Hui ordered to return objects to Bishop Museum

[Miulang]

Re: Hui ordered to return objects to Bishop Museum

I'm relieved that Judge Ezra has made the wise decision to let all the different kanaka maoli groups work toward a resolution of the disposition of the artifacts that are in dispute rather than have his court make the decision.

Here's a description of the ho'oponopono ceremony (as described by Mary K. Pukui) which is being presented as one alternative to resolving the conflict between the competing kanaka maoli groups. It seems like a much more civilized way of settling disputes. Maybe Western society needs to take a note from the kanaka maoli and try to resolve conflicts in this manner, instead of immediately heading into court. In court decisions, there always has to be a "winner" and a "loser". In this case, by using ho'oponopono there is a very good chance that everyone can come out a winner.

Miulang

[damontucker]

Re: Hui ordered to return objects to Bishop Museum

KHON 2 news tonight...

Did I not mention that you would hear it here first?

MORE TO COME

[Miulang]

Re: Hui ordered to return objects to Bishop Museum

Here's the story that ManoaSurfer is referring to:

"...Two documents written in the early 1900s may shed light on the current dispute over a collection of burial objects hidden in a Big Island cave.

One is a report written by the man who took the objects from the cave more than 100 years ago, the other is a letter written in response to his findings.

The documents may answer questions as to why a man was willing to go to jail for refusing to tell a federal judge where his group restored what he calls stolen items, and why he never intended to return them to the Bishop Museum...."

Miulang

[Pua'i Mana'o]

Re: Hui ordered to return objects to Bishop Museum

Is there a statute of limitations on stolen property?

If there isn't, why should a museum be allowed to keep stolen property when it acquired it knowing that it was stolen?

Why did a federal judge put the executive director of an organization created for the purposes of repatriation in jail, because he did his job, which is returning stolen property?

Why is the word "loan" bandied about, when the employee of Bishop Museum who worked with Hui Malama, under the authority of Bishop Museum gave the stolen property to Hui Malama, authorizing the removal of the stolen property from the museum grounds (in this post- "Ka'ai" era), knowing what Hui Malama's organizational purpose is?

Finally, why "leave it up to the Hawaiians" to ~agree~ first on what to do with stolen property?

For nearly 100 years it has been documented that Forbes stole what he wanted from the burial cave. And sold it. To the Bishop Museum. Who knew it was stolen.

I am not pro-hui/con-hui anything. But I find the whole situation alarming.

[alohabear]

Re: Hui ordered to return objects to Bishop Museum

Listen to Doctor Trey's special interview with La'akea Suganuma. He really explains all the huhu behind this issue. Very eye opening , if you've been following this story ,this is a MUST listen.

[LikaNui]

Re: Hui ordered to return objects to Bishop Museum

Breaking news:

"Edward Halealoha Ayau, executive director of Hui Malama I Na Kupuna O Hawai'i Nei, has been ordered released from the federal detention center and into home confinement on Moloka'i following an appearance in court this morning.
"The order came during a status conference on the progress toward mediation in a dispute about the disposition of 83 Native Hawaiian artifacts.
"Ayau has been held at the detention center near Honolulu International Airport since Dec. 27 for not complying with a federal order to divulge the exact location of the artifacts."

Full story at http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/ar.../br/br04p.html

[Pua'i Mana'o]

Re: Hui ordered to return objects to Bishop Museum

Listen to Doctor Trey's special interview with La'akea Suganuma. He really explains all the huhu behind this issue. Very eye opening , if you've been following this story ,this is a MUST listen.

Notice with whom Mr. Suganuma is aligning himself.

[alohabear]

Re: Hui ordered to return objects to Bishop Museum

Doctor Trey now has the other viewpoint of this matter featuring Jon "Hawaiian Eyes" Osorio. He makes some good points too. How long does Ho'oponopono last? Interesting

[Miulang]

Re: Hui ordered to return objects to Bishop Museum

Doctor Trey now has the other viewpoint of this matter featuring Jon "Hawaiian Eyes" Osorio. He makes some good points too. How long does Ho'oponopono last? Interesting

I think ho'oponopono lasts as long as it has to; as long as all parties involved apologize to the aggrieved parties and come to an agreement about how to right the wrong. For sure it wouldn't just be a one hour business meeting!

Miulang

P.S. I listened to that podcast with Jon Osario and he and the interviewers made an interesting point: the two mediators who were appointed are both men. It is kind of surprising that one of the notable wahines who practice ho'oponopono was not invited to take part in the mediation. I think it would greatly assist the decision making to have someone who is a regular practitioner be part of the mediation and women are famous for wanting to compromise rather than stand firm and intransigent.

[Miulang]

Re: Hui ordered to return objects to Bishop Museum

Now I'm not certain if the ho'oponopono ordered by Judge Ezra will in fact bring about resolution of the dispute because not all of the parties involved in the struggle will be involved initially.

"...The two groups suing Hui Malama -- Na Lei Alii Kawananakoa and the Royal Hawaiian Academy of Traditional Arts -- want all 14 claimants to decide on the objects' fate under provisions of the Native American Graves Protection and Repatriation Act, a 1990 federal law that governs the repatriation of human remains and artifacts.

But despite its goal of bringing people together, mediation likely will not include all groups this time. So far, only Hui Malama, Na Lei Alii and the Royal Academy have confirmed participation.

