 2 centuries of recorded western civilization.

[Miulang]

Re: The Iraq War - Chapter 4

While they have been freed from Saddam Hussein and his repressive government, here is a list of what the people of Iraq have lost in the process since 2003.

Miulang

[LikaNui]

Re: The Iraq War - Chapter 4

Where is the list of names of our 2,500+ soldiers who have died in Iraq?

[Miulang]

Re: The Iraq War - Chapter 4

Where is the list of names of our 2,500+ soldiers who have died in Iraq?

Here ya go...
This list has not yet been updated with the names of Tucker, Menchaca and the other two military people who have been killed since June 17. Or these 4 Marines killed in Anbar Province yesterday.

Miulang

[Miulang]

We're pulling out of Iraq! (sorta)

Is this a ploy for the US to "save face"? I really truly believe the government of Iraq is, unbeknownst to the American public, pleading with the US behind the scenes to pull its forces out of Iraq sooner rather than later.

So even though the 2 resolutions backed by the Democrats in the Senate both went down in flames this morning, maybe Congress doesn't need to do much more. It's all up to the democratically elected government of Iraq to call the shots...not us.

"...Coalition forces will pull out of a relatively peaceful, West Virginia-sized region in southern Iraq by the end of July, a British officer said Thursday -- the first transfer of an entire province to Iraqi security forces.

However, the international troops will maintain a presence nearby and be prepared to help the Iraqis if needed in Muthanna province, a predominantly Shiite area of 550,000 people bordering Najaf, Basra and Saudi Arabia....

"...''The agreement for transition is that by the end of July there will be no permanent presence in Muthanna, so all the forces within it will need to move out by then,'' he said during a visit to the British-Australian camp and the nearby provincial capital of Samawah...

"...His remarks offered the first specific timeframe for the British and Australian forces to leave the province.

Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki announced shortly after taking office May 20 that Iraqi security forces would soon assume full responsibility for some of Iraq's 18 provinces, starting an 18-month process leading to the eventual withdrawal of all coalition forces...."

More evidence of a probable drawdown of troops in Iraq in the near future.

"...Casey said the U.S. military and the Iraqi government ''have several different strands of contacts going on, and there are opportunities in that regard we just haven't had before.'' He did not elaborate. He also said the insurgency has grown more complex in recent months, and he complained that it has been assisted by Iranian special operations forces who provide bomb materials, weapons and training to Shiite extremists in southern Iraq.

''They are using surrogates to conduct terrorist operations in Iraq both against us and against the Iraqi people,'' Casey said. ''It's decidedly unhelpful.'' He added there has been a ''noticeable increase'' in the problem since January, but he could not quantify it...."



Miulang

[waioli kai]

Iraqi soldier=US surrogate soldier

" It's getting better for US " says Death Maker Cheney to John King,cnn Situation Room 6/22/o6 broadcast interview, " there are, for christ's sake more (US surrogate soldier) Iraqis dying and that's good for US! "

Cheney unfolds his sardonic, twisted grin revealing the arrogant expanse of his mastery of the analysis of deaths (usually others, predominately non-US deaths) verses US (corporatUSt, militarUSt, zionUSt) benefits and the U.S. tolerance (which is exceedingly high) for political, economic and judicial deception in the United States.

[Miulang]

Re: The Iraq War - Chapter 4

News from Iraq for today...another American death besides the 4 Marines in Anbar Province:

U.S. soldier assigned to Multi-National Division Baghdad died Wednesday morning when his vehicle struck a roadside bomb south of the Iraqi capital.

OTHER SECURITY INCIDENTS

Baghdad:

Two Iraqi policemen were wounded in a blast in southwestern Baghdad. Two policemen were wounded and a police vehicle was damaged in the attack.

Fourteen bodies of workers in an electricity plant were found in the city morgue on Tuesday. They were abducted and killed on June 12, the Association of Muslim Scholars said in a statement.

A bomb attached to a motorcycle exploded in the Alawwi area in central Baghdad, killing two civilians and injuring eight others.

Najaf:

Gunmen riding a motorcycle shot dead a police officer in Najaf.

Taji:

(Update) The kidnappers of more than 100 Iraqi government employees have freed about half of their hostages: The industry ministry workers were snatched by gunmen Wednesday after their shift ended at a factory north of Baghdad. "Women hostages and those who were Sunnis were set free, and we believe that now about 40 to 50 employees are still held captive," an interior ministry official said on Thursday.

Iraqi police stormed a farm north of Baghdad and freed at least 17 people who were snatched a day earlier in a mass kidnapping of about 85 workers and family members at the end of a factory shift.

Iraqi soldiers said they had found several bodies in a violent area north of Baghdad where factory workers were abducted by gunmen a day earlier. "Only 30 employees were kidnapped, of whom 25 were released the same day and only five now are still being held," an official in the minister's office told Reuters.
Karbala:

An Iraqi ayatollah who spent nearly 15 years in exile in Southern California was shot twice as he was returning home after delivering a sermon in the holy city of Karbala last week but survived the assassination attempt, his son, spiritual leader of an Irvine mosque, said Wednesday. Sayed Mortada Al-Qazwini, 76, who joyously returned to Iraq two weeks after the ouster of Saddam Hussein in 2003, refused to wear a bulletproof vest and mostly shunned security provided to him by the government and Shiite religious authorities, said Moustafa Al-Qazwini.

Dhuluiya:

Gunmen killed an Iraqi soldier in his home in Dhuluiya, 40 km (25 miles) north of Baghdad.

Iraqi forces found a civilian car with two bodies in the town of Bani Saad, west of Baquba. One of the bodies is of an Iraqi Army engineer with a rank of a captain.

The governor of Iraq's Diyala province was wounded and his driver and bodyguard killed when a bomb exploded near his convoy in the city of Baquba. Raad al-Mowla was travelling home from work when the shrapnel from the blast punctured his car's tyre causing it to overturn. The police source said Mowla was flown to a U.S. military hospital in Iraq for treatment.

Hawija:

Gunmen killed a carpenter on Wednesday in Hawija, 70 km (43 miles) southwest of Kirkuk.

Kirkuk:

Iraqi soldiers killed a gunman and arrested two on Wednesday after coming under attack in Kirkuk.

(W. of) An Iraqi civilian was shot dead by unknown militants west of Kirkuk. A source at the police in Kirkuk told KUNA that unknown gunmen, who were riding a black Opel Vectra, opened fire at Mohammad Mohsen Hussein and killed him.