Iraq War Called Illegal by Hawai‘i Army Lieutenant

[damontucker]

Re: Iraq War Called Illegal by Hawai‘i Army Lieutenant

I post not to change anyone's mind. I post to express my thoughts and what I have feel as a Military Mom. If I have been repeating over and over without anyone reading - so be it. That was not intention to begin with.

My personal feeling for members of the Forum is widely known. I have expressed on the Board my Respect and Honor for Tita Muilang and Leo. To voice our opionions within the rules and regulations of the Forum is what I abide by.

Yes, I'm guilty of name calling. I did it because that is how I feel. If it is not to the liking of others, I apologize but it doesn't change the fact in what I believe.

I do not want to be told to become silent over an issue I feel passionate about. To do so would be an injustice.

Respecting everyone's view is priority. Sometimes in the heat of the things - it can be overlooked. I agree with you that we should be more aware of what everyone has to say and listen.

Freedom of Speech is Excellent!!!

Lynn

you get the pupule defense

[chriscollado]

Re: Iraq War Called Illegal by Hawai‘i Army Lieutenant

I don't wish to insult you children who have decided that it is there calling to fight for the United States government. To me they are truly honorable to fight and die for what they believe. However 2507 Americans killed and over 100,000 Iraq Civilians killed not including insurgents. I do not want another soldier to die for the United States Administration. I want them to come home I support the troops and as a Marine I have a duty to my fellow Marines to make sure they get back home safely. I am a warrior but I do not want to kill those who have not attacked me. The Republic of Iraq did not attack the United States of America.

You can call me a Coward. You can call me a traitor. But unfortunately there is nothing in this world that can strip of my title of Marine. You can try all you want. It will not happen. I promise no matter how much you despise my decision, I will bring you children home with the help of my military training, knowledge of international law, and the backing of the IVAW, VFP, GSFP, Cindy Sheehan, and many many more.

Also if you don't want to contribute your inteligent opinion on the war in Iraq or your strategy to win or withdraw from Iraq. You are no better than those that you despise.

Semper Fidelis means to be Alway Faithful and I am to my Constitution not to the GOP not to the President. As I promised to defend it I shall.

If you continue to support this illegal mission you are contributing to the same thing you felt the worry over when you sent your children to die and be put into harms way in Iraq.

Stop calling yourself a marine.. You are a coward.

Sorry Muilang, name calling for me doesn't mean I have run out of things to say. I have a RIGHT cause I sacrificed four years of my life proudly to call bull$hit on him. Sorry, but I call it like I see it. I would have retired from the Army but the Man upstaris had other plans for me. He brought me to Hawaii and I'm thankful for that. So my body is broken, but it is still serving the only way it can, in civil service. Trust me I have plenty to say and it won't include any cut and paste wisdom either. I'm just too lazy to type.

[nachodaddy]

Re: Iraq War Called Illegal by Hawai‘i Army Lieutenant

A Marine On Extended Leave Of Absence. A marine, when eventually caught, will be held accountable by the UCMJ. A marine, stripped down to E-1 and thrown in the gulag. A marine, who will hit his private glass ceiling due to a dishonorable discharge and that little box "have you been convicted of a crime".

A marine, sure, just one not very good at it.

Maui was fun, nice S/SE seshes. Asked about you, no one there knew who you were.......you seem to be forgotten. For you , hope things work out in Canada.

[War_Resisters_Canada]