This could be another problem, said Naomi Losch, a faculty member at the Department of Hawaiian/Indo-Pacific Languages & Literatures at the University of Hawaii.

"It's going to be difficult to exclude people from the process and try to get a resolution," said Losch, who is Keala Losch's mother.

Jodi Yamamoto, legal counsel for the Bishop Museum, would not confirm or deny the museum's participation, saying she was sworn to secrecy by the judge. At least during initial mediation, the state's Office of Hawaiian Affairs, another group claiming the items, will not be present, said Lance Foster, director of native rights, land and culture...."


From what I understand of ho'oponopono, ALL parties involved in the dispute need to be present for the resolution to be a good one.

Miulang

[candyglassy@gmail.com]

Re: Hui ordered to return objects to Bishop Museum

Originally Posted by alohabear
Listen to Doctor Trey's special interview with La'akea Suganuma. He really explains all the huhu behind this issue. Very eye opening , if you've been following this story ,this is a MUST listen.


Many kupuna are opposed to Hui M, but will never step forward.
It's enough for them to appear at these NAGPRA hearings. So you know
how upset they are.

We don't hear about the behind the scenes action like Eddie Ayau and Pua Kanahele demanding museums destroy anthro records and photographs of the artifacts they take possession of. How convenient. And how hocus pocus of them. Who knighted them the All Knowing and the Only Knowing? Doesn't it seem a little disingenuous of them to charge families for kapa and performance of rituals they created (in the last few years)?
Wouldn't you think that because they have over a million bucks in their non profit (verified) they'd do it for free? Isn't that what they were formed
to do?

[damontucker]

Re: Hui ordered to return objects to Bishop Museum

Originally Posted by alohabear
Listen to Doctor Trey's special interview with La'akea Suganuma. He really explains all the huhu behind this issue. Very eye opening , if you've been following this story ,this is a MUST listen.


Many kupuna are opposed to Hui M, but will never step forward.
It's enough for them to appear at these NAGPRA hearings. So you know
how upset they are.

We don't hear about the behind the scenes action like Eddie Ayau and Pua Kanahele demanding museums destroy anthro records and photographs of the artifacts they take possession of. How convenient. And how hocus pocus of them. Who knighted them the All Knowing and the Only Knowing? Doesn't it seem a little disingenuous of them to charge families for kapa and performance of rituals they created (in the last few years)?
Wouldn't you think that because they have over a million bucks in their non profit (verified) they'd do it for free? Isn't that what they were formed
to do?

Please read this weeks Honolulu Advertiser.

I earlier posted that you would hear it here first... Now that Auntie has written her letter to the Weekly... I can talk a little more about it.

Forbes in 1905 knew exactly what he was doing. He wrote a memo stating specifically to keep things hushed about his discovery as he knew that burial laws and caves were kapu.

These artifacts are my wifes ancestors.... let them rest already.

Nuff said.

[Miulang]

Re: Hui ordered to return objects to Bishop Museum

These artifacts are my wifes ancestors.... let them rest already.

Nuff said.

I really feel badly for your wife's ohana, Manoa. I wouldn't want articles that were buried with my ancestor's bones (or the bones themselves) to be put on exhibition. What Forbes did was tantamount to grave robbing. Remember what happened to the original discoverers of the tomb of King Tut? Many of them died of mysterious circumstances. Better to leave the dead and their possessions alone.

Miulang

[candyglassy@gmail.com]

Re: Hui ordered to return objects to Bishop Museum

I really feel badly for your wife's ohana, Manoa. I wouldn't want articles that were buried with my ancestor's bones (or the bones themselves) to be put on exhibition. Miulang

No offense to Manoa's ohana but we are talking about objects not bones.
and it has never been established that ALL the artifacts are burial items. in part what's being argued is why should Hui Malama continue to have sole discretion over what is and what is not a burial item. even native archaeologists, anthropologists, and many kupuna have taken different positions on this. unlike egyptians, kanaka maole did not usually bury their dead with a lot of objects. maybe kapa, a bowl or two. phds say that large finds are probably from just after kaahumanu broke the kapu. priests could not bring themselves to destroy what had for generations been considered sacred, so they hid these things in caves.

whether we agree or not, shouldn't we listen to the older generation, the people who are native speakers who didn't learn their hawaiian from a book at a university? they know their family traditions and rituals and when they asked Hui Malama to step aside and let their ohana handle repatriation of their iwi, they were disrespected. this is a major part of the pilikia. the hawaiians who are loudest in crying out disrespect, are the very ones who have brought disrespect to the ancestors of other hawaiians. listen to what Laakea Suganuma and the kupuna say. it is not easy to stomach but it's sadly true.

[Miulang]

Re: Hui ordered to return objects to Bishop Museum

whether we agree or not, shouldn't we listen to the older generation, the people who are native speakers who didn't learn their hawaiian from a book at a university? they know their family traditions and rituals and when they asked Hui Malama to step aside and let their ohana handle repatriation of their iwi, they were disrespected. this is a major part of the pilikia. the hawaiians who are loudest in crying out disrespect, are the very ones who have brought disrespect to the ancestors of other hawaiians. listen to what Laakea Suganuma and the kupuna say. it is not easy to stomach but it's sadly true.

That's what Judge Ezra was trying to say. However, without all the 14 factions being equally represented at the ho'oponopono, this thing will not be resolved satisfactorily.

Miulang