New smoking ban

[surlygirly]

Re: New smoking ban

I don't know, but I was swallowing my normal seasonal allergy coughs the other day when I was holding my friend's baby.

Although, FWIW, I always give my smoking husband stink eye when he starts hacking. We agreed to quit together. I did. He didn't. I know it's harder for some people than others, and I don't harass him about it, but I will always give him quiet stink eye about the hacking.

And since I've quit, I've gone from getting 5-6 horrible colds a year to maybe 1 not-so-awful.

[Leo Lakio]

Re: New smoking ban

We agreed to quit together. I did. He didn't. I know it's harder for some people than others, and I don't harass him about it, but I will always give him quiet stink eye about the hacking.

Oh, that's tough. Doing so along with someone else is one of the best motivations for changing behavior. If he couldn't quit then, it'll likely be tougher for him at any other time. (But let's hope he still succeeds someday!)

[AlohaKine]

Re: New smoking ban

I find it rather interesting that the health department is wasting $45,000 in radio ads to promote the smoking ban in bars when the state is broke and layoffs and furloughs are on the horizon. To top it all off, the legislature isn't even in session! WOW.

Off course this is small compaired to the millions in government funds Fukino gives to private anti-smoking lobbyist rings. State workers out of work and professional private lobbyists laughing all the way to the bank. - SICK

Alledged bartender "Justin" at an alledged unnamed bar says he likes the ban on the radio ads. No kidding, like the Health department would give equal time to the many people in the industry that want the economically damaging ban in bar to go away.

[Amati]

Re: New smoking ban

I find it rather interesting that the health department is wasting $45,000 in radio ads to promote the smoking ban in bars when the state is broke and layoffs and furloughs are on the horizon.

What is the source of the money that pays for the ads?
Tax dollars paid by workers in Hawaii, or ...
from taxes paid by cigarette smokers on each pack of cigarettes, or...
from the money that goes to states from the tobacco companies as part of the lawsuit settlement that is supposed to go to battle the financial ravages of smoking upon the tax payers (such as health care costs)?

AlohaKine, I bet you could call the Health Department and find out where the money is coming from. Please share the answer with us.

[Frankie's Market]

Re: New smoking ban

What is the source of the money that pays for the ads?
Tax dollars paid by workers in Hawaii, or ...
from taxes paid by cigarette smokers on each pack of cigarettes, or...
from the money that goes to states from the tobacco companies as part of the lawsuit settlement that is supposed to go to battle the financial ravages of smoking upon the tax payers (such as health care costs)?

AlohaKine, I bet you could call the Health Department and find out where the money is coming from. Please share the answer with us.

According to Derrick DePledge's blog, the $45,000 comes from the state's tobacco settlement fund.

http://thenotebook.honadvblogs.com/2009/05/27/smoky/

[Amati]

Re: New smoking ban

According to Derrick DePledge's blog, the $45,000 comes from the state's tobacco settlement fund.

Oh, so it is tobacco company money. I don't mind that being spent on anti-tobacco ads. Within reason, of course.

[AlohaKine]

Re: New smoking ban

Oh, so it is tobacco company money. I don't mind that being spent on anti-tobacco ads. Within reason, of course.

Actually it wasn't tobacco company money. It was citizen's of Hawaii money. I fact the tobacco settlement mandates that the money come from smokers in the state based on the number of smokers. The tobacco companies are forbidden from paying on cent of their own assets. Furthermore any money that goes to "tobacco control" is in fact diverted from the general fund, which of course means non-smokers get hit to.

One more note, smokers on average SAVE society about $100,000 in health care costs per a Dutch government study that came out not to long ago. It appears that longer living and ultimately more expensive disease getting non-smokers actually cost the most.

http://www2.tbo.com/content/2008/feb...hest-for-thin/

So basically if all 200,000 Hawaii smokers quit today, we would see an increase in total health care costs of $200 billion over the next 50 years and the loss of $5 billion in cigarette tax revenue. The tab of course would be picked up by non-smokers.

[Leo Lakio]

Re: New smoking ban

I fact the tobacco settlement mandates that the money come from smokers in the state based on the number of smokers. The tobacco companies are forbidden from paying on cent of their own assets.

Someone's really blowing smoke here.

Under the terms of the 1998 Tobacco Master Settlement Agreement, the major tobacco companies (at the time: Brown & Williamson Tobacco Corporation, Lorillard Tobacco Company, Philip Morris Incorporated, R.J. Reynolds Tobacco Company, Commonwealth Tobacco, and Liggett & Myers - some are no longer in operation) agreed to make annual payments to the 46 states (and assorted territories; four states struck separate agreements) to compensate them for some of the medical costs of caring for persons with smoking-related illnesses. The money also funded an anti-smoking advocacy group.