Re: Iraq War Called Illegal by Hawai‘i Army Lieutenant

I sincerly apologize to those I may have insulted or even outraged by my comments. I tried my absolute hardest to keep my comments inteligent so that I could be able to inform you of our situation from our side. We all have a political standing I can see many of the people who contribute to this thread are on the Right and Many on the Left. Where as I define my self as a Progressive Liberal. I believe in following all rules set forth. And that the Geneva Conventions was an overriding factor to my contract with the Marines. The consitution states that it is by making it the supreme law of the land. Now I may have gone about things the wrong way in your eyes. But everyone must make a decision for themselves. I could have gone about with my life in the Marines and conducted combat operations in Iraq, but for what, I would just be participating in an illegal an immoral war. I could have refused orders and be thrown in the brig like some of the other war resisters. But I could not let my wife be alone for however long I would be imprisioned. And I would not be able to speak out now. I chose to desert whether you agree or don't, that is up to you. But with out me deserting none of you would have heard my thoughts, I wouldn't have been taken seriously by the Pentagon, I wouldn't have been taken in by the majority of the Canadian people, and I wouldn't have the political backing I have now here in Canada and the United States. It is your right to agree or not to agree with me. You can call me a coward, a traitor, or whatever it is you can think of. I have heard it all, and it hasn't stoped me yet. I will continue to fight for what I believe just as you would continue to fight your battle in side yourself whether or not this war is illegal. I support the troops and I want them to come home. Which is why I critize the training given to Marines before deployment for the lack detailed training in urban warfare and basic arabic. I do not support the War because the United Nations security council didn't pass the resolution for armed forces in Iraq, therefore making the United States a rouge nation seeking to start a war of agression, against the SOVREIGN REPUBLIC OF IRAQ.

Being from Hawaii you must all remember what we learned as children from our parents and grandparents , and even school, about how the sovreign kingdom of hawaii, was taken over through sheer show of force. Our sovreignty was gone in the blink of an eye. That was the United States first step in setting up a foreign policy that involves annex territory for economc and military strategical gain. What do you think Iraq is. The United States was then condoned by the nations of the world.

Just as today, you must remember the coalition of the willing, is not the majority of the world. it is just a fraction of it.

Now I respect your rights respect mine. Do not lower youselves to name calling but rather speak out inteligently. Find a debate on the Law the war is based on do you research before you come barging in here and calling me a coward but yet you do not have a basis of argument beyond you are certain I am wrong.

Resister

[Pua'i Mana'o]

Re: Iraq War Called Illegal by Hawai‘i Army Lieutenant

Now I respect your rights respect mine. Do not lower youselves to name calling but rather speak out inteligently. Find a debate on the Law the war is based on do you research before you come barging in here and calling me a coward but yet you do not have a basis of argument beyond you are certain I am wrong.

Resister

That is a solid point. I look forward to reading those discussions and hope that they track back to the cerebral, instead of staying mired in the visceral.

[War_Resisters_Canada]

Re: Iraq War Called Illegal by Hawai‘i Army Lieutenant

Now I have a question for all of you...

We all agree that the Geneva Conventions is something that the United States must abide by. Did you know that the Geneva Conventions treaty which also enshrines the United Nations as the judge as to what is and isn't a war of agression and Nuremberg Principles which say we have a duty to not participate in wars of agression. To do so would make one party to war crimes, and as such you duty supercedes all domestic regulations.

Now I always go back to saying constitution makes treaties the supreme law of the land. Therefore NO executive order, legislative act, or resolution can contradict any treaty in place. I present you then with the Joint Resolution for Armed Forces in Iraq. This resolution was passed by the senate however it was not approved by the United Nations Security Council. Which would in turn render the resolution void according to international law as soon as the Security Council concluded not to approve it.

Further more the President, Vice President, all Secretaries of Executive Departments, all Supreme Court Justices, all Senators, all Congressman, and the Armed services members i.e. Marines, Army, Navy, Air Force, Coast Guard, are sworn to defend the consititution of the United States of America. Now by acting on the resolution which wasn't approved by the UN, makes every person in the chain of command responsible for breaking international law.

I am sure I will hear the argument well it had to be done because of the terrorist. I am sure I will hear the terrorist want to kill us all and take away our rights as Americans. The want to burn the flag and the Constitution.

That might be the case. But how bad is it that Americans in the administration, legislature, Dept. of State, and Dept of Defence have already done it they have bypassed the Consititution.

The Constitution is not a piece of paper it is not a guideline of how we should do things. IT IS OUR COUNTRY. That document is everything this country stands for. That document ensures our rights. That document is our defense from tyrants, corrupt officials, and people who dare take our rights away.

