More sacrilegious commercialisation of Hawaiian culture...

[Glen Miyashiro]

Re: More sacrilegious commercialisation of Hawaiian culture...

i just KNOW yer jokin'.
But I must assert; it is time to ho'oponopono and always maka'ala.

Actually I'm not joking at all. If you read my older comments you'll see how I feel about religion in general. However, out of courtesy to you and tita Lynn, since you feel so strongly about it, I will stop now.

[kimo55]

Re: More sacrilegious commercialisation of Hawaiian culture...

Actually I'm not joking at all. If you read my older comments you'll see how I feel about religion in general. However, out of courtesy to you and tita Lynn, since you feel so strongly about it, I will stop now.

maybe I am a lil confused:
You are saying you are not joking; that nothing is sacred? You feel anything is fair game?


....also, there is religion, and then, there is religion;
Contemporary american religion is a far cry from ancient/contemporary Polynesian cultural philosophy/relgion.

It is nigh impossible to synopsize the difference in one small paragraph, but...

Christianity in general is crystallized, dogmatic, overly structured, separate from daily life.
Polynesian 'religion" is intrinsically intertwined with each and every aspect of daily life and related to respect and connection to every living thing, the appreciation for the aina and nature in general as being the source of life, and being manifestations of the gods.

[Miulang]

Re: More sacrilegious commercialisation of Hawaiian culture...

maybe I am a lil confused:
You are saying you are not joking; that nothing is sacred? You feel anything is fair game?

Nah. He means he not going be sarcastic about religion anymore.

Miulang

[Glen Miyashiro]

Re: More sacrilegious commercialisation of Hawaiian culture...

maybe I am a lil confused:
You are saying you are not joking; that nothing is sacred? You feel anything is fair game?

Yup, that's what I am saying. Now mind you, this doesn't mean that I think this kind of cultural appropriation is in good taste; it's not. But I don't think anything is sacred and not to be challenged. If somebody wants to make tiki kitsch, or Jesus kitsch, or Buddha kitsch, then they're free to do so. Just as you're free to dislike it and refuse to buy.

[kimo55]

Re: More sacrilegious commercialisation of Hawaiian culture...

Yup, that's what I am saying. Now mind you, this doesn't mean that I think this kind of cultural appropriation is in good taste; it's not. But I don't think anything is sacred and not to be challenged. If somebody wants to make tiki kitsch, or Jesus kitsch, or Buddha kitsch, then they're free to do so. Just as you're free to dislike it and refuse to buy.

ok, granted. This being america, we are 'free' to do most anything, and mostly we do, especially if it stretches the bounds of good taste. After all, we want to challenge and be "edgy". Don't we.

Personally I don't see the point in challenging "religious" aspects of Polynesian cultures that have existed for hundreds of years only to be usurped, denegrated and nearly destroyed by foreigners, and then, to have insult added to injury by mockery, challenge, and thoughtless, blatant commercialisation.

I believe many things should remain sacred. Respected. Untouched by the profane.
A societal structure that allows for this complete breakdown, is one with a corrupt moral fabric and decayed spiritual constitution and is bound to witness its own disintegration and fall.
Besides, I myself, just feel better inside, respecting some things. Of course, others will never have that experience, and more's the pity.




******
wow. 170 hits on one thread in one hour. controversy sells.

[1stwahine]

Re: More sacrilegious commercialisation of Hawaiian culture...

Dear Glen, I sent you an email at Private Messages. Please read.

Thank you,
Auntie Lynn

[Miulang]

Re: More sacrilegious commercialisation of Hawaiian culture...

Even if you put aside the religious/sacriligeous part of the icons depicted on that website, the question remains: what the hell does a tiki have to do with golfing anyway? Does this imply that by praying to god your game might improve (I dunno. When I played golf, I know I used to curse a lot ).

Maybe I'm a purist. If I see an icon as part of a design, I'd like it to represent the product/company if it looks "realistic". All bets are off if it's not a recognizable symbol, but I still don't get the correlation between that particular company, which is located in Florida, and the tiki, which is from Hawai'i.

Copyright/trademark infringement is another matter.

Miulang

[pzarquon]

Re: More sacrilegious commercialisation of Hawaiian culture...

Dear Glen, I sent you an email at Private Messages. Please read.

Eh, Aunty! Doesn't this defeat the purpose of a Private Message?

Anyway, I have no idea why they linked golf to a polynesian carving, either. Then again, when it comes to team sports and icons, just about anything goes. Unless it involves racial characterizations. Or remarkably unpleasant mammals. Or something. I lost my Politicallly Correct stylebook a while ago.

I'm confused a bit on the discussion relating bobble-head Jesus figures to this golf shirt, though. Is it, "Sure, you can treat a symbol someone feels is sacred with disrespect, but that doesn't mean you should"? Or is it, "These carvings are important, but Jesus/Christianity is more important"? Or is it, "Unlike Polynesian beliefs, Christianity can be mocked because as the 'Mainstream' faith it's not like it's in any danger or anything"?

I think it's a fair question to ask if we can dismiss things that ridicule one belief system if we're going to take an insult against another so seriously...