National Association of Attorneys General quote for specifics:

Financial Provisions --- States will receive over $206 billion over 25 years:
* Up-front payments - $12.742 billion.
* Annual Payments, beginning April 15, 2000 - $183.177 billion through 2025.
* Strategic Contribution Fund, 2008-2017 - $8.61 billion.
* National Foundation ($250 million over next 10 years).
* Public Education Fund (at least $1.45 billion 2000-2003).
* State Enforcement Fund ($50 million, one-time payment).
* National Association of Attorneys General ($1.5 million over next 10 years).

A few other financial specifics, exceprted from the same source:

Tobacco manufacturers will pay $206 billion over the next 25 years to states in "up-front" and annual payments.

Up-front Payments ($12.742 billion):
* Tobacco companies will pay $2.4 billion annually between 1998 and 2003: $2.4 billion in 1998; $2.472 billion in 2000; $2.546 billion in 2001; $2.623 billion in 2002; and $2.7 billion in 2003.

Annual Payments ( $183.177 billion)
* If all states participate in the settlement, annual payments will "ramp-up" beginning with a $4.5 billion payment on April 15, 2000. The April 15th annual payments will be as follows:
$4.5 billion in 2000; $5 billion in 2001; $6.5 billion in each of 2002 and 2003;
$8 billion in each year 2004-2007; $8.139 billion in annually in 2008-2017 (plus $861 million annually during the same period to the strategic fund); and
$9 billion in 2018 and thereafter.

Strategic Contribution Fund ($8.61 billion)
* On April 15, 2008 and on April 15 each year through 2017, the companies will pay $861 million into a strategic contribution fund.

Complete summary available here.

[craigwatanabe]

Re: New smoking ban

have you noticed that the new and improved craigwatanabe has kept silent on this raging debate?

I'm exercising restraint right now on my opinion

Howeve like I said many moons ago in this thread that if they made cigarette smoke smell like a barbecue, no one would be complaining except non-smoking vegetarians and members of PITA.

[Amati]

Re: New smoking ban

Actually it wasn't tobacco company money. It was citizen's of Hawaii money.

Someone's really blowing smoke here.
Under the terms of the 1998 Tobacco Master Settlement Agreement, the major tobacco companies (at the time: Brown & Williamson Tobacco Corporation, Lorillard Tobacco Company, Philip Morris Incorporated, R.J. Reynolds Tobacco Company, Commonwealth Tobacco, and Liggett & Myers - some are no longer in operation) agreed to make annual payments to the 46 states (and assorted territories; four states struck separate agreements) to compensate them for some of the medical costs of caring for persons with smoking-related illnesses. The money also funded an anti-smoking advocacy group.

Thanks Leo Lakio, your post sent me googling, here is a similar explanation, stating that the money comes from THE TOBACCO COMPANIES.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tobacco...ment_Agreement

"The Tobacco Master Settlement Agreement (MSA) is an agreement entered into in November 1998, originally between the four largest US tobacco companies and the Attorneys General of 46 states. The MSA settled the Medicaid lawsuits of these states against the tobacco industry for recovery of their tobacco-related health care costs. It is the largest civil settlement in United States history."

[AlohaKine]

Re: New smoking ban

The settlement is so large theat the only choice for the industry is to raise the price to compensate and to pass all the costs on to Hawaii's smokers based on our percentage of smokers and every State that is part of the settlement as well.

It's NOT coming out of "mr. Big" on the east coast, it's coming from our working people as a hidden tax.

It's kind of like theives are stealing half of all of Walmarts revenue. They have two choices, go bankrupt or pass the difference on to the custormers in the form of higher prices. It's basic ecomonics. Same with tort in the medical industry. If you have out of control lawsuits, the cost ultimately gets passed on to the patients.

[Amati]

Re: New smoking ban

It's NOT coming out of "mr. Big" on the east coast, it's coming from our working people as a hidden tax.

Based upon the sources provided in previous posts [#968 & 970], that is just not correct. The money is not coming from working people in the form or a hidden tax. The money is coming from the tobacco companies. Granted, the tobacco companies pass on the costs to their consumers (smokers), but that means that SMOKERS are paying the cost, not "working people in the form of hidden taxes". (Of course, many smokers are workers, but that is not the same as saying workers pay the costs.)

[AlohaKine]

Re: New smoking ban

The money is a tax. It can go one of two ways - to interest groups or the general fund. When it does not go to the general fund they will come looking for non-smokers to pick up the difference.

The gears of govornment have to turn. How you do you want it, you make that choice.

[Amati]

Re: New smoking ban

The money is a tax.

You are wrong. The money is not a tax. The money is from a lawsuit against the tobacco companies.

[AlohaKine]

Re: New smoking ban

You are wrong. The money is not a tax. The money is from a lawsuit against the tobacco companies.

It is a de-facto "tax". You can't tell me that ultimately smokers in Hawaii are not paying for this lawsuit or that dollars spent on "tobacco control" are not diverted from the general fund. Just this year, due to the budget situation, the 12.5% for "tobacco control" of the settlement funds got reduced to 6.5%. The balance went into the general fund.

And yes, smoker by in large are "working folks" the have to pay this ripoff.