But alot of Americans believe well Bush is doing the right thing. Let me tell you about the right thing. GWB pushed the Patriot Act and the Patriot Act II through the house luckily only the first survived. The Patriot Act voids some of you Rights as an American. They supervise your every move, the computer systems can figure our your travel history for years past, they can tap your phone call because they think you are associated with a terrorist, they can arrest you without granting any of your rights, and lock you up for years with our conviction.

I ask of you to explain without name calling without comments like well he is the President and he is right. I also don't want to hear well you are a young 20 year ld Marine with no clue about foriegn politics. Believe me you would be suprised. And if you do say these things shame on you for not opening up your mind. And participating in your government. It is your right it is your duty.

Explain to me what gives the United States power to defy a law that the United States enshirned and decided to be subject to?

[War_Resisters_Canada]

Re: Iraq War Called Illegal by Hawai‘i Army Lieutenant

Chris,
I just noticed your last post. Are you implying that I am not knowledgable about this subject and that I do not know what I am talking about. I am sorry if you feel that way but I have proven myself to far more distinguished people than yourself. I have studied International Law not only here in Canada but in the States. I also have the backing of the years of experience with International Law and Criminal Justice from my good friend Jeffry House Solicitor and Barrister. I have spoken to Members of Parliment, Congressman, Senators, Retired Field and General Officers, I have spoken out to universities, public forums, I have explained and recieved compassionate response from many persons across Canada including Americans. You can trash talk me all that you wish. But I know that my voice is being heard by people across the world. Let me ask you where is your opinion getting aired other than on this blog.

Resist

[Miulang]

Re: Iraq War Called Illegal by Hawai‘i Army Lieutenant

I believe the US is a member of the world community, and as such, has every obligation to honor and uphold any international laws. That being said, this White House is trying to convince the American public through its smoke and mirror tactics that the humane treatment of detainees is not required (as is evidenced by the DoD's desire to remove mention of those Articles from its revised Rules of Conduct) and that the US is above all international law.

I believe that by allowing the atrocities at Abu Ghraib, Gitmo, Haditha, Fallujah, etc. etc, to be committed by our troops, that the beheading (that is what is currently being reported by the media as the cause of death) of the 2 captured soldiers from the 101st Airborn is a direct reaction to those atrocities.

I do not believe we are engaged in a defensive war because the US is not being occupied by a foreign government; we are engaged in an illegal occupation in a foreign country that is verging on a civil war in which we have no right to be involved.

If we were in a defensive war against an enemy where the United States was occupied, I would be one of the first to sign up to defend this country. I would kill any invader who tried to hurt my family. But no invader is occupying my country and no invader (other than my own government) is trying to hurt me. And that is why I am against this occupation. The "war" in Iraq ended in May, 2003, when the repressive regime of Saddam Hussein was overthrown.

Miulang

[War_Resisters_Canada]

Re: Iraq War Called Illegal by Hawai‘i Army Lieutenant

Let me add to that Muiland.

Although Saddam Hussien wasn't completely approved by the International community. He did provide his people with 24 hours of Electricity, Water, and an adequate sewage system. Since the invasion of Iraq the city of Bagdahd has suffered from only having 4 hours of electricity a day and having to get water from a military water source. Not to mention ancheint Iraq was home to the first known sewage system however after 3 years the people are now dealing with dug in latrines because the money that was to go into rebuilding the city and its sewage system seems to disappear quite quickly. Also during his reign he didn't kill 150,000 civilians, unlike the "Coalition of the Killing." During Saddam Hussien's reign as president he attacked a kurdish village with white phospherous killing hundreds. Yet the United States has killed thousands with the use of the same chemical that only a few months ago the Pentaogn admited to using.

Do not get me wrong I do not support Saddam Hussien in anyway but to me I see some Irony here.

[waioli kai]

victory by deceit and default

War_Resisters_Canada -- "... what gives the United States power to defy a law that the United States enshirned and decided to be subject to? " --

Those who control the United States do not keep it a secret. They ritually invoke the name of their Judeo-Christian deity as their enabler, their giver of material wealth with attendent judicial blessings which have befallen them, their redeemer from all sins commissioned in their deity's name.

The following exchange ends with 'what gives the United States power' and begins with a symptom of what happens when United States defies "law that the United States enshrined.'