But more realistically, Kimo, you mentioned knowing the carver. So, right there you have a strategy toward limiting the commercial appropriation of cultural images. If someone was making money selling something with my artwork on it, you bet your sweet bippy you'd hear from me (or my lawyer).

And for better or worse, sometimes the mere mention of gettin' lawyered up is enough to send ignorant capitalists a'packing...

[Glen Miyashiro]

Re: More sacrilegious commercialisation of Hawaiian culture...

I'm confused a bit on the discussion relating bobble-head Jesus figures to this golf shirt, though. Is it, "Sure, you can treat a symbol someone feels is sacred with disrespect, but that doesn't mean you should"? Or is it, "These carvings are important, but Jesus/Christianity is more important"? Or is it, "Unlike Polynesian beliefs, Christianity can be mocked because as the 'Mainstream' faith it's not like it's in any danger or anything"?

I meant the first: you can, but it's in poor taste to do so.

[Miulang]

Re: More sacrilegious commercialisation of Hawaiian culture...

This discussion kinda reminds me of the name changes that are going on with high school and college mascots. Remember when an "Indian" or a "Warrior" was a good thing? Now in our politically correct world, as soon as someone takes offense at having a mascot that might depict ethnicity, schools are changing their mascots. I think that's why the UH changed its name from the "Rainbow Warriors" to the "Rainbows".

My favorite, most-PC college mascot is the UC-Santa Barbara Banana Slugs. Now I'm waiting for PETA or some other group to say that's a perjorative and their mascot needs to be changed. "Go 'Slugs, Go!"

Or how about the Mo'ilili School Surfboards?

Miulang

[pzarquon]

Re: More sacrilegious commercialisation of Hawaiian culture...

I think that's why the UH changed its name from the "Rainbow Warriors" to the "Rainbows".

Did they? I mentioned the mascot thing above, but in UH's case, I thought they did the exact opposite. In fact, Joe Moore and June Jones had a big lover's quarrel over this issue. They dropped 'Rainbows' (since it's affiliated with gay culture) to go with just 'Warriors.'

Which isn't to say that there aren't issues with the 'Warrior' thing. Just look at the whole flap over Vili the Warrior.

[kimo55]

Re: More sacrilegious commercialisation of Hawaiian culture...

Eh, Aunty! Doesn't this defeat the purpose of a Private Message?

you don't know aunty very well, do you?!

Anyway, I have no idea why they linked golf to a polynesian carving, either.

Not that it elucidates anything or satisfies the question, but they do give a little b/g or justification on their page. You no see yum?

[1stwahine]

Re: More sacrilegious commercialisation of Hawaiian culture...

you don't know aunty very well, do you?!

Eh! Wat you mean by dat BRO KIMO? Nah, all in the fun...I can take it! SMILE EVERYONE!

[kimo55]

Re: More sacrilegious commercialisation of Hawaiian culture...

In fact, Joe Moore and June Jones had a big lover's quarrel over this issue. They dropped 'Rainbows' (since it's affiliated with gay culture) to go with just 'Warriors.'

But latest news (late-breaking as they call it), tells us Joe and June have been seen picking out curtains together.

[kimo55]

Re: More sacrilegious commercialisation of Hawaiian culture...

"nothing is sacred. Everything is fair game."

It is. Isn't it?

Haoles, foreigners, tourists, whatever ya wanna callem, many of them are seen trodding upon heiau, removing or moving pohaku, leaving things on the heiau, crossing the kapu line and entering the sacred enclosure at heiau all over Oahu as well as the FtDerussy Memorial for fallen maoli warriors.
I was once doing a shoot at Puuhonua o Honaunau and these german tourists actually removed the fence enclosure of the Hale o Keawe temple and entered so they could get a picture of themselves next to the ki'i.
I roundly berated them and told them to expect well... don't remember exactly what I said, but implied it is extremely bad luck to commit such a disrespectful damaging trespass and possibly ill fortune will befall these cretins.


call it what ya want:
I say it is thoughtless, stems from a lack of education,a lack of breeding. A lack of thinking, learning, a simpleminded lemming reaction, jumping on the bandwagon of the idiot masses. These louts, inured to the sensitivity required while visiting other cultures, live in a society that unfortunately, continually believes nothing is sacred. anything is game for ridicule, exploitation, for commercialization. So; they say to themselves; Since I see goofy looking tikis in party supply centers and plastic tikis available in the dollar stores nationwide, and I see the sacred godhead of Polynesia on sportswear swinging gold clubs, and others reinforce that it's ok to challenge, well this means I have no need to keep my distance, I can walk all over heiau, litter on sacred ground, make childish rude comments when I am exposed to the ancient carved gods of Polynesia when visiting the Bishop Museum...

Nope. I say; some things are sacred and should be treated as such. And supposedly, mature thinking adults should show respect.
I can't see how some feel comfortable belittling the things held in highest regard by a society and culture far removed from their own, that has been beaten down for so long by foreigners. When will they acheive satisfaction in their perniciously rapacious wanton ways?!
How can they sleep with themselves?