======---

- "...why should the prisoners be tried. They are combatants. They were caught on the battlefield without uniforms,"- -

Uniforms? That's a joke, right?

----___---

- - "They are not necessarily being detained for crimes per se, just as combatants, "- -

"... not being detained for crimes per se " ?? How far is that from being: 'They are not necessarily being killed for crimes per se.'

----___---

- -"What about the summary torture and execution of our
(US's U.S. mercenary forces and for-profit corporations, tax-exempt armies of hired guns!!)
people?" - -

It is not inevitable that the corporatUSt State's U.S. Military personnel remain to project the Cheney Gangster's march of madness further into their misguided, unfounded, and long criminal US$ Enterprise Iraq. They are career criminals, the Reaganauts, of the Reagan-Bush years and their following, worshipper$ and sycophant$, who believe they won "The Cold War", who feel their reward for their victory by deceit and default, their ju$t desert for "winning" was/is control of the United States from foreign policy to taxation, to "representative" government, to religion, justice and truth itself.

[scrivener]

Re: Iraq War Called Illegal by Hawai‘i Army Lieutenant

we are engaged in an illegal occupation in a foreign country that is verging on a civil war in which we have no right to be involved.

Just to clarify (because I think we agree on most things related to this war): Do you mean that we have no right because of what it is, or that we have no right because none of the parties involved in the civil war asked us to get involved? In other words, are you saying we don't belong in other countries' civil wars, or that we have no right to be involved in this particular civil war?

[War_Resisters_Canada]

Re: Iraq War Called Illegal by Hawai‘i Army Lieutenant

We do not have a right in any War unless the United Nations sanctions for relief or the government in power formall request assitance. This has been part of the rules of war since WWII however it something the United States keeps forgeting. Or maybe it is because God talks to Mr. Bush...

[Miulang]

Re: Iraq War Called Illegal by Hawai‘i Army Lieutenant

Just to clarify (because I think we agree on most things related to this war): Do you mean that we have no right because of what it is, or that we have no right because none of the parties involved in the civil war asked us to get involved? In other words, are you saying we don't belong in other countries' civil wars, or that we have no right to be involved in this particular civil war?

Hi Scriv: I am against all "wars of aggression" where the "aggressors" (i.e., the US in this case) invade and illegally occupy another country. And in the case of Iraq, we had no legitimate business going there in the first place, except maybe to protect our oil interests. But since we did invade Iraq, we could have just left after we captured Saddam and let the Iraqis figure out what kind of government they wanted, rather than our lingering there, at the expense of countless American and Iraqi lives, trying to teach them "our" brand of democracy. When are we ever going to learn that just maybe "our" brand of "democracy" (i.e. capitalism) is not a "one size fits all" ideology?

We, as a single nation state, have no right meddling in the affairs of another country's internal political bickerings. That's what the United Nations was set up to do. If we have any role to play in another country's civil war, it should be of a diplomatic nature, and certainly in conjunction with the United Nations. The White House's "Coalition of the Willing" was cobbled together on the basis of lies and assumptions, and many of our friends have figured out they were duped and are pulling their troops out of Iraq.

Now if the North Koreans decide to invade us here in this country, I'd be headed down to the enlistment office right now to enlist. I love this country as much as the next flag waving patriot, but I am not content to just be lied to by my President. I feel it is my duty as a citizen to ask questions of my government and not to just take its word that it is doing the best thing for me.

Miulang

[waioli kai]

Re: Iraq War Called Illegal by Hawai‘i Army Lieutenant

"Or maybe it is because God talks to Mr. Bush..."

No "maybe" there. Cheney talks to His First, His Only Son all of the time. Their never-ending terrorUSt$ "War on Terror" is a legUSy they will never live down., nor in death, in history be absolved.

[glossyp]

Re: Iraq War Called Illegal by Hawai‘i Army Lieutenant

We do not have a right in any War unless the United Nations sanctions for relief or the government in power formall request assitance. This has been part of the rules of war since WWII however it something the United States keeps forgeting.

Can you cite a reference for this? I sincerely doubt that the U.S. has ever ceded the right to declare and wage war to the U.